348 réponses à ce sujet

[Emissary of the Collectors]

The Warden never spoke. It's much easier to have multiple playable races when your protagonist is completely silent. You don't need to record different lines of dialogue for characters of different species, or have to pay the costs of more than one voice actor for each gender.

 

Having said I know some people here wouldn't mind a Mass Effect game that was just like with DA:O, with multiple playable races and a silent protagonist. I think that would be a horrible trade off however, and I hope to never again see a Bioware game where the protagonist is silent. The protagonist's dialogue not being voiced while NPCs are would make the game much less immersive than it could otherwise be.

Wait you think it is more immersive to have someone else's voice reading your responses?

 

Plenty of good voice actors do multiple voices (even Male Shep was also Vorcha), also it isnt like it is a time constraint, it isnt like they have 1 voice booth at a studio and all the actors have to line up (unless maybe they are an indie dev but Bioware isnt).

 

No voice for your character means it is YOUR voice, which i always prefer. In ME1-3 we played AS Shepard, so it was never our character, just our choices. I would assume with "human only" we are once again gonna get a specific character instead of a free-range (i bet their name will be Knight or King or some such cliche). In DA:O each Origin was a template, but not a character and yet they were all plenty fleshed out and interacted beautifully with the world.

 

You can only make so many characters out of "human male/female renegade/paragon", in comparison to any number of races with unique perspectives and abilities. I would take variety over 1 deep pre-determined character any day

[KR96]

I enjoyed the Inquisitor and don't understand the perception that your species (and class) didn't impact role-playing aspects, since it opened up a number of dialogue opportunities and context variations.

Kudos for your opinion, but I didn't feel the same way. If I recall correctly, as a Qunari you were automatically not a follower of the Qun, which is the only damn thing that is not already in a locked place in Thedas' society. Other than that, altering your race changed a couple of dialogue options, true, affected romance options, and it even changed some of the mission values (e.g. court approval). And I can imagine this being extremely satisfactory for anyone who apparently finds humanity boring and silly, but I don't feel that it adds anything tangible to the gaming experience.

I quit my second replay of DA:I as a Qunari halfway through because I just couldn't be bothered. I really felt as if there was barely any difference between my first (human) and second playthrough. In a game such as Mass Effect which baseline's always been to explore the progress of humanity on the intergalactic front, a system of multiple playable races would just not make sense.

I think the way they are allowing people to play as different races in MP is a perfect solution to the problem. You will still get to explore different cultures and species in SP as a human, but why would I have to be an alien to have a 'role play experience'? Why would being 'just' a human not cut it?

I really just don't understand people who are heftily disappointed at not being able to play as a different race (which doesn't mean I don't respect their opinions). This is not an installment of DA, where you could play as several races in the first game, but a Mass Effect game. A game which is part of a franchise which never even hinted at multi-race playability in its storyline.

[CrutchCricket]

No voice for your character means it is YOUR voice, which i always prefer. In ME1-3 we played AS Shepard, so it was never our character, just our choices.

I disagree with this. Having people just speak at your character then react to nothing when your character remains silent is far more immersion breaking for me, and just plain weird. In Skyrim I had to headcanon my character as having telepathy for some reason to deal with it.

 

Either give everyone a voice or give no one one, and we can go back to text adventure games.

 

And plenty of people had no problem making Shepard themselves but in space, or any other RP character they chose to pursue.

[Emissary of the Collectors]

I disagree with this. Having people just speak at your character then react to nothing when your character remains silent is far more immersion breaking for me, and just plain weird. In Skyrim I had to headcanon my character as having telepathy for some reason to deal with it.

 

Either give everyone a voice or give no one one, and we can go back to text adventure games.

 

And plenty of people had no problem making Shepard themselves but in space, or any other RP character they chose to pursue.

Then they are easily immersed into being someone set in stone, i am not

[CrutchCricket]

Then they are easily immersed into being someone set in stone, i am not

How is having the protagonist voiced any more, or less, set in stone?

 

You still have a limited set of options to enact. The same set of options, in fact.

[Hazegurl]

DA:O did pretty well, but also chose a story which would fit any race. You were not a (place race here), but you were a grey warden. They tried the same thing with the Inquisitor, but that just didn't work out.
With Mass Effect, you just can't take a story which is so generic and applicable to all races because these races are so inherently different, contra to DA:I, where other than the followers of the Qun, the only real difference was caste. I just don't think they could create a fulfilling ME experience when the whole human focus for survival and development is gone.

I agree, DA:O did a pretty good job with the races. There was more special dialogue and interactions, and a playable back story.  Replay value was pretty high. DAI just gave us one or two special dialogues and a place card.  Not enough to truly distinguish the different races.  Not to mention that they retconned their own lore to give a dwarf magic powers.  DAO did a good job implementing playable races.  DAI, did a poor job of it. That is why people can compare them.

 

As for ME, I don't get why fans are so salty about playable races. ME never had them and never promised them. The series has always focused on the human experience.

[Emissary of the Collectors]

How is having the protagonist voiced any more, or less, set in stone?

 

You still have a limited set of options to enact. The same set of options, in fact.

That was nothing to do with voicing, it was to do with Commander Shepard the character

[mopotter]

Two PC models = exponentially cheaper, faster animation cycle = more cutscenes / animated dialogue. 

 

I'll take that tradeoff every time.

Dialogue, I want as much as possible, NCP dialogue, my character dialogue, tell some jokes, play some poker, flirt a bit.  Cut scenes, I hope they don't go overboard with them.  I want to participate in dialogue as much as possible, not watch it.  Some is good, too much is not good.    

 

Will also take the trade off.

[Han Shot First]

Wait you think it is more immersive to have someone else's voice reading your responses?

 

 

Yes, because it isn't my response. My name isn't Shepard, Hawke, Trevelyan, Levellan, Adaar, or Cadash.

 

I never self-insert with RPGs. 

[Han Yolo]

No Volus cowboy for me then. Sad really. I had great plans. 

 

I don't think you can compare DA's races to the ME species. ME species vary so greatly, both in appearance and in culture. Body animation wouldn't be the only problem, there's also facial animation. 

Also people calling the new protagonist Shepard 02 just because he's gonna be human should turn down the drama a bit. We're all humans here and I dare say we're not all alike. 

[mopotter]

Disappointed.

 

Still the main reason i play is for the characters so as long as they don't screw that up i'm fine.

 

I don't mind playing a human, but I definitely hope they don't mess up the characters.  I'm not too worried about that though, I've enjoyed them all, maybe not Liara as much as BioWare would have liked me to, but even she was ok.  

[Emissary of the Collectors]

Yes, because it isn't my response. My name isn't Shepard, Hawke, Trevelyan, Levellan, Adaar, or Cadash.

 

I never self-insert with RPGs. 

So you take what they give you instead of making your own way? This is the opposite of Immersion for me

[RoboticWater]

So you take what they give you instead of making your own way? This is the opposite of Immersion for me

I think people are talking about different types of immersion here.

 

Immersing yourself within a character is a fundamentally different experience to absorbing yourself within a story, and BioWare have always aimed to perfect the latter. That's why they utilize voiced protagonists, so that dialog feels natural. That's why BioWare feels comfortable showing us only dialog snippets in the dialog wheel, so that the players can feel a bit surprised by the conversation.  

 

BioWare games are simply not the kind where you can insert yourself  and "be" the main character, they are narrative experiences built to express the opinions of the writers. BioWare may let us mess around a little within the plot but at the end of the day, BioWare is telling us a story. Their story. And they want to make it as natural as possible.

[AlanC9]

So you take what they give you instead of making your own way? This is the opposite of Immersion for me

I'm making my own way. I'm just not doing it as me.

[mopotter]

I don't think it'll be original. I'm just not convinced you'll formally be military. I mean, in sci-fi you need a military background to some extend to justify not sucking at combat. But they might do something else to get you that background besides formally human military. 

 

If they are settlers looking for new homes, they will learn combat or die.  And some would be x military so maybe we will get to pick a background, which would increase the replay for me, and different classes, again increasing my replay value and I liked all of the classes in the series.  

 

Maybe x-military, like Torin Kerr or Joshua Nolan,  being one background.    I'd be happy to pick a background like Tom Mason,  teacher thrown into a role of leader or even someone like Talitha who is traumatized and trying to start a new life, someone who watched their family die or who escaped from something.  

 

Have no idea what BioWare will actually do, but I'm not going to say I won't get it this early.  I'm sort of looking forward to tidbits we find out as the years go by.  

[AresKeith]

I enjoyed the Inquisitor and don't understand the perception that your species (and class) didn't impact role-playing aspects, since it opened up a number of dialogue opportunities and context variations.

 

My guess is that it didn't have enough impact for some people

[CrutchCricket]

That was nothing to do with voicing, it was to do with Commander Shepard the character

You specifically mentioned voicing and you only cited Commander Shepard as an example.

 

BioWare games are simply not the kind where you can insert yourself  and "be" the main character, they are narrative experiences built to express the opinions of the writers. BioWare may let us mess around a little within the plot but at the end of the day, BioWare is telling us a story. Their story. And they want to make it as natural as possible.

I disagree. I was able to insert myself just fine, as were others. I didn't think I was playing myself in space, but I did think I was playing a character with my values or an idealized version of my values who would act and react as I would in those circumstances. In the first two games at least.

 

Though it might depend on what level of insertion you want to consider. I don't think a total self-insert is the typical expectation though.

[Gwydden]

I've talked a few times already about why playable aliens are a terrible idea, so I'll just say I'm glad they made this choice.

And humans are about the most fascinating thing in the universe. I'll never understand people who think they're 'boring' xD

[Emissary of the Collectors]

I've talked a few times already about why playable aliens are a terrible idea, so I'll just say I'm glad they made this choice.

And humans are about the most fascinating thing in the universe. I'll never understand people who think they're 'boring' xD

Because we already know everything about them...we ARE them...therefore they are extremely boring compared to any fictional alien lifeform

[mopotter]

Yes, because it isn't my response. My name isn't Shepard, Hawke, Trevelyan, Levellan, Adaar, or Cadash.

 

I never self-insert with RPGs. 

I do self-insert, but I have found I enjoy hearing my character say something a lot more than I enjoy the silent ones.  And really, the silent ones sometimes yell something so they have a voice they just don't use it in conversations.   

 

BG I always picked one voice for my elf because she looked sort of squeaky and for my mage a more calm adult voice.  They would say "Follow Me"  "To Arms"  "Hey watch it".  

 

I'd like to have a couple of voices to chose from or a voice range, but I don't want to go back to silence.  

[mopotter]

You specifically mentioned voicing and you only cited Commander Shepard as an example.

 

I disagree. I was able to insert myself just fine, as were others. I didn't think I was playing myself in space, but I did think I was playing a character with my values or an idealized version of my values who would act and react as I would in those circumstances. In the first two games at least.

 

Though it might depend on what level of insertion you want to consider. I don't think a total self-insert is the typical expectation though.

Agree.

 

ME1 I was Commander Kate Shepard, she had my values, my responses and I loved it. She was colonial, raised by her grandparents and watched her friend die as she was trying to escape.   ME2 I started noticing I was losing her and ME3 she was no longer mine.  It's one reason I hope they do future games individually.  

[BabyPuncher]

If they are settlers looking for new homes, they will learn combat or die.

 

Uh-huh. Okay. Sure.

[Rannik]

Absolutely approve.

[Hellion Rex]

Totally cool with this. None of the other races really interested me at all.

[Lyrandori]

Well let's see... as far as I myself am concerned:

 

ME1: Human only, loved the game, and never had the desire after finishing it to start over as another race (I.E. it wasn't a feature I would have wanted).

ME2: Human only, loved the game, still didn't see myself playing as another species.

ME3: Human only, campaign sucked overall (not just the ending part for me), but still didn't want to play as another species.

ME3 Multiplayer: I suppose that's the ironic part, but also logical given the context. Had the MP portion of the game also been limited to human only then it'd have sucked too. But it turns out ME3MP was - in my opinion - very fun. And playing that part of the Mass Effect universe as other species was not only fun but most likely essential.

 

The way I see it is that Mass Effect: Andromeda's Multiplayer will definitely allow us to choose between Human, Salarian, Krogan characters, etc. But the campaign's protagonist will remain (and has been confirmed) human only. I'm perfectly fine with that. I GUESS that I might have been interested to see different perspectives coming from other species... say playing as a Salarian or an Asari. The "problem" with that is that to make it work BioWare would practically need to copy-paste the "Origins" formula from DA:O, and I sincerely believe that even BioWare themselves will never do that again. And by "Origins formula" I don't just mean being able to merely choose between two or three races here. What I mean is that EACH one of the selectable races in an Origins-style system would have their own unique game intros, with their specific initial "Origins story" map(s), which would at some point all converge to the same "main starting point" for all chosen races, just like DA:O did. I said it was a "problem" earlier simply because doing something just like that is perhaps... I don't know... maybe too demanding, too taxing on BioWare? If that's not the case, then it might simply be a "design choice" rather than being something they can't feasibly achieve anymore.

 

So yeah, in all honesty I have no issue now knowing that Andromeda will be "limited" to a human only protagonist.

 

On a side note, I absolutely loved Hawke and of course DA2's protagonist could only be a human. And as far as Inquisition goes I still went with a human (canon) Inquisitor in the end. I DO have a Qunari Inquisitor, and also made a canon Dalish Warden in Origins. Now quite frankly, I do not care one bit about my Qunari AND my canon human Inquisitors simply because there's no Origins per say in Inquisition so the "bond" between me and my Inquisitors is atomic-level thin. The only real successful "choose your race" system that BioWare has ever done was for DA:O and nothing else, and it won't happen ever again I'm afraid.