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A Character's Appearance is Important


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#1
Winged Silver

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I know it's been done to death, but having yet to hear a response from Bioware in regards to this, I thought I'd throw in another post.

 

A character's appearance is important in an RPG game. And in a Bioware game, the number of options is often vital to the success of creating a character.

 

Although different games have different rates of success for different people, I think it can be said that Bioware creates their games with the intention that people will be able to play a game multiple times, experiencing different outcomes, journeys, personas, etc. Because of this intention, the ability to create a huge variety of characters becomes really important. If I only like 2-3 hairstyles on my characters, that's 2-3 times I can cheerily replay a game, because for me, using the same hairstyle across characters becomes irksome; every time I see the second character's hair, I'm reminded of the first, which kills the immersion for me. 

 

In some games, limited hairstyles aren't a big deal. I play an MMO where classes aren't really a thing. One character can go all the way, in terms of skill trees and talents. So having this one character switch between 2-3 hairstyles isn't such a big deal, because it's unlikely I'll ever really feel the need to create a new character.

 

But for a Bioware game, you can't experience everything in one playthrough. So it becomes much more important that we have the ability to create different looks. I hadn't really put much thought into it until today, when I thought I'd attempt to create a dwarf lady. This quickly became an exercise of frustration for me, as I realized that I'd already used all the hairstyles I thought decent, and that I'd either have to put her in something I found distasteful, or deal with her resembling one of my other characters. 

 

I know there are people out there who are talented enough to create huge disparities in the facial structures of characters, that even with the same hairstyles, they look dissimilar. I am not one of those people. 

 

This is also something I feel applies to the general outfits. In Mass Effect, I greatly enjoyed having my Sheps dress appropriately to their class and background (an engineer might wear the engineer's outfit, or someone who was born with military parents might take the matters of dress protocol more seriously and wear their official uniform more often). Having the ability to change things up a little across playthroughs really helps I think, in regards to keeping a game fresh across each playthrough, and with a game as long as Inquisition (long if you try to do most to all of it, which was how I experienced it), the little changes across playthroughs can really help.

 

I also know that for some, it's not really a big deal, and it's strange how it may seem a big deal to others. In which case, you're luckier than I, as it's something that's continues to bother me.

 

Anyway, that's my two cents. I hope we hear something from Bioware soon.

 

Edit: Something extra, and a picture:

Spoiler

 

And here are the styles that are currently in the game, for reference:

Spoiler

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#2
BansheeOwnage

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If I only like 2-3 hairstyles on my characters, that's 2-3 times I can cheerily replay a game, because for me, using the same hairstyle across characters becomes irksome; every time I see the second character's hair, I'm reminded of the first, which kills the immersion for me. 


 This quickly became an exercise of frustration for me, as I realized that I'd already used all the hairstyles I thought decent, and that I'd either have to put her in something I found distasteful, or deal with her resembling one of my other characters.

Perfectly said. I second that appearance is extremely important in an RPG, and especially a Bioware one. Someone even posted an article about exactly that. I only like the 2 shoulder-length hairs, so I feel your pain. Now that I've finished 2 playthroughs, I can't make a new character without resembling an old one, or not liking their appearance. And that's a big deal when you're going to be seeing them for dozens of hours.

 

As I've said before, something that is especially disappointing in any sequel (or game made by the same company) are things that are done worse than previous games. You highlighted the outfits from ME, and the hair in DA definitely fits as well. Combine 2 of the most universally-held disappointments in the game (hair and Skyhold outfit) and customization and appearance is hit pretty hard. I was hoping the BE would add something in terms of appearance, be it an armour toggle, tinting for the Skyhold outfit, hair, anything.

 

I maintain that your complaints are valid for a number of reasons:

 

1. The overwhelming response from players even before release, yielding no results so far.

2. The fact that previous games did these things much better.

3. The fact that modders have been successfully implementing new hair and outfits since launch, in their own time (driven by the fact that what we have is so bad, I would assume) while an entire team of professionals hasn't improved the situation at all or even commented on it in 6 months.

 

I feel for you :(


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#3
caradoc2000

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A character's appearance is important in an RPG game.

Which is why the Witcher series is so popular... Oh, the unlimited customizability options available to the character... :rolleyes:


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#4
Gileadan

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These days it seems popular to mix up "character creator" with "face customizer". 

 

I can create great faces in DA:I. (there is that one hair style I find okay... :D)

I can create great characters in PoE.



#5
CathyMe

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Which is why the Witcher series is so popular... Oh, the unlimited customizability options available to the character... :rolleyes:


The frequency with which the Witcher is brought up in this forum is getting irksome. -.-
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#6
KaiserShep

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I think what makes it even worse here is that you technically have two characters to potentially customize, so if there's only like two hairstyles you like in the entire lineup, and maybe two sets of eyebrows, that's it for Inky and Hawke lol.


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#7
Gileadan

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I think what makes it even worse here is that you technically have two characters to potentially customize, so if there's only like two hairstyles you like in the entire lineup, and maybe two sets of eyebrows, that's it for Inky and Hawke lol.

You know what's great about male characters? There's also one beard I like! Plus, different hair colors!


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#8
CathyMe

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I think what makes it even worse here is that you technically have two characters to potentially customize, so if there's only like two hairstyles you like in the entire lineup, and maybe two sets of eyebrows, that's it for Inky and Hawke lol.


Well, if the quizzie is human, you can headconnon that they are related, if you try hard enough :P

#9
BansheeOwnage

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Which is why the Witcher series is so popular... Oh, the unlimited customizability options available to the character... :rolleyes:

That's one of the reasons I would hesitate to call The Witcher an RPG.

 

The frequency with which the Witcher is brought up in this forum is getting irksome. -.-

Agreed.

 

I think what makes it even worse here is that you technically have two characters to potentially customize, so if there's only like two hairstyles you like in the entire lineup, and maybe two sets of eyebrows, that's it for Inky and Hawke lol.

Haha that's very true! And really sad. My first playthrough I stuck with default Hawke so I wouldn't lose my voice (why oh why can't she look like default Hawke from DA2?! What have you done with your hair?! :angry:). My second playthrough, I used both shoulder-length styles, one for my Quizzy and one for Hawke. Now I'm twice as stumped about what to do next playthrough. Another thing: If we actually had the hair from DA2/DA:O, we would not only have much better styles, but we could actually make Hawke look like Hawke! :mellow:


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#10
BansheeOwnage

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Well, if the quizzie is human, you can headconnon that they are related, if you try hard enough :P

Well, Hawke was related to the Warden if you're an Amell, and Dorian is related to Trevelyan (very, very distantly) so you never know!



#11
CathyMe

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Well, Hawke was related to the Warden if you're an Amell, and Dorian is related to Trevelyan (very, very distantly) so you never know!

Exactly :D The travelyans and pavus have a common ancestor. Maybe the amell and travelyans do too.

#12
BansheeOwnage

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Exactly :D The travelyans and pavus have a common ancestor. Maybe the amell and travelyans do too.

Not unlikely :) Anyway, you all know how it's a bit immersion breaking when your PC looks exactly like every other person's PC except for their face? Or every NPC? Well, it's turned up to 11 in Inquisition now that everyone wears the skin-tight Skyhold outfit. At least when you can wear different stuff it not only makes characters a bit more unique, but baggier clothes (among tight clothes) don't highlight the fact that everyone has the same measurements.



#13
SardaukarElite

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The frequency with which the Witcher is brought up in this forum is getting irksome. -.-

 

It's like an accelerated and more volatile version of Godwin's law.



#14
Winged Silver

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Which is why the Witcher series is so popular... Oh, the unlimited customizability options available to the character... :rolleyes:

 

The Witcher has a set character. The story, though you have options within it, is Geralt's. In a Bioware game though, that is not the case. There isn't a set character with a set appearance. There may be defaults offered, but ultimately, the story revolves around your character, which you may create. So, given how Bioware designs their games, I feel the appearance is important. If you feel differently, and the lack of options doesn't bother you, like I said, lucky for you.


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#15
Winged Silver

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Perfectly said. I second that appearance is extremely important in an RPG, and especially a Bioware one. Someone even posted an article about exactly that. I only like the 2 shoulder-length hairs, so I feel your pain. Now that I've finished 2 playthroughs, I can't make a new character without resembling an old one, or not liking their appearance. And that's a big deal when you're going to be seeing them for dozens of hours.

 

As I've said before, something that is especially disappointing in any sequel (or game made by the same company) are things that are done worse than previous games. You highlighted the outfits from ME, and the hair in DA definitely fits as well. Combine 2 of the most universally-held disappointments in the game (hair and Skyhold outfit) and customization and appearance is hit pretty hard. I was hoping the BE would add something in terms of appearance, be it an armour toggle, tinting for the Skyhold outfit, hair, anything.

 

I maintain that your complaints are valid for a number of reasons:

 

1. The overwhelming response from players even before release, yielding no results so far.

2. The fact that previous games did these things much better.

3. The fact that modders have been successfully implementing new hair and outfits since launch, in their own time (driven by the fact that what we have is so bad, I would assume) while an entire team of professionals hasn't improved the situation at all or even commented on it in 6 months.

 

I feel for you :(

 

I've been keeping an eye on posts made by yourself and other's regarding this. There were so many good points brought up, and it's a little disheartening to see no response made to them. But hey, I'm sure they'll have to respond someday :P

 

Thank you for bringing in some more points, particularly about how Bioware has proven they're capable of introducing that level of customization in past games. The thought hadn't fully realized in my head. I hope they address the issues soon.



#16
caradoc2000

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Sarcasm is so underrated these days.



#17
SnakeCode

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I think there's a bit of nostalgia going on if people thought the character creators were any better in past Bioware titles. Ever tried to make a custom male Shepard in any of the Mass Effect games? I get nightmares just thinking about it. The hair made the selection we have in Inquisition look amazing  by comparison, and stubble that only went halfway up his jaw leaving a big gap between where it ended and the sideburns started. Add in the really odd facial structures, and It was difficult to get a custom male shepard to look human, never mind good.

 

At least with Inquisition it's only the hair that looks bad, which is something Bioware have never been able to do anyway. Other than that it's by far the best character creator they've ever done. Characters don't look like corpses (Origins, which also suffered from "my beard isn't attached to my face!") or like they're made out of play dough (DA2.)


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#18
Winged Silver

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I think there's a bit of nostalgia going on if people thought the character creators were any better in past Bioware titles. Ever tried to make a custom male Shepard in any of the Mass Effect games? I get nightmares just thinking about it. The hair made the selection we have in Inquisition look amazing  by comparison, and stubble that only went halfway up his jaw leaving a big gap between where it ended and the sideburns started. It was difficult to get a custom male shepard to look human, never mind good.

 

At least with Inquisition it's only the hair that looks bad, which is something Bioware have never been able to do anyway. Other than that it's by far the best character creator they've ever done. Characters don't look like corpses (Origins, which also suffered from "my beard isn't attached t my face!") or like they're made out of play dough (DA2.)

 

I agree with Broshep bit...it took me ages to figure out how to make a custom male shep who's appearance I could tolerate. 

 

I also agree that Inquisition is by far Bioware's best presentation of a CC, given how much variety there is to be found within the facial structure. But I also feel that that is also where the lack of variety in the hair options becomes jarringly disparate. 


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#19
DSiKn355

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Why is there no black hair? Blue?? And I mean blatant blue which stands out too much lol.

 

And my god the beards look 8bit in comparison to the rest of the face!


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#20
Gileadan

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One of the problems with ME1 Shepard was that apparently the "gameplay"-face was at a much lower detail level than the "close up"-face...which left you at least partly at the mercy of whatever algorithm created that effect.

 

And DA always had this weird lighting going on during character creation... there's not one DA game where one of my first thoughts at the start of my playthrough wasn't "I picked what eye color??"


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#21
SnakeCode

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I agree with Broshep bit...it took me ages to figure out how to make a custom male shep who's appearance I could tolerate. 

 

I also agree that Inquisition is by far Bioware's best presentation of a CC, given how much variety there is to be found within the facial structure. But I also feel that that is also where the lack of variety in the hair options becomes jarringly disparate. 

 

Yeah, agreed that having the hair still being awful despite an otherwise fantastic CC makes the bad hair stand out more than it otherwise would. I can't see this changing anytime soon though, as Bioware don't look to be improving in this regard even as the technology does.

 

The only way I cold see them doing it is by outsourcing the work to a team like NVIDIA Hairworks or AMD TressFX, but that's going to be too costly for a Bioware game I think.



#22
BansheeOwnage

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I think there's a bit of nostalgia going on if people thought the character creators were any better in past Bioware titles. Ever tried to make a custom male Shepard in any of the Mass Effect games? I get nightmares just thinking about it. The hair made the selection we have in Inquisition look amazing  by comparison, and stubble that only went halfway up his jaw leaving a big gap between where it ended and the sideburns started. Add in the really odd facial structures, and It was difficult to get a custom male shepard to look human, never mind good.

 

At least with Inquisition it's only the hair that looks bad, which is something Bioware have never been able to do anyway. Other than that it's by far the best character creator they've ever done. Characters don't look like corpses (Origins, which also suffered from "my beard isn't attached t my face!") or like they're made out of play dough (DA2.)

Well, they should always aim to improve, right? And they did, with the CC. It's spectacular. This thread doesn't disagree, it's just highlighting of of its aspects that is rather bad. And it's a very important aspect. I'm sure we would all be happy if the level of improvement for hair was the same as the CC mechanics.

 

Edit: Also, what you said about the great CC highlighting the terrible hair.



#23
Panda

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And then there is race like qunari who doesn't have any decent hairstyles :?


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#24
Chardonney

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At least with Inquisition it's only the hair that looks bad, which is something Bioware have never been able to do anyway.

 

I think you're forgetting the eyebrows. Even thought the hair collection is bad, the eyebrows are even worse.


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#25
DSiKn355

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And if you choose a deep voice your character sounds like some kind of monster when jumping across certain terrain despite being human lol