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[Seyd71]

The Reaper is created from each harvested race. One race is deemed the most important and results in a capital Reaper ship. Others are deemed secondary and end up as Destroyers. The outside shape is the same for all Reapers of the same class but inside the shell there are "pilots" - Reaper core in a shape of a harvested race. So human Reaper would've ended up in a cuttlefish form with a human Reaper inside of it. 

 

I accepted that explanation once I learned about it, but yesterday I realized something. What's the point of having a "Pilot" to represent each race if it's inaccurate (mouth laser thing, and the eyes) and doesn't fully represent the race they're harvesting since Humans can be male or female. Why would Reapers care about having a warped metallic version of the species they're harvesting? Are the Reapers just sentimental? Wouldn't data about the biology of humans be enough?

[Seyd71]

They should have made James a LI for femShep to replace the loss of Jacob and Thane.

 

Agreed

I occasionally think it would be an awkward romance, but then again Garrus worked out well after the whole "mentor" thing. But anyway, they did need another straight female romance option because if you kill Kaidan or have Ashley coming from a horrible, horrible Suicide Mission, then the only romance option left are the same-sex romances and Liara. It's funny, Bioware tries so hard to be equal and allow people of every sexual orientation to have a romance option, but a straight female could be left out under certain circumstances.

[Seyd71]

OT: I found the theme song for this thread

 

I don't know, I think it's going pretty well. No one is really being offensive, yet people are still discussing things that make sense and don't make sense. I mean, I think my choice in title probably could've been better, but that's really all I'd change here.

[angol fear]

The only thing I really hate is how heavy-handed the writers got with the 'Shepard's the only one who can save the universe' thing.

 

Then you have to explain that Mass Effect 1 isn't about Shepard trying to stop a galactic threat (the reapers), and almost nobody, except his squadmate and Anderson, do listen to him when he talks about the reapers. You have to prove that in Mass Effect 1 Shepard isn't the only one who can stop the reapers and save the universe. Mass Effect 3 isn't different from Mass Effect 1. If you disagree then it's because you didn't really play Mass Effect 1 for its story.

You'll probably say that what you mean is that it is forced ("heavy-handed"), but what is the element that can save the universe? It's not Shepard, it's the crucible. Shepard is just trying to gather races to create that. Shepard was about to die in the end. I really don't see how it's "heavy-handed", because you never feel that he is the only one who can save the universe.

And once again in Mass Effect 1 Shepard is an exception and a leader. If you disliked that in Mass Effect 3, you should have stop at the beginning at Mass Effect 1 when you learnt what the reapers are.

[fraggle]

Well, I know what you mean, but what I'm trying to say is that they didn't really hint at him liking men at all.

 

I don't think it's important to mention that or hint at it.

Dunno, I'd call myself straight, but who knows, if an opportunity would arrise to try out the other thing and it just fits, why the hell not? Doesn't mean I need to tell everyone

Why shouldn't it be possible that a technically straight person could fall for the other sex at some point?

[Vazgen]

I accepted that explanation once I learned about it, but yesterday I realized something. What's thee point of having a "Pilot" to represent each race if it's inaccurate (mouth laser thing, and the eyes) and doesn't fully represent the race they're harvesting since Humans can be male or female. Why would Reapers care about having a warped metallic version of the species they're harvesting? Are the Reapers just sentimental? Wouldn't data about the biology of humans be enough?

Tbh, human Reaper was one of the dumbest things in the trilogy IMO. But if you want a justification, it was incomplete. The extra eye might've been closed in the final version or whatever.

Spoiler

As for why would they want it, perhaps organic minds have easier time controlling the Reaper if they perceive it in a familiar form.

[BraveVesperia]

Nah, they didn't want to have to figure out what Quarian architecture looked like. I seriously doubt it looked like those bunkers on Haestrom. If it did, they deserve to be wiped out as a favor to the galaxy.

It seems strange that they didn't include some proper quarian architecture (especially during the Rannoch mission), considering they did for Tuchanka. There was a whole segment with ancient krogan ruins, opening out into this vista of beautiful, crumbling architecture and a feel of what was lost. Considering that the krogan storyline is more about the preparing for the future, while the quarian storyline is about reclaiming the past, you'd think the quarian planet would show that more.

[Batarian Master Race]

Well, I know what you mean, but what I'm trying to say is that they didn't really hint at him liking men at all. Kaiden can romance MShep in ME3, but in ME1 Kaidan just feels like a good friend who just tries to explain how he feels about the current situation. He never has a single moment in ME1 that I've seen where he hints at being bisexual through an action or dialogue.

 

Does he need to? Not everyone broadcasts their sexual orientation.

 

In fact, most of the characters never hint towards their sexual orientation until you're actually in their romances.

[GalacticWolf5]

Well, I know what you mean, but what I'm trying to say is that they didn't really hint at him liking men at all. Kaiden can romance MShep in ME3, but in ME1 Kaidan just feels like a good friend who just tries to explain how he feels about the current situation. He never has a single moment in ME1 that I've seen where he hints at being bisexual through an action or dialogue.

 

That doesn't mean he was straight. Not everyone openly talks about their sexual orientation. Nothing in ME1 indicates that Kaidan is bisexual, but nothing indicates that he isn't either.

[Pasquale1234]

It seems strange that they didn't include some proper quarian architecture (especially during the Rannoch mission), considering they did for Tuchanka. There was a whole segment with ancient krogan ruins, opening out into this vista of beautiful, crumbling architecture and a feel of what was lost. Considering that the krogan storyline is more about the preparing for the future, while the quarian storyline is about reclaiming the past, you'd think the quarian planet would show that more.

Interesting take.

I thought that going through the Tuchanka ruins, seeing krogan art, sculptures, etc. was important in that it showed us a very different side to the species and their past. Comments about them having been a proud people, a potential cultural renaissance, etc. seemed much more believable after seeing what they had done / been in the past.

It would have been nice to have seen some quarian architecture or infrastructure on Rannoch. Maybe what they wanted to show there was a beautiful, pristine planet ready to be settled and developed.

[Daemul]

Then you have to explain that Mass Effect 1 isn't about Shepard trying to stop a galactic threat (the reapers), and almost nobody, except his squadmate and Anderson, do listen to him when he talks about the reapers. You have to prove that in Mass Effect 1 Shepard isn't the only one who can stop the reapers and save the universe. Mass Effect 3 isn't different from Mass Effect 1. If you disagree then it's because you didn't really play Mass Effect 1 for its story.
You'll probably say that what you mean is that it is forced ("heavy-handed"), but what is the element that can save the universe? It's not Shepard, it's the crucible. Shepard is just trying to gather races to create that. Shepard was about to die in the end. I really don't see how it's "heavy-handed", because you never feel that he is the only one who can save the universe.
And once again in Mass Effect 1 Shepard is an exception and a leader. If you disliked that in Mass Effect 3, you should have stop at the beginning at Mass Effect 1 when you learnt what the reapers are.

[ImaginaryMatter]

The only thing I really hate is how heavy-handed the writers got with the 'Shepard's the only one who can save the universe' thing. I feel like I'm one play-through away from handing out pamphlets at the airport.

 

I don't mind this sort of thing in theory. My problem with it in ME is that as the series progressed it became less and less justified. You hear a lot of things about how Shepard is this leader yet the mechanical interaction is people telling him where to go and Shepard mowing through a bunch of aliens to get there; and, as it turns out in the multiplayer, there are tons of other people who can do the same thing.

[Vazgen]

Let's not forget "If we lose Shepard, humanity might well follow."

[Pasquale1234]

And Javik is a party pooper who points out that one of the paintings depict servitude/slavery of some form.

He seems to be the only squadmate who interprets it that way. No real surprise, considering that he came from a species intent on subjugating the entire galaxy.

But, really, what difference does it make? Quite a few "great" civilizations / cultures practiced slavery.
 

I learned more from the male Shaman, personally.

His is an interesting take on their current philosophy / mental state and what they had become. It doesn't tell you much about their ancient past.

[Pasquale1234]

I don't think he's any less of an authority than Eve. Both of them have the same philosophy, more or less. About enlightenment through pain and harsh survival. Both of them admit that the Krogan destroyed themselves..and make no excuses about it.

He just thinks they need to keep destroying themselves. lol. It seems like he thinks they need to hit completely rock bottom over and over, until they learn by themselves -- and only then, will they be wise enough to rebuild their civilization properly.

It's kind of what spiritual / philosophical leaders do - seek among the ashes of failures and try to find some wisdom / hope in it. What I'm suggesting is that the cause-effect could be reversed. I'm not convinced that they purposely wrecked themselves over and over to make themselves stronger. I'm suggesting that the belief it will make them stronger came into being because they repeatedly wrecked themselves.

Eve tells us that technology made their lives too easy. It seems they did that to themselves - before the Salarians uplifted them - but the overall theme points out the dangers of technology in the hands of a culture not prepared to limit its use to things that will benefit them as a whole.
 

Eve thinks it should happen now. Which is nice. But it'll never happen with her dead. It hinges completely on her. And the only way she'll live is if  you're OK with Maelon experimenting on human victims. Behind the "rosy worldview" that Eve promotes is this ugly, dark testament to unethical science. The real world cringes at using Doctor Mengele's research, but here, it's all good. For some reason.

I think their path is a lot easier with Eve alive, but a lot of the point she makes is that, with the genophage cured, their society may become more balanced again in terms of leadership by both sexes. With the genophage cured, they might once again live in family units instead of separate clans. Other female leaders could emerge. There would be less competition between males.
 

Sorry, I'm getting off topic now. I think I managed to Godwin this thread.

What was the topic again?

[Alan Rickman]

The fanbase.

[aoibhealfae]

I don't think the reapers are suppose to copy the exact species they're harvesting. What I see was they were trying to improve on organics by creating a synthesis between their tech and the materials from their harvest. Like an abominable mad scientist construct of creating a perfect creature of sorts. 

[Quarian Master Race]

Rannoch is an example of how Bioware doesn't know how to design planets. Average surface temperature of 48C compare with Earth of 23C. Tali is complaining of how hot it gets in those suits. It should have been sweltering hot on the Quarian ships to the other races.

 

Yet there are oceans on Rannoch. Its name means walled garden. Walled garden of what? Sand? Was this the reason the Quarians created the Geth? They don't like farming in the hot sun?

It's possible that the quarians didn't evolve on the hotter areas of the planet, and never inhabited them. After all, the planet is only slightly smaller than Earth, yet the peak population before the war and exodous was only 1/4 of modern earth's. The fact that there are no ruins in the regions that we land on in game is probably because they are close to the equator, where the temperature is presumably the hottest.

If we are just going by average surface temperature, there's no way that Terra Nova should be the largest human colony, because it's average is even higher than Rannoch and is more than twice what Earth's is at 56C. It says that the equatorial region is a desert, but the settlements are located in the polar regions.

[Pasquale1234]

I can understand taking this route. It requires a lot of faith from me though.... so I dislike it. I've still tried it, but I don't really want to make huge choices on that basis when it comes down to it. I wish I was given a small sign at least. I mean, I see better collective examples of Batarians than I do Krogan. It's believable to me that the Batarians might reform their society with the Hegemony gone --- because I see what they're like in the games. They're very human, more or less. With Krogan, I'm given nothing to base this kind of grand vision of the future on. It's just faith.

I don't know that it's faith so much as desperation and some willingness to give them a chance. I tend to agree with Victus wrt the need for krogan allies in the reaper war. He also says "I'd rather have a grateful ally than a bitter rival" or something along those lines.

We talk to only one krogan female, but I expect the others have similar feelings. She is their shaman and apparently a leader in the female clan. She's very aware that the krogan brought a lot of it on themselves, and seems quite eager to avoid a repeat.
 

edit: Well, there are the epilogue slides, I guess. I still have plenty of questions though. The epilogues make the Cure look peachy no matter what you do... but in my mind, it plays out like a delicate house of cards, where you need everything in just the right place.. 
 
The slides kind of ruin the complexity and fun of it. It's easily the "right" choice.

The slides do show them rebuilding, but don't tell us much about their relationships with other species. If you really think about how they've been living with the genophage, and how much the fabric of their culture will change without it - well, it could be the impetus for some significant changes. Remember the ambient conversations in ME2, where some Urdnot men were talking about visiting the female camp, and one of them was wondering whether some youngster was his? Things are going to be very different for them when they can have their own mates again, assured of paternity.

All that said, the cure might not be permanent. While those females were in custody, the salarians likely got a lot more current genetic information about them. It's something the salarians monitored, anyway - krogan were adapting, and Mordin's team needed to modify it. Looks to me like Tuchanka might need the salarians to build them a new shroud since it was getting wrecked. I expect the rest of the galaxy will be keeping tabs on the krogan, the salarians standing by with another round of biowarfare if it is needed.

[Vazgen]

The epilogues make the Cure look peachy no matter what you do... 

Try to cure it with Wreav in charge and choose Destroy.

Spoiler

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

Then you have to explain that Mass Effect 1 isn't about Shepard trying to stop a galactic threat (the reapers), and almost nobody, except his squadmate and Anderson, do listen to him when he talks about the reapers. You have to prove that in Mass Effect 1 Shepard isn't the only one who can stop the reapers and save the universe. Mass Effect 3 isn't different from Mass Effect 1. If you disagree then it's because you didn't really play Mass Effect 1 for its story.

You'll probably say that what you mean is that it is forced ("heavy-handed"), but what is the element that can save the universe? It's not Shepard, it's the crucible. Shepard is just trying to gather races to create that. Shepard was about to die in the end. I really don't see how it's "heavy-handed", because you never feel that he is the only one who can save the universe.

And once again in Mass Effect 1 Shepard is an exception and a leader. If you disliked that in Mass Effect 3, you should have stop at the beginning at Mass Effect 1 when you learnt what the reapers are.

 

Oh come on, even a little unborn child's life depends upon Commander Shepard's input in ME1. Gene therapy or no gene therapy? And in ME3 everything was done with a click of a mouse during a planet survey! You could treat people like absolute dog sh*t and it didn't matter. You were loved. There was the cult of The Shepard. The writers even poked fun at it in the Stargazer scene.

 

And how can you say that you never feel that Shepard is the only one who can save the galaxy?

 

Spoiler

 

Everyone in the galaxy got a major case of stupid so that Shepard could solve their problem. If they didn't, they became a villain.