64 respuestas en este tema

[Asch Lavigne]

You forgot the bear's (drawing a blank on the name) fate.

 

There was have him reminded of his "crime" everday

 

Didn't judge him

 

Recruited for the Inqusition

 

And one other one that I forget

[Totuvor]

First of all I want to thank the creator of this topic!

 

When I made my choices on the tapestry and checked them up by loading my savegame in DAO, I was very dissappointed that so many quests were missing compared to those you are experiencing during the playthrough. I'm afraid that just quests were imported to the keep but not the many choices you have done besides the quests (so they are unmentioned in the quest structure). That's why I had the same idea of making a list of missing quests and choices but here they are already

 

I would like to give some additions for DAO if you don't mind:

 

Dalish:

- Did you feel guilty for Tamlen's accident / or was it his own fault?

- Did you give up / never give up the search for Tamlen? (so will he tell you at the camp fight that he loved you as female warden?)

 

Redcliff:

- Did Murdock (the Mayor) and Tomas die during the defending?

- Did Ser Perth survive the fight at the village and the engage of the castle?

- Did you lie to Ser Perth about the silver amulets given by Mother Hannah? Did you even get some?

- Did you convience Dwyn, Berwick and Lloyd to take part in the fight? Did they survive?

--> (Everyone who died in the night will be mentioned by Bann Teagan)

- Who fought against the demon controlling Connor? Warden, Morrigan, Wynne or Irving?

- How did you behave towards the imprisoned Jorwan? Try to help / go and never return / stay in cage / kill

 

Broken Circle:

- (After defeating a group of bloodmages in the second floor you get in a conversation with one mage who survived) Did you release or kill her?

- Who was in your party when you were traped by the demon in the void (next to Wynne) ? (there were interesting emotional happenings of their past they got confronted with again)

 

Paragon of her kind:

- Did you restore the "creature of void?"? Did you kill or release it for a high reward?

- Did you give Nadeszda alms / insult her?

- Rescued Lady Brodens / didnt get the antidot?

- Did you open Jammers chest successfully?

- Did you help Leske / let him imprisoned?

 

Nature of the beast:

- The oak and the hermit are interwoven and can be put together like: Did you kill the oak and hermit survive / Did you kill the hermit and helped the oak / Did you kill both / Didnt meet one of them (both survive)

 

Battle for Denerim:

- Weren't there several tasks to do which can also be failed for example helping Shianni in the elfish part of Denerim?

 

Urn of sacred ashes:

- Did you agree with Genitiv to spread the word about the sacred ashes or did you kill him?

 

Companions:

- Did Alistair keep his emotional charakter or did you harden him?

- Missing Addition: Did you give Morrigan Flemeth's book (it is a gift!) or did you keep it for yourself?

- Which 3 companions travelled with the warden the most?

 

Missing: Ostagar DLC:

- Did you return to Ostagar? (Killed the ogre and burried King Cailan

- Found Cailan's set and the documents between Ferelden and Orlais?

 

Warden:

- What about gifts of people you helped but rejected their gifts? (You dont want to get paid for naturalness.) So there could be a section like: Did you often accept/demand/decline offers?

- Duncan forced you into the Grey Wardens / you joined willingly (quoted by Pokemario)

 

 

For me it doesn't matter if some of the choices are "pointless" and may never be recognized for the following parts of DA. I have made them nevertheless and so I want to represent the story in its entirety on my personal tapestry. For the experience of DAO also these smaller choices brought the game to its glory and without them the DA series would have extincted, after DA2 at the latest. Since EA disabled direct save imports and cloud save for DAO and DA2 I'm annoyed that they just chuck ~70% of the story on the tapestry when you have in mind that especially the arguments of "every choice is influencing" and "import the story completely!" were included for the sales Promotion. Hopefully EA will add more stuff from the list to the keep

[Darth Vitrial]

"

- Missing Addition: Did you give Morrigan Flemeth's book (it is a gift!) or did you keep it for yourself?" that's  already in Tapestry. Giving Morrigan Flemeth's Grimiore implies giving her the book.

"- Weren't there several tasks to do which can also be failed for example helping Shianni in the elfish part of Denerim?" Already mentioned those.

"

Missing: Ostagar DLC:

- Did you return to Ostagar? (Killed the ogre and burried King Cailan

- Found Cailan's set and the documents between Ferelden and Orlais?

" I think that's implied by the existence of the DLC, since we aren't really given any choices there.

 

"Which 3 companions travelled with the warden the most?" what about players that cycle their party and had no most frequent ones?

Will add most of the others.

[Totuvor]

"that's already in Tapestry. Giving Morrigan Flemeth's Grimiore implies giving her the book"
During the conversation with Flemeth you can claim her book for yourself. After killing her and returning to Morrigan you can tell her, that you killed her mother, but the book is an independent gift and can be given to Morrigan afterwards or not. I supposed it would be noteworthy and thats why missing as an option.

"I think that's implied by the existence of the DLC, since we aren't really given any choices there."
So it is also automatically implied that you find the documents and the set pieces in the sidepaths?
By the way, you have to make a decision at the end if you make a cremation for Cailan or put him on the ground for the wolves or let him impaled.
 
"- Weren't there several tasks to do which can also be failed for example helping Shianni in the elfish part of Denerim?" Already mentioned those."
I was talking about the choices during the Battle for Denerim. There you meet Shianni again and can let them flee, defend the houses or conviencing to take part in the fight at the gates.

""Which 3 companions travelled with the warden the most?" what about players that cycle their party and had no most frequent ones?"
True. What about changing the main idea just to "who accompanied the warden to the archdemon" then?


Paragorn of her Kind:
You should add that you can also release the Fade Beast for reward instead of just killing it.

Denerim:
- Spared / killed Denewera in the warehouse.
- Tevinter slaver can also be spared without accepting his blood magic deal.

Companions:
- If you are not a female human noble but in a romance with Alistair, he will cancel the relationship, but after you can have an other one instead.
- Zevrans romance should be separated in "just sex" and "true love", shouldn't it?

[Neverwinter_Knight77]

There haven't been any new tiles added since beta. Are there ever going to be more DA:O or Awakening tiles added?

[Totuvor]

We will see if the idea/list here which also includes missing choices of available tiles reaches the common consent and the developers (does anyone of them read the forum at all ? 0o) It will depend on the developers on the one hand  and on the community on the other hand.

 

The keep was created just a short time before DAI came out because the idea of recreating the story independent of the saves was new. So I guess that they were mainly focused on the main story elements and their interconnection, programing the keep itself and some sidequests with the remaining time before the release. Since then they had much to do with the sync problems etc. and maybe that's why they didnt add more of the possibilities.

But now It shouldn't be difficult to add the missing tiles since the "scaffolidng" is already set. Most of the missing quests and choices would be easy and fast to add. Most of them are not interlinked with other quests and there are also some with the same yes or no choices like "did you bring the amulet/book/ring/wounded back = yes/no". In addition they dont have to put it in the dubed history like they didnt do with the already implemented sidequests. So from my point of view only the creation of the drawn artworks for the tiles could be labour intensive maybe.

Nevertheless the developers should make use of the diversity and depth of their games especially when some volunteers gather obiously missing information for the keep and put them in a list. By the way a good company shows itself by a neverending development

 

At last also the community could have an influence here. Are we satisfied with the less choices at the keep compared to those we have done during the playthrough? Are we satisfied with the fact that we neither can import our save games nor are able to use the cloud for saves from DAO and DA2 anymore? Are we satisfied with the sale promotion "every choice has an influence/is important" but now we may have half of all at the keep?

If it seems so for the developers they don't have any urgent reasons for adding more tiles. If this actual state won't improve I would feel beeing fobbed off by the developers "Just some effort for the keep, cancel save imports for PC gamers, some sidequests for the round off, finished".

 

Finally everything is just speculating as to whether the keep will offer more in the future or not but it shouldn't influence the work the creator have done by creating the list and we could start giving him likes for his effort

[Totuvor]

I guess I found a bug in the tapestry for DA2 aswell:

 

If you side with the templars in the final battle and Anders isnt killed but allowed to flee, he will return after entering the mages hall. As fas as I have read it doesn't matter which dialogue option you choose, this meeting will lead in a fight in which Anders dies.

So if you set "Anders survived" in the companion section and "Sided with templars" in the Act III section, no window is coming up in which you have to change your choice for Anders. So actually the keep alllows us that Anders could survive the events in act III even if you sided with the templars and this is impossible in the DA2 playthrough.

[Jedi Master of Orion]

He can side with the templars if you have full rivalry with him. He says he plans to kill himself afterward but apparently changed his mind based on what Varric says in DAI.

[Totuvor]

I indeed had full rivalry with Anders! (I was gathering some missing achievements for DA2 for example "magehunter" and also got the rivalry achievement for him ).

 

That's the reason why I thought it can't be changed during my playthrough anymore that Anders returns and engages you in case you sided with the templars. (I don't want any companion to be killed or left). Therefore I was very dissatisfied because I didnt kill Anders, so Sebastian left but if you have to kill Anders nevertheless I also could have killed him instantly for keeping Sebastian. So I lost both ;(

 

Besides I also can't imagine that Anders would side with you against the mages even if you have a romance with him 0o

I guess his option killing himself afterwards comes if you side with the mages but convict his action towards the chantry and don't allow him to join your party again.

[Jedi Master of Orion]

No he will fight alongside the templars if you have full rivalry and agreed to do his final quest. Just ask.

[kimgoold]

1. My gripe is my Warden specialisations are not registered, why the inquisitor and not the Warden? And Hawke if a blood mage, you should get the option of calling he/she a hypocrite at ritual tower.

2. Why no tiles for Golems of Amgarrak? You overhear about House Dace blocking attempts to enter (Winter Palace), and Varric also mentions a loan to Jerrick Dace to finance expedition so why no mention?

[Totuvor]

Hmmmm this could be the reason. I just helped Anders gathering the ingredients but didnt go with him to the church to distract Elthina.

 

Maybe thats why he is fighting against me even with full rivalry and wont survive. So it isnt a bug in the tapestry then after all.

[Darth Vitrial]

List updated.

[Brian Mills]

For the case of Golems of Amgarrak specifically, I think the reason we didn't add any tiles was the fact that there weren't many choices actually made during the DLC.  We had that come up for a few different pieces of content we looked at.  Instead, the game usually assumes that the DLC was completed, and includes it (or not) on that basis.

 

For some of the other choices listed, we've actually looked at a number of them in the past.  Some we left out for the reason above, while others we could solve for based on other choices you made ("if you do X and Y then Z must have happened - we don't need a tile for it"), and others were just left out, either intentionally or otherwise.  

 

Having a list of suggested plots that could be added in the future doesn't hurt (and saves me from having to manually edit and maintain a list of the request we get!), but I can't commit to which, if any, will be added in the future; that would depend on a number of factors, including staffing and budget for art, text, qa, etc., which story lines the writers might want more flexibility around, and so forth.  The Keep team isn't large, and we need to balance completeness and varied content in the site with having an accessible level of detail for players new to the franchise that allows them to create a new world state quickly and easily.

[Darth Vitrial]

Oh wow, staff response! 0_0

Thanks for taking the time to look this over. Do you have any specific ones I should remove from the list (or just strikethrough but leave there for record purposes)? As in, any "definitely nope" or "already accounted for" ones?

Edit: as far as art and simplicity go, have you considered just having a list of yes/no checkboxes for the particularly minor choices? This would also help for choices like character origins with lots of possibilities.

[Brian Mills]

I (and a few others) do watch this forum

 

We could add checkboxes for nearly all plots - "Did you kiss NPC XYZ? Y/N" was a common request early on.  Unfortunately, we'd end up with dozens (hundreds?) of plots there were nothing else and that would make no sense for someone new to the franchise.  We also are restricted in how many tiles we can add - each of them has a definite cost associated to them, both financial and for factors like site performance, speed of the autosolver when correcting logic errors, etc.

 

For the most part, anything we can 100% tell from existing tiles isn't likely to be added, unless it's a major plot point or it's completely not obvious how to set that value.  For example, the Dark ritual tile isn't needed per se, since we can solve some of it from the tile about who killed the Archdemon, but it is a major plot point and one people expected to find but didn't in early versions of the Keep, so we added it during closed beta.  Likewise, anything that boils down to "did you do a DLC" or "did you do a sideplot with no major impact in that game?" probably won't be added, unless it is wanted by writing or other groups.  We also condensed down a few plot outcomes in some cases, where the end result was identical, allowing us to cut down choices in the hopes people could pick the "best" answer.

 

Fun fact:

When we started the Keep, we had a much smaller list of plots than we have now - basically just the bare minimum for what DAI needed.  During closed beta, we added a number of other tiles, either for plot outcomes we missed or entire plots, as well as fixing logic around the plots to match all of the edge cases and scenarios that were possible (and a huge thank you to everyone who helped with that, as I could never have caught them all myself).  

 

During that time, the #1 requested specific plot tiles weren't for Awakenings or the Architect (which didn't exist at all) - it was for Zerlinda, to ensure that we added more of her possible outcomes.  If I recall correctly, she was the most requested improvement by a factor of 2-3X to anything else.

[Darth Vitrial]

That's very interesting, thanks for the info!

Another thought that occurred for dealing with insignificant choices- an "advanced" tab. It could be a much simplified design, no fancy art or anything, and just lots of options for choices that are currently not used/planned to be used. That way, players that want lots of customization can use it, but newbies would have it hidden by default and wouldn't need to worry about it. Just an idea.


Appreciate the response, thanks.

[Brian Mills]

In some ways, the tapestry is already the advanced tab, if you think of the ISS as being the simpler version with only a few choices

 

We did do some experiments with designs like simple checklists and dropdowns, but they all had major interface issues - any advanced tab would likely need to retain the tapestry-style interface, or some other design if we reworked the entire site.  Personally, I think the biggest challenge would be deciding what should be a "base" choice and what would be an "advanced" choice; to me, Zerlinda is a minor plot choice, but as I noted above, to a large number of players she was a major decision that they needed to correctly reflect in their world state.  Some people think the boons in DAO have a major impact on their story, and others chose ones with a relatively minor consequence.  Likewise, things like romances are minor and completely ignored by a lot of players and for others they're one of the most important aspects of their roleplaying experience.  We could do a system like that, but I think it would be a challenge, if not impossible, to make everyone happy about what we did and did not place into each category - definitely something I'd make someone else decide if I could

[Kantr]

People thought Zerlinda was more Important than the Architect?

[Brian Mills]

Zerlinda was more common a response for sure - on a side by side comparison, they may have said otherwise, but it's always surprising to me what characters and parts of our games people remember and focus on.  Further, it seems like what people comment on and ask for is almost never what I personally like or remember from the same story line or game.

 

Those players may have never encountered the architect at all - or maybe they just found Zerlinda's plot line memorable for some reason.  We also had a lot of people trying to recreate "their" world state, rather than just any world state, so the fact that they couldn't select the "right" choice might have been more jarring to them than another choice not being there and being overlooked by them.  It's hard to say.

[TheKomandorShepard]

I have a question to you Brian Mills, im not sure if you can answer.

 

Why keep lacks some of "choices" from previous games despite they are used in DaI?

 

In dai leliana establishes her relations with the warden ,everything is fine unless you didn't romance her and she was in your party ,then Dai assumes you were BFF with her.Same is with Alistair, in states where he is grey warden if i recall dai always assume you had him in the party during fade sequence as he mentions demon pretending to be her sister.  

[Brian Mills]

I can't speak for every choice, but I would imagine a lot of it is simply due to having enough zots to cover all situations.  DAI is a large game, and the team was already working on a project that didn't leave room to put in everything that we would have liked it to.

 

Adding a way to reflect and control the handling of every possible alternate line of dialogue would need, at a minimum:

• New tile art and text in the Keep
• Testing to ensure the "rules" for the Keep are correct for the new choices
• Testing to ensure the game handles the new flag states correctly 
• Writing for the new dialogue line
• Recording of VO for the new dialogue lines, at 4 actors X 9 languages
• Cinematic design and/or animations to play when the line is spoken
• Level designer work to manage how the plot flags in-game are handled, and whether we need to hide/show characters differently
• Producers trying to corral all of the above, within budget and time constraints
• A bunch of other work I'm probably forgetting (it's almost 1AM and my 2-year old won't sleep :'( )

In some other cases, it may have been planned, but cut due to time and budget (a.k.a "zots") contstraints, or simply an oversight during development.  The Dragon Age franchise has a massive number of "what if?" cases, and to handle every one completely and in a way that interacts with the others is a huge task to cover.  We could have added the choices to just the Keep, and always used the same choices, but people notice that sort of thing and we don't want to do it on purpose.

 

We also made a conscious choice for the Keep that there was no handling of romancing >1 person at once - if you romanced someone and broke it off, or went on to romance someone else, then the new NPC was your romance.  Doing it any other way would have made the plot logic required almost impossible for us to manage, especially when many plot outcomes were dependent on not just if you romanced someone, but how you did it (e.g. "rivalmancing")

[Hiigo]

i think who stabbed morrigan is important choice. keep says warden doing it it implying mc when custom made character can stab her too.

[flixwito]

Awesome list, i hope they implement these ideas on future....

 

I just want to add a little:

* Vigilance

Well... it's already on this list.

* The Hawke's Key

It's a bit difficult to add this since it depends on Hawke's class and talent choice..

 

I hope we can obtain those weapons on DA:I with their unique effects.

[Izanagi_Nazo]

I wouldnt mind having more length in the Heroes' description that way I could describe specializations that I picked for them within that instead of worrying about the ability to pick them within the keep. Maybe some things within the narrative could be flagged.