178 réponses à ce sujet

[Basher of Glory]

If I would be rude, I'd say go elsewhere to wine about your console-bound fate.

 

But of course I am not rude and don't say such vulgarities

[FieryDove]

Asking for a toolkit is not the solution. It help only 1/5 of the player community. is egoistical and ecocentric.

 

If you don't mind me asking, would you use mods if you could? I think that 99.99% of those playing on consoles would not use or care about mods. The reason I think this? When both new consoles were announced I read a multitude of forums for several weeks and it was all complaining about spy cameras and having to be connected to play a purchased game every 24hrs or be locked out of purchase etc. Not one person asked about mods/modding. Not one.

 

If these people would have complained as one huge voice like they did to get M$ to change spy cam/24 connect etc. S$ny and M$ would have had to at least pacify the crowds as say something like, approved mods on some titles may happen in the future. (or something like that).

 

As someone pointed out there is one game that will allow mods if approved, hopefully more will follow suit. But it's doubtful when the user base doesn't care or doesn't think they can change things when clearly they can.

 

all imho

 

As to hair, I hope all future titles of DA are set far away from orlais. What they call fashion is ugly as all heck and I'd rather go back to free marchers/ferelden. At least I had good looking hair/variety. (My DAI dwarf looked bad without braids)

 

cheers,

FD

[duckley]

I have played games on PC and have used mods - especially DA:O. I would definitely use them on my PS4 as I much prefer gaming on a console to the PC.

[Felya87]

If you don't mind me asking, would you use mods if you could? I think that 99.99% of those playing on consoles would not use or care about mods. The reason I think this? When both new consoles were announced I read a multitude of forums for several weeks and it was all complaining about spy cameras and having to be connected to play a purchased game every 24hrs or be locked out of purchase etc. Not one person asked about mods/modding. Not one.

If these people would have complained as one huge voice like they did to get M$ to change spy cam/24 connect etc. S$ny and M$ would have had to at least pacify the crowds as say something like, approved mods on some titles may happen in the future. (or something like that).

As someone pointed out there is one game that will allow mods if approved, hopefully more will follow suit. But it's doubtful when the user base doesn't care or doesn't think they can change things when clearly they can.

all imho

As to hair, I hope all future titles of DA are set far away from orlais. What they call fashion is ugly as all heck and I'd rather go back to free marchers/ferelden. At least I had good looking hair/variety. (My DAI dwarf looked bad without braids)

cheers,
FD

What have to do being forced to have the console connected to play the game with mods? because really, I can't see how the thing is even remotely similar. How many PC players complain about Origin or being forced to stay online to play a game? I don't keep my console connected everytime, for example. And until two years ago, I had to take it to my parents to connect it and download patch and DLCs, because I didn't had internet. having to connect it daily would have been a problem. many console players choose console because is less expensive than a gaming pc, and if they don't always have the money for the pc, is possible they have limited connection.

You may never seen console players complain about mods in those occasions...because there were never any options ofr those! why should have they complained about it? that doesn't means they would not have cared. But in that moment, it was another subject they where angry about: the freedom of a console player, who buy the cd, put it in the console and play, and chance to exchange games from one friend to another, or buy without problem used games.

The obligatory online would have made impossibile the exange of games between friends, that was always a thing with consoles (I played two over three games of Spyro thanks to my friends).

Edit: By the way, of course if there was the chance console players would use mods! Why not?

[Basher of Glory]

Perhaps we should come back to the topic. I am certain, that a thread about consoles and PCs exists somewhere.

 

But one question is interesting:

 

Could it be true, that BW makes modding hard respectively impossible to even out the disadvantages of consoles vs. PC and thus, create a very strange "justice" and / or to avoid "jealous" console-players?

[Felya87]

Naaa...I think is mostly about wanting to make a less modifiable game. The mods aren't supported from DA2, is nothing new. Mostly is that they don't possess Frostbite.

[Sunnie]

Perhaps we should come back to the topic. I am certain, that a thread about consoles and PCs exists somewhere.

 

But one question is interesting:

 

Could it be true, that BW makes modding hard respectively impossible to even out the disadvantages of consoles vs. PC and thus, create a very strange "justice" and / or to avoid "jealous" console-players?

Some points...

 

• DA:I was developed on the Frostbite 3 engine
• Frostbite series engine was created as a Shooter engine by DICE
• Frostbite (and FB2), were created primarily to combat hacking/cheating/modding in these MP shooter games while creating an engine to use newer graphics, audio, and network technologies.
• Frostbite 3 was adapted (at great expense and time) by BioWare for DA:I (and still more for ME4) because EA has mandated that FB3 is to be used for all its main stream titles going forward. Other EA studios are also now using it and a few non-shooter games have already been released.

The 3rd point, this is a major reason why it's more difficult to mod the game. There was a discussion with a few developers who stated that they are NOT trying to kill modding, its just that they don't consider modding when making updates and DLC for the game, which in turn breaks the player made tools used to mod with. BioWare devs have actually been very forthright with their thoughts on modding, they have nothing against it.

 

Something interesting about Frostbite, DICE has stated in the past that they have not ruled out the possibility of releasing mod tools for the Frostbite 2/3 engines. There's a glimmer of hope there, but unless EA can somehow monetize that, it is likely that will never happen.

[Basher of Glory]

Let's say, that there will be modding tools in a near future.

 

What do you think about how long it would take to create

 

- nice hairpacks

- a skillbar like in DA:O

- the first "overhaul" which makes the customization of literally anything possible?

[andy6915]

If you don't mind me asking, would you use mods if you could? I think that 99.99% of those playing on consoles would not use or care about mods. The reason I think this? When both new consoles were announced I read a multitude of forums for several weeks and it was all complaining about spy cameras and having to be connected to play a purchased game every 24hrs or be locked out of purchase etc. Not one person asked about mods/modding. Not one.

If these people would have complained as one huge voice like they did to get M$ to change spy cam/24 connect etc. S$ny and M$ would have had to at least pacify the crowds as say something like, approved mods on some titles may happen in the future. (or something like that).

As someone pointed out there is one game that will allow mods if approved, hopefully more will follow suit. But it's doubtful when the user base doesn't care or doesn't think they can change things when clearly they can.

all imho

As to hair, I hope all future titles of DA are set far away from orlais. What they call fashion is ugly as all heck and I'd rather go back to free marchers/ferelden. At least I had good looking hair/variety. (My DAI dwarf looked bad without braids)

cheers,
FD

Are you freaking kidding me? You actually think console gamers wouldn't care about mods if they were an option? I knew PC gamers were as confused and clueless about console gamers as the Arishok was about Kirkwall, but this... Take it from me, a console game: I would l would use the HELL out of mods. Countless freaking times I have gotten ridiculously jealous of PC gamers for the mods they get to use that I never will, like the DAO ones that make female Dalish armor into real armor instead of a damn 2 piece bikini.

[lastpatriot]

Countless freaking times I have gotten ridiculously jealous of PC gamers for the mods they get to use that I never will

 

Don't take this the wrong way but if you feel so strongly about the options afforded by the PC, why not ditch the console?  I used to hate playing games on a PC but now I'll never use a console again.  I just hate the limitations you are stuck with on a console and a PC is so easy to upgrade.

[Basher of Glory]

I am aware, I could google it.

 

But tell me please about the prices of actual consoles and how long they will be valid until the next gen comes out.

 

A good PC I estimate between € 400,-- (minimum requ.) and 800,-- (good enough to play most games on medium to max settings).

For high end PCs add another € 500 - 1000 + x

[Sunnie]

I am aware, I could google it.

 

But tell me please about the prices of actual consoles and how long they will be valid until the next gen comes out.

 

A good PC I estimate between € 400,-- (minimum requ.) and 800,-- (good enough to play most games on medium to max settings).

For high end PCs add another € 500 - 1000 + x

$300-$600 for a current gen console + the cost of anything you want to do with it. There's a cost attached to just about everything a console does.

 

A current mid-range gaming PC can be had for $1200ish (there are options for pre-built, custom, and modified pre-built that can drive the cost down). A better built PC can last, be relevant  and play everything for 10-15 years.

 

I am still using the PC I built back in 2003, and it plays everything on high or ultra just fine, as well as the Abobe Suite and Vegas Pro, very well. The only thing I am going to have to do soon is buy a new display card because mine is a DX10 card and most games coming out in the next year and beyond will require DX11+.

Other than that, my display card is still very good.

 

In the time I have been using my PC, I have seen 3 generations of consoles. Add the fact that there's a lot you can do on a PC that doesn't rob your bank/wallet/purse every time you turn it on, and it's not hard to see which is the better value over time. Sure, it may cost more initially, but the cost over time and the lack of limitations far outweigh a Consoles value for many people.

[Lebanese Dude]

I honestly fail to see how consoles could ever realistically be remotely on par with PCs when it comes to modding, at least in the remote future.

 

I empathize with people who cannot afford PCs that meet the minimum requirements for most modern games, but the fact of the matter is that the very concept of modification goes against what consoles are designed to do: Be simple, efficient, regulated, and safe platforms for running multimedia. 

[Basher of Glory]

Today I saw a pre-built budget PC in a supermarket for € 399,-- (~ 441 US $)

 

It was a dual-core Intel Pentium G3250 (2× 3,2 GHz) with a GeForce GTX 750 and 4 GB RAM and W 8.1 pre-installed.

Certainly not the end of the line, but good enough to play almost anything currently out there on min - medium settings.

Invest another 100 - 150 bucks and get more RAM and perhaps a cheap quad-core and you have a nice machine.

 

There must be some advantages for consoles... right?

 

EDIT:

 

When I wrote this, the poster above me answered my question:

 

"Be simple, efficient, and safe platforms for running multimedia."

[midnight tea]

Today I saw a pre-built budget PC in a supermarket for € 399,-- (~ 441 US $)

 

It was a dual-core Intel Pentium G3250 (2× 3,2 GHz) with a GeForce GTX 750 and 4 GB RAM and W 8.1 pre-installed.

Certainly not the end of the line, but good enough to play almost anything currently out there on min - medium settings.

Invest another 100 - 150 bucks and get more RAM and perhaps a cheap quad-core and you have a nice machine.

 

There must be some advantages for consoles... right?

 

One I can think of - it's easier for devs to design and build game ports for consoles, thanks to the fact that everybody who has PS or Xbox owns virtually the same hardware. Since PC configurations are - naturally - many and varied, it's harder to avoid issues and bugs while building a PC port.

[Lebanese Dude]

 

When I wrote this, the poster above me answered my question:

 

"Be simple, efficient, and safe platforms for running multimedia."

 

I added regulated.

[Lebanese Dude]

One I can think of - it's easier for devs to design and build game ports for consoles, thanks to the fact that everybody who has PS or Xbox owns virtually the same hardware. Since PC configurations are - naturally - many and varied, it's harder to avoid issues and bugs while building a PC port.

Nailed it.

 

Consoles have many, many benefits for both consumer and producer.

 

Modding is simply not one of them.

[Felya87]

those prices are quite misleading, since many don't keep count of: screen, key board, speakers, mouse and others things like a microphone or camera. All things that count for those that buy a gaming PC.

A console already have a joypad and all the stuff needed to be connected to a tv, thing that usally people have already at home.

[Basher of Glory]

those prices are quite misleading, since many don't keep count of: screen, key board, speakers, mouse and others things like a microphone or camera. All things that count for those that buy a gaming PC.

A console already have a joypad and all the stuff needed to be connected to a tv, thing that usally people have already at home.

For my example above you may add a screen, if you want one exclusively for the PC (70 + x €).

But you can connect it to the TV as well. HDMI-cable costs 10 - 20 €

Mouse, keyboard, (basic) speakers are all within the bundle. Headphones with mic cost about 10 - 20 (+ x for better quality) €.

[Sunnie]

those prices are quite misleading, since many don't keep count of: screen, key board, speakers, mouse and others things like a microphone or camera. All things that count for those that buy a gaming PC.

A console already have a joypad and all the stuff needed to be connected to a tv, thing that usally people have already at home.

For a PC:

screen - Use any HDMI TV, most PCs come with all the cables needed.

keyboard & mouse - usually comes with most PCs (unless you are custom building from the ground up)

speakers - not needed if you already have any basic stereo system with an Aux input or HDMI TV

microphone - not necessary

camera - not necessary

game pad - not necessary, see KBM above.

 

Most consoles only come with a single controller, no headset, no mic, no speakers. You still have all the same costs and more than if you use a PC.

 

Listen, I don't hate consoles, I have 6 consoles in my house (SNES, PS1, PS2x2, Wii, PS3), and I like all of them for various things, I just can't stand using them for games that really should be KBM controlled (all shooters, most RPGs). I also have to mod every game I play (side effect of being in game dev for almost 30 years), so I can't do that on a console freely. Consoles are just too limiting and overall costly IMO.

[andy6915]

Don't take this the wrong way but if you feel so strongly about the options afforded by the PC, why not ditch the console?  I used to hate playing games on a PC but now I'll never use a console again.  I just hate the limitations you are stuck with on a console and a PC is so easy to upgrade.

 

Lack of money and the exclusives for both Wii U and PS4 have those consoles being higher priority to eventually buy, knowing PC versions of games often get crappy ports because devs generally don't care about PC gaming (Batman Arkham Knight is a great example), a computer area that would be bad for gaming, not wanting to deal with bad DRM which consoles largely don't have to deal with, having to constantly worry about specs, not wanting to go through some of the horror stories I've heard where you just can't get a game to work no matter what despite having high enough specs because there's something about your rig that makes it incompatible with that particular game.

 

I don't hate the idea of PC gaming, especially with Steam where I know you can buy a dozen great games for the price of a single console game thanks to their low prices and constant specials and with the modding community. But it's simply not high enough priority.

[Basher of Glory]

A question for the experts:

 

If you take a current gen console and compare it to a average PC, how would you rate the performance of this console?

E.g. better than a quad-core i5-2500k @ 3,3 GHz with a GTX 750 and 8 MB RAM? 32 or 64 bit etc.?

[Felya87]

A question for the experts:

If you take a current gen console and compare it to a average PC, how would you rate the performance of this console?
E.g. better than a quad-core i5-2500k @ 3,3 GHz with a GTX 750 and 8 MB RAM? 32 or 64 bit etc.?

I have no idea what are you talking about. I have no way to see How is different. How can I confront something I can't 1) test myself 2) I have no idea what it means?

By the way, PS4 have mic with earphone in the box. And usually a game Too.

[Basher of Glory]

I have no idea what are you talking about. I have no way to see How is different. How can I confront something I can't 1) test myself 2) I have no idea what it means?

By the way, PS4 have mic with earphone in the box. And usually a game Too.

This is why I wrote "... for experts" 

[Sunnie]

A question for the experts:

 

If you take a current gen console and compare it to a average PC, how would you rate the performance of this console?

E.g. better than a quad-core i5-2500k @ 3,3 GHz with a GTX 750 and 8 MB RAM? 32 or 64 bit etc.?

Ok, if I understand your question....

 

Current gen consoles (PS4/XB1) are about on par technically with my current PC (Intel C2Quad-3.2ghz/8GB/NVidia GTX285OC-2GB) but with current tech GPUs.

While they (consoles) are both using a pair of later AMD Jaguar core processors, they are only running at 1.6ghz which puts these processors only microscopically better than the average 4 core Intel processor from 12-15 years ago (running at 2.8-3.2ghz).

They are also using modern AMD/ATI GPUs (PS4 has more GPU cores @1152 as opposed to XB1 @768).

 

So the short answer is; They are slightly better than a purpose built PC from 10-15 years ago, they are not anywhere close to current gaming PC tech.