1315 réponses à ce sujet

[ShadyKat]

Romances have always been a option. If you don't want any, then don't do it yourself. It's silly to say most players don't want romances, so why should those players get shafted because you don't want them in?

[In Exile]

You know what? Sure do romances so long as they all end up like Mornith.

 

An actual romance - as in, the characters are in love - but with the twist that the Asari will absolutely kill you if you do it would at least be a bit of novel fun. 

[Angry_Elcor]

It's silly to say most players don't want romances

 

This must be my fault. I have a memory-related disability, in that I can't remember saying things that I never actually said.

[SubjectZer0]

What's wrong with romance?? Being able to have Shepard develop relationships and fall in love with their friends is one of my favorite things about Mass Effect.

[CrystalXPredator]

Oh my god, someone want a "non voiced protagonist" and now no romances, **** are you trying to castrate the game? Because if no romanceable characters the devs have more time to focus on creating more polygons so a tree will look like a tree? Come on this can't be serious right.

[Killdren88]

Oh my god, someone want a "non voiced protagonist" and now no romances, **** are you trying to castrate the game? Because if no romanceable characters the devs have more time to focus on creating more polygons so a tree will look like a tree? Come on this can't be serious right.

 

I'll take a voiced Protag if it meant no romance.

[Natashina]

You'll end up with romance options and a voiced protagonist.  They aren't taking romances out of the Mass Effect series, at least not this game.  I doubt if BioWare is going back to a silent hero, despite the occasional requests for it.  ME has never had a silent hero, so I can't see them changing that now.

 

I personally would prefer if they keep the romances for Dragon Age and ME.  I've enjoyed them and they have added to my experiences.  However, with the new IP Gaider is working on, if they decide to keep the "pandora's box" of romance content closed, I wouldn't care.  

[KotorEffect3]

in all honesty I am suprised this thread hasn't been axed.

[Natashina]

in all honesty I am suprised this thread hasn't been axed.

I take it you don't see the almost constant amount of pro and anti-romance threads on the DA forums?  This is pretty civil, all things considered.

[In Exile]

You'll end up with romance options and a voiced protagonist.  They aren't taking romances out of the Mass Effect series, at least not this game.  I doubt if BioWare is going back to a silent hero, despite the occasional requests for it.  ME has never had a silent hero, so I can't see them changing that now.

 

I personally would prefer if they keep the romances for Dragon Age and ME.  I've enjoyed them and they have added to my experiences.  However, with the new IP Gaider is working on, if they decide to keep the "pandora's box" of romance content closed, I wouldn't care.  

 

Mass effect, in fact, pioneered the dialogue wheel. It put cinematic conversation games - in the movie sense - on the map. With you on romances, as well. But rather than cut them I'd like to see them actually do something in the plot. It's late enough in its release that it's no longer a spoiler so let me use POE as an example:

 

The basic premise of the game is that you can "see" the past lives of souls (which are a real thing). In your own past life, there's the possibility that you had a romantic relationship with a character. Defining it as romantic is up to you. But the richness of that - what it adds to the story of that character, and that arc - is IMO very powerful. Let's go further and use a moment in DA:O: romanced Alistair pushing the PC aside to perform the plot-required sacrifice instead. That's interesting storytelling. 

 

When relationships are reduced to a dating mechanic, that's not interesting. When it's all melodrama (or mostly melodrama) like a CW show, that's not interesting.

 

But there's a lot of power to a romantic plot, and I wish Bioware did more with it. 

[RIPRemusTheTurian]

So first we removed playable races because of resources, now we're arguing to remove romances, voices, and multiplayer because of resources.

 

Maybe we should just remove everything, because having any sort of optional or differing content seems to take too many "resources".

[Natashina]

Mass effect, in fact, pioneered the dialogue wheel. It put cinematic conversation games - in the movie sense - on the map. With you on romances, as well. But rather than cut them I'd like to see them actually do something in the plot. It's late enough in its release that it's no longer a spoiler so let me use POE as an example:

 

The basic premise of the game is that you can "see" the past lives of souls (which are a real thing). In your own past life, there's the possibility that you had a romantic relationship with a character. Defining it as romantic is up to you. But the richness of that - what it adds to the story of that character, and that arc - is IMO very powerful. Let's go further and use a moment in DA:O: romanced Alistair pushing the PC aside to perform the plot-required sacrifice instead. That's interesting storytelling. 

 

When relationships are reduced to a dating mechanic, that's not interesting. When it's all melodrama (or mostly melodrama) like a CW show, that's not interesting.

 

But there's a lot of power to a romantic plot, and I wish Bioware did more with it. 

I'm out of likes, but I completely agree.

 

Since I can afford my new video card sooner than expected, I'll be looking at PoE once I'm done with my current game of DA:I.  I'm just over the mid-point there.

[Natashina]

As long as it's mostly civil and on-topic, the mods have been letting the players discuss whatever they want.  There is a thread nearly 200 pages long that's primarily talking about TW3 versus DA:I, and it hasn't been axed yet.  I don't see why this would be.  If someone doesn't like it, they don't have to click on it, and then respond.  There's a lot of non-romance threads involving ME for anyone to go post in.  I don't agree with the OP, but I see the validity in the discussion.

[CrutchCricket]

So first we removed playable races because of resources, now we're arguing to remove romances, voices, and multiplayer because of resources.

 

Maybe we should just remove everything, because having any sort of optional or differing content seems to take too many "resources".

We need to get back to the basics- Text-based adventure!

 

Forget all these fancy cutscenes, physics engines and high texture models. They just get in the way of Real Plot™

[LaughingBanana]

What is Mass Effect without the opportunity to spread Human DNA to other species of aliens?

 

Nothing. Nothing I say!

[Angry_Elcor]

You'll end up with romance options and a voiced protagonist.

 

I actually think a voiced protagonist makes more sense for Mass Effect. As for the other thing... it is distinctly possible that I never had any expectation that this thread would impact any decisions by the developers regarding romances. I may have even been satisfied with the idea that it would simply offer perspective regarding how a not-insignificant portion of the playerbase, while they appreciate romances, feel they have been over-prioritized.

 

But I would never admit such a thing, even if true.

[Angry_Elcor]

What is Mass Effect without the opportunity to spread Human DNA to other species of aliens?

 

You humans are all racist. What about Elcor DNA? Do you have any idea how long it takes two Elcor to get through a first date, talking the way we do!? We need every opportunity we can get!

[Natashina]

I actually think a voiced protagonist makes more sense for Mass Effect. As for the other thing... it is distinctly possible that I never had any expectation that this thread would impact any decisions by the developers regarding romances. I may have even been satisfied with the idea that it would simply offer perspective regarding how a not-insignificant portion of the playerbase, while they appreciate romances, feel they have been over-prioritized.

 

But I would never admit such a thing, even if true.

I don't think it's been over-prioritized by BioWare at all.  I think it's the fans that have taken that and run with it.  Talk about a laser-like focus.

[Angry_Elcor]

I don't think it's been over-prioritized by BioWare at all.  I think it's the fans that have taken that and run with it.  Talk about a laser-like focus.

 

I was looking for something short to convey something complicated, but I don't necessarily mean over-prioritized in terms of the conventional development process.

 

It is an inescapable side effect of the romances that the forums are filled with romance-related threads. They range all over the map, from the absurd, to the barely-disguised-agenda-thread, to constructive discourse about character archetypes. But I think it would be a fair estimation to say that the mods spend more time dealing with romance threads than they do with any other individual kind of thread. I also think it would be a reasonable to say that the developers spend a lot more time addressing romance issues than those issues genuinely merit, whether in their personal time, or as a consequence of the audience focus in the various mediums they use to communicate with that audience.

 

So I didn't really mean they received too much priority in terms of budget or writing, but in terms of energy and focus. I'm not saying they can simply step away from it (that's not realistic) but there is room, I think, for them to re-engage the subject differently in the future. As it is now, I think the cycle of marketing and announcements brings that laser focus into play. There is a great deal of energy spent on how to manage the information, how to disseminate it, and how to contain the inevitable backlash.

 

The audience won't simply step away from the focus. As in any fandom, that focus will always have enough supporters to live and breath on the front lines of any social media from time to time. If the cycle is going to simmer down, it will require the developers and marketers, those who engage that audience, to try a new approach. I certainly didn't realistically think that romances weren't going to be in the next Mass Effect, or that it was even the best way to accomplish that new approach. I was more concerned with showing the developers that they have room to try a new approach to ease back the laser focus. That there is a sizable enough portion of even the fans that frequent this site who are content to let them do and try whatever they want to try. That they don't have to try and please us with particular characters, or romance types, or anything specific. That we're most concerned that the content they are creating is content that they care about.

[Angry_Elcor]

Being all serious makes me go a little crazy.

 

 

Need a beer.

[LPPrince]

We already know they're gonna do them.

[Natashina]

This is why if BioWare decided not to do romances in future IPs, it wouldn't bother me.  I didn't play NWN for the romances, that's for sure.  Nor BG2.

[Lady Artifice]

Romance defense force: ASSEMBLE!

 

Boo, bad. Do not like. 

 

::greatly disapproves::

 

 

Now that I've gotten that out of my system, I do believe that judging the Dev focus the romance content claims by measuring the the fan focus is an unreliable way to go about it. I might be one of the last people most forum goers would listen to about this, considering how outspokenly I enjoy the inclusion of the romances, and the fact that I've been an OP of one of those annoying romance threads and an active participant of a lot of others, but I can promise that not all of us who enjoy the romance content do so as a form of wish fulfillment or out of "loneliness." Some of us just enjoy the different perspectives on the characters that the romance content provides, or we enjoy romantic content in itself. 

 

Contrary to the stereotype that circulates around romance fans in general, being a fan of romantic stories does not imply loneliness or desperation, any more than being a fan of the horror genre implies a person of violence. 

 

I'm a fan of both, and I can only give my word that I'm neither lonely nor violent. 

 

Anyway, I do understand that, when taken to the point of fixation, focus on romances can be off-putting. However, when we dislike talking about a subject, In my experience it's usually more effective to just avoid discussing it ourselves than it is to rant against the other people who do want to discuss it. 

[Jorji Costava]

I'm one of those players who almost always skip the romances, but since it's inevitable that they'll be included, I'll make a few suggestions; these are all reworked from a previous post that I spent way too much time digging up. I'll put it in a spoiler tag because it's TL;DR and I don't want to clutter up the thread too much:

Spoiler

1. Make it easier for NPCs to reject you: I'm not the first person to note this, but the main thing for me is that the NPC's lack agency in these relationships. As long as you say and do certain things, they're into you no matter how much of a saint or sinner you've been for the rest of the series. Using Miranda as an example (although I think this is true of all the LI's), she may be in love with your ruthless Shepard, but she'd also be in love with my boy-scout Shepard as long as I completed the loyalty mission and chose a couple of upper right-hand dialogue options. That's just not convincing to me.

2. Make conversations more of a give-and-take: I've always felt that the NPC's should realistically get a bit bored of the PC; it's always them having to talk about their stories to him or her, and never the other way around. That seems like a pretty one-sided way to conduct conversation, and makes it hard to see what draws the character to Shepard, other than the fact that Shepard is the PC, or the Hero of the Citadel, etc., which is hardly the basis for a healthy relationship.

Suppose you could have a scene where Liara or somebody asks Shepard something like "What was it like on Torfan?" (I know it's cheesy; Shut up!) Shepard could then do a spiel describing what Torfan was like, and the player could interject at various points to dictate the general tenor of the description; think of the big speeches that Shepard gives after taking command of the Normandy in ME1, or during the suicide mission in ME2.

So you could either say something like "It was horrible, and I hope I never have to make decisions like that again" or "It was totally worth it to kill those Batarian SOBs." Some NPC's would be freaked out by you telling them that killing Batarians is totally worth losing most of your unit, while others might be intrigued by your badassery. The only problem I can see is that it could get really boring repeating the Torfan story nine or ten times, but the point is to make the dynamic between PC and NPC more give-and-take, and provide more opportunities for role-playing.

 

3. Don't make sex into the goal and endpoint of the relationship arc: This seems pretty self-explanatory, so I'm not going to elaborate on it much, but it just seems pretty unrealistic to suppose that all dramatic tension between two characters would be resolved by having sex the first time. It also contributes to the reputation of romances as a "Say nice things, get sex as a reward" mechanic. So yeah, do not want.

[Otter-under-the-mountain]

Instead of romance, I'd like to see a system where, once the entire squad is recruited, you can somehow signal to the game that you want to develop your relationship with one of the squadmates over anyone else, and you'd get a unique questline that might or might not end up with that character and the PC in something resembling a romance, and it would change how that character interacts with you and the others, and pursuing any of them too far will lock you out of the others somehow.

 

Essentially, I want to see "romances" that... aren't that.

 

I don't know how that would be implemented in a way that would make sense, but I think an icon on the dialogue wheel telling you "pick this and you get special content with the person you're talking to at the expense of special content with others" would be better than one that says "pick this and you might end up copulating with the person you're talking to".

 

Wishful thinking, I know, but still.