258 réponses à ce sujet

[Kakistos_]

It has been confirmed by David Gaider, I believe. That the Architect was a Tevinter Magister, I mean.

Wow. I really wish I had known that before I let him walk...

 

Anyway, was it really confirmed? I recall someone saying that The Architect was the same type of creature as Corypheus. Thats not the same as saying he was infact one of the seven Magisters. Either way, huge implications. More so if there are more than just the original seven powerful, intelligent emissaries.

 

Fair enough, Though I see Why his personality and relationship with the darkspawn Are different from Cory. He (probably) lost his memory.
His powers might be inconsistent with Cory, though it's not necessary that they have the same powers.

It has been stated that of the intelligent Darkspawn encountered that Corypheus was the most powerful, which is why the Grey Wardens singled him out to be captured.

[myahele]

There's also the fact that Cory was asleep for nearly 1,000 years and was shocked at the state of the world once woken. Whereas, Architect had who knows how long (lets say a few decades) to wander the deeproads and contemplate things.

 

It's also interesting that the Priest of Urthemiel in WoT2 appeared apprehensive/ conflicted in Corypheus' plans. He wasn't seeking godhood, initially.

[Urzon]

He got turned inside out by a rift, and was sent into the Fade without his body hopping powers. If he's not dead, he might as well be.

Incoming DLC, The weakened Nightmare fuses itself with the remnants of Cory's torn apart body and spirit. The DLC's name? Corypheus Strikes Back(...Again)!

[Shechinah]

Wow. I really wish I had known that before I let him walk...

 

I believe it was only confirmed afer Corypheus had made his appearance in the franchise so you couldn't have known. People were speculating back in the day and afterwards if he was an atypical emissary or if he was a magister. He genuinely, however, seems to not know why he is different from the other darkspawn and deaf to the song of the Blight hence why I in part consider him likely to be one of the corrupted Magisters of old like Corypheus who seemed unaffected by the song as well.

 

The quote is here; "'Yeah,' Gaider agreed, 'he (the Architect) is the same type of character as Corypheus, absolutely. Whether he pops up again, well, possibly. I think so... I mean obviously not if you killed him.'" - Link is in post #10 (is the Architect actually a Tevinter Magister of old?)

 

 

[Jedi Master of Orion]

The theory that The Architect was a Tevinter was definitely floated around at the time Awakening came out, but I think it was actually the way they introduced Corypheus that made the idea the Architect was a Magister not make as much sense. The entire point of his plan was to free the darkspawn from the Call of the Old Gods. And his plan backfired because his creations turned on him and raised armies against him. The Mother says that he can't hear the music like they can. But Corypheus could talk to Dumat. If The Architect could mimic the call of Old Gods like Corypheus could, then the Mother wouldn't have been a threat to him. Nor would any of the events of Awakening happened if he could influence the Wardens to do his bidding. He wanted their help (or at least their blood) but he had to resort to kidnapping them, which set off the whole chain of events in the game when the Withered attacked Vigil's Keep.

 

I suppose the idea that he lost all him memories explains why his motives and goals and even the species he identifies as is completely different from Corypheus, but I never really thought that idea made a lot of sense. Especially since The Architect didn't appear to be lost and confused. And the fact that he can't seem to influence the wardens isn't even explained by that because that was implied to be instinct that didn't required any conscious effort on Corypheus' part.

 

The fact that his speech pattern was noticeably different from Corypheus' was another big clue, but I noticed they seem to have quietly dropped Corypheus old timey way of talking for Dragon Age Inquisition. 

[In Exile]

The introduction of Corypheus cemented it beyond any reasonable form of doubt. The idea that having a different motivation disqualifies one from being the same type of being doesn't make sense. A communist and capitalist aren't different kinds of entities based on their political views. A management lawyer and a union lawyer aren't different beings because they're on different sides.

Corypheus more importantly can't mimic the call. The Nightmare demon can. The fact that their abilities aren't identical isn't proof of anything. That would be like saying an Ogre isn't a darkspawn because it doesn't look like a genlock mage.

Shale doesn't have her memories. She's not confused. Her values are clear.

And we don't know that the Architect can't influence Wardens. He can't influence the PC but that's different.

[Jedi Master of Orion]

The introduction of Corypheus cemented it beyond any reasonable form of doubt. The idea that having a different motivation disqualifies one from being the same type of being doesn't make sense. A communist and capitalist aren't different kinds of entities based on their political views. A management lawyer and a union lawyer aren't different beings because they're on different sides.

Corypheus more importantly can't mimic the call. The Nightmare demon can. The fact that their abilities aren't identical isn't proof of anything. That would be like saying an Ogre isn't a darkspawn because it doesn't look like a genlock mage.

Shale doesn't have her memories. She's not confused. Her values are clear.

And we don't know that the Architect can't influence Wardens. He can't influence the PC but that's different.

 

Larius specifically says he mimics the call of the Old Gods in Legacy. If the Architect could have influenced the Grey Wardens, he wouldn't have needed send the Withered to Vigil's Keep to obtain their help. The Architect is not confused. But Corypheus was. Even in DAI he couldn't seem to keep his stories about the Golden/Black City straight. 

 

Corypheus was someone who still thought of himself as a Tevinter Magister as opposed a darkspawn. But The Architect not only does not, but he doesn't even know he is or even understand non darkspawn. 

[Kakistos_]

That's another thing. The Architect was able to influence other Darkspawn but could he influence Wardens? Corypheus could influence Wardens but never attempted to influence other Darkspawn which would have granted him another army and subsequently more Wardens when they came to stop them. Also no one, enemies or allies, seemed to be concerned about being infected by the taint via Corypheus. I would have worn gloves while fighting him. Are their abilities regarding the influence they have on the tainted different or are there major oversights on both their parts or just by the writers?

[X Equestris]

That's another thing. The Architect was able to influence other Darkspawn but could he influence Wardens? Corypheus could influence Wardens but never attempted to influence other Darkspawn which would have granted him another army and subsequently more Wardens when they came to stop them. Also no one, enemies or allies, seemed to be concerned about being infected by the taint via Corypheus. I would have worn gloves while fighting him. Are their abilities regarding the influence they have on the tainted different or are there major oversights on both their parts or just by the writers?

It could be related to their outlooks on what they are. Cory never sees himself as a darkspawn after he is awakened in Legacy. The Architect, meanwhile, sort of sees himself as an abnormal darkspawn. It might be that attempting to influence the group they didn't identify with simply didn't occur to them.

[Jedi Master of Orion]

That's another thing. The Architect was able to influence other Darkspawn but could he influence Wardens? Corypheus could influence Wardens but never attempted to influence other Darkspawn which would have granted him another army and subsequently more Wardens when they came to stop them. Also no one, enemies or allies, seemed to be concerned about being infected by the taint via Corypheus. I would have worn gloves while fighting him. Are their abilities regarding the influence they have on the tainted different or are there major oversights on both their parts or just by the writers?

 

The Architect doesn't influence darkspawn in the same way Corypheus does. His army comes from the same way any powerful darkspawn controls others. The Mother is the same way. His whole project is to free them from the song of the old gods. Corypheus influences them the same way the archdemons do.

[Kakistos_]

It could be related to their outlooks on what they are. Cory never sees himself as a darkspawn after he is awakened in Legacy. The Architect, meanwhile, sort of sees himself as an abnormal darkspawn. It might be that attempting to influence the group they didn't identify with simply didn't occur to them.

I'm not sure I buy that. Coyepheus was clearly aware of his connection to the Taint through his manipulation and body snatching of the Wardens. He may not have seen himself as a Darkspawn but why would he pass up another army under his command?

[leaguer of one]

The Architect doesn't influence darkspawn in the same way Corypheus does. His army comes from the same way any powerful darkspawn controls others. The Mother is the same way. His whole project is to free them from the song of the old gods. Corypheus influences them the same way the archdemons do.

Sorry, but nothing shows they are different. 

[VelvetV]

The quote is here; "'Yeah,' Gaider agreed, 'he (the Architect) is the same type of character as Corypheus, absolutely. Whether he pops up again, well, possibly. I think so... I mean obviously not if you killed him.'" - Link is in post #10

 

Judging by this it's not likely we'll see him again. Just maybe a small cameo. Too bad.

[X Equestris]

I'm not sure I buy that. Coyepheus was clearly aware of his connection to the Taint through his manipulation and body snatching of the Wardens. He may not have seen himself as a Darkspawn but why would he pass up another army under his command?

Practical reason: raising a Darkspawn army is the one thing that would likely unite all of Cory's enemies. That disrupts his divide and conquer strategy.

It might also make gaining other allies...problematic. He wants to rule over the world, not a blighted wasteland.

Personal reason: Cory's legendary hubris. Cory may accept that he has the taint, but he completely refuses to see himself as a darkspawn. Raising an army of them might be, in his mind, an admission that he is on the same level as them.

[X Equestris]

Judging by this it's not likely we'll see him again. Just maybe a small cameo. Too bad.

The thing is that Gaider's wording is very tricky. "Obviously not if you kill him." Well, what if you can't actually kill him? If he is a magister (almost certain at this point), he may be able to body-hop, and thus can't be killed

[VelvetV]

The thing is that Gaider's wording is very tricky. "Obviously not if you kill him." Well, what if you can't actually kill him? If he is a magister (almost certain at this point), he may be able to body-hop, and thus can't be killed

 

Does he really think so deep? I'm inclined to view his reply as a simple reply to a simple question. Reading too much into it would be awesome, because I want the Architect to be alive, but taken at face value, his words aren't cryptic at all. He says ok, maybe you'd see a small cameo, but you obviously can't if he's dead.

 

I'm just afraid that searching for a hidden meaning in these words is spurred by nothing but wishful thinking.

[In Exile]

The thing is that Gaider's wording is very tricky. "Obviously not if you kill him." Well, what if you can't actually kill him? If he is a magister (almost certain at this point), he may be able to body-hop, and thus can't be killed

I think he didn't want to show him again because of what happened with Leliana.

[Kakistos_]

Practical reason: raising a Darkspawn army is the one thing that would likely unite all of Cory's enemies. That disrupts his divide and conquer strategy.

It might also make gaining other allies...problematic. He wants to rule over the world, not a blighted wasteland.

Personal reason: Cory's legendary hubris. Cory may accept that he has the taint, but he completely refuses to see himself as a darkspawn. Raising an army of them might be, in his mind, an admission that he is on the same level as them.

And the Demon army wouldn't have united his enemies? Defeating armies of Darkspawn have precedence. Defeating armies of Demons does not and as we know the world powers would ultimately have failed to do so in the dark future. Controlling an army of Darkspawn would not only have given some credence to Corypheus' 'god' schtick, he could have and probably should have used it as a last resort against the Inquisition after they foiled all of his plans, prevented the Demon army and destroyed the one at the Well of Sorrows. At that point he had nothing to lose. He also needent call on the Darkspawn with an intensity resembling a blight. A few pockets of Darkspawn resistence here and there would have aided in his divide and conquer approach.

 

No, I think that there is another reason he didn't call on the Darkspawn: He couldn't. Something has been going on with the Wardens for a while now and I'd bet it has something to do with the events in Awakening. DA2 had a few hints. Avernius' notes to the Hero of Ferelden regarding the power of Warden blood, during the Qunari attack when you run into Stroud/Alistair and or Bethany/Carver they seem rushed and apparently have more pressing issues than a Qunari attack, and in the side quest where Nathaniel makes a cameo with Bethany/Carver he mentions the Wardens "Special Allies" during what was apparently an important mission. This all points to the Wardens reacting to the emergence of these 'awakened' Darkspawn as well as many unknowns culminating in the alleged inter Warden conflict at Weishaupt. Whatever has been going on it probably has had something to do with Corypheus and other such 'awakened' Darkspawn, Magister or otherwise and the ever enigmatic Song.

[Jedi Master of Orion]

Sorry, but nothing shows they are different. 

 

I just listed a whole bunch of things that show they are different.

[VelvetV]

No, I think that there is another reason he didn't call on the Darkspawn: He couldn't. Something has been going on with the Wardens for a while now and I'd bet it has something to do with the events in Awakening.

 

So... The Architect freed the darkspawn? That would be awesome! I knew I didn't put my trust in him for nothing

 

Not that I cared for freeing the darkspawn specifically, but you know what I mean. No archdemons.

 

Btw, earlier in thread or another someone (too bad I can't remember who) said that they found it odd how noone was afraid of catching the Blight from Corypheus. I find it odd, too. Maybe people don't realize that he's a darkspawn? Actually, one reason that he didn't unleash the darkspawn (provided that he could) might've been that if he did, he'd lose all credibility, people would fear him too much to help. I don't really believe in this theory, though, judging by Cory's character he'd hardly give a damn and would've exchanged his present allies for the darkspawn without much regrets.

[X Equestris]

So... The Architect freed the darkspawn? That would be awesome! I knew I didn't put my trust in him for nothing
 
Not that I cared for freeing the darkspawn specifically, but you know what I mean. No archdemons.
 
Btw, earlier in thread or another someone (too bad I can't remember who) said that they found it odd how noone was afraid of catching the Blight from Corypheus. I find it odd, too. Maybe people don't realize that he's a darkspawn? Actually, one reason that he didn't unleash the darkspawn (provided that he could) might've been that if he did, he'd lose all credibility, people would fear him too much to help. I don't really believe in this theory, though, judging by Cory's character he'd hardly give a damn and would've exchanged his present allies for the darkspawn without much regrets.

Most people seem to realize he is a darkspawn and one of the seven Magisters, though.

[Ahriman]

Btw, earlier in thread or another someone (too bad I can't remember who) said that they found it odd how noone was afraid of catching the Blight from Corypheus. I find it odd, too. Maybe people don't realize that he's a darkspawn? Actually, one reason that he didn't unleash the darkspawn (provided that he could) might've been that if he did, he'd lose all credibility, people would fear him too much to help. I don't really believe in this theory, though, judging by Cory's character he'd hardly give a damn and would've exchanged his present allies for the darkspawn without much regrets.

I don't think he ever could comand darkspawn. It's never stated directly, but game gives enough hints on that.

His venatory had to fight darkspawn. His dragon wasn't Archdemon, just a creature corrupted by Cory's power. The Call to Grey Wardens was created by Terror demon.

Speaking of Architect ,he also probably couldn't comand darkspawn himself and used awakened sergeants for that.

[Urzon]

Speaking of Architect ,he also probably couldn't comand darkspawn himself and used awakened sergeants for that.

I think I read he could command Darkspawn, but like other Darkspawn alphas or emissaries, it usually through power, intimidation, and however amount of pull they have through the Taint.

As for whether or not Cory could command the Darkspawn, he was able too before the Grey Wardens imprisoned him. Though, like the Architect, he was probably only able to command a sizable horde/herd of them. Nothing Blight level, but enough to possible conquer a major city or two if deployed well. It might have been possible for him to enhance the size of his "command" I guess though magic and the red lyrium, but we'll never really know now.

http://dragonage.wik...usual_Discovery

Though, we can't really be sure if he retained that ability or not, since he seems to have forgotten everything he did and what happened to him after the Black City incident to the time he was awakened by Hawke.

[Panda]

I think Architect has some authority over darkspawn, but he can't command them nor Wardens. In the Calling he could stop darkspawn from killing humans in the area he was in too, but it always seemed to be done by intimidation rather than mindcontrolling them with song like Cory has done.

[Ahriman]

I think I read he could command Darkspawn, but like other Darkspawn alphas or emissaries, it usually through power, intimidation, and however amount of pull they have through the Taint.

As for whether or not Cory could command the Darkspawn, he was able too before the Grey Wardens imprisoned him. Though, like the Architect, he was probably only able to command a sizable horde/herd of them. Nothing Blight level, but enough to possible conquer a major city or two if deployed well. It might have been possible for him to enhance the size of his "command" I guess though magic and the red lyrium, but we'll never really know now.

http://dragonage.wik...usual_Discovery

Hmm, yes, you are right. Though it seems that degree of personality and self-awareness of darkspawn changes over games. In DAO darkpsawn commanders were sort of hivemind retranslators, they even couldn't talk (emissars could though). In DAA they could get personality and will through Awakening. In DAI alphas can talk stuff by default. Cory probably could command darkspawn through force taking role of alpha, since they took him as one of them, but he couldn't really call them like Archdemon.