1396 réponses à ce sujet

[Zjarcal]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Zjarcal wrote...
But of course no one can beat Wynne in her affinity for the Fade. It shines out of her bum after all...

And yet Sten and Morrigan fare much better there than her.

I forgot to the add the sarcasm tag...

Ugh, now I'm reminded again that I have to go through her fade dream in my next playthrough... 

Modifié par Zjarcal, 16 décembre 2010 - 12:01 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

I understood you regardless

It's sad that there is nothing to talk about in this section of the forum, other than Wynne. Ugh.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 16 décembre 2010 - 12:02 .

[Zjarcal]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

It's sad that there is nothing to talk about in this section of the forum, other than Wynne. Ugh.

*sighs*

You're right. 

Three more months till DA2....

[Reaverwind]

Zjarcal wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Zjarcal wrote...
But of course no one can beat Wynne in her affinity for the Fade. It shines out of her bum after all...

And yet Sten and Morrigan fare much better there than her.

I forgot to the add the sarcasm tag...

Ugh, now I'm reminded again that I have to go through her fade dream in my next playthrough... 

UGH, indeed. I'll just grit my teeth and deal with the collateral damage when I kill her this go-round - I really hate having her forced into my party.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Zjarcal wrote...

But of course no one can beat Wynne in her affinity for the Fade. It shines out of her bum after all... *sarcasm*

Hell, if Wynne had a "Fade Shine" spell, where she controlled enemies with her bright shiny bum, I would consider using her more often.

She probably originally came with a "fart rainbows" area effect spell, or "summon unicorn" spell, but the developers realized it was too glorious for most graphics cards to handle, so they just left her with vessel of the Spirit.

[ejoslin]

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...

Zjarcal wrote...

But of course no one can beat Wynne in her affinity for the Fade. It shines out of her bum after all... *sarcasm*

Hell, if Wynne had a "Fade Shine" spell, where she controlled enemies with her bright shiny bum, I would consider using her more often.

She probably originally came with a "fart rainbows" area effect spell, or "summon unicorn" spell, but the developers realized it was too glorious for most graphics cards to handle, so they just left her with vessel of the Spirit.

Somehow, I think a photoshop pic of the Alicorn with Wynne in RtO is in order -- but I'm too lazy.

[Zjarcal]

ejoslin wrote...

Somehow, I think a photoshop pic of the Alicorn with Wynne in RtO is in order -- but I'm too lazy.

There's an idea!

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

[quote]ejoslin wrote...

[/quote]

Somehow, I think a photoshop pic of the Alicorn with Wynne in RtO is in order -- but I'm too lazy.

[/quote]

Farting rainbows while suggesting to Alistair she wants to drag him back to her tent and get Granny-Freaky, so her hitting on him doesn't seem so....vile?

That would blow every creep factor out of the water by a long shot.

[IanPolaris]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Zjarcal wrote...
But of course no one can beat Wynne in her affinity for the Fade. It shines out of her bum after all...

And yet Sten and Morrigan fare much better there than her.

Boy isn't that the truth!  In fact Morrigan's dream in the fade is the sort of thing I'd expect from an savvy, experienced mage that might not have enough octane on their own to break it.  I also notice that Niall wasn't fooled by a moment by his dream and he (like your warden) had enough strength to escape the first level of the trap.  He just didn't have the courage to go the rest of the way.

Compared with Morrigan and even Niall, Wynne's "affinity" for the fade sure sounds pretty underwhelming to me.

-Polaris

[Sabariel]

You can have an affinity for something and still get blindsided. I have an affinity for horses. Doesn't mean I always know when I'm going to get a kick.

[IanPolaris]

Sabariel wrote...

You can have an affinity for something and still get blindsided. I have an affinity for horses. Doesn't mean I always know when I'm going to get a kick.

It does mean, however, that your skill should be better than those of a city-boy and thus you should get kicked less.

The point is that Wynne shows shocking incompetance in the Fade for a Mage of her experience and position.

-Polaris

[ejoslin]

IanPolaris wrote...

Sabariel wrote...

You can have an affinity for something and still get blindsided. I have an affinity for horses. Doesn't mean I always know when I'm going to get a kick.

It does mean, however, that your skill should be better than those of a city-boy and thus you should get kicked less.

The point is that Wynne shows shocking incompetance in the Fade for a Mage of her experience and position.

-Polaris

It also makes me wonder what really IS possessing her -- would she really know the difference between various fade denizens.  She was unable to recognize the demons in the fade -- and the fade spirit that was in her, that you think would have at least given her a feeling that something was wrong, does not give her a clue about this as well.  

we only have her word about what is possessing her.  I'm sure she believes it's a benevolent spirit.  demons do that -- fool their hosts and their thralls.

Edit: After all, we DO know that spirits don't try to cross over into our world -- only demons do that.  A pride demon may be able to convince someone who is sure of their own fade-affinity-ness that they are the one special person whom a spirit would want to keep alive.

Or it could be a demon who wants to experience what it's like to feel mortal.  Justice is the one other spirit you know of that inhabits a dead body -- but he actually took over the body completely and did NOT choose it.  Wynne's spirit is sharing, like demons do, for whatever reasons they have.

Just some random musing about it here

Modifié par ejoslin, 16 décembre 2010 - 01:22 .

[Sabariel]

No, not particularly. I've seen a "city boy" or two who've taken to the horses naturally and have been just as good with them as me or even better in a few instances. Does that make me a person worthy of such venomous hatred?



And that warrants hatred, why? Wynne never claims to be the Grand Pooba of the Fade. She merely says she's always had an affinity for the spirits of the Fade (not the actual Fade itself). And, if she was truly able to summon a spirit that helped her, she was correct.

[Sabariel]

ejoslin wrote...

IanPolaris wrote...

Sabariel wrote...

You can have an affinity for something and still get blindsided. I have an affinity for horses. Doesn't mean I always know when I'm going to get a kick.

It does mean, however, that your skill should be better than those of a city-boy and thus you should get kicked less.

The point is that Wynne shows shocking incompetance in the Fade for a Mage of her experience and position.

-Polaris

It also makes me wonder what really IS possessing her -- would she really know the difference between various fade denizens.  She was unable to recognize the demons in the fade -- and the fade spirit that was in her, that you think would have at least given her a feeling that something was wrong, does not give her a clue about this as well.  

we only have her word about what is possessing her.  I'm sure she believes it's a benevolent spirit.  demons do that -- fool their hosts and their thralls.

And yet she acts nothing like one who has been possessed by a demon. Why would she be the only one to act differently?

[ejoslin]

Sabariel wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

IanPolaris wrote...

Sabariel wrote...

You can have an affinity for something and still get blindsided. I have an affinity for horses. Doesn't mean I always know when I'm going to get a kick.

It does mean, however, that your skill should be better than those of a city-boy and thus you should get kicked less.

The point is that Wynne shows shocking incompetance in the Fade for a Mage of her experience and position.

-Polaris

It also makes me wonder what really IS possessing her -- would she really know the difference between various fade denizens.  She was unable to recognize the demons in the fade -- and the fade spirit that was in her, that you think would have at least given her a feeling that something was wrong, does not give her a clue about this as well.  

we only have her word about what is possessing her.  I'm sure she believes it's a benevolent spirit.  demons do that -- fool their hosts and their thralls.

And yet she acts nothing like one who has been possessed by a demon. Why would she be the only one to act differently?

hmmm, you actually see a few abominations outside of the tower.  Not all are the dramatic connor types.  Uldred was acting like a prat even before he was possessed by a pride demon.  the templar who was enthralled by the desire demon, yes he was living in a fantasy world, but probably not acting any differently than he would have had he actually been living in that situation.  sophia didn't seem to be in any hurry to take over the world.  I wonder if Amalia was unrecognizable if kitty possesses her.

I think it would depend greatly on the demon's personality, how different the person would be.

Modifié par ejoslin, 16 décembre 2010 - 01:26 .

[Sabariel]

ejoslin wrote...

Sabariel wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

IanPolaris wrote...

Sabariel wrote...

You can have an affinity for something and still get blindsided. I have an affinity for horses. Doesn't mean I always know when I'm going to get a kick.

It does mean, however, that your skill should be better than those of a city-boy and thus you should get kicked less.

The point is that Wynne shows shocking incompetance in the Fade for a Mage of her experience and position.

-Polaris

It also makes me wonder what really IS possessing her -- would she really know the difference between various fade denizens.  She was unable to recognize the demons in the fade -- and the fade spirit that was in her, that you think would have at least given her a feeling that something was wrong, does not give her a clue about this as well.  

we only have her word about what is possessing her.  I'm sure she believes it's a benevolent spirit.  demons do that -- fool their hosts and their thralls.

And yet she acts nothing like one who has been possessed by a demon. Why would she be the only one to act differently?

hmmm, you actually see a few abominations outside of the tower.  Not all are the dramatic connor types.  Uldred was acting like a prat even before he was possessed by a pride demon.  the templar who was enthralled by the desire demon, yes he was living in a fantasy world, but probably not acting any differently than he would have had he actually been living in that situation.  sophia didn't seem to be in any hurry to take over the world.  I wonder if Amalia was unrecognizable if kitty possesses her.

I think it would depend greatly on the demon's personality, how different the person would be.

They don't have to be dramatic. They all long for something. They're all cruel in one way or another. If Kitty possesses Amalia she. starts. talking. like. William. Shatner. on. a. slow. day. Her father notices something is not quite right with her when she returns to him, but they leave before that can be explored further.

Wynne never talks like a possessed person, she never expresses cruelty, she never expresses longing or wanting, and no one close to her ever mentions a change in her.

And why would a demon even bother to revive a dead old woman when Petra was right there?

Modifié par Sabariel, 16 décembre 2010 - 01:32 .

[Addai]

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...

Farting rainbows while suggesting to Alistair she wants to drag him back to her tent and get Granny-Freaky, so her hitting on him doesn't seem so....vile?

That would blow every creep factor out of the water by a long shot.

LOL!  Indeed.  Ugh, Wynne cougaring on Alistair on the field where hundreds died and right before you go bury Cailan has got to be one of the creepiest setups in the game.

[ejoslin]

Sabariel wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

Sabariel wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

IanPolaris wrote...

Sabariel wrote...

You can have an affinity for something and still get blindsided. I have an affinity for horses. Doesn't mean I always know when I'm going to get a kick.

It does mean, however, that your skill should be better than those of a city-boy and thus you should get kicked less.

The point is that Wynne shows shocking incompetance in the Fade for a Mage of her experience and position.

-Polaris

It also makes me wonder what really IS possessing her -- would she really know the difference between various fade denizens.  She was unable to recognize the demons in the fade -- and the fade spirit that was in her, that you think would have at least given her a feeling that something was wrong, does not give her a clue about this as well.  

we only have her word about what is possessing her.  I'm sure she believes it's a benevolent spirit.  demons do that -- fool their hosts and their thralls.

And yet she acts nothing like one who has been possessed by a demon. Why would she be the only one to act differently?

hmmm, you actually see a few abominations outside of the tower.  Not all are the dramatic connor types.  Uldred was acting like a prat even before he was possessed by a pride demon.  the templar who was enthralled by the desire demon, yes he was living in a fantasy world, but probably not acting any differently than he would have had he actually been living in that situation.  sophia didn't seem to be in any hurry to take over the world.  I wonder if Amalia was unrecognizable if kitty possesses her.

I think it would depend greatly on the demon's personality, how different the person would be.

They don't have to be dramatic. They all long for something. They're all cruel in one way or another. If Kitty possesses Amalia she. starts. talking. like. William. Shatner. on. a. slow. day. Her father notices something is not quite right with her when she returns to him, but they leave before that can be explored further.

Wynne never talks like a possessed person, she never expresses cruelty, and no one close to her ever mentions a change in her.

And why would a demon even bother to revive a dead old woman when Petra was right there?

wynne was weak and dying, petra was strong enough to avoid possession.  

Not all demons have different voices as well.  Now, i'm not saying wynne for sure was possessed by a demon, but you really can't rule it out completely either.  She definitely was possessed, and she most definitely did not understand the fade or spirits the way she thought she did.  It just seems odd to me that she couldn't recognize the fade, couldn't recognize demons, and the thing inside of her, in its element, didn't let her know something was wrong.

One of the first thing you learn about Wynne is she actually cannot recognize demons or the fade.  Whatever was possessing her made her feel good, special, loved.  which makes me think it was possibly a desire demon.  Maybe the demon wanted the darkspawn dead as well -- I'm sure a blighted world is not as much fun for demons to play around in.

Modifié par ejoslin, 16 décembre 2010 - 01:36 .

[Sabariel]

ejoslin wrote...

wynne was weak and dying, petra was strong enough to avoid possession.  

Not all demons have different voices as well.  Now, i'm not saying wynne for sure was possessed by a demon, but you really can't rule it out completely either.  She definitely was possessed, and she most definitely did not understand the fade or spirits the way she thought she did.  It just seems odd to me that she couldn't recognize the fade, couldn't recognize demons, and the thing inside of her, in its element, didn't let her know something was wrong.

Considering Petra needed Wynne to fight off the demon that attacked her I would not call her "strong". She seems a better candidate for possession to me.

They don't all have different voices, but they all speak of the same things: longing, wanting, cruelty. Every demon wants something or longs for something. Wynne doesn't speak of the things they want at any point in time. I find it very hard to believe that a demon was her savior.

[Sarah1281]

Petra wasn't dying and Wynne was. Wynne already had a demon or spirit interested in her and it chose the time she was dying to possess her. A demon can't seem to possess someone without force unless that person is in the Fade. Petra wasn't in the Fade and Wynne was. Wynne wasn't forcibly possessed, she let the 'spirit' help her. And not all demons have 'longing, wanting, cruelty'. There are different demons who want different things. The theory about Wynne is she was possessed by a pride demon. Pride demons don't have to be greedy or go on mad killing sprees. What they do is appeal to the person's pride and Wynne is far prouder than I think someone with her skills deserves to be and - more to the point - more proud than she was pre-possession at Ostagar.

[Tigress M]

Reading about Wynne and RTO reminded me of last playthrough where I took Loghain with me to Ostagar. After picking up the quest, he highly suggested I leave the circle mage at camp for that trek. I thought that was incredibly funny!

[maxernst]

Sabariel wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

wynne was weak and dying, petra was strong enough to avoid possession.  

Not all demons have different voices as well.  Now, i'm not saying wynne for sure was possessed by a demon, but you really can't rule it out completely either.  She definitely was possessed, and she most definitely did not understand the fade or spirits the way she thought she did.  It just seems odd to me that she couldn't recognize the fade, couldn't recognize demons, and the thing inside of her, in its element, didn't let her know something was wrong.

Considering Petra needed Wynne to fight off the demon that attacked her I would not call her "strong". She seems a better candidate for possession to me.

They don't all have different voices, but they all speak of the same things: longing, wanting, cruelty. Every demon wants something or longs for something. Wynne doesn't speak of the things they want at any point in time. I find it very hard to believe that a demon was her savior.

I don;'t think Wynne is truly posessed by a demon for the same reason that I don't think Flemeth is really posessed, or if she is, it's by something else.  Demons are described in the codex as essentially maliciousand being driven by one of five fundamental human emotions.  There's no evidence in game to support demons having complex motives--except for Flemeth, and Morrigan hints in Witch Hunt that she is not really an abomination.

Modifié par maxernst, 16 décembre 2010 - 01:48 .

[ejoslin]

Sabariel wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

wynne was weak and dying, petra was strong enough to avoid possession.  

Not all demons have different voices as well.  Now, i'm not saying wynne for sure was possessed by a demon, but you really can't rule it out completely either.  She definitely was possessed, and she most definitely did not understand the fade or spirits the way she thought she did.  It just seems odd to me that she couldn't recognize the fade, couldn't recognize demons, and the thing inside of her, in its element, didn't let her know something was wrong.

Considering Petra needed Wynne to fight off the demon that attacked her I would not call her "strong". She seems a better candidate for possession to me.

They don't all have different voices, but they all speak of the same things: longing, wanting, cruelty. Every demon wants something or longs for something. Wynne doesn't speak of the things they want at any point in time. I find it very hard to believe that a demon was her savior.

Petra did her harrowing I assume?  She's far stronger than Wynne at that moment when it comes to being possessed by a demon -- Wynne cannot fight off a possession if she's, well, dying or dead.  Or invites it in.

And you only learn a small amount about demons.  All I can say for sure about Wynne is she's possessed by something, and believes it's a good spirit, not a bad one, though good spirits have no interest in being in the world of mortals (only demons do).  she cannot recognize demons nor the fade.  And when she was being fooled by demons in the fade, she believed what they pretended they were.  And her fade spirit didn't let her know anything was wrong, though that was its domain.

Maybe that's why she ended up going to tevinter, or just disappearing.   

Modifié par ejoslin, 16 décembre 2010 - 01:55 .

[Reaverwind]

Tigress M wrote...

Reading about Wynne and RTO reminded me of last playthrough where I took Loghain with me to Ostagar. After picking up the quest, he highly suggested I leave the circle mage at camp for that trek. I thought that was incredibly funny!

Really? Does he say why?

[maxernst]

Sarah1281 wrote...

Petra wasn't dying and Wynne was. Wynne already had a demon or spirit interested in her and it chose the time she was dying to possess her. A demon can't seem to possess someone without force unless that person is in the Fade. Petra wasn't in the Fade and Wynne was. Wynne wasn't forcibly possessed, she let the 'spirit' help her. And not all demons have 'longing, wanting, cruelty'. There are different demons who want different things. The theory about Wynne is she was possessed by a pride demon. Pride demons don't have to be greedy or go on mad killing sprees. What they do is appeal to the person's pride and Wynne is far prouder than I think someone with her skills deserves to be and - more to the point - more proud than she was pre-possession at Ostagar.

We didn't really see that much of her at Ostagar and as far as being prouder than someone with her skills deserves to be--why?  She's a senior enchanter who was asked to be first enchanter, so she's one of the very best mages in the country.  She's approximately as skilled as the rest of the party and several members are clearly prouder than her in my opinion:  Morrigan, Loghain and Sten.  Are they all posessed by pride demons, too?

As far as the fade, I think the fact that she got caught indicates that the spirit is not really in posession of her.  If it was, why would it surrender control to another demon,and a lesser one at that, since pride demons are supposedly the top of the demonic food chain.  As to why she failed to recognize the made and Morrigan didn't.  Maybe there's a simpler explanation.  Morrigan's dream with its loving Flemeth was totally unconvincing, so she recongized it as a dream for the same reason that the PC does, even if not a mage.