960 réponses à ce sujet

[Elhanan]

Exactly. Certain quests are already if not good, quite interesting, and with adequate presentation, can be even touching.
 
What do you suggest, than? something must be done, because some side quest cleary miss something. a zoom of the camera, then? I think some sort of cinematic must be reintroduced for side quests. Or really, the feeling of just being fillers is too strong. Giving them a parvence of important is necessary. I don't want a repeat of Imshael's quest, where to see his face I had to wait for BioWare to post a pick of him.

While I disagree that something must be done, having the camera go in closer for tighter shots (possibly as an option in Settings) would be fine; something similar was offered as a mod in Skyrim which seemed to be beneficial for many Players.

[HowlingSiren]

To those who oppose cut scenes: are you bothered by all cutscenes because it's just dialogue and you'd rather have action, or do you oppose cutscenes where you have no input, i.e. where you don't get to pick responses? 

[Panda]

I can play DAI without buying new console.. that has to be plus point despite bugginess.

[Elhanan]

To those who oppose cut scenes: are you bothered by all cutscenes because it's just dialogue and you'd rather have action, or do you oppose cutscenes where you have no input, i.e. where you don't get to pick responses?

Only speaking for myself, but a lack of input, interrupts catch one off guard, PC goes out of character for some Players, placed into combat without preparation, having to see it again for possible re-loads, weapons occasionally switched, and so much extra expense/ zots spent on these when it could go elsewhere. Main quest storylines I am generally fine with them, but secondary and side quests should be as limited as possible, IMO.

[Saphiron123]

Still disagree, I feel that they did get it almost right in terms of the areas themselves. They need improvement on filling those areas, which they can look at TW3 on idea for filling them

Well, that's a hell of a thing to fall short on. It's like setting a nice table and forgetting the food. Sure there's a long way to walk and it looks pretty but there's very little that was fun or amazing to find within. If the whole game was like the main story, and the side quests were the kind of quests you could find in past dragon age games, DAI could have been amazing instead of just okay.

I don't think DAI does nothing particularly better. But the Dragon Age series has concepts that I like:
 
. Party-based combat (DAI actually is a departure from previous titles in which it is more easy, practical and intuitive to control just one guy at a time. I would like an investment in party-based controls (select all, formations, real tactical combat and so on);
. The political correct agenda of the game is kind of in-your-face sometimes, but I think it is good that there is a RPG out there that has gays, transgenders, women at the forefront of things. I don't think all games should be like that, but Bioware is truly invested in this and I think it is overall positive.
. Create your own character is great;
. Their lore is good, but DAI just have too much exposition - let us live it a bit more. Instead of telling us, show us more.
. The romance idea is also a trademark, but I think the "press button to have romance" option is super dumb. I understand they are trying to "warn" people that they are entering a romance path, but it completely brakes immersion and makes this part of the game predictable and uninteresting.
 
All considered I think the series is becoming something that is not targeted to me anymore, but if people are liking it, that's cool.

The politics are very in your face. They aren't written for LGBT people, they more preach to straight people instead. I think Gaider's politics took centre stage in many ways, to the point they were rewriting the Qunari for inclusiveness instead of respecting their past lore and unique culture.

You really hit the nail on the head with show don't tell though, bioware have us big pointless environments while reserving much of the interesting content for codex entries and offhandedly conversation. Where a game like the witcher let's you experience events as they unfold, DAI tells you about them... Even the final major battle against corypheus' demon army was just talked about at the war table, you didn't even get to see it raging in the background. Would have been nice to be part of it.

Was that laziness or just being PC? I don't know, but it wasn't good storytelling. I expect more from bioware.

[Torgette]

I don't have any strong preference over the cinematic conversations versus the non-cinematic conversations we got in DAI, but too many cutscenes (particularly if they're unskippable) get annoying quickly, especially if you find yourself re-loading for do overs. Agreed here.

 

The cutscenes we got were comparatively sparing in DAI, but were, in the case of the companion dialogues, really well done.

 

I love the abundance of cutscenes in TW3 but it's true that it also sloooooows thiiiiings dooooooooown, that combined with loads of minor fetchy-quests and the quiet music and the huge zones that require lots of time to navigate and i'm catching myself falling asleep at least half the time I play the game.

[Milan92]

Being able to play as a female character. More strong female leads, but all of Dragon Age has had that in the past. It has more of my attention as an RPG with the option of being able to play as a female protagonist. 

 

Could you please elaborate on what makes DA females stronger? I'm curious.

 

Edit: Actually nevermind, read your post wrong.

[Saphiron123]

Only speaking for myself, but a lack of input, interrupts catch one off guard, PC goes out of character for some Players, placed into combat without preparation, having to see it again for possible re-loads, weapons occasionally switched, and so much extra expense/ zots spent on these when it could go elsewhere. Main quest storylines I am generally fine with them, but secondary and side quests should be as limited as possible, IMO.

So you don't want story or emotion or anything meaningful, you want a dialogue free sandbox to run around and stab stuff in while collecting 50 of this or 30 of that?

You're in the minority here, man.

I want a story, I want characters that feel personal and events that feel important and amazing. I want a great antagonist and hard choices that I'll remember years from now. Nobody will remember mining iron and stabbing your 500th cut and paste fire/Ice mine Mage.

Any game can be a sandbox, dragon age should be something memorable.

[Torgette]

Well, that's a hell of a thing to fall short on. It's like setting a nice table and forgetting the food. Sure there's a long way to walk and it looks pretty but there's very little that was fun or amazing to find within. If the whole game was like the main story, and the side quests were the kind of quests you could find in past dragon age games, DAI could have been amazing instead of just okay.


The politics are very in your face. They aren't written for LGBT people, they more preach to straight people instead. I think Gaider's politics took centre stage in many ways, to the point they were rewriting the Qunari for inclusiveness instead of respecting their past lore and unique culture.

You really hit the nail on the head with show don't tell though, bioware have us big pointless environments while reserving much of the interesting content for codex entries and offhandedly conversation. Where a game like the witcher let's you experience events as they unfold, DAI tells you about them... Even the final major battle against corypheus' demon army was just talked about at the war table, you didn't even get to see it raging in the background. Would have been nice to be part of it.

Was that laziness or just being PC? I don't know, but it wasn't good storytelling. I expect more from bioware.

 

PC?

[HowlingSiren]

Only speaking for myself, but a lack of input, interrupts catch one off guard, PC goes out of character for some Players, placed into combat without preparation, having to see it again for possible re-loads, weapons occasionally switched, and so much extra expense/ zots spent on these when it could go elsewhere. Main quest storylines I am generally fine with them, but secondary and side quests should be as limited as possible, IMO.

Thanks. Agree on the lack of interrupts. Can't stand cutscenes where I can't decide either. Not sure where you go the idea that TW3 has that, as it's just plain inaccurate (I was in fact shocked at how much input I had). Disagree though on the rest, I'm afraid. I like seeing NPC expressions when they tell me something, and I like seeing my characters respond not just through my chosen answer but also through their expression and body language. Those weird fly-by quests in ME3 where you walk past people and pick up a quest and return later to just get a token response is the worst, to me. Same in DAI, so rarely seeing anyone up close, in an RPG, is just odd. Choices and input should not be limited to main missions surely, with only a standard "accept/decline quest" response for all the rest.   

[Saphiron123]

I love the abundance of cutscenes in TW3 but it's true that it also sloooooows thiiiiings dooooooooown, that combined with loads of minor fetchy-quests and the quiet music and the huge zones that require lots of time to navigate and i'm catching myself falling asleep at least half the time I play the game.

Totally disagree. I care about the world of the witcher , it feels real and personal. It feels like I'm living events. It's the feeling I got from origins and the feeling that made me love deagon age.

Sure, dragon age doesn't get interrupted, but instead of great set pieces with amazing moments, most of it is static maps with random mobs and side quests that aren't fun or interesting. I'll remember the witcher and I can't wait to replay it. DAI is the first dragon age that just doesn't leave me with the urge to play it over and over.

[Saphiron123]

PC?

Politically correct.

[FKA_Servo]

Only speaking for myself, but a lack of input, interrupts catch one off guard, PC goes out of character for some Players, placed into combat without preparation, having to see it again for possible re-loads, weapons occasionally switched, and so much extra expense/ zots spent on these when it could go elsewhere. Main quest storylines I am generally fine with them, but secondary and side quests should be as limited as possible, IMO.

 

I like interrupts in theory, but not in execution. It was stupid in ME2 when I hit a renegade interrupt and all of a sudden I'm pushing a dude out a window.

 

I think a full range of "emotive" interrupts would be kind of neat (though they wouldn't be nearly so interrupt... ive, if you understand me). Like romance related ones, to hug or kiss someone. The ability to choose to either physically comfort someone in distress... or to refrain from doing so. Strike someone who's out of line. You'd get a description of whatever action you'd take in any event. Though this might not work well unless you paused in mid-conversation.

 

What made me think of it were the paragon interrupts at the end of "Lair of the Shadow Broker" with Liara if you had romanced her. There were three in quick succession and on the third one, you stopped to kiss her. I liked it... but I didn't like it necessarily being baked into ME's stupid pseudo-"morality" system.

[Torgette]

Totally disagree. I care about the world of the witcher , it feels real and personal. It feels like I'm living events. It's the feeling I got from origins and the feeling that made me love deagon age.

Sure, dragon age doesn't get interrupted, but instead of great set pieces with amazing moments, most of it is static maps with random mobs and side quests that aren't fun or interesting. I'll remember the witcher and I can't wait to replay it. DAI is the first dragon age that just doesn't leave me with the urge to play it over and over.

 

You totally disagree that I fell asleep? Anyways yes the Witcher feels more alive, over in the feedback thread there's loads of informative posts where people (myself included) break this stuff down into individual components - hopefully Bioware takes inspiration. It's also true that presentation can require balancing and sometimes people respond to presentation differently, ie: Kubrick's movies typically move methodically and dwell on things, some people love it some people hate it (I love it when movies are methodical, but not as much with games). I do think for myself I have a hard time keeping my mind going when nearly nothing has quickness. DAI has issues with pacing as well, I only enjoyed that game when I completely avoided a lot of the fetch quests and only focused on the interesting side stuff.

 

Politically correct.

 

Care to explain what that has to do with reality?

[Torgette]

I like interrupts in theory, but not in execution. It was stupid in ME2 when I hit a renegade interrupt and all of a sudden I'm pushing a dude out a window.

 

I think a full range of "emotive" interrupts would be kind of neat (though they wouldn't be nearly so interrupt... ive, if you understand me). Like romance related ones, to hug or kiss someone. The ability to choose to either physically comfort someone in distress... or to refrain from doing so. Strike someone who's out of line. You'd get a description of whatever action you'd take in any event. Though this might not work well unless you paused in mid-conversation.

 

What made me think of it were the paragon interrupts at the end of "Lair of the Shadow Broker" with Liara if you had romanced her. There were three in quick succession and on the third one, you stopped to kiss her. I liked it... but I didn't like it necessarily being baked into ME's stupid pseudo-"morality" system.

 

Interrupts are fun the first time because they're surprises which can be fun, but they are shallow - basically quick time events - and don't add much to roleplaying.

[TheOgre]

You totally disagree that I fell asleep? Anyways yes the Witcher feels more alive, over in the feedback thread there's loads of informative posts where people (myself included) break this stuff down into individual components - hopefully Bioware takes inspiration. It's also true that presentation can require balancing and sometimes people respond to presentation differently, ie: Kubrick's movies typically move methodically and dwell on things, some people love it some people hate it (I love it when movies are methodical, but not as much with games). I do think for myself I have a hard time keeping my mind going when nearly nothing has quickness. DAI has issues with pacing as well, I only enjoyed that game when I completely avoided a lot of the fetch quests and only focused on the interesting side stuff.

 

 

Care to explain what that has to do with reality?

 

I disagree with you falling asleep. How dare you differ in experience than myself? 

 

I tossed his post a like because I much prefer the cinematics to DAI's zoom in and dialogue option heh.

[Elhanan]

Thanks. Agree on the lack of interrupts. Can't stand cutscenes where I can't decide either. Not sure where you go the idea that TW3 has that, as it's just plain inaccurate (I was in fact shocked at how much input I had). Disagree though on the rest, I'm afraid. I like seeing NPC expressions when they tell me something, and I like seeing my characters respond not just through my chosen answer but also through their expression and body language. Those weird fly-by quests in ME3 where you walk past people and pick up a quest and return later to just get a token response is the worst, to me. Same in DAI, so rarely seeing anyone up close, in an RPG, is just odd. Choices and input should not be limited to main missions surely, with only a standard "accept/decline quest" response for all the rest.

Am good with the VO demonstrating emotion; this was done fairly well in DAI and ME3 without the need for close-ups and cut-scenes (eg; the desk clerk that discovered her Krogan husband that perished). Not a fan of finding random items and returning them (eg; Obelisks of X, trousers, etc), but when asked to help someone honor their dead while playing a noble-hearted leader does not bother me a bit. And if playing a brute, having the option to refuse or walk away is there.

As for responses, in DAI one may hear how rewarding these small actions have to the refugees that received such gestures. While I cannot recall if the actual Quest giver said much, the people it helped banter quite a bit about it later.

[FKA_Servo]

So you don't want story or emotion or anything meaningful, you want a dialogue free sandbox to run around and stab stuff in while collecting 50 of this or 30 of that?

You're in the minority here, man.

I want a story, I want characters that feel personal and events that feel important and amazing. I want a great antagonist and hard choices that I'll remember years from now. Nobody will remember mining iron and stabbing your 500th cut and paste fire/Ice mine Mage.

Any game can be a sandbox, dragon age should be something memorable.

 

Apparently, it's still a pretty memorable game for a lot of players - I'd go so far as to say most players around here. Personally, Haven, and the Temple of Mythal, stand out as some of the single most affecting moments in any of Bioware's games, period (and I've played all but two of them). I'm sorry you didn't enjoy it (though not really sorry, because your posts are hilariously overdramatic, and I enjoy reading them), but thems the breaks, I guess.

 

You get really mad about this whole "PC" thing, though (especially with the qunari, which is ridiculous because it contradicts nothing that we learned in the past games), but Bioware has been on this road for a long time, because they care about inclusion and diversity. Since KoTOR, arguably. It shouldn't surprise you, and if you hold DA2 in the high regard that you claim to (was that you? I don't remember. Might be another poster), I'm uncertain why it even bothers you.

 

Care to explain what that has to do with reality?

 

It's a buzzword that provides a nice window into the psyche of whoever happens to be employing it.

[TheOgre]

Apparently, it's still a pretty memorable game for a lot of players - I'd go so far as to say most players around here. Personally, Haven, and the Temple of Mythal, stand out as some of the single most affecting moments in any of Bioware's games, period (and I've played all but two of them). I'm sorry you didn't enjoy it (though not really sorry, because your posts are hilariously overdramatic, and I enjoy reading them), but thems the breaks, I guess.

 

You get really mad about this whole "PC" thing, though (especially with the qunari, which is ridiculous because it contradicts nothing that we learned in the past games), but Bioware has been on this road for a long time, because they care about inclusion and diversity. Since KoTOR, arguably. It shouldn't surprise you, and if you hold DA2 in the high regard that you claim to (was that you? I don't remember. Might be another poster), I'm uncertain why it even bothers you.

 

That would be me! I think DA2's nightmare system was the most fun experience of the DA games. Couldn't OP that one. I like the control element and the synergy of my group.

 

Cannot deny that Temple of Mythal was pretty amazing. Would argue that Adamant was more impacting for me than Haven. Haven was decent -- otherwise those were my 'wow' moments of DAI.

[Pasquale1234]

Only speaking for myself, but a lack of input, interrupts catch one off guard, PC goes out of character for some Players, placed into combat without preparation, having to see it again for possible re-loads, weapons occasionally switched, and so much extra expense/ zots spent on these when it could go elsewhere. Main quest storylines I am generally fine with them, but secondary and side quests should be as limited as possible, IMO.

All that plus:
-- The time I spend watching cutscenes is time I'm not spending actually playing the game. I buy games to play them, not watch them.
-- Cutscenes often interject themselves when I wanted to do something else. Case in point: the end of DA2's Act 2, after you've battled your way to where Meredith is standing in High Town. There is lots of post-battle loot lying around, but any attempt to collect it triggers the cutscene.
-- I've learned to loot as I go in Bioware games, though it is not my preference to do so. All too frequently, you are cutscened out of the area once you've completed a mission objective.

ME3 was a carnival of cutscenes. There are places where I've learned to switch the settings to automatic responses, and step away for awhile. Unfortunately, some of those areas have Shepard dream sequences stuck in the middle of them, and you can't get past those without providing some input. So - I'll come back long enough to get those over with, and then step away again until the entire sequence is complete and I can get back to playing the game.
 

So you don't want story or emotion or anything meaningful, you want a dialogue free sandbox to run around and stab stuff in while collecting 50 of this or 30 of that?

Not the point.

There's a difference between being given the tools to create your own story, emotion, meaningful stuff and being force-fed the characterization and storyline envisioned by the devs.

For me, DAO and ME1 found that sweet spot. They gave me a menu from which to order and allowed me to create my own experience. To play ME3, I had to be willing to accept whatever meal the chef had decided to serve.

[FKA_Servo]

That would be me! I think DA2's nightmare system was the most fun experience of the DA games. Couldn't OP that one. I like the control element and the synergy of my group.

 

Cannot deny that Temple of Mythal was pretty amazing. Would argue that Adamant was more impacting for me than Haven. Haven was decent -- otherwise those were my 'wow' moments of DAI.

 

I think it could have been any number of posters, honestly. Now that there's a new Bioware game to hate, a lot of people seem to be realizing that hey, DA2 wasn't that bad!

 

Of course, I'm thinking now of Adamant and remembering how goddamn great the Fade was this time around. It was so sad and engaging. That's another one.

 

I haven't played through the Fade in DAO since 2012, when I got the game on PC. Since then, the "Skip the Fade" mod hasn't left my install.

[Felya87]

Am good with the VO demonstrating emotion; this was done fairly well in DAI and ME3 without the need for close-ups and cut-scenes (eg; the desk clerk that discovered her Krogan husband that perished). Not a fan of finding random items and returning them (eg; Obelisks of X, trousers, etc), but when asked to help someone honor their dead while playing a noble-hearted leader does not bother me a bit. And if playing a brute, having the option to refuse or walk away is there.

As for responses, in DAI one may hear how rewarding these small actions have to the refugees that received such gestures. While I cannot recall if the actual Quest giver said much, the people it helped banter quite a bit about it later.

 

I find the voice not compelling enought. Mostly because my language is not english, and for me english actors always feel a little...unemotional. And by the way, listening to "bla bla bla" reading the subs without some good thing to look at is really boring.

for me the side quests are just reading sub with voice that I don't understand much (I'm not bad at reading english, but I really have difficult with talked english) so when I have some cinematic presentation, and some body language, help me enter more in contact with characters and situations.

[Pasquale1234]

Totally disagree. I care about the world of the witcher , it feels real and personal. It feels like I'm living events. It's the feeling I got from origins and the feeling that made me love deagon age.

It's just the opposite for me.

Seeing the PC emote on-screen is another degree of separation between the character and myself. I can usually get immersed in third (rather than first) person camera points of view, but the more cutscenes I see starring my character, the more I am reminded that the character is a separate entity.

I am certainly capable of forming connections and empathy with fictional characters in the cinema, but I'm not role-playing them. It's a different form of entertainment.

[TheOgre]

Not the point.

There's a difference between being given the tools to create your own story, emotion, meaningful stuff and being force-fed the characterization and storyline envisioned by the devs.

For me, DAO and ME1 found that sweet spot. They gave me a menu from which to order and allowed me to create my own experience. To play ME3, I had to be willing to accept whatever meal the chef had decided to serve.

 

Recently played TW1 -- Probably not directly relevant so I'm hiding it

 

Spoiler

I don't know if this will be as relevant as TW3 but I ran into a situation with a village where there was a beast curse and the villagers blamed the Witch for their problems. People were dying to beasts that just kept spawning at night time. She maintained her innocence through out the entire quest while I found the most wicked crimes committed by the more known villagers. They blamed their misdeeds on her completely. But the man that killed his brother while the brother was sleeping, had a doll of himself in her cabin, which could be used for bewitching. There is a well known witch clan that manipulates people into misdeeds for their own self ruin. Even though I protected her and sent her on her way, I felt guilty because that "what if she did it" lingered in the back of my head. Practically killed the villagers  

 

Can completely understand why someone would not want to play the witcher. You cannot control the looks over your character, the voice is not for everyone also but I personally love it. But I personally felt I had far more control over the character than I did with DAI's character.

 

DAO? Better experience IMO than TW1-3, it's probably the nostalgia juice honestly but I know for certain that I can kill certain npc's after a quest just (like when I was hunting for the Ashes of Andraste, I didn't want the Chantry to get a hold of the temple's location.. he was adamant on making it well known and a site. I killed him and kept that place Chantry free... at least in DAO.) I felt like they had the most tools to create your own story and emotion, meaningful.

 

Yet strangely for myself, I felt I had far more control over Geralt's actions/decisions than I had in DAI. Have not played ME3, can you compare the two, DAI ME3 for freedom of choice/beliefs? 

[FKA_Servo]

It's just the opposite for me.

Seeing the PC emote on-screen is another degree of separation between the character and myself. I can usually get immersed in third (rather than first) person camera points of view, but the more cutscenes I see starring my character, the more I am reminded that the character is a separate entity.

I am certainly capable of forming connections and empathy with fictional characters in the cinema, but I'm not role-playing them. It's a different form of entertainment.

 

This guy's not the only one who feels this way, and Bioware is mostly responsible (whether they're at "fault" is subjective). Certainly since ME, and to a lesser (but still notably present) extent in DA, they've embarked in a progressively more "cinematic" direction, to say the least. These guys probably cut their teeth on ME1 and DAO, which is why the less cinematic DAI feels like such a dramatic "departure" as opposed to a return to form for Bioware.