13 réponses à ce sujet

[penwhiel]

Pretty straightforward question.

 

Due to the huge AC my high-Intelligence, high-Tumble Swashbuckler/Duelist will have, coupled with Enhanced Mobility (+4 AC to AoO), is Spring Attack of somewhat dubious value since I'll be so well-from melee?

 

[Arkalezth]

Skip it. It's of dubious value for -any- character, and completely redundant if you have a high Tumble, as a (modified) score of 14 or more will make you immune to AoOs from moving.

[Dann-J]

I've only ever taken Spring Attack to qualify for Whirlwind, which in turn I've only ever taken to qualify for Weapon Master. So unless you plan to be a swashbuckler / duelist / weapon master, I wouldn't bother with it either.

[penwhiel]

Much obliged, folks. You basically said what I was thinking.

[Sriep]

... So unless you plan to be a swashbuckler / duelist / weapon master, I wouldn't bother with it either.

 

My favorate MOTB build.

[Groove Widdit]

I've never really seen the attraction of WM, to be honest. You're putting so much into int that could be st--is it really worth the trade off?

[Dann-J]

I've never really seen the attraction of WM, to be honest. You're putting so much into int that could be st--is it really worth the trade off?

 

WM only needs INT and DEX values of 13. That opens up the possibility of taking a few other feats as well, like Feint, Disarm, and Improved Knockdown (all INT 13+). It's good to have options.

 

+1 to their dexterity bonus grants them that extra +1 to AC when wearing fullplate. +1 to their intelligence bonus boosts their lore and crafting skills slightly, and gives them an extra skill point to play with per level.

 

I wouldn't play as a fighter with DEX or INT less than 12 anyway. Who wants to play as a ham-fisted meat-head?

[Arkalezth]

Yeah, even if you're playing a retarded cripple, you're not going to be able to raise STR a lot higher, just a point or two at most. The real investment are the feats, and WM may or may not be worth it depending on the build (do you deal a lot of damage that crits?) and the module (are most enemies crittable at all?). If you're playing a low STR character in an undead-filled module, stay away from the class.

[Thorsson64]

I've always felt that WM was one of the most overrated classes. The attraction is that occasionally you get very big numbers; people forget all the things you could have got instead. On PWs you can always tell the n00bs - they're the ones running around dual-wielding Scythes.

[Dann-J]

If you're just interested in hitting things, there there's not a great deal of difference between being a pure fighter or being a fighter / WM. You'll miss out on a few of the fighter's bonus feats by taking some WM levels, but you'll gain a few feats that compensate for it.

 

There's really no need to take any more than seven levels of WM - any more than that and all you'll gain are a few more Ki Damage hits per day. I'm not a big fan of the Ki Damage feat. At higher levels you'll have to sacrifice several attacks per round to make just one. You may well have done more damage just attacking normally.

 

I certainly had fun with my duel-wielding Fighter / WM / Blackguard character in MotB. He specialised in katanas, and took all the two-weapon fighting feats right up to 'perfect'. The number of attacks per round he had at epic levels was insane - more than the player model could animate. Frequent critical hits were the icing on the cake, but I'm guessing he'd have been just as dangerous as a pure fighter. I was tempted to put a second katana in the off-hand (instead of the Dream Dagger), since his attack rate was so high that he could have easily absorbed the attack penalty. He got a bit boring to play with after a while, since nothing lived more than a round or two against him. Where's a tarrasque or prismatic dragon when you need one?

[Sriep]

I've never really seen the attraction of WM, to be honest. You're putting so much into int that could be st--is it really worth the trade off?

 

It works well with duelists as both need int, and the duelist prerequists are a subset of the WM ones. 3Swash/7WM/10Duelist/10Ftr WTG

[Thorsson64]

It works well with duelists as both need int, and the duelist prerequists are a subset of the WM ones. 3Swash/7WM/10Duelist/10Ftr WTG

10 Duelist and 10 Fighter? If that's your best effort you should refrain from offering advice.

[Sriep]

10 Duelist and 10 Fighter? If that's your best effort you should refrain from offering advice.

 

What is your reasoning, and what would you prefer for the Epic levels of a Duelist/WM?

 

I really think Swash feats above level 3 are not worth that much. The reason I like Ftr as with WM is that you are focusing on one weapon, so stuff like GWFocus WSpec work well. Are you thinking that taking Barbarian levels is better?

 

I don't like mixing rouge and fighter like classes as I think its better to focus on either sneak attack or Attack Bonus, not dilute both of them.

[Thorsson64]

Duelist 10 gives an extra d6 damage, which does not multiply on a crit. Fighter 12 allows EWS which is 4 damage that does crit. Also you have to push both Dex & Int on such a build - Dex for the AB, so you can't usually take advantage of the Duelist AC bonus to high levels. TBH you're better off using a Shield most of the time anyway, unless you take advantage of the small race 'bug' (allows them to finesse with 2H attacks).