51 réponses à ce sujet

[Andrew Waples]

Meaning their "original voice" would be back and would retain all of the memory that was lost or how would that work? Cassandra seems to remember everything that has happened before when she was made tranquil. Unless for her case the situation was different because she was a non mage and required a different sort of tranquil thing.

[Frikipolleces]

Tranquils do not lose memories (???). They lose their emotions, which is completely different.

 

I'd assume that given enough time they'd be back to normal, but an "untranquil" is extremely unstable and unable to control their emotions. If a mage, that means they're terribly dangerous and prone to possession.

[Andrew Waples]

Tranquils do not lose memories (???). They lose their emotions, which is completely different.

 

I'd assume that given enough time they'd be back to normal, but an "untranquil" is extremely unstable and unable to control their emotions. If a mage, that means they're terribly dangerous and prone to possession.

When talking to the mage that collects the creature research in Skyhold, I believe she says that she use to like animals (puppies?) but she couldn't remember why she liked animals.

[DirkJake]

Pharamond (who successfully reversed his tranquility) did remember his memory but experienced heightened emotional state. 

[Gervaise]

It depends what you mean by normal.    They would have their emotions restored.    Having your emotions again after so long without them can be a bit overwhelming.    However, you can't base everything on how Pharamond reacted because we have no way of knowing if he wasn't an extremely emotional sort before he was made tranquil.   It may have been that he felt (or others felt) that his tendency to emotional outbursts would put him in danger of possession and that is why he was made tranquil.

 

When Karl had his tranquillity reversed by the presence of Justice he seemed okay until he realised it was only temporary and he was losing it again, when he begged Anders to kill him.    Mind you, when the tranquillity was restored, they made it seem like he couldn't remember what had just occurred, which is why people started thinking that it took your memories as well.    When Pharamond was restored he could remember everything from when he was tranquil, including what it felt like to be tranquil.

 

It may be that how tranquillity affects you depends on whether you voluntarily asked for the procedure, whether it was forced on you with you being aware of what was happening (which would be very traumatic and therefore likely to leave permanent scars on the mind if the procedure was reversed) or whether you were made tranquil without being aware that you were (like the Seekers).     In their case it would not seem to occur through an actual physical procedure (the lyrium brand - which was present in DA2 but absent in DAO and DAI) but through the person "emptying themselves of emotion" through a sort of trance state/meditation, which could be why it was easier to entice a spirit from across the veil to touch their mind because they were still connected in some sub-conscious way.

[Frikipolleces]

I think she means she remembers liking them, but not the emotions behind what compelled her to like them, which are forgotten.

Precisely. It's like "I remember trying to eat a butterfly when I was 3 years old, but I don't remember why". She didn't lose her memories, but been fond of animals probably seems pretty absurd to someone who can't empathize with them.

 

So far, there are two mages known to have been cured from tranquility. One is Ander's lover in DA2, who begged him to kill him before he was made tranquil again. The other one is Pharamond, who begged Cole to kill him before he was made tranquil again...

[Master Warder Z_]

Unknown.

The emotional instability may or may not pass.

Cassandra herself said as much.

There you go.

Simple answer.

We don't know.

[Sable Rhapsody]

It would likely depend on how long you'd been Tranquil too.  Karl seemed like he was pretty controlled when he was briefly restored.  And Cass is clearly fine.  But both of them were Tranquil for short periods of time: Cass for a year, and Karl probably for no more than a week since he'd just recently asked Anders for help.

 

I think Pharamond had been Tranquil for much, much longer than either of them, which might account for his later instability.  

[Master Warder Z_]

Again.

It's a unknown.

[Frikipolleces]

Again.

It's a unknown.

Ok, sir, we'll stop speculating. *Thread closed*

[Master Warder Z_]

That'd be just grand.

[Sifr]

It would likely depend on how long you'd been Tranquil too.  Karl seemed like he was pretty controlled when he was briefly restored.  And Cass is clearly fine.  But both of them were Tranquil for short periods of time: Cass for a year, and Karl probably for no more than a week since he'd just recently asked Anders for help.

 

I think Pharamond had been Tranquil for much, much longer than either of them, which might account for his later instability.  

 

You can't really blame Pharamond for being that unstable, poor guy had a major case of survivor guilt over all the people that died due to his experiment going out of hand, coupled with how he'd finally become a whole person again, only for Lambert to yank the rug back from under him and want him to be rendered Tranquil again?

 

That'd be just grand.

 

Warder doesn't like to think of the repurcussions of Tranquility, it ruins the black and white morality for him.

 

[Master Warder Z_]

Warder doesn't like to think of the repurcussions of Tranquility, it ruins the black and white morality for him.

Far from it actually.

I just do not apply speculation to offset a argument on a moral factor to achieve effect.

That's just a weak argument using morality to hide behind.

However many do and actual thought on a matter suffers for it.

[Master Warder Z_]

That said I'm assuming you were speaking in jest to offset you're own argument using such a thing.

[Sifr]

I was only mostly joking...

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm not entirely in favour of some morally ambiguous choices at times, just that Tranquility probably veers to far over the line as far as I'm concerned, since it lacks any real practical purpose (well, aside from the Circle getting some free enchanting and labour) and as a certain Inquisitor noted, it's an "easy" solution that the Templars would rather trot out rather than actually accept the burden of either executing someone or learning to actually find a better way to deal with problem cases?

 

As for the original question, they never lost their memories, although we get a lot of indications that the Tranquil wish that they would.

[Master Warder Z_]

That's not my point.

I'd prefer objective speculation not clouded by personal bias if possible.

For example our dear friend just a few posts ago went out of their way to pin a Seeker in a antagonistic fashion due to them performing their role.

Excusing that the person in question was responsible for a disaster costing dozens of lives.

So no.

My problem isn't with objective reasoning and speculation.

But it being a mask to hide a personal political statement.

I take issue with it in reality too.

[Master Warder Z_]

Objectivity friends.

Not morality.

[Sifr]

That's not my point.

I'd prefer objective speculation not clouded by personal bias if possible.

For example our dear friend just a few posts ago went out of their way to pin a Seeker in a antagonistic fashion due to them performing their role.

 

Lambert was antagonistic, he peformed his role poorly because his heavy handed and strict approach alienated everyone. He'd have buried Pharamond's discovery simply because it would have weakened the Templar's position over the mages if Tranquility was cureable?

 

That's not personal bias, that's accurately stating what happened.

 

But I fear we're repeating the same derailing topic from the other thread?

 

[Master Warder Z_]

From you're perspective possibly.

Or it could have been a tinderbox inside a already raging fire.

That's the problem.

There are many ways to look at a issue.

Hence why I prefer on topics like this anyway for it to be objective if possible.

Clinical.

Detached.

Hence why I answered the actual query in such a fashion.

[ModernAcademic]

Forgive my ignorance, but who's Pharamond and how did he manage the miracle of reversing Tranquility? 

[Master Warder Z_]

Forgive my ignorance, but who's Pharamond and how did he manage the miracle of reversing Tranquility?

Reads asunder

[Lady Artifice]

Forgive my ignorance, but who's Pharamond and how did he manage the miracle of reversing Tranquility? 

 

As Warder mentioned, he's from the novel Asunder. Basically a tranquil's mind being "touched" by a fade spirit can cure a tranquil mage. It turns out, they aren't actually immune to possession, they're just invisible to them in the fade.

 

The trouble is, your mind being touched by a spirit usually means being possessed by one. Then you need to be cured of that. It also turns out having emotions again after not having them for a while is an overwhelming experience and you might have a severe nervous breakdown. 

 

Pharamond, however, is considered to have been a fragile sort of person before the rite, so we don't really know if his reaction would be guaranteed in other people.