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Killing Shepard was a bad idea....


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#151
MattFini

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The Reapers wouldn't allow Shepard to just destroy them outright. That's why they kind of steer you away from destroy choice and make it look like their solutions are the best ones. It makes perfect sense.

 

If Shepard was allowed to make the choice it would be only the Reapers die, mass relays and Citadel intact, galaxy saved, everything returns to normal, and you see people rebuilding based on your decisions.

 

Reapers essentially are willing to risk everything in order to stop you. Including destroying their own technology (Citadel, mass relays, etc), even if it means they get destroyed themselves.

 

Essentially, I'd rather die and take the whole galaxy with me than let you find a solution that works for both of us.

 

That the Catalyst allows you to make a choice is the problem I had. It was anticlimactic and unexciting. 

 

If the story had been slightly re-worked so that you rode the beam back onto the Citadel and discovered a Catalyst who was very upset about you making it this far, it would've flowed better.

 

If you could then fire the Crucible against his wishes, it would've put more narrative power in Shepard's hands, and made it so he/she continued driving the story instead of being dealt the passive choices he/she was allowed to make. 



#152
fraggle

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If the story had been slightly re-worked so that you rode the beam back onto the Citadel and discovered a Catalyst who was very upset about you making it this far, it would've flowed better.

 

If you could then fire the Crucible against his wishes, it would've put more narrative power in Shepard's hands, and made it so he/she continued driving the story instead of being dealt the passive choices he/she was allowed to make. 

 

Ever tried Low EMS with the Collector Base from ME2 destroyed? :)

The Catalyst is more hostile there and doesn't really like it you made it this far. Plus, you only get one option that way, Destroy - the option it wants the least.

Of course that would also mean the outcome is a lot worse for the remaining species.

 

But one more thing, the Catalyst is not the one who allows the choices. The Crucible made it possible and changed the Catalyst to accept and merely present the new solution(s) to Shepard. It says so in the dialogue. The end choice is still your own, so basically if you pick Destroy it's also definitely against its wishes.

The Catalyst to me is nothing more than a "guide", if you will, to explain what the hell you're actually about to do.



#153
Dantriges

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Interesting. It´s pretty clear that the Catalyst isn´t completely in control or he wouldn´t raise the platforms to the control and destroy options. He didn´t call a horde of creatures either but I thought it was because he had to offer you the alternatives to synthesis or it wouldn´t work.



#154
Guest_Buru_*

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The Catalyst is more hostile there and doesn't really like it you made it this far.

 

You have choice, more than you deserve!

 

My favorite line from the low EMS version.



#155
xassantex

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Shepard didn't die, he's retired 

Hence all the exploring, you know,. seniors bus tours. 



#156
themikefest

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You have choice, more than you deserve!

 

My favorite line from the low EMS version.

The Catalyst says that line no matter what your ems is and if you choose the bottom right dialogue



#157
muy_thaiguy

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My Master Engineer/Biotic Master Shepard altered the blast from Destroy to only target Reaper forces. Starchild was pissed until Shepard backhanded him like Raditz did to Gohan. Accidentally turned Starchild into a Flowerchild and became the first ever hippy AI. So now the Citadel is tie dye with holographic flowers decorating everything including the numerous corpses.



#158
Dantriges

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You have choice, more than you deserve!

 

He got to talk at all. That´s more than the starchild deserves. <_<


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#159
Red Panda

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War always has happy endings....  All the survivors who return to their families who don't have PTSD, the side that wins, all those who benefit from war (and there are a lot)...war is politics, and those who achieve their aims have happy endings.

Not with MAD.



#160
Ezra Watcher

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well depending on your choice and DLC it does chance a little. is you control the reapers you Shepard dies, same if you do synthesis. but if you destroy the reapers as anderson would do there is a small clip where Shepard get us (and i assume is alive)  please not that joker is pissed at you cos you killed EDI.



#161
prosthetic soul

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I think I got an aneurysm from reading through this entire thread. 

 

The people who are fine with the outcome are so for one of two reasons: They are fine with Shepard dying and that is the outcome they were expecting OR because their headcanon-fu is strong.  I'm talking....REALLY strong.  Both parties tell the people who aren't fine with their Shepard dying to "get over it" because they do not care to "headcanon it up" or because they did not want Shepard to die.

 

I'm sorry but this is quintessentially selfish.  And pigheaded.  If you are fine with the endings, that's well and good.  But where do you get off telling others who aren't to get over it?

 

Again, Shepard MAYBE survives in High EMS destroy.  MAYBE.  I don't get where people are getting this "HE LIVES IN ONE ENDING THOUGH" nonsense from.  And Christ almighty we deserve closure!  Don't even give me any of that "it's artistically ambiguous" crap either!  They spelled out Shepard's death clearly enough in the other 3 endings, don't suddenly make it all vague in the fourth ending when he has a chance to survive!  That's stupid!   



#162
fraggle

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Again, Shepard MAYBE survives in High EMS destroy.  MAYBE.  I don't get where people are getting this "HE LIVES IN ONE ENDING THOUGH" nonsense from.  And Christ almighty we deserve closure!  Don't even give me any of that "it's artistically ambiguous" crap either!  They spelled out Shepard's death clearly enough in the other 3 endings, don't suddenly make it all vague in the fourth ending when he has a chance to survive!  That's stupid!   

 

That "nonsense" has been confirmed by the devs though.

Spoiler

 

So it's been long confirmed that Shepard indeed survives this, so I don't know where your problem lies.

And I'm sorry, but you don't put in a hopeful scene like that in a game just to say then "ah, no, sorry, Shepard didn't survive in the end". Given that you need High EMS to get that scene, it's a reward for fans who go to the lengths to collect every possible War Asset, that's how it works. There are games out there in which you get some secret scenes/endings if you work for it, if you complete the game almost 100% or something similar. This is no different I think.

 

About the moving on. Yeah, of course noone can tell people to move on, but it's a suggestion. :P

I guess some people just can't believe how you can be mad at something for 3 years, and counting. Most people would've moved on by then. It's healthier to let go. For myself I can't imagine to be angry at something for several years, and a video game at that. But to each his own I guess.



#163
prosthetic soul

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That "nonsense" has been confirmed by the devs though.

Spoiler

 

So it's been long confirmed that Shepard indeed survives this, so I don't know where your problem lies.

And I'm sorry, but you don't put in a hopeful scene like that in a game just to say then "ah, no, sorry, Shepard didn't survive in the end". Given that you need High EMS to get that scene, it's a reward for fans who go to the lengths to collect every possible War Asset, that's how it works. There are games out there in which you get some secret scenes/endings if you work for it, if you complete the game almost 100% or something similar. This is no different I think.

 

About the moving on. Yeah, of course noone can tell people to move on, but it's a suggestion. :P

I guess some people just can't believe how you can be mad at something for 3 years, and counting. Most people would've moved on by then. It's healthier to let go. For myself I can't imagine to be angry at something for several years, and a video game at that. But to each his own I guess.

Bah, confirming something after the fact has as much impact as tissue paper being thrown against a wall.  But I suppose if they did confirm it, then Shepard apparently survives. He sure as hell doesn't live though. 



#164
AtreiyaN7

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Newsflash that's about a billion years old but that you, OP, are somehow were not privy to: ME1, ME2, and ME3 were intended to be Shepard's trilogy. Shepard was never meant to be the franchise's hero forever and ever and ever.


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#165
CrutchCricket

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Bah, confirming something after the fact has as much impact as tissue paper being thrown against a wall.  But I suppose if they did confirm it, then Shepard apparently survives. He sure as hell doesn't live though. 

lol we talking Khal Drogo levels of survival here?

 

Emilia+Clarke+and+Jason+Momoa+as+Danener


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#166
Lazengan

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"B-b-but I want to self insert myself as Shepard and write as many fanfics as possible about settling down with my husbando/waifu"



#167
prosthetic soul

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"B-b-but I want to self insert myself as Shepard and write as many fanfics as possible about settling down with my husbando/waifu"

Nice strawman. 



#168
God

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Well, this has been a great exhibition of why Chronoid is considered one of the more topical figures of the ME forum.

 

For someone who hates it when others tell him what he thinks and criticize his views, he certainly goes on about how everyone is wrong to believe something else. 

 

Shepard has become Schrodinger's toy: He lives or dies at the discretion of the player. 

 

As far as I'm concerned, High EMS Destroy showed everything that needed to be said. Nothing else. That doesn't mean I like it per se, but I get what its saying, and it really doesn't need to state anything more. 

 

The power is yours on what comes after. I don't know why you reject it. You seem to want him dead. So for you, he's dead.



#169
prosthetic soul

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Shepard has become Schrodinger's toy: He lives or dies at the discretion of the player. 

 

As far as I'm concerned, High EMS Destroy showed everything that needed to be said. Nothing else. That doesn't mean I like it per se, but I get what its saying, and it really doesn't need to state anything more. 

 

The power is yours on what comes after. I don't know why you reject it. You seem to want him dead. So for you, he's dead.

Ah that's better.  I deleted the obnoxious ad hominem.  Isn't that much nicer when you don't insult people? Look at all the fat cut from that post.  You're trying to make me out to be this big hypocrite and it just isn't working.   Also, why do you think I seem to want him dead?  The only reason I believe he is dead in every ending is due to the fact that Bioware couldn't muster up the effort to prove otherwise

 

 A tweet confirming he is alive is all well and good.  I get that.  But it's not in the game.  Ergo, the confirmation rings a bit...hollow.   I beat the game before all the extended cut nonsense came out and before Bioware backpedaled up the yin yang.  I remember the tweets which came before the actual confirmation which merely stated the "breathing scene" was merely to give the players some "Semblance of hope" and other such trolling nonsense. So in reality, the confirmation tweet posted in this very thread may very well be seen as yet another contradiction spewed by Bioware. 

 

There is also no closure.  No closure whatsoever.  And before anyone accuses me of "Waifu-ing it up" I respond to that with this: I just want fair treatment in regards to the ending I chose.  The ending I chose was the Shepard lives.  But apparently the Shepard lives ending doesn't get any closure compared to the Shepard commits suicide ending.   So if there's no actual closure (read: evidence) proving Shepard is alive and well, then what do I have to go on here?  Bioware's word?  We all know how good their word is.  



#170
God

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That wasn't an ad hominem. That was a statement. Learn the difference.

 

Their word is actually pretty good. They've done a lot to win back a lot of their support from past failures. As well, there is no fairness. BW has no obligation or duty to provide you with what you want.

 

On the business end of things, part of the statement is this: Tough. Too bad. You weren't owed anything. 

 

As for whether there is closure or not, there's a very strong argument to be had that contradicts what you're saying. There was closure, if you knew where to look for it. If you knew what to make of it. If you knew that its up to you do make your own closure. 

 

The reason I say you want Shepard dead is because you seem bound and determined to see him die in the ending, even when you claim otherwise. 

 

It's not BW's job to tell you what happens next. That's on you. Their job ended at the breath scene. Now its your story. You're the one who can't seem to muster up the effort to finish the story. Quit blaming BW and others for your own shortcomings. Anything else doesn't need to be in the game. It's not their game anymore. It's yours at that point.

 

BW shouldn't have had to confirm anything. It's ambiguous. It doesn't need closure or clarification. 


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#171
CrystalXPredator

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I know what BioWare is hiding in their sleeves and most of us know that too, if Andromeda fail they want something to get back on.

And this will be a continue about Sheps story. There are also so many hints about it and this time I will say let's see how good andromeda will be.

Yes BioWare you can prank other people but not with me my lovin company I got you.  :wub: 



#172
prosthetic soul

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That wasn't an ad hominem. That was a statement. Learn the difference.

 

Their word is actually pretty good. They've done a lot to win back a lot of their support from past failures. As well, there is no fairness. BW has no obligation or duty to provide you with what you want.

 

On the business end of things, part of the statement is this: Tough. Too bad. You weren't owed anything. 

 

As for whether there is closure or not, there's a very strong argument to be had that contradicts what you're saying. There was closure, if you knew where to look for it. If you knew what to make of it. If you knew that its up to you do make your own closure. 

 

The reason I say you want Shepard dead is because you seem bound and determined to see him die in the ending, even when you claim otherwise. 

 

It's not BW's job to tell you what happens next. That's on you. Their job ended at the breath scene. Now its your story. You're the one who can't seem to muster up the effort to finish the story. Quit blaming BW and others for your own shortcomings. Anything else doesn't need to be in the game. It's not their game anymore. It's yours at that point.

 

BW shouldn't have had to confirm anything. It's ambiguous. It doesn't need closure or clarification. 

1. What contradiction?  You're parroting my word usage without using it in the right context here.   There was no closure.  You're saying there was without actually providing any proof or evidence. Where was this closure you speak of?  Elaborate please.   

 

2. Ad hominem and statements aren't inherently separate things.  They can be the same thing actually.  So what you just said about it being a statement was meaningless.  You attacked me instead of my argument claiming I was a topical figure.  Which by the way, doesn't even make any sense.  Topical wasn't a word I don't think you wanted to use there. 

 

3. Actually, Bioware does owe me it.  Because that's what they said they were going to give me before the game was released.  Otherwise, it's called false advertising.  Which is illegal.  I paid 60 dollars for the game.  I expect quality.  If the quality of the game is to be found severely wanting then it is my prerogative to complain about it on their official forums. 

 

4. Who made it a rule that's it up to me to make my up my own closure?  Where are you pulling these ordained bull**** restrictions from?  Your ass? 

 

5. No, I am not bound and determined to see him dead in every ending.  But you are free to continue being obnoxiously arrogant enough to presume what I am or am not thinking at the moment.  Because surely you are that omniscient.   Your name may be God but I think that username may have gone to your head.

 

6. On the contrary, it is BW's job to tell me what comes next.  That's why they have the writers.  They have a job to tell the freaking story.  If not, then they have incompetent story tellers.

 

7. I fail to see how wanting a comprehensible and well-written story that offers closure is me having short comings.  I don't know where you get off being this insulting but you need get off Bioware's **** for 5 freaking seconds and come back down to Earth.  Back down to reality.  Because it is hilarious how out of touch you are with both. 

 

8. That last statement is an opinion.  Nothing more.  Not going to bother responding to it. 



#173
Monica21

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*sigh*

 

3. Actually, Bioware does owe me it.  Because that's what they said they were going to give me before the game was released.  Otherwise, it's called false advertising.  Which is illegal.  I paid 60 dollars for the game.  I expect quality.  If the quality of the game is to be found severely wanting then it is my prerogative to complain it on their official forums. 

 

The only thing Bioware owed you was a conclusion to Shepard's story. Whether you liked it is entirely subjective. Whether you think it was quality work is entirely subjective. You got exactly what you paid for, regardless of your personal feelings.



#174
prosthetic soul

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*sigh*

 

 

The only thing Bioware owed you was a conclusion to Shepard's story. Whether you liked it is entirely subjective. Whether you think it was quality work is entirely subjective. You got exactly what you paid for, regardless of your personal feelings.

No. I did not get what I paid for.  Not at all.  Speak for yourself please. 



#175
Monica21

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No. I did not get what I paid for.  Not at all.  Speak for yourself please. 

 

Yes, you did. You got a conclusion to Shepard's story. End.


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