92 réponses à ce sujet

[Ashaantha]

I'm going to be that person and point out it is a song sung in the Chantry based on Cole's chat about Roderick's last thoughts (if you went with mages) after recruiting him in Skyhold.

Spoiler

C: Roderick was sorry before he died

I: Did he tell you why he was sorry?

C: Blood everywhere, monsters, madness dying. we're all dying. The Herald stands against it and heads turn. Desperate and simple. Pure.

Voices in the Chantry, years since I'd sung the song and felt it flowing through me, but this is real. This is real. So long since I'd felt it, falling, flying. Faith. And I fought her. Maker forgive me I hope I did enough.

[leaguer of one]

Hi guys,

 

Does any body know, if The Dawn will Come song has an actual in game lore significance?

 

Thanks in advance!

It's a hyme from Andrastian faith

[YourFunnyUncle]

Josephine summed it up aptly.

All nations are culturally diverse, obviously that would include hymns.

The Chantry is the obvious source and the one thing any of those nationalities have in common.

I don't actually disagree that the song is likely a Chantry hymn, but your logic is not sound.

 

The Chantry is a major source of common ground in a diverse continent, sure, but cultural diversity does not by necessity negate any chance of shared cultural elements that aren't Chantry related.

 

Oh and you mentioned Tevinter which doesn't actually have the Chantry in common with the rest. It has its own separate Chantry with different traditions, which likely extends to music. One thing that all these nations do however have in common is knowledge of the common tongue, which spread through trade as I said.

[Master Warder Z_]

I don't actually disagree that the song is likely a Chantry hymn

Then this discussion is over.

[Char]

And Europeans know Over the Rainbow. I'm just saying there's nothing identifiably religious, or even specifically Chantry-like, about that particular song.

Not this European the first two lines, sure, but anything after that is nonexistent. Then again Eva Whatsherface doesn't really mesh with my music tastes. Not enough electric guitar.

To be a bit more on topic, we didn't get much in the way of cryptic predictions in this game. This saddens me.

[Master Warder Z_]

I'm actually sort of happy about that.

Those cryptic messages got annoying.

[Char]

I'm actually sort of happy about that.
Those cryptic messages got annoying.

I'm the sort of person who likes to know spoilers for everything...
I require straws to clutch at

[Master Warder Z_]

I'm the sort of person who likes to know spoilers for everything...
I require straws to clutch at

I am not and don't.

[Monica21]

I'm going to be that person and point out it is a song sung in the Chantry based on Cole's chat about Roderick's last thoughts (if you went with mages) after recruiting him in Skyhold.

Spoiler

C: Roderick was sorry before he died

I: Did he tell you why he was sorry?

C: Blood everywhere, monsters, madness dying. we're all dying. The Herald stands against it and heads turn. Desperate and simple. Pure.

Voices in the Chantry, years since I'd sung the song and felt it flowing through me, but this is real. This is real. So long since I'd felt it, falling, flying. Faith. And I fought her. Maker forgive me I hope I did enough.

 

And when I was a kid we sang If I Had a Hammer in Sunday school. That doesn't make it a hymn. Guys, this is really easy. A song has to have religious overtones to be a hymn. It's a song in praise or worship to a deity. The Dawn Will Come does not fit that definition hence it is not a hymn.

[Master Warder Z_]

Andraste loves me, this I know for the chant tells me so

[Ashaantha]

And when I was a kid we sang If I Had a Hammer in Sunday school. That doesn't make it a hymn. Guys, this is really easy. A song has to have religious overtones to be a hymn. It's a song in praise or worship to a deity. The Dawn Will Come does not fit that definition hence it is not a hymn.

 

I said it was a song sung in a Chantry. find the word 'hymn' somewhere in my post, you won't since it's not there. I agree with you that a song sung in a religious setting doesn't make it a religious hymn.

[In Exile]

I'm not disputing any of that. I'm saying that there's nothing identifiably religious about the song. There is no mention of a higher power or a church or anything. That's not typically the way hymns work. I'm not saying it wasn't spread because of the spread of the Chantry, I'm saying that there's nothing about the song that makes it religious.

Perhaps I'm too ignorant about hymns? I'm an atheist brought up in a secular household. To me it sounds like a religious sound would sound like - or how I think it would sound like (to put it differently).

[YourFunnyUncle]

Then this discussion is over.

No it isn't.

[raging_monkey]

No it isn't.

don't do it

[Master Warder Z_]

No it isn't.

It isn't?

We both agree on the most likely source.

So I see little need for continued discussion on it.

[Wulfram]

The sun seems to be the major Andrastean symbol for the maker, so it's imagery fits well with the Chantry

[Korva]

Perhaps I'm too ignorant about hymns? I'm an atheist brought up in a secular household. To me it sounds like a religious sound would sound like - or how I think it would sound like (to put it differently).

 

I'm an atheist from a non-religious family, too, but I do think the religious overtone come from 1) the song being started by a cleric, 2) right after a discussion on faith, and 3) the "worshipful" postures that she and some of the other singers strike ... though kneeling, too, isn't necessarily religious but can also mean a pledge of allegiance and service to an actual person instead of a deity. The words themselves have no religious connotations at all. It's just a song that happens to be a perfect match for the situation that the survivors of Haven find themselves in. Lost, in the dark, desperate. They've just lost everything, many likely not for the first time if they were refugees from the mage/templar war and/or lived through the Fifth Blight before that. I'm sure the Chantry has plenty of blatantly religious songs for occasions like that, but Giselle pointedly does not hit everyone over the head with Maker this, Andraste that.

 

I do think she means to encourage hope through faith in the Andrastians among the survivors (who are bound to be the overwhelming majority anyway), but without blatantly alienating whatever non-believers may be there as well. The primary point of the song is to say, "we're in this together, we will get through this together". Plus an implicit show of her support for and faith in the Herald, encouraging the others to place their trust in you as well, whether you are a believer or not.

[Ezra Watcher]

I wished this song was in the Soundtrack, it's beautiful   and I'd like to listen more to it, than only once in a PT. 

I totally agree with liking the song. i looked everywhere on south african to buy the sound track and one of the things i found had it as song number 11 of 39. it is 1 min 59 secs long.  everything else was just game background sound/music. though i was actually looking for something with al the pub songs.

[Lady Artifice]

And when I was a kid we sang If I Had a Hammer in Sunday school. That doesn't make it a hymn. Guys, this is really easy. A song has to have religious overtones to be a hymn. It's a song in praise or worship to a deity. The Dawn Will Come does not fit that definition hence it is not a hymn.

 

I think it's a case of what's more probable. It might not be a hymn, but considering that it's a song everyone nearby knows, it's much more likely to be something associated with Andrastianism. Over the Rainbow is widespread in modern secular society, but the Andrastian society is not secular, the chantry dominates most aspects of souther Thedasian life. Secular songs aren't so common and successful in dominantly religious society. 

[Dellevis]

I totally agree with liking the song. i looked everywhere on south african to buy the sound track and one of the things i found had it as song number 11 of 39. it is 1 min 59 secs long.  everything else was just game background sound/music. though i was actually looking for something with al the pub songs.

 

Are you able to acces and use Spotify in your area? 
If so, here is a link to the bard songs on Spotify if that is what you were looking for: https://open.spotify...CLTiHjQrRRck4ZJ

[Monica21]

Perhaps I'm too ignorant about hymns? I'm an atheist brought up in a secular household. To me it sounds like a religious sound would sound like - or how I think it would sound like (to put it differently).

 

I grew up going to church, so perhaps that's where my beef with the song being called a hymn comes from. It's just not. A song sung by a member of the Chantry does not mean it's a hymn. A hymn a song sung in praise or worship of a deity and there's really no getting around that defintion. There are no such mentions in the song. It's much closer to a folk song, which is why I brought up If I Had a Hammer. We sang that in Sunday School, but it's not a hymn. It's not religious. It's just a hopeful song and that's all.

[Monica21]

I think it's a case of what's more probable. It might not be a hymn, but considering that it's a song everyone nearby knows, it's much more likely to be something associated with Andrastianism. Over the Rainbow is widespread in modern secular society, but the Andrastian society is not secular, the chantry dominates most aspects of souther Thedasian life. Secular songs aren't so common and successful in dominantly religious society. 

 

We don't live in Thedas and therefore only see it through the lens with which Bioware presents their society. There clearly is a non-Andrastian song that everyone knows, because Mother Giselle sang it. Christianity dominates modern Western society, but that doesn't mean we don't have songs that aren't explicitly religious and yet are still hopeful.

[Ezra Watcher]

Are you able to acces and use Spotify in your area? 
If so, here is a link to the bard songs on Spotify if that is what you were looking for: https://open.spotify...CLTiHjQrRRck4ZJ

thank you and checking now if it can work  

 

 

and apparently not thank you though

Modifié par Ezra Watcher, 25 mai 2015 - 06:57 .

[dgcatanisiri]

In Origins we learned during the Gauntlet that Andraste sang. It could be that The Dawn Will Come was a song written and originally sung by Andraste to her disciples during their march on Tevinter. Within the cultural context of Thedas, that seems to qualify it as a hymn to me - it's a song written and sung by the prophet of the faith for the faithful. Maybe not by a strict dictionary definition of the word, but in universe, I'd be willing to say they'd call it a hymn.