258 réponses à ce sujet

[Kakistos_]

I'm slightly creeped out that its implied that the Grey Wardens keep the remains of the Archdemon carcasses and some sort of "ancient weapon". We know that will all end well.  Though, Cory being drawn to Dumat's blood does give some credence to the theory that the magisters might play a part in finding and corrupting their corresponding Old God.

The Grey Wardens most definitely keep the remains of Archdemons. It is Archdemon Blood, after all, that is one of the key ingredients in the ritual that creates Grey Wardens, making the Blood, and the rest of the body, an extremely precious resource. I would be surprised if entire carcasses of Archdemons from Blights past haven't been presereved for future use.

 

We don't know exactly what happens when women get turned into broodmothers. I suspect, because the process is quite complicated, that someone devised it. Who that someone was, I don't know, but I bet there was some experimentation going on before they figured out what exactly they had to do to make a tainted woman mutate. 

 

I've heard that some people think that the first broodmother was one of the magisters, but why should all the male magisters be turned into darkspawn and only the women turned into complex ghouls (I suspect there was at least one female magisters from the original seven)? That would be kind of weird. 

I doubt very much that it is complicated. Most Darkspawn are bestial by nature, including the Magisters at one time. The process of reproduction isn't something that has to be experimented, it is instinctual.

 

I don't know what on writerers' minds, but it would be logical, since how else would first darkspawn appear if there were only 7 magisters? Unless hundreds of them  somehow fell of Black City.

The Blight. It spreads like a plague. Even if all seven Magisters were male, they would have quickly tainted many of the women they came into contact with, creating Broodmothers.

 

It's feeding them tainted meat and raping them + something else, if we can believe Hespith's poem. The first two I would attribute to instinctive darkspawn behavior, but the "something else" is what makes me wonder that it actually might be a constructed ritual. 

 

And I actually think that darkspawn existed before the Black City incident, but they lacked a hive mind, which was added when the magisters became darkspawn. Magister listened to the Old Gods -> taint creates an actual connection -> magisters are a bridge for the call of the Old Gods to all darkspawn. Or something like that. I just really hate the idea that the male magisters stayed semi-sentient beings and that the female magisters turned into something reduced to reproduction.

The female Magisters may have transformed into Broodmothers but that doesn't make them any less dangerous. Like Corypheus and possibly the Architect, they probably retained their intelligence and great magical abilities. As the first Darkspawn the Magisters are unique so it is very possible that the female Magisters look and function differently than average Broodmothers. They may even be mobile.

[Jedi Master of Orion]

Darkspawn Tevinter Magisters don't behave the same as ghouls, so I would assume any female magisters that breached the Golden City wouldn't just turn in to Broodmothers.

[Heimdall]

Darkspawn Tevinter Magisters don't behave the same as ghouls, so I would assume any female magisters that breached the Golden City wouldn't just turn in to Broodmothers.

Not normal broodmothers, but that's why I think they gave emissaries unique models. And I wouldn't be so dismissive of Broodmothers anyway. The Mother may have been insane, but she definitely demonstrated how dangerous a sentient broodmother could be.

[myahele]

Razikale (still not blighted i think) is the only Female Old God that we know of, so it would seem appropriate to have at least 1 female magister.

[littlebrightpanda]

Razikale (still not blighted i think) is the only Female Old God that we know of, so it would seem appropriate to have at least 1 female magister.

Razikale isn't blighted yet. Although if the rumors of a new blight brewing in the Anderfels are true...

[myahele]

Well, there might still be a sleeping Old God in Western Approach:

 

Red Templars(Controled by Corypheus) seem to be digging in that area

 

And through the Grey Wardens he'll know their location and kill them as seen in the future scenario.

 

more here: http://forum.bioware...stern-approach/

[Cobra's_back]

 

This is not correct, the Architect is a liar his true purpose was not to help his kind by transforming the Dragon into a disciple but was rather to try to save one of his precious pet, the one that he use to worship.

I killed him and killed his pet forever and without remorse Urthemiel can sing his song into the Oblivion alongside his brothers from now on,it seems that there is another one in the western approach,i will take care of him.

 

 

 

I didn't see the Architect as a good guy as well. I remember the book The Calling he planned to make everyone take the taint.

 

"Using Bregan as well as First Enchanter Remille and his mages to spread the taint through enchantments in the major human cities, the Architect hoped to make all of Thedas take in the taint, despite the fact that this would involve an extraordinary number of deaths of those who could not take the taint. Ultimately, this plan would change the survivors into darkspawn-like hybrids. Its compromise is that it will use the call of the Old Gods to locate and kill them before the darkspawn can find them and turn them into archdemons, thereby ending all future Blights. This is how it gains Bregan's and Genevieve's assistance in its plans.

 

Not a good plan.

[Jedi Master of Orion]

 

This is not correct, the Architect is a liar his true purpose was not to help his kind by transforming the Dragon into a disciple but was rather to try to save one of his precious pet, the one that he use to worship.

I killed him and killed his pet forever and without remorse Urthemiel can sing his song into the Oblivion alongside his brothers from now on,it seems that there is another one in the western approach,i will take care of him.

 

 

So he planted false journals in his lab lamenting that he didn't kill Urthemiel while he slept with the hope that Warden Commander would break out of his cell, kill all his followers and then read it and be convinced he wasn't darkspawn magister and just an intelligent darkspawn emissary?

[Aren]

It seems a shame that such a potentially interesting character as The Architect only got to feature in an expansion. Pity most people killed him off.

An expansion was enough, i do not wish to see again a reused enemy anymore, look at Corypheus from the badass of legacy to the jerk of Inquisition,regardless of his fate Alive or dead i do not wish to see the architect anymore, because he will be ruined and will not be interesting anymore.

[Aren]

So he planted false journals in his lab lamenting that he didn't kill Urthemiel while he slept with the hope that Warden Commander would break out of his cell, kill all his followers and then read it and be convinced he wasn't darkspawn magister and just an intelligent darkspawn emissary?

Unlike Corypheus the architect is clever, very clever, according to World of thedas volume 2 he is the acolyte of Urthemiel dragon of beauty

(this is the reason of his name The Architect),he know the location of all the Old gods, and he is the only one who can reach and kill them very easly

(remember that he possess the disciples that are AD killer like the GW),however despite the fact that there were 4 of them available (Razikale,Lusacan;Serpentine,Urthemiel) he chose the dragon of beauty (the coincidence....), he have never tried to free the darkspawn from their curse in the logical way by killing the old gods,no his purpose was to try to wake his god,

i believe that he remember,he just wish that the Warden commander believe otherwise.

[VelvetV]

An expansion was enough, i do not wish to see again a reused enemy anymore, look at Corypheus from the badass of legacy to the jerk of Inquisition,regardless of his fate Alive or dead i do not wish to see the architect anymore, because he will be ruined and will not be interesting anymore.

 

Do you assume that after DA:O and DA2 there can be no more worthy writing by Bioware and any character they take on will inevitably be ruined? Talk about gloomy

 

Imho, the Architect as a character can't be predicted to be interesting or not. It all depends on what they'll do with him. *shrug*

[Aren]

Do you assume that after DA:O and DA2 there can be no more worthy writing by Bioware and any character they take on will inevitably be ruined? Talk about gloomy

 

Imho, the Architect as a character can't be predicted to be interesting or not. It all depends on what they'll do with him. *shrug*

Thedas have many mysteries, that need to be explored,give concession to someone or something that was already been explored is not interesting and is not mysterious anymore.

[Jedi Master of Orion]

 

Unlike Corypheus the architect is clever, very clever, according to World of thedas volume 2 he is the acolyte of Urthemiel dragon of beauty

(this is the reason of his name The Architect),he know the location of all the Old gods, and he is the only one who can reach and kill them very easly

(remember that he possess the disciples that are AD killer like the GW),however despite the fact that there were 4 of them available (Razikale,Lusacan;Serpentine,Urthemiel) he chose the dragon of beauty (the coincidence....), he have never tried to free the darkspawn from their curse in the logical way by killing the old gods,no his purpose was to try to wake his god,

i believe that he remember,he just wish that the Warden commander believe otherwise.

 

 

If that was his plan it was a stupid plan. He planned for the Warden-Commander to escape and kill all his guys? It basically cost him his war with the Mother.

[Aren]

If that was his plan it was a stupid plan. He planned for the Warden-Commander to escape and kill all his guys? It basically cost him his war with the Mother.

Yes because he has never cared for his guys to begin with they are just mindless monsters (the non disciples)  he have spared the warden commander when it was possible for him to finish the warden into the mine, , as i said he is very clever he needed you so he  spared you.

Have you ever wonder of why he created the mother to begin with? for what purpose?

 He tell to the warden a lie regarding the AD affair,but he never speak about the reason behind the creation of the mother,it was not to "free" her, since the mother was kidnapped when she was a normal human it was to use her.

The architect needed more disciples to further his plans, (remember that one of the Disciples ability is to control  non awakened Darkspawn just like an AD but in a lesser scale) the more disciples would be under his command the more darkspawn he would be capable to control and direct in an intelligent way to the prison of the old gods,however  create a disciple is a difficult task because it require GW blood which is difficult to obtain, Utha being the only resource.

So he has thought to create an intelligent mother that was "in theory" capable to give birth to hundreds of disciples more easly, however an intelligent mother is a mutation and produce only mutated darkspawn,he was unaware of this (the children).

The mother have revealed to posses increadible magic talent (remember she banish you into the fade,same green power of the anchor) and she was capable to control others darkspawn and the children, To that point the only option for the Architect was to ask the warden commander help, otherwise he would have never exposed himself in such a danger

Unlike Corypheus the Architect love to stay away from his enemies, far away,but he was incapable to escape from the mother (tainted creature can percieve each other,so it would be only a matter of time for the mother to achieve her victory).

His only concern to that point was the mother that was the only one capable to kill him.

Into the Dragon bone lands there are 2 key scenes, the first one is the scene in which Seranni is involved, you can see that she is already tainted and that you as a player are not allowed to " kill her", so she escape as a mandatory event.

Then the architect come to you  to try to trick you, is a win win situation for him, because despite of your actions he will survive, even if you kill him and Utha he will just body jump to Seranni that was prepared to be a new host (he his an acolyte he know how to body jup), that is why he expose himself for the first time to danger, he win because the mother is always killed by the Commander.

His next prey probably would be Lusacan in the western approach,he do not hear the calling but he knew where they are because the Orlesian GW senior commander has revealed to him everything.

He doesn't care to help the darkspawn because they are not his kind,he his an ancient acolyte and he will try again with the black city one day

The architect is not Corypheus he plotted even with Duncan,Fiona,Maric and the others Wardens,he plotted with Urthemiel,he plotted with the HoF, he is an evil master mind that love to hide himself under an apparent calm and politeness expression, best villain of the franchise.

[Jedi Master of Orion]

He needed those guys we killed for his war with the Mother. Her forces outnumbered his. He was already desperate enough to launch a doomed attack on Kal'Hirol. Even if he had somehow planned specifically to go out of his way to capture the warden and then sacrifice his entire base to pretend that the Warden escaped on his own instead of using their blood to create more disciples, there would no way he could know the warden would read his journals. 

[Urzon]

The Grey Wardens most definitely keep the remains of Archdemons. It is Archdemon Blood, after all, that is one of the key ingredients in the ritual that creates Grey Wardens, making the Blood, and the rest of the body, an extremely precious resource. I would be surprised if entire carcasses of Archdemons from Blights past haven't been presereved for future use.

 
True, but I think it's also been said that the Joining can also be prepared with regular Darkspawn blood as well, but the blood's Taint needs to be strengthened with lyrium first. So the Archdemon's blood is a key component, but it isn't always needed. Though, if I'm remembering that right, it does shine more light on why red lyrium could definitely by far the most dangerous substance in Thedas at the moment.

Ever expanding extremely potent Blight/Taint... Wonderful...
 

Not normal broodmothers, but that's why I think they gave emissaries unique models. And I wouldn't be so dismissive of Broodmothers anyway. The Mother may have been insane, but she definitely demonstrated how dangerous a sentient broodmother could be.

Plausible. It might help explain their unique model, their increased intelligence compared to regular Darkspawn, their ability to talk, and their extreme devotion to the Old Gods/Archdemons.

[Drasanil]

 

Unlike Corypheus the architect is clever, very clever, according to World of thedas volume 2 he is the acolyte of Urthemiel dragon of beauty

(this is the reason of his name The Architect),he know the location of all the Old gods, and he is the only one who can reach and kill them very easly

(remember that he possess the disciples that are AD killer like the GW),however despite the fact that there were 4 of them available (Razikale,Lusacan;Serpentine,Urthemiel) he chose the dragon of beauty (the coincidence....), he have never tried to free the darkspawn from their curse in the logical way by killing the old gods,no his purpose was to try to wake his god,

i believe that he remember,he just wish that the Warden commander believe otherwise.

 

There were 7 Old Gods and 4 Blights already, meaning there were 3 left not 4. Where did you even get "Old God Serpentine" from any ways? 

[Urzon]

Where did you even get "Old God Serpentine" from any ways?

 

There's no confirmation on whether it's an actual Old God or not, but the speculation of a possible 8th came from...

 

http://dragonage.wik...ation:_Draconis

 

Called "High Dragon" in common parlance, the constellation Draconis is always depicted by a dragon in flight. Recently, it has come into question whether this was the case in the ancient Imperium. Most Tevinter dragon imagery was reserved for the Old Gods, so why would they dedicate a constellation to dragons in general when specific dragons were held in such reverence? This speculation is fueled by older drawings showing Draconis as more serpentine in appearance, perhaps depicting a sea creature or an unknown eighth Old God that was stricken from historical record.

--From A Study of Thedosian Astronomy by Sister Oran Petrarchius

 

[Drasanil]

That's pretty flimsy. 

[littlebrightpanda]

 Plausible. It might help explain their unique model, their increased intelligence compared to regular Darkspawn, their ability to talk, and their extreme devotion to the Old Gods/Archdemons.

 

I still don't like the idea that the female magisters got turned into ghouls, while the men became darkspawn. That's just a weird divide. Humans are supposed to be equal, so why would some of the most powerful women in the ancient world become something different than their peers? 

 

However, we don't know whether all magisters took the taint willingly. We know Cory and Archie did, plus two more, but the others? Maybe that's how they found out how to make broodmothers?

 

I mean, we still don't really understand how emissaries are able to wield magic. Is it similar as to how it works for the other races? Can Darkspawn only wield magic if they are descendant of a presumed magister broodmother? How long do broodmothers survive? 

[Heimdall]

I still don't like the idea that the female magisters got turned into ghouls, while the men became darkspawn. That's just a weird divide. Humans are supposed to be equal, so why would some of the most powerful women in the ancient world become something different than their peers?

I think you're drawing a kinda arbitrary line between ghoul and darkspawn in this case, where both are becoming decidedly unique creatures.

[Drasanil]

 

I still don't like the idea that the female magisters got turned into ghouls, while the men became darkspawn. That's just a weird divide. Humans are supposed to be equal, so why would some of the most powerful women in the ancient world become something different than their peers? 

 

It makes perfect sense for the female magisters (if any) to become broodmothers or something akin to them. Because that's the effect prolonged taint exposure has on women, its how darkspawn reproduce, it's part of their body horror image. You suggesting they should get some sort of arbitrary exemption to darkspawn biology because Bioware decided to make the sexes equal in Thedosian societies is rather silly.

 

 

I mean, we still don't really understand how emissaries are able to wield magic. Is it similar as to how it works for the other races? Can Darkspawn only wield magic if they are descendant of a presumed magister broodmother? How long do broodmothers survive? 

 

Emissaries wield magic by chanelling the power of the taint as opposed to drawing from the fade IIRC. Nobody knows how emissaries come about. And finally, given the taint makes darkspawn immortal unless killed, one would assume broodmothers are the same. 

[wtfman99]

I have World of Thedas Volume 2, there was definitely a reference to the Architect being a magister (and having amnesia).

 

If you really want I can type it out here when I have time, but I'd pretty much like to think it is confirmed at this point. Architect = magister.

[In Exile]

There's no comparison between ghouls and whatever the 7 magisters became when they were altered by crossing into the Fade. Normal ghouls becoming rotting zombies, not immortal demi-gods.

[Reznore57]

There's no comparison between ghouls and whatever the 7 magisters became when they were altered by crossing into the Fade. Normal ghouls becoming rotting zombies, not immortal demi-gods.

 

Yeah ,the 7 magisters are unique .

The funny or not funny thing is they did manage to get some godly powers , they are closer to the archdemons than ghouls , wardens or even darkspawn.

 

I'd like to meet a non delusional magister at one point .I'm frustrated by the Architect conveniant amnesia , and Cory ...well I don't even know what the hell was wrong with him.

All the stories say the magisters were told about the Golden City by Dumat , even in Legacy Cory goes "we were promised blablabla"...he didn't seem very happy about what happened.

In DAI the whole thing is just poof gone , no more talks about the "light" , no trying to find out who pranked him , just "I'm going to be a God" thing.

 

I could befriend a magister darkspawn if he/she would go full Flemeth foaming at the mouth "I was betrayed as the world was betrayed!".

In theory the only really awful thing the magisters did was all the blood sacrifices...the rest wasn't evil at all.

If Dumat and co were speaking to them , well they were invited by their Gods in the city .

The Maker wasn't popular and the Golden city is a squat for whatever god you're following anyway , there's lore about  the Maker , the Elven Gods and the Old gods living there.

 

So yeah I'd like a sane magister who could clearly explain what went on exactly .