73 réponses à ce sujet

[Donovan Du Bois]

I loved the magic in DAO (And all of DAO in general), And It seemed well laid out, 4 schools each with 4 subschools, made sence to me. DA2 was radically different, and while the skill trees are interesting, I always thought the broken magic was left due to lack of time.

 

But here I am finished with DAI, and while I thought the game was great, I have to know what happened to magic? Why are we presented with these schools of magic in the first game and then we never see them again? The schools seem important enough to have codex entries and scholars studding single schools, so why would they just up and vanish?

[Urzon]

I'm guessing they found the different schools of magic too "unwieldy" so they dumbed down condensed down all the schools and combined parts of them with the different professions.

 

I was extremely disappointed they took away Crushing Prison. My favorite spell in the entirety of Dragon Age...gone...

[In Exile]

The spell combinations and schools are just total nonsense, and the spell selection is really underwhelming. Everything is glyph based, which is cool and all, but they're missing a lot of the clever spells they created with DA2 and largely have no AOE or CC abilities. 

[KaiserShep]

The one I will always lament in its loss is Force Mage. Sure, there's Rift Mage, but no one will convince me that it's the same thing. It was like being a Jedi that can pile a crowd together, then body slam them, or pull them toward me, then use telekinetic burst to blow them away XD. It was a total blast, often literally.

[Smudjygirl]

I once killed all of the soldiers in Redcliffe during the siege with inferno. Mages are over powered enough, but more so in Origins.

It is a shame that it was changed so drastically. But I felt mages balenced a little more with warrior and rouge.

[Donovan Du Bois]

I once killed all of the soldiers in Redcliffe during the siege with inferno. Mages are over powered enough, but more so in Origins.

It is a shame that it was changed so drastically. But I felt mages balenced a little more with warrior and rouge.

 

I agree 100%, but changing the way mages work so they are balanced, and messing with their own lore are different. I would have liked to see the 4 skill trees be the 4 schools of magic instead of fire, ice, lightning, and everything else.

[Smudjygirl]

I agree 100%, but changing the way mages work so they are balanced, and messing with their own lore are different. I would have liked to see the 4 skill trees be the 4 schools of magic instead of fire, ice, lightning, and everything else.

I agree with that. But we can't know why the writers thought to change it. A mistake? Because it interfered with other lore? Maybe its something that will be explored. Origins was the start and many things have changed an more will likely be changed to fit where they intend to take the story. If there is one thing Inquisition set up, it's that we know the truth of their lore about as much as Thedas does.

[Urzon]

I agree with that. But we can't know why the writers thought to change it. A mistake? Because it interfered with other lore? Maybe its something that will be explored. Origins was the start and many things have changed an more will likely be changed to fit where they intend to take the story. If there is one thing Inquisition set up, it's that we know the truth of their lore about as much as Thedas does.

I doubt the changes to the spell selection had to deal with lore at all. Like you said, mages were a bit OP in Origins. They most likely had to change the mechanics a bit to balance it all out compared to the other classes, so lore just took a back sit to it all at the end of day.

[Smudjygirl]

I doubt the changes to the spell selection had to deal with lore at all. Like you said, mages were a bit OP in Origins. They most likely had to change the mechanics a bit to balance it all out compared to the other classes, so lore just took a back sit to it all at the end of day.

Yep, but I was answering OP's "messing around with their lore" comment. I really think it was to add balance to how powerful mages were, an the lore was a bit of an "of to the side" thing. In which case, it was still changed/ignored for the future of the story.

[Alfa Kilo]

Just because the schools are not mentioned doesn't mean that they were eliminated from the lore (granted, it's a bit odd but I bet most of DAI spells could be assigned to the schools presented in Origins)

[Sunnie]

I loved the magic in DAO (And all of DAO in general), And It seemed well laid out, 4 schools each with 4 subschools, made sence to me. DA2 was radically different, and while the skill trees are interesting, I always thought the broken magic was left due to lack of time.

 

But here I am finished with DAI, and while I thought the game was great, I have to know what happened to magic? Why are we presented with these schools of magic in the first game and then we never see them again? The schools seem important enough to have codex entries and scholars studding single schools, so why would they just up and vanish?

Sounds like you went straight from DA:O 10 years ago and skipped DA2. If you had played DA2, you wouldn't be complaining too much about mage trees in Inquisition.

[Medhia_Nox]

I don't mind that they diminished the mage's spells - I just mind which spells they diminished.  

 

Three schools of "Blast with X" spells... really?  

 

Any mage I play - is not a mindless blaster.  So I lamented three lists from one school.

 

There should have been four lists - one from each school.  

 

It wasn't the mechanics that were dumbed down - but the actual mages themselves to mere artillery. 

[Laughing_Man]

Magic in DA:I was more or less like the game itself: had potential, but was lackluter in the end.

 

They had some good combination ideas here and there (some of which were bugged of course) not to mention a few new spells, but the new restrictive mana system coupled with prohibitive costs for single target spells, the limited variety of spells, the 8 ability limit, the removal of many interesting and effective magics, and the annoying need to ground-target most spells, made magic feel castrated and boring.

 

Probably another reason for why I managed to actually finish only one playthrough.

[Donovan Du Bois]

Sounds like you went straight from DA:O 10 years ago and skipped DA2. If you had played DA2, you wouldn't be complaining too much about mage trees in Inquisition.

 

I played through DA2, I was disappointed that they lowered the number of skills and divided them strangely, but they were diverse. These new trees are just three elemental trees and one utility tree. It's the depth magic lost that I'm upset about, and the conflict in lore.

[Sunnie]

I understand, I really do. Blame it on the game being developed and designed first and foremost for the consoles.

[Donovan Du Bois]

I understand, I really do. Blame it on the game being developed and designed first and foremost for the consoles.

 

I really don't like the 'PC Master Race' card, but I honestly feel like that was the problem, every class lost depth and all sustainable abilities were cut. I loved dragon age the story driven game with real depth to character building, and while I still love the story, character depth has been lost. You don't even distribute your own ability points anymore, all our control over how our character plays has been bottle-necked into pick one of 3 roads.

[Sunnie]

Well, to be fair, I should have said "first and foremost for the (console) controller" instead of "for the consoles". The game would play exactly the same on a console that has a keyboard/mouse attached as it does on a PC. But I guess it comes full circle back to consoles again, and the general lack of control options on said consoles.

[Joseph Warrick]

DAO had too much fat in term of spells, sequels tried to offer a leaner, tighter solution. I think I like DA2 best because of the entropy, spirit, and arcane trees. While I agree on every gameplay-enhancing argument for the DAI system (plus better specializations), I can't get over that the trees this time are elemental 1 / elemental 2 / elemental 3 / support.

[Akrabra]

I'm guessing they found the different schools of magic too "unwieldy" so they dumbed down condensed down all the schools and combined parts of them with the different professions.

 

I was extremely disappointed they took away Crushing Prison. My favorite spell in the entirety of Dragon Age...gone...

Oh crushing prison, you were the light in the dark on a nightmare playthrough, my one true love. We will mourn you.

 

I liked it when magic had abit more crowd control that could be used for the combos, its abit to flashy in both DAII and DA:I and i actually don't enjoy playing a mage that much anymore. Rift Mage was pretty awesome though. 

[Kakistos_]

I don't really mind that Mages were powered down, but I was EXTREMELY dissapointed that the different schools of Magic were thrown out the window for NO REASON. Relegating the varied forms of Magic to fire, ice and lighting was just pure laziness because if you look at the effects of the spells they have the same affects as spells in previous games, they just skipped the part where they were to be fleshed out and catagorized into schools. For example the Ice Wall Spell is just Glyph of Repulsion and Flash Fire is just Horror. Every Spell in Inquisition has such an equivalent.

 

And the absence of Blood Magic and Keeper Magic is just galling considering that the main antagonist is one of the most famous Blood Mages of ALL TIME and we have the opportunity to play as an ACTUAL DALISH KEEPER. The handling of Magic in Inquisition is the single most disappointing point in the entire series for me personally. This coming  from a person who has bought each game and all dlc and played multiple playthroughs. Is it too much to hope that this blatant insult to Mage fans is corrected at some point?

[Statare]

Not having access to a more diverse spell repertoire was super annoying for me when I tried to get into my mage (which was/is my only play through). I felt, having played DAO, that the game was trying to limit my roleplaying potential, as I tend to view the 'flashy, elementalist'  mage as a very loaded character, which is my own bias, though I am sure I am not the only one considering such a character even is represented in multiplayer.

[Sinophile]

Well, to be fair, I should have said "first and foremost for the (console) controller" instead of "for the consoles". The game would play exactly the same on a console that has a keyboard/mouse attached as it does on a PC. But I guess it comes full circle back to consoles again, and the general lack of control options on said consoles.

In addition to making DA:I more console friendly, it is also designed to be multi-player. DA:O and DAII were the last of the completely single player games produced by Bioware.

[Sunnie]

In addition to making DA:I more console friendly, it is also designed to be multi-player. DA:O and DAII were the last of the completely single player games produced by Bioware.

True that. But ME3 controls didn't suffer because of dumbed down MP controls, so I am not sure that's really relevant.

[LinksOcarina]

The spell combinations and schools are just total nonsense, and the spell selection is really underwhelming. Everything is glyph based, which is cool and all, but they're missing a lot of the clever spells they created with DA2 and largely have no AOE or CC abilities. 

 

I definitely agree with this.

 

It seems like the magic for Inquisition was designed to be used both for the tactical camera and for their offensive power and maneuverability. They stuck to the basics of offensive elements and creation, compensated for the loss of healing, and kind of put spells in every school without a thought to why. 

 

We may not need the schools, but they did give the world some character in the end. I loved the skill tree design in Dragon Age 2 a lot more, because we had a lot of spells that were also sustained abilities, which added to their use id say.

 

Frankly we should go back to the design from Dragon Age 2...

[Big I]

Why are we presented with these schools of magic in the first game and then we never see them again? The schools seem important enough to have codex entries and scholars studding single schools, so why would they just up and vanish?

 

1) The schools from DA:O are an in-universe explanation. If later characters don't use those definitions, perhaps sholastic thought has changed around the idea of separate magical schools, or the characters come from magical traditions that don't use the schools as they're taught in the sourthern Circle (like the dalish and qunari mage Inquisitors).

 

2) The Rift changes the way some magic works, Your Trainer mentions it in dialogue. Perhaps spell definitions are shifting to reflect those changes.