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[In Exile]

DA2 released quite a bit earlier than Skyrim. DA's release date was in March and I believe Skyrim did not come out till September or so. It did release at almost the same time as The Witcher 2. And even you would have to admit that DA2's lesser sales have far more to do with the backlash surrounding it than with Skyrim. Games like that and The Witcher 2 just made Bioware's rush job all the more glaring.

TW2 and DA2 are bad examples. They're bad examples because a lot of the backlash around DA2 was around already pre-release and specifically for things that TW2 did or expressly incorporated into the design. DA2 failed as a game in many ways and TW2 was certainly better designed and more polished, but there was a lot of hypocrisy going around at the time. So I wouldn't say TW2 made the faults more glaring.

[slimgrin]

DA2 was the start of the fan wars. Before that, talk of The Witcher was not contentious in these parts. Crap timing for Bioware to have to rush a game out alongside TW2, but that game almost never saw the light of day because of the financial troubles CDPR were having. That's when they made the promotional video to find a publisher so they could finish the game. 

[In Exile]

DA2 was the start of the fan wars. Before that, talk of The Witcher was not contentious in these parts. Crap timing for Bioware to have to rush a game out alongside TW2, but that game almost never saw the light of day because of the financial troubles CDPR were having. That's when they made the promotional video to find a publisher so they could finish the game.

It was contentious before too, when TW1 came out before DAO. A great deal of it tied in with "maturity" - but this was a theme on the old Bioware forums. That's what led to the fan wars - this stuff was already simmering with DAO.

[Blooddrunk1004]

What you or I think is ear elephant; fact is that DAI sold better and is more acclaimed than the previous title made in 2011.

While better sales result success for companies, it doesn't mean that it makes the product better.

SW: Battlefront (EA) sold millions, yet it's barely being played based on the number of players stats. CoD and AC which is same **** - different year are selling like hotcakes everytime the new title is released, because there is a marketing juggernaut behind those franchises.

 

DA:I sold more because DA2 was awful. It's not hard to make the game that is better than DA2 especially for someone like Bioware.

[Xetykins]

I wouldn't say da2 was really that awful. It was just very...limiting in every way. I think if they had given it time to cook, it would have been very good. Same with DAI, if they had implemented the things they had promised, it would have been great. It was easy to accept dai as a good game until I played TW3, then a lot of things about it made me unhappy and sad in a way. They could have given DAO quality expansions even as small-ish as HoS and I would have been happy with it.

But I guess that just highlights how much I loved DAO more than anything else. It has been touched on by many critics too so I know I'm not alone with it.

[Elhanan]

While better sales result success for companies, it doesn't mean that it makes the product better.
SW: Battlefront (EA) sold millions, yet it's barely being played based on the number of players stats. CoD and AC which is same **** - different year are selling like hotcakes everytime the new title is released, because there is a marketing juggernaut behind those franchises.
 
DA:I sold more because DA2 was awful. It's not hard to make the game that is better than DA2 especially for someone like Bioware.

But DA2 is not awful, IMO. I personally have played it for hundreds of hours, but still is my least fave of the franchise due to the lack of polish. And DAI also received major awards on top of sales to indicate that it is a quality product.

And while I cannot play it, SW Battlefront is an entertaining game; one I may reconsider getting when the single player aspect is shown more. And because some do not care for a game does not define it's popularity; CoD still has vibrant support, as does TW3.

[Wolven_Soul]

I wouldn't say da2 was really that awful. It was just very...limiting in every way. I think if they had given it time to cook, it would have been very good. Same with DAI, if they had implemented the things they had promised, it would have been great. It was easy to accept dai as a good game until I played TW3, then a lot of things about it made me unhappy and sad in a way. They could have given DAO quality expansions even as small-ish as HoS and I would have been happy with it.

But I guess that just highlights how much I loved DAO more than anything else. It has been touched on by many critics too so I know I'm not alone with it.

 

DA2 had a crap load of potential.  It had the potential to be the best, most unique game in the entire series with some of the ideas it had.  Sadly, with the rush job, that potential was never realized and it became a horrible mess.  With a story that just jumped all over the place without ever really connecting one act with the others.  It was more like a small anthology of stories rather than one big story.  While I enjoy anthology books, I don't want to play an anthology game.

[AngryFrozenWater]

 

duplicate post

 

Cool. That allows me to give you two likes for the post above it.

 

Thanks for the clips.

[KBomb]

We all in this thread must make a Gwent tourney together the moment it comes out! See which among us is the ultimate gwent master.

Well, I can't tell you who the Master is, but I can tell you who isn't: me.

[Wolven_Soul]

Well, I can't tell you who the Master is, but I can tell you who isn't: me.

 

Probably won't be me either, but I would have a lot of fun playing it with everyone here.

[panzerwzh]

OMG OMG OMG, the wedding of Geralt and Yen is coming. The one and only true ending!

http://en.cdprojektr...s-of-kings-mod/

[Lady Artifice]

She actually threw the bed off the balcony. I almost wish Geralt had been there for that, so I could have seen it. 

[panzerwzh]

She actually threw the bed off the balcony. I almost wish Geralt had been there for that, so I could have seen it. 

Depends on player's choice, she might throw something else into the lake. 

[Lady Artifice]

Also, lol at "the louder it squeals the closer you are." 

 

I realized why Geralt chuckled so wickedly the very same instant Yenn did.

[panzerwzh]

Also, lol at "the louder it squeals the closer you are." 

 

I realized why Geralt chuckled so wickedly the very same instant Yenn did.

True couple's mind in sync.

[KBomb]

#teamtriss

[kaze369]

#teamtriss

#teamtriss

[nfi42]

#teamsingleandfancyfree

[In Exile]

DA2 had a crap load of potential.  It had the potential to be the best, most unique game in the entire series with some of the ideas it had.  Sadly, with the rush job, that potential was never realized and it became a horrible mess.  With a story that just jumped all over the place without ever really connecting one act with the others.  It was more like a small anthology of stories rather than one big story.  While I enjoy anthology books, I don't want to play an anthology game.

 

DA2 was just misconceived. It was the pointless prologue to a more dynamic story. They had the idea to do a game long origin story and try and play with the usual suspects idea, but totally failed to set it up. The basic story pitch was that Cassandra thinks Hawke's engineered the mage-templar war, but it's basically bumbling idiot Anders. In the meanwhile, Hawke basically sets up the entire plot of DA:I, and probably ends up with the anchor. They just didn't really tie this alll right. They clearly designed Hawke to be the fulcrum of a bunch of their DA stories, but DA2 tanked so hard they dropped that idea. 

[Dutchess]

I still like DA2 considerably more than DA:I, despite all its issues and having been pretty frustrating to play through, especially at release. I guess it's because of the more original aspects it had going for it. The companions carried the game for me, and I enjoyed the friendship/rivalry system. It was not perfectly implemented but a pretty interesting alternative to the traditional approve/disapprove, like/dislike meter. 

While DA:I appears to be better received all around, I... actually find it really hard to find anything to like in it. I like the character creation, but even that is sullied by Bioware's worst attempt at hair ever. I enjoyed Blackwall's character and kinda like what I consider the other better-written characters, Solas, Vivienne and Cole. And that's about it. It was a bore to play and I actually think the writing isn't any better than in DA2. Sure, not everyone goes insane anymore, which is nice, but instead people tend to be just dumb. I used to really enjoy the romances and interactions with companions but some of DA:I's romances left me wondering whether Bioware has started trolling players with them because they tend to be made fun of. 

The lifeless worlds filled with nothing but repetitive and meaningless quests have been mentioned enough. I thought it was a nice sign of showing attention to detail when Skyrim added notes and journals to its dungeons to give them a story. Then Bioware took that idea and... got it all wrong, somehow. I'm not even sure how they managed that. 

 

I know Skyrim caused games to put more focus on the idea of open worlds and the size of their worlds, but vast spaces you're left to explore on your own still hurt the urgency of the main story. TW3's world is beautiful, it's fun to explore, but it always feels weird to roam when you're supposed to be in a hurry to find Ciri or find a way to stop the Wild Hunt. I'm doing a third playthrough at the moment and disabled the question marks on the map for the first time around, but I still tend to look up buildings and ruins on the map and head toward them to see if they contain anything interesting. I've also tried to stick as close to the quest's level requirement as I can and not wait too long to advance the Baron's and the Bog's storyline, but again that leaves me to go all the way to the swamp again once already learning that Ciri could still be in Novigrad, which is in the very opposite direction. 

[Seboist]

I still like DA2 considerably more than DA:I, despite all its issues and having been pretty frustrating to play through, especially at release. I guess it's because of the more original aspects it had going for it. The companions carried the game for me, and I enjoyed the friendship/rivalry system. It was not perfectly implemented but a pretty interesting alternative to the traditional approve/disapprove, like/dislike meter. 

While DA:I appears to be better received all around, I... actually find it really hard to find anything to like in it. I like the character creation, but even that is sullied by Bioware's worst attempt at hair ever. I enjoyed Blackwall's character and kinda like what I consider the other better-written characters, Solas, Vivienne and Cole. And that's about it. It was a bore to play and I actually think the writing isn't any better than in DA2. Sure, not everyone goes insane anymore, which is nice, but instead people tend to be just dumb. I used to really enjoy the romances and interactions with companions but some of DA:I's romances left me wondering whether Bioware has started trolling players with them because they tend to be made fun of. 

The lifeless worlds filled with nothing but repetitive and meaningless quests have been mentioned enough. I thought it was a nice sign of showing attention to detail when Skyrim added notes and journals to its dungeons to give them a story. Then Bioware took that idea and... got it all wrong, somehow. I'm not even sure how they managed that. 

 

I know Skyrim caused games to put more focus on the idea of open worlds and the size of their worlds, but vast spaces you're left to explore on your own still hurt the urgency of the main story. TW3's world is beautiful, it's fun to explore, but it always feels weird to roam when you're supposed to be in a hurry to find Ciri or find a way to stop the Wild Hunt. I'm doing a third playthrough at the moment and disabled the question marks on the map for the first time around, but I still tend to look up buildings and ruins on the map and head toward them to see if they contain anything interesting. I've also tried to stick as close to the quest's level requirement as I can and not wait too long to advance the Baron's and the Bog's storyline, but again that leaves me to go all the way to the swamp again once already learning that Ciri could still be in Novigrad, which is in the very opposite direction. 

That's one of the chief flaws of video games as a storytelling medium, player freedom vs story(which also ties into another flaw, bad pacing).

[kaze369]

I still like DA2 considerably more than DA:I, despite all its issues and having been pretty frustrating to play through, especially at release. I guess it's because of the more original aspects it had going for it. The companions carried the game for me, and I enjoyed the friendship/rivalry system. It was not perfectly implemented but a pretty interesting alternative to the traditional approve/disapprove, like/dislike meter. 

While DA:I appears to be better received all around, I... actually find it really hard to find anything to like in it. I like the character creation, but even that is sullied by Bioware's worst attempt at hair ever. I enjoyed Blackwall's character and kinda like what I consider the other better-written characters, Solas, Vivienne and Cole. And that's about it. It was a bore to play and I actually think the writing isn't any better than in DA2. Sure, not everyone goes insane anymore, which is nice, but instead people tend to be just dumb. I used to really enjoy the romances and interactions with companions but some of DA:I's romances left me wondering whether Bioware has started trolling players with them because they tend to be made fun of. 

The lifeless worlds filled with nothing but repetitive and meaningless quests have been mentioned enough. I thought it was a nice sign of showing attention to detail when Skyrim added notes and journals to its dungeons to give them a story. Then Bioware took that idea and... got it all wrong, somehow. I'm not even sure how they managed that. 

 

I know Skyrim caused games to put more focus on the idea of open worlds and the size of their worlds, but vast spaces you're left to explore on your own still hurt the urgency of the main story. TW3's world is beautiful, it's fun to explore, but it always feels weird to roam when you're supposed to be in a hurry to find Ciri or find a way to stop the Wild Hunt. I'm doing a third playthrough at the moment and disabled the question marks on the map for the first time around, but I still tend to look up buildings and ruins on the map and head toward them to see if they contain anything interesting. I've also tried to stick as close to the quest's level requirement as I can and not wait too long to advance the Baron's and the Bog's storyline, but again that leaves me to go all the way to the swamp again once already learning that Ciri could still be in Novigrad, which is in the very opposite direction. 

 

Think of it like searching for someone in western Europe with only a horse and very vague clues. Not to mention Ciri can teleport.

[slimgrin]

That's one of the chief flaws of video games as a storytelling medium, player freedom vs story(which also ties into another flaw, bad pacing).

 

In the lead up to TW3, they strongly hinted they weren't going to do this. But as soon as you leave White Orchard it becomes like Skyrim or any other game in this regard: you have an urgent mission...but let's see if that peasant plays Gwent first. Or what's on top of that hill? Don't I hear some wolves growling over there?

 

I've never known an open world game to crack this particular nut. 

 

 

Edit- Murky Waters?? Lol. TW1 on the brain

[Seboist]

In the lead up to TW3, they strongly hinted they weren't going to do this. But as soon as you leave Murky Waters, it becomes like Skyrim or any other game in this regard: you have an urgent mission...but let's see if that peasant plays Gwent first. Or what's on top of that hill? Don't I hear some wolves growling over there?

 

I've never known an open world game to crack this particular nut. 

One way I can see it being tackled is if the open world was one large territory being fought over by two sides that are constantly trying to advance to capture more territory and you have a limited amount of time before one side ends up overrunning it completely(unless you try to impede their advance to buy yourself more time). I sort of expected TW3 to be loosely like this, but sadly, the war and the politics took a backseat and what little there is, is pretty lackluster.

 

It'd be a tricky thing to pull off with a story heavy game though.

[In Exile]

So I finally finished Blood and Wine. Really liked it. Surprised again by how saccharine it could all be - without intending or realizing it could be different I ended up with a somewhat poignant ending. Kind of like the base game, honestly.