1315 réponses à ce sujet

[BabyPuncher]

1. Make it easier for NPCs to reject you: I'm not the first person to note this, but the main thing for me is that the NPC's lack agency in these relationships. As long as you say and do certain things, they're into you no matter how much of a saint or sinner you've been for the rest of the series. Using Miranda as an example (although I think this is true of all the LI's), she may be in love with your ruthless Shepard, but she'd also be in love with my boy-scout Shepard as long as I completed the loyalty mission and chose a couple of upper right-hand dialogue options. That's just not convincing to me.

 

That's pretty much true of all nearly all player choices in RPGs, not just romance. And an inevitabilitity, I think. Companions almost always stay by the player character no matter how many senseless and stupid murders you commit that really should outrage them and end with them shooting you in the head while you sleep.

 

It would end up severly punishing players who want to be 'evil' in video games. And the plain reality is, nobody wants to play 'Sit-in-prison-simulator' or 'get rejected because you're an ******* simulator' no matter how realistic it is.
 

[Vicex]

That's pretty much true of all nearly all player choices in RPGs, not just romance. And an inevitabilitity, I think. Companions almost always stay by the player character no matter how many senseless and stupid murders you commit that really should outrage them and end with them shooting you in the head while you sleep.

 

It would end up severly punishing players who want to be 'evil' in video games. And the plain reality is, nobody wants to play 'Sit-in-prison-simulator' or 'get rejected because you're an ******* simulator' no matter how realistic it is.
 

 

BioWare sort of tried this out with SWTOR, where some of your conversational choices led you to lose/gain 'points' with companions based on what the companion values.

 

Did it work? Meh, I've mixed feeling on it- especially since it had little impact on the progression of the game/relationships and all you had to do was buy gifts to get them infatuated with you despite doing everything that they hate.

[Jeremiah12LGeek]

BioWare sort of tried this out with SWTOR, where some of your conversational choices led you to lose/gain 'points' with companions based on what the companion values.

 

Did it work? Meh, I've mixed feeling on it- especially since it had little impact on the progression of the game/relationships and all you had to do was buy gifts to get them infatuated with you despite doing everything that they hate.

 

It became a source of endless delight for me to watch my dialogue choices enrage Khem, periodically interrupted by completely inexplicable approval.

[Joseph Warrick]

That's pretty much true of all nearly all player choices in RPGs, not just romance. And an inevitabilitity, I think. Companions almost always stay by the player character no matter how many senseless and stupid murders you commit that really should outrage them and end with them shooting you in the head while you sleep.

It would end up severly punishing players who want to be 'evil' in video games. And the plain reality is, nobody wants to play 'Sit-in-prison-simulator' or 'get rejected because you're an ******* simulator' no matter how realistic it is.

I wanted the rachni queen to murder Shepard upon being freed. I wanted Saren to deceive Shepard into believing he had changed his mind, moved by Shepard'd poignant speech. I wanted Balak to actually destroy a human world if Shepard lets him go. At least I was able to save Mordin's life by convincing him to put the galaxy ahead of his personal feelings.

[BabyPuncher]

I wanted the rachni queen to murder Shepard upon being freed. I wanted Saren to deceive Shepard into believing he had changed his mind, moved by Shepard'd poignant speech. I wanted Balak to actually destroy a human world if Shepard lets him go. At least I was able to save Mordin's life by convincing him to put the galaxy ahead of his personal feelings.

 

Oh, I'm sure you do. Do you also want Shepard to be promptly court martialed and sent to prison the first time you shoot a civilian in the face for speaking against your character? Or perhaps the aliens immediately barring humans from Citadel facilities and representation with their much more powerful fleets the moment Udina decides to try and declare that humans are the now the new rulers of the galaxy in ME 1? How about Saren flat-out killing Shepard in a cutscene if you don't persuade him because he's simply a more capable combatant?

[Grieving Natashina]

By the way, Elcor, not all fans are completely focused on romances.  I've tried to have three threads going for favorite friendships in DA, but they tend to get overlooked.  I guess there isn't enough drama.  

 

_{Daelen Red Tiger for life!}

[Angry_Elcor]

Anyway, I do understand that, when taken to the point of fixation, focus on romances can be off-putting. However, when we dislike talking about a subject, In my experience it's usually more effective to just avoid discussing it ourselves than it is to rant against the other people who do want to discuss it. 

 

I don't think I'm ranting against the people discussing romances. I've been discussing them myself, after all. I don't dislike it as a subject, and I have no objection to people wanting them to be included.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

Wait... other people can come into your games? How do I unlock that feature?

 

It's a secret feature of the Mass Effect 3 ending. While you're on the destroy platform, after you've hit the tube the first time, you turn and shoot the control rods. But you have to be quick and do it before the cut scene kicks in.

[sandalisthemaker]

No.

 

I want a cute gay guy for my PC to smooch. 

 

No aliens though.  Ew. 

[SlottsMachine]

I am fine with romances. What is wrong with them?

 

Nothing. Just as there is nothing wrong with not having them. People and there opinions or something.

[Joseph Warrick]

Oh, I'm sure you do. Do you also want Shepard to be promptly court martialed and sent to prison the first time you shoot a civilian in the face for speaking against your character? Or perhaps the aliens immediately barring humans from Citadel facilities and representation with their much more powerful fleets the moment Udina decides to try and declare that humans are the now the new rulers of the galaxy in ME 1? How about Saren flat-out killing Shepard in a cutscene if you don't persuade him because he's simply a more capable combatant?

In fact, picking the bottom right option at any point should trigger an immediate critical mission failure, game over screen. It's impossible for devs to design a believable role to play other than plucky Jesus whose most powerful weapons are love and understanding.

[Angry_Elcor]

No aliens though.  Ew. 

 

 

Two excuses to use this one in a row!

[SlottsMachine]

Oh, I'm sure you do. Do you also want Shepard to be promptly court martialed and sent to prison the first time you shoot a civilian in the face for speaking against your character? Or perhaps the aliens immediately barring humans from Citadel facilities and representation with their much more powerful fleets the moment Udina decides to try and declare that humans are the now the new rulers of the galaxy in ME 1? How about Saren flat-out killing Shepard in a cutscene if you don't persuade him because he's simply a more capable combatant?

 

Why would you shoot a civilian in the face? Heroes don't do **** like that. #HEROISM

[aoibhealfae]

I prefer having the option to have or not have a romance arc rather than being forced to endure a default romance arc.

[Grieving Natashina]

I prefer having the option to have or not have a romance arc rather than being forced to endure a default romance arc.

Yeah, same here. 

[Lady Artifice]

I don't think I'm ranting against the people discussing romances. I've been discussing them myself, after all. I don't dislike it as a subject, and I have no objection to people wanting them to be included.

 

That was more of a reference to some of the other people in your thread. The ones who have been really annoyed by the mere existence of romance related thread/discussion. 

 

I'm not trying to be uptight. I just enjoy romance content, and every once and a while I feel a little weary of seeing those of us who like romances made out to be generally crazy or obsessed, or treated as though we're trying to take over the worthwhile aspects of the game, like the main story and the combat, with our silly fluff. It happens now and then, and I know it isn't an attitude that's going away. I'm not accusing you specifically of doing it, but I am accusing a portion of the BSN of being pretty snobbish about us dumb romance fans who prioritize the story wrong in their eyes. 

 

Because the romances are avoidable, I can't wrap my head around the idea of someone putting energy into wanting them gone. If one person doesn't want that content, they can just not pursue that content. Asking for it to be removed from the game is asking for someone else to lose content that they enjoy, just because the one asking thinks that it's over discussed and over focused on. 

 

I can try to understand your point of view, but I have a really hard time grasping what you'd actually get out of your request being granted (I realize you aren't actually expecting that it will be) because it seems like the only people the game would change for is those of us who place value on the romance arcs. The forums might change (eventually, after the outrage settled), but I don't think he game itself would change for someone not pursuing romances. 

[BabyPuncher]

Because the romances are avoidable, I can't wrap my head around the idea of someone putting energy into wanting them gone. If one person doesn't want that content, they can just not pursue that content. Asking for it to be removed from the game is asking for someone else to lose content that they enjoy, just because the one asking thinks that it's over discussed and over focused on.

Well, it's not that simple.

 

The concern people have is that it might give developers too easy a way out. Too easy a way to feel they've accomplishing something.

 

Compared to other elements of the story, writing a standard BioWare romance is easy. You have characters flirt, and become more intimiate, and declare their attractive, and consumate. You throw in some witty dialogue and banter and whatnot from other characters. You do that, and you'll have produced a very acceptable romance. Not brilliant, not mind-blowing by any means, but it accomplishes what it's meant to accomplish. 

 

When developers can do that and have that prasied by forum threads thousands of pages long...it's going to sap your motivation. It's going to kill your ambition to do something that is brilliant, that is mind-blowing. When this is all you have to do to get such praise, why should you put in the huge amount of serious, draining work to do something better?

[Angry_Elcor]

Because the romances are avoidable, I can't wrap my head around the idea of someone putting energy into wanting them gone. If one person doesn't want that content, they can just not pursue that content. Asking for it to be removed from the game is asking for someone else to lose content that they enjoy, just because the one asking thinks that it's over discussed and over focused on. 

 

I can try to understand your point of view, but I have a really hard time wrapping my head around what you'd actually get out of your request being granted (I realize you aren't actually expecting that it will be) because it seems like the only people the game would change for is those of us who place value on the romance arcs. The forums might change (eventually, after the outrage settled), but I don't think he game itself would change for someone not pursuing romances. 

 

The OP and title are a suggestion that the developers free themselves from the cycle of dealing with their audience's rage over how they handle romances. It was intended to be funny, but I was aware that many people would not take it that way. I also wanted to make the point that I don't believe doing away with the romances would actually harm the series. I don't think they are what makes it a Mass Effect game.

 

But it's not that I "want them gone" or that I avoid the content. As I mentioned earlier, I actually appreciate the romance content. Some of it has been done well, some of it has not. When it has been done well, I think it is worth having. But I don't think that BioWare should approach games by asking the question "and what romances are we going to do this time?" And if there is content that is weaker, I think they should be prepared to cut it early, rather than include it to meet a romance quota.

 

None of which is intended to judge the people who like the romance content. I like it, too. I fall in the "it's nice but not as important as it is made out to be" camp.

[Lady Artifice]

The OP and title are a suggestion that the developers free themselves from the cycle of dealing with their audience's rage over how they handle romances. It was intended to be funny, but I was aware that many people would not take it that way. I also wanted to make the point that I don't believe doing away with the romances would actually harm the series. I don't think they are what makes it a Mass Effect game.

 

But it's not that I "want them gone" or that I avoid the content. As I mentioned earlier, I actually appreciate the romance content. Some of it has been done well, some of it has not. When it has been done well, I think it is worth having. But I don't think that BioWare should approach games by asking the question "and what romances are we going to do this time?" And if there is content that is weaker, I think they should be prepared to cut it early, rather than include it to meet a romance quota.

 

None of which is intended to judge the people who like the romance content. I like it, too. I fall in the "it's nice but not as important as it is made out to be" camp.

 

I do understand, and I'll hop off the soapbox. It really wasn't you that I was annoyed with, honestly. Your OP did make me laugh. 

[Angry_Elcor]

Your OP did make me laugh, despite myself.

 

Well, thank you. I think it's the Independence Day gif that sells it.

[RatThing]

I wouldn't mind as well, if romances would disappear from the game. They're considered too important by now. During the first game we had just 3 romance options and it really was just a minor element of the game. In ME3 ,Citadel DLC options included, we ended up having 14 !!! That's like an exponential growth. 

In general, this intensive focus on character interaction annoys me. There were far too much banal dialogues and meaningless interactions with characters in the games for my taste. Mass Effect started out as an adventure in space, but later felt too often like a social simulation game, like Sims in Space. Help your Sim with his daddy issues, now have a date with your Sim, finally have a party with all your favourite Sims. And it certainly does divert from the things I consider really interesting, story, setting, exploration etc..

I definitely would welcome if characters would be written for the story and setting again, and not as a replacement for friends/girlfriends etc. in the next game. Romances and Bromances should become a minor element again.   

[DarkKnightHolmes]

But then how will everyone get into pointless arguments on BSN about best wifey???

[RatThing]

But then how will everyone get into pointless arguments on BSN about best wifey???

 

I wouldn't miss that as well . That's actually another point, it's almost impossible to have a nice discussion in forums about a character and this characters impact on the story without either admirers appear to defend his/her honour or hardcore haters to bash him/her (or both). Kinda pathetic if you ask me.   

[The Sauce of Awesome]

No romances?? But...but how am I gonna go all Captain Kirk on the Andromeda galaxy if I can't bang half the ladies in there?!

[Exaltation]

Romanceless BioWare game?!