297 réponses à ce sujet

[In Exile]

I understand realism is important. I believe the core problem is why a person plays. It is a game to me. I never see the characters as real. You follow a conversation tree to get the results you want. That is not real. I don't play the game for that.

Robert said it correctly: "Love making is what I did in my bedroom."

I actually want to follow up on that quote: calling it " love making" and doing it in the bedroom, versus it ***** and doing it in the kitchen while handcuffing your partner to a table, versus doing it in sex club with four other people, is reflective of your character. To say that sex doesn't have a role in plot driven character stories is wrong.

[robertthebard]

How people have sex can be quite illustrating of their character and arc. The apparent SM scene with IB being the sole attempt by Bioware to do this mind you and partly played for laughs, but still a character movement versus just pixels. It fits a lot with his character (see him wanting to get hit to work out his feelings about the Abyss quest).

...and yet, those are examples of things that are already represented in game. Josie has no sex scene, which, to me, seems to fit well with her character and the romance arc, it's actually a romance arc, instead of a "get laid" arc. If this is the basis for this topic, then no, I'm against the whole idea; Josie's arc represents getting a little something for everyone in the game, and that's better than assuaging the "not enough naked bits" argument.

[In Exile]

...and yet, those are examples of things that are already represented in game. Josie has no sex scene, which, to me, seems to fit well with her character and the romance arc, it's actually a romance arc, instead of a "get laid" arc. If this is the basis for this topic, then no, I'm against the whole idea; Josie's arc represents getting a little something for everyone in the game, and that's better than assuaging the "not enough naked bits" argument.

I'm not taking the view Bioware needs to do more per set; I don't particularly care either way as long as the content is serving a narrative purpose. I just object to the idea that a sex scene in a game is always gratuitous no matter the design or that people who are of the view such scenes should be included do it because they want "AI pixel sex".

[Ilwerin]

So now you are saying that Bioware needs to put out games that many adult can't play. Many adults have kids. Can they be careful about certain scenes? Yes they can. Are they possible buyers and does Bioware want to cut them out? This market may not be interested in Cyber AIs getting it on. Bioware may still want to sell to them.

 

Your answer is to cut that group out. Less dollars for Bioware. Good thing you don't control their marketing.

 

Parents should indeed exercise discretion. That that even comes into question boggles my mind. However, denying someone the ability to play a game because they have kids isn't something I'm down with. So no, I'm not really agreeing with the premise.

 

No, you both are uncomfortable watching making love in games, it is your right and you can skip those scenes by pressing esc. But your arguments "oh, what about our children!" is absolutely silly! I have two little children and I play only when they sleep = in my free time... no, I really do not feel I am beeing denyied to play a game... Maybe these parents should spend more time with their children and less with video games - one day they could be surprised what they are watching in TV in the other room (tv series full of violence since very morning, great, but no sex, so you are Ok with that)...

Besides nudity is natural for children. So what bother you? That they can see naked breasts or two men hugging and kissing? Isn't it nice? They love each other like mum and dad... no problem with that. What has bad impact on little children is hectolitres of blood and killing - because they do not understand why are people hurting each other. That is bad...

 

And again, no one here is talking about actual porn in games.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

No, you both are uncomfortable watching making love in games, it is your right and you can skip those scenes by pressing esc.

To be fair, the scenes involving nudity in DAI weren't able to be skipped just by pressing esc. Instead there was dialogue you had to go through while there was nudity on the screen. Same goes for some other games, like the Witcher franchise.

[KaiserShep]

Speaking of dialogue, I feel like that gets lost in the whole discussion about sex scenes, because it's not as if the characters are just pumping away at each other or something. They're actually having a conversation about how they feel, or possibly having an amusing exchange, like in Sera's case. Like, in Cassandra's scene, if you don't remember anything she says just because the two of them are lying there naked, that's more a problem on the part of the viewer than anything.

[In Exile]

Speaking of dialogue, I feel like that gets lost in the whole discussion about sex scenes, because it's not as if the characters are just pumping away at each other or something. They're actually having a conversation about how they feel, or possibly having an amusing exchange, like in Sera's case. Like, in Cassandra's scene, if you don't remember anything she says just because the two of them are lying there naked, that's more a problem on the part of the viewer than anything.

 

And with Cassandra you get variable dialogue based on your race and your beliefs. Which is something (e.g. they'll say I went bonkers and got seduced by a Qunari heretic). 

[KaiserShep]

I really like that line "...they will say that I was seduced by the wiles of a qunari madman."

[robertthebard]

No, you both are uncomfortable watching making love in games, it is your right and you can skip those scenes by pressing esc. But your arguments "oh, what about our children!" is absolutely silly! I have two little children and I play only when they sleep = in my free time... no, I really do not feel I am beeing denyied to play a game... Maybe these parents should spend more time with their children and less with video games - one day they could be surprised what they are watching in TV in the other room (tv series full of violence since very morning, great, but no sex, so you are Ok with that)...
Besides nudity is natural for children. So what bother you? That they can see naked breasts or two men hugging and kissing? Isn't it nice? They love each other like mum and dad... no problem with that. What has bad impact on little children is hectolitres of blood and killing - because they do not understand why are people hurting each other. That is bad...
 
And again, no one here is talking about actual porn in games.

Perhaps, before you try to tell me how comfortable or uncomfortable I am about nudity, you should have a little background? I was a bouncer in strip clubs for a decade, that's 10 years, not sure why I feel the need to explain that, but strangely, I do. Let me ask you, is that a job someone uncomfortable with nudity could handle? Once again, the uninformed step up and try to "educate" the unwashed masses, eh? My example is something that can happen no matter what kind of time parents spend with their children, so again, we have the uninformed trying to "educate" us, right?

So, since you didn't address my question, despite me clearly laying it out, I'll try once again:

What is it that more nudity will actually bring to the game? Is there some reason that you can't address this point?

[Ilwerin]

To be fair, the scenes involving nudity in DAI weren't able to be skipped just by pressing esc. Instead there was dialogue you had to go through while there was nudity on the screen. Same goes for some other games, like the Witcher franchise.

Dialog parts no, but I meant the other - but it was a presumption, I never skipped anything.

 

 

Perhaps, before you try to tell me how comfortable or uncomfortable I am about nudity, you should have a little background? I was a bouncer in strip clubs for a decade, that's 10 years, not sure why I feel the need to explain that, but strangely, I do. Let me ask you, is that a job someone uncomfortable with nudity could handle? Once again, the uninformed step up and try to "educate" the unwashed masses, eh? My example is something that can happen no matter what kind of time parents spend with their children, so again, we have the uninformed trying to "educate" us, right?

So, since you didn't address my question, despite me clearly laying it out, I'll try once again:

What is it that more nudity will actually bring to the game? Is there some reason that you can't address this point?

You mentioned your background few times here already And it says nothing - I haven't said you are uncomfortable with nudity in RL and it doesn't mean you are ok with nudity in games or TV. But there are such people of course and they have / could have the possibility to not romance anyone or not go so far (another discussion about this on different topic). Besides, you are talking about nudity and sex scenes like game contains hours of such things.... no, they are only few moments and you can easily "protect" children from seeing them - tv / monitors have turn off button

 

Do you have children? I have - so I know.

 

As for your question - more nudity in the right time on the right place adds to more realistic and less awkward (ME3) impression of the game. I really do not understand what is so offensive on naked breasts and buttocks.

[Gold Dragon]

I can only think of two times in Inquisition when "the F bomb" get's used, and both of them are Blackwall.

Dorian says it once during his meeting with his father.

[Cantina]

What is it that more nudity will actually bring to the game? Is there some reason that you can't address this point?

 

I've played many games where there was no nudity.

 

How about Bioshock?

 

No nudity in the game but the violence was increased.

 

I have no issues with nudity in or out of a game. However it seems people find nudity in games evil yet there OK with some Big Daddy shoving his drill hand in a Splicer and spewing his guts all over the room.

 

So....

 

What is it that violence will actually bring to the game?

[robertthebard]

Dialog parts no, but I meant the other - but it was a presumption, I never skipped anything.
 
 
You mentioned your background few times here already And it says nothing - I haven't said you are uncomfortable with nudity in RL and it doesn't mean you are ok with nudity in games or TV. But there are such people of course and they have / could have the possibility to not romance anyone or not go so far (another discussion about this on different topic). Besides, you are talking about nudity and sex scenes like game contains hours of such things.... no, they are only few moments and you can easily "protect" children from seeing them - tv / monitors have turn off button
 
Do you have children? I have - so I know.
 
As for your question - more nudity in the right time on the right place adds to more realistic and less awkward (ME3) impression of the game. I really do not understand what is so offensive on naked breasts and buttocks.

So what's the "right time and the right place" then, in every romance because reasons? I've addressed this already, in Josie's case for sure, it gives a little something for everyone, and there's no need to "fix" something that isn't broken. You see, you're coming at this like I'm somehow offended by what nudity we did get. This isn't the case. My question was, and still largely is, what would it add. Your answer doesn't persuade me that it would add anything to what we already have. As I said earlier, taking all romances into consideration, we already have nudity equal to what we had in, and I believe it was your example, Starship Troopers. There is nothing narrative wise to be gained from additional scenes, and nothing that will drive the story forward. Josie's romance arc suits her character to a tee, as does both Cassandra's and Sera's. So I don't see anything that's broken in what we got.

[robertthebard]

I've played many games where there was no nudity.
 
How about Bioshock?
 
No nudity in the game but the violence was increased.
 
I have no issues with nudity in or out of a game. However it seems people find nudity in games evil yet there OK with some Big Daddy shoving his drill hand in a Splicer and spewing his guts all over the room.
 
So....
 
What is it that violence will actually bring to the game?

Considering the game we're playing, self preservation, as far as the character is concerned. You see, the problem with falling back to "but there's violence in the game, so there should be lots of nudity", which is the way this position comes across, is that we're fighting a war, not playing a dating sim. Romances are bonus content, and they were handled rather well. So no, this argument isn't convincing me that we need more nudity. In fact, there's really no argument here, is there? Just an expertly handled deflection to "but violence...".

[KaiserShep]

What is it that more nudity will actually bring to the game?

 

I suppose the simple answer would be: more nudity. I think that it also depends on the context. In Inquisition, since nudity is used solely as a means to establish intimacy between two characters, it doesn't really seem to serve much purpose beyond that in this particular game. Now, if it was a different kind of setting, like, for instance, there's a raid in a brothel and its patrons are violently forced out, then it would make sense to see some nudity here and there amidst the chaos, sort of a Game of Thrones type of moment.

[Cantina]

Considering the game we're playing, self preservation, as far as the character is concerned. You see, the problem with falling back to "but there's violence in the game, so there should be lots of nudity", which is the way this position comes across, is that we're fighting a war, not playing a dating sim. Romances are bonus content, and they were handled rather well. So no, this argument isn't convincing me that we need more nudity. In fact, there's really no argument here, is there? Just an expertly handled deflection to "but violence...".

 

No I am not saying that all. I am saying I find it idiotic that people are fine with violence but goodness forbid if a woman flashes her breasts on screen.

 

I am fully aware romances in this game are bonus content. Thanks for pointing that out <rolls eyes>. Romances in game are there to add realism. There are people like me who do RP in games like these. However I felt the romance scenes where pretty tame compared to those seen on everyday T.V. Thus I find it hard to label it as sexual content when really it was not. Does that mean I want hardcore porn? No, of course not.  Now sex scenes in games like The Witcher...that is sexual content...seeing Cassandra's breasts is not sexual content.

[KaiserShep]

Yeah, only one scene that I'm aware of here even hints at a specific sex act. I haven't seen any Witcher sex scenes, but DA:I's scenes exclude the visceral stuff and focus primarily on the character dialogue.

 

I think something to consider is that leaving a lot to the imagination allows you to have your own personal view of how your character would approach sex and intimacy rather than having the game decide that sort of thing for you. Like, imagine if Cassandra's scene was a full-on sex scene, and they just decided to throw in a full on doggy style bit. Like, what if you don't care for that sort of thing and didn't want your character to do it? It'd be pretty awkward lol.

[robertthebard]

Yeah, only one scene that I'm aware of here even hints at a specific sex act. I haven't seen any Witcher sex scenes, but DA:I's scenes exclude the visceral stuff and focus primarily on the character dialogue.

Which is what BioWare does well. Also yeah, raiding a brothel, it would make sense to see some nudity, that's what a brothel is about.

No I am not saying that all. I am saying I find it idiotic that people are fine with violence but goodness forbid if a woman flashes her breasts on screen.
 
I am fully aware romances in this game are bonus content. Thanks for pointing that out <rolls eyes>. Romances in game are there to add realism. There are people like me who do RP in games like these. However I felt the romance scenes where pretty tame compared to those seen on everyday T.V. Thus I find it hard to label it as sexual content when really it was not. Does that mean I want hardcore porn? No, of course not.  Now sex scenes in games like The Witcher...that is sexual content...seeing Cassandra's breasts is not sexual content.

Romances are not there to add realism, they are there to add a connection to the people you are involved with, unless you're trying to tell me that every army camp around the world is full of naked people all the time? Use caution here, I've actually served, and happen to know better, for the most part, and that fraternizing with fellow soldiers can get you in trouble.

It would seem, however, that your biggest complaint is that this isn't The Witcher series. I understand they have three games out now, maybe your needs will be better met there? I can't speak for 3, I haven't purchased it yet, although, since I own the previous two, I'm likely to sooner or later, but I do know that Triss has a nice ass. Oh, and seeing it didn't offend me in the least bit, and I even commented on it, out loud I'd guess by the fact that my cat came to see who I was talking to. Nudity for the sake of nudity? It's not something that BioWare needs to spend a lot of time on, unless they decide they want to go that way. So long as it makes sense for the story, it doesn't bother me.

[In Exile]

Yeah, only one scene that I'm aware of here even hints at a specific sex act. I haven't seen any Witcher sex scenes, but DA:I's scenes exclude the visceral stuff and focus primarily on the character dialogue.

 

I think something to consider is that leaving a lot to the imagination allows you to have your own personal view of how your character would approach sex and intimacy rather than having the game decide that sort of thing for you. Like, imagine if Cassandra's scene was a full-on sex scene, and they just decided to throw in a full on doggy style bit. Like, what if you don't care for that sort of thing and didn't want your character to do it? It'd be pretty awkward lol.

 

And now you've basically seen TW2's sex scenes. Well, some of them. 

[WikipediaBrown]

Perhaps, before you try to tell me how comfortable or uncomfortable I am about nudity, you should have a little background? I was a bouncer in strip clubs for a decade, that's 10 years, not sure why I feel the need to explain that, but strangely, I do. Let me ask you, is that a job someone uncomfortable with nudity could handle? Once again, the uninformed step up and try to "educate" the unwashed masses, eh? My example is something that can happen no matter what kind of time parents spend with their children, so again, we have the uninformed trying to "educate" us, right?

So, since you didn't address my question, despite me clearly laying it out, I'll try once again:

What is it that more nudity will actually bring to the game? Is there some reason that you can't address this point?

 

Sir. No one cares if you are a strip club bouncer, a gay trapeze artist, or a member of the Westboro Baptist Church. What you are not is the final arbiter of what can or cannot be included in the game. People do not need to defend their position on nudity in games to you. Everyone is allowed to have an opinion, not just you.

 

In my opinion it's silly that characters should have to be fully clothed before talking about their relationship because people find naked body parts icky.

 

We are all faceless strangers shouting into the void that is the Bioware forums in the vain hope that some Bioware employee is listening. 

[Cantina]

Romances are not there to add realism, they are there to add a connection to the people you are involved with, unless you're trying to tell me that every army camp around the world is full of naked people all the time? Use caution here, I've actually served, and happen to know better, for the most part, and that fraternizing with fellow soldiers can get you in trouble.

It would seem, however, that your biggest complaint is that this isn't The Witcher series. I understand they have three games out now, maybe your needs will be better met there? I can't speak for 3, I haven't purchased it yet, although, since I own the previous two, I'm likely to sooner or later, but I do know that Triss has a nice ass. Oh, and seeing it didn't offend me in the least bit, and I even commented on it, out loud I'd guess by the fact that my cat came to see who I was talking to. Nudity for the sake of nudity? It's not something that BioWare needs to spend a lot of time on, unless they decide they want to go that way. So long as it makes sense for the story, it doesn't bother me.

 

I would reply but....

 

This makes no damn sense

 

and

 

I have no further need to try to justify my opinion when my opinion cannot be respected nor properly understood.

 

<shakes head>.

[Uccio]

Considering the game we're playing, self preservation, as far as the character is concerned. *snip*

 

Just stepping in on this part. Not really since most of the game the pc is the one advancing in the area showing up as a aggressor. The self preservation is reserved for the countless of mooks who attack the inquisitor to protect their territory.

[robertthebard]

Sir. No one cares if you are a strip club bouncer, a gay trapeze artist, or a member of the Westboro Baptist Church. What you are not is the final arbiter of what can or cannot be included in the game. People do not need to defend their position on nudity in games to you. Everyone is allowed to have an opinion, not just you.
 
In my opinion it's silly that characters should have to be fully clothed before talking about their relationship because people find naked body parts icky.
 
We are all faceless strangers shouting into the void that is the Bioware forums in the vain hope that some Bioware employee is listening.

...and if they're listening and say "No"? It's odd, to me, that you run around naked all day talking about your relationships. Do you do this with every relationship? Doesn't that get kind of awkward if you're talking to a sibling about the next family camping trip?
 

I would reply but....
 
This makes no damn sense
 
and
 
I have no further need to try to justify my opinion when my opinion cannot be respected nor properly understood.
 
<shakes head>.

So far, "It's not the Witcher" is your opinion. Yes, logic is hard, and people that aren't likely to just curl up under their desk because somebody called them a prude are hard to deal with, especially when they don't even care about how much nudity there is or isn't, but just want to figure out what adding more would actually add to the game.

So far, I think that Kaiser pretty much hit the nail on the head for the purpose of this thread:

I suppose the simple answer would be: more nudity. I think that it also depends on the context. In Inquisition, since nudity is used solely as a means to establish intimacy between two characters, it doesn't really seem to serve much purpose beyond that in this particular game. Now, if it was a different kind of setting, like, for instance, there's a raid in a brothel and its patrons are violently forced out, then it would make sense to see some nudity here and there amidst the chaos, sort of a Game of Thrones type of moment.

So it would add more nudity, and that's it. Nothing to drive the story, nothing to add to the narrative, just more nudity. So really, considering what we actually got, it would serve absolutely no purpose.

[robertthebard]

Just stepping in on this part. Not really since most of the game the pc is the one advancing in the area showing up as a aggressor. The self preservation is reserved for the countless of mooks who attack the inquisitor to protect their territory.

Here's what you do then, since you believe the PC is the aggressor. Walk into the Templar camp in the Hinterlands, and see if they offer you some tea.

[Uccio]

Aren´t you intruding a military operation camp then in a state of war?

 

Besides, you don´t need to show violence in the game. Your pc is supposed to pass each combat to advance the game, therefore you don´t need to see it. You could have instavictory button and not see the unnecessary violence.