4356 réponses à ce sujet

[Jaison1986]

Unfortunately the series since Fallout 3 now supports playing the game as a FPS. It's obvious that Bethesda isn't planning on going back on that idea, which means that the game gets to have some FPS mechanics in it.

 

It's honestly not even much of a change from New Vegas, as it primarily affects just the highly accurate rifles. Automatic weapons get increased spread, but you generally aren't trying to do long ranged precision shooting with them and missing 1 bullet from an assault rifle isn't as big as missing one from an AMR.

 

You can still have gun skill affect recoil and gun sway while aiming down the sights. That's an acceptable way of having gun skill affect your accuracy without taking it completely out of your hands as a player.

 

Of course if you watch the E3 video closely the pip-boy menu has no option to view your skills, and the description for INT now reads that it increases XP gain with no mention of skill points. Based on that, I'm not going to be surprised if skills as we know them are just gone from the game in Fallout 4.

 

IDK. They are trying really hard to stay faithful of the style FO3 and FNV introduced. It would be quite the low blow if they just remove skills alltogether.

[Fast Jimmy]

Unfortunately the series since Fallout 3 now supports playing the game as a FPS. It's obvious that Bethesda isn't planning on going back on that idea, which means that the game gets to have some FPS mechanics in it.

It's honestly not even much of a change from New Vegas, as it primarily affects just the highly accurate rifles. Automatic weapons get increased spread, but you generally aren't trying to do long ranged precision shooting with them and missing 1 bullet from an assault rifle isn't as big as missing one from an AMR.

You can still have gun skill affect recoil and gun sway while aiming down the sights. That's an acceptable way of having gun skill affect your accuracy without taking it completely out of your hands as a player.

Of course if you watch the E3 video closely the pip-boy menu has no option to view your skills, and the description for INT now reads that it increases XP gain with no mention of skill points. Based on that, I'm not going to be surprised if skills as we know them are just gone from the game in Fallout 4.

Yes, there isn't a dial for it, but there is also greyed-out dialogue options that the player can't say because they don't have a high enough Speech skill.

So I think calling Skills dead at this point is jumping the Fat Man quite a bit.

[Iakus]

Yes, there isn't a dial for it, but there is also greyed-out dialogue options that the player can't say because they don't have a high enough Speech skill.

So I think calling Skills dead at this point is jumping the Fat Man quite a bit.

I like the FNV option where you could say something with an insufficient skill score, but it comes out all unconvincing and wrong (like accusing the Boomers of cannibalism with a low Survival score)

 

Goes well with a Dumb Courier run.

[Jaison1986]

I like the FNV option where you could say something with an insufficient skill score, but it comes out all unconvincing and wrong (like accusing the Boomers of cannibalism with a low Survival score)

 

Goes well with a Dumb Courier run.

 

Haha, I remember that. The Courier was all like "so uhh... how about... we do the thing?" Totally awkward. One thing I don't like is that checks don't seem to have an percentage here. In new vegas you could see the skill required to sucefully charm a person.

[Fast Jimmy]

Haha, I remember that. The Courier was all like "so uhh... how about... we do the thing?" Totally awkward. One thing I don't like is that checks don't seem to have an percentage here. In new vegas you could see the skill required to sucefully charm a person.

I think they are moving away from the 1%-300% scale for skills and, instead, going with a 1-10 level, just like SPECIAL. This removes the percentages entirely and just makes it a "Level 5" skill check, for example.

[Sully13]

I liked how in Fallout3 you could just popback to a previos save and try it aggain and pass the check. i never failed once in that game. 

[Mr.House]

I liked how in Fallout3 you could just popback to a previos save and try it aggain and pass the check. i never failed once in that game. 

And that's why I hated the % check.

[Sully13]

Agreed i was being sarcastic. yeah i know i dosn't translate well.

[Cyonan]

Yes, there isn't a dial for it, but there is also greyed-out dialogue options that the player can't say because they don't have a high enough Speech skill.

So I think calling Skills dead at this point is jumping the Fat Man quite a bit.

 

Well I'm not calling them dead. Just noting that the way it's currently looking, they've been extremely absent from most marketing material for Fallout 4 so it wouldn't be incredibly surprising if they turned out to be dead or drastically changed.

 

I must have missed the dialogue that was greyed out. It seems odd that they would have skills without a menu to look at them.

[Barbarossa2010]

Well, here's a brief early analysis...and what he's talking about is what is fueling the 'no skills' speculation. Take it with a grain of salt or not. I still don't think Skills are out of the picture myself. I personally don't want to just perk my way through the game, managing a PC with only SPECIAL stats and perks. Too Skyrim-ish.

[Sully13]

thaught as much. honestly i like the look of the new system but we will see.

[Jaison1986]

What if... It's like in Skyrim? Were we increase our skills by performing them? Shooting an gun and hitting an enemy increase your guns skills, hacking computers increase your science, passing speech checks increase your speech, etc, etc.

 

Of course, even if it was like that, the pipboy still should have an option to show how our skill are progressing. So, who knows for sure?

[Fast Jimmy]

What if... It's like in Skyrim? Were we increase our skills by performing them? Shooting an gun and hitting an enemy increase your guns skills, hacking computers increase your science, passing speech checks increase your speech, etc, etc.

Of course, even if it was like that, the pipboy still should have an option to show how our skill are progressing. So, who knows for sure?

Maybe the Perk Chart is exactly like Skyrim's, where it shows the level of Skill we currently have as well as any perks? That, to me, would make sense why there isn't a separate Skills tab, simply because the perks and skills are all represented in the same place.

[Akrabra]

Maybe the Perk Chart is exactly like Skyrim's, where it shows the level of Skill we currently have as well as any perks? That, to me, would make sense why there isn't a separate Skills tab, simply because the perks and skills are all represented in the same place.

Most likely it will be like this. And to be honest that makes me more interested. Maybe i am in the minority by liking the system in Skyrim, but it was alot of fun even if it was abit more streamlined. 

[Mr.House]

And that will kill FO4 for me. that system was horrible in Skyrim.

[ObserverStatus]

Well, here's a brief early analysis...and what he's talking about is what is fueling the 'no skills' speculation. Take it with a grain of salt or not. I still don't think Skills are out of the picture myself. I personally don't want to just perk my way through the game, managing a PC with only SPECIAL stats and perks. Too Skyrim-ish.

Whatever the case, I'm just glad we won't be having to practice our skills to gain levels anymore. Grinding alchemy to get 2H weapon perks in Skyrim was annoying. Boo to alchemy. I mean Skyrim's progression system may have been intuitive, but it was so boring trying to level up everything that wasn't a weapon skill. I wasted many hours making magic daggers that I would have rather spent chopping draugrs into little pieces.

[Cyonan]

Most likely it will be like this. And to be honest that makes me more interested. Maybe i am in the minority by liking the system in Skyrim, but it was alot of fun even if it was abit more streamlined. 

 

I liked the idea of the different perks within each skill, though I would still prefer being able to assign points on level up to each skill.

 

Having to actually use them was a pain to level certain skills like Speechcraft.

[Barbarossa2010]

Whatever the case, I'm just glad we won't be having to practice our skills to gain levels anymore. Grinding alchemy to get 2H weapon perks in Skyrim was annoying. Boo to alchemy. I mean Skyrim's progression system may have been intuitive, but it was so boring trying to level up everything that wasn't a weapon skill. I wasted many hours making magic daggers that I would have rather spent chopping draugrs into little pieces.

OMG, I'm having 'iron dagger' flashbacks.

[Fast Jimmy]

And that will kill FO4 for me. that system was horrible in Skyrim.

I feel like in some respects, it made sense. In others, it was really out there.

Some of the dependent feats in the trees made no sense to me and felt like a waste. Other things worked... one shouldn't be able to craft 10,000 iron daggers and go straight into crafting dragon mail. But taking the feats themselves seemed odd... it would have made more sense with a trainer system or something.



Regardless, it would mean Skills aren't dead.

[Fast Jimmy]

I liked the idea of the different perks within each skill, though I would still prefer being able to assign points on level up to each skill.

Having to actually use them was a pain to level certain skills like Speechcraft.

Agreed. I abused a glitch that you could abuse in the Riften brewery to max it out. But then it did nothing at all in game (I remember the number of times it played into something could RB counted on one hand), which makes such things even worse.

I'm all for an XP system. Ideally, there would be various types of XP. Combat, magic, Charismatic, Crafting... XP gained for different tasks, so you avoid the "I killed 500 giant rats, now I can understand thermonuclear physics" situations.

[Barbarossa2010]

I liked the idea of the different perks within each skill, though I would still prefer being able to assign points on level up to each skill.
 
Having to actually use them was a pain to level certain skills like Speechcraft.

Agreed. And when they plugged the exploits, it made it virtually impossible, save selling billions and billions of items, to ever max it.

 

I didn't like having to do certain things I would normally never do, or didn't enjoy, in order to level above the 50's. It's really all about choosing your grind. I'd rather decap a thousand Raiders than pick 50,000 locks, or sell a billion items. Just me.

 

Use it and improve it works well in the primary skills you want to use, it's all the rest that hold you back from level capping and force you into an unpleasant grind.

[Sully13]

Who actualy baught anything in New Vegas or Skyrim other than Stims or potions? i wound up going threw New Vegas only buying the implants and 12.7mm ammo and invisability potions and training in Skyrim.

[Cyonan]

Agreed. And when they plugged the exploits, it made it virtually impossible, save selling billions and billions of items, to ever max it.

 

I didn't like having to do certain things I would normally never do, or didn't enjoy, in order to level above the 50's. It's really all about choosing your grind. I'd rather decap a thousand Raiders than pick 50,000 locks, or sell a billion items. Just me.

 

Use it and improve it works well in the primary skills you want to use, it's all the rest that hold you back from level capping and force you into an unpleasant grind.

 

I actually didn't care too much about level capping in Skyrim, though I was playing a thief that I wanted to be good at speechcraft. Of course, unless I sold the stupid number of items there wasn't really a way to get that skill up. Even paying for training was getting so expensive that I was starting to struggle with stealing it all back with 100 pickpocketing.

 

If they're gonna go with the "use it to level it" style of skills, then they need to provide more chances to level up the skills that have limited to no use in combat.

 

Lock picking is one that I actually naturally have high on every Skyrim character, just because I can't not loot a locked chest even if it'll have pointless loot 90% of the time.

[Fast Jimmy]

I actually didn't care too much about level capping in Skyrim, though I was playing a thief that I wanted to be good at speechcraft. Of course, unless I sold the stupid number of items there wasn't really a way to get that skill up. Even paying for training was getting so expensive that I was starting to struggle with stealing it all back with 100 pickpocketing.

If they're gonna go with the "use it to level it" style of skills, then they need to provide more chances to level up the skills that have limited to no use in combat.

Lock picking is one that I actually naturally have high on every Skyrim character, just because I can't not loot a locked chest even if it'll have pointless loot 90% of the time.

You're being generous with 90%.

[Akrabra]

Still the Skyrim system didn't lock you down with 7 skills for lvling the rest of the game. If you wanted to change your lot in life you could, and it made for some interesting roleplaying. Atleast when they introduced Vampires aswell. It did have its flaws ofc, but everything can be made to be better.

 

When it comes to FO4 i am still thinking that the skills will be perk based, maybe a 1-10 system and you get to choose one skill-perk per level on top of the normal perk you get. Either you do 1 - 4 skill where each one counts as 25 skill points from the old system or 1 - 10 where each rank counts as 10 skill points from the old system. Or just revamp everything into skills that has perk benefits, or perks that have skills, hmmm.