I'm maintaining the idea that they reopen Mass Relays, and one leads to Andromeda in the end.
Wouldn't that imply that there is a Mass Relay in the Andromeda galaxy. We have Reapers in the Andromeda galaxy? I don't think BioWare would want to go down that path.
Guest_AugmentedAssassin_*
I think what Chris said is very possible and feasible.
Wouldn't that imply that there is a Mass Relay in the Andromeda galaxy. We have Reapers in the Andromeda galaxy? I don't think BioWare would want to go down that path.
Why does everyone make this leap in logic?
"If the Reapers can get to Andromeda, that means they're waiting for us there!"
Why would they split up? It would make each harvesting cycle more inefficient and still leave them waiting the same length of time around between cycles. If they all attacked en masse every time they would harvest faster and get to other galaxies faster.
Looking back, maybe this is the Ark. A little Citadel style place station.
Why does everyone make this leap in logic?
"If the Reapers can get to Andromeda, that means they're waiting for us there!"
Why would they split up? It would make each harvesting cycle more inefficient and still leave them waiting the same length of time around between cycles. If they all attacked en masse every time they would harvest faster and get to other galaxies faster.
Because they have a mandate to "protect life" at all cost. WIth no specified limits. All Milky Way Reapers have to do is start another "Reaper Brood" and the Andromeda harvests could proceed without further interference from the Milky Way Reapers. Just have to get the ball rolling, and the Andromeda Reapers will build up their numbers the same way: harvests.
Thus the big problem with any route to Andromeda: Why wouldn't the Reapers use it?
Why does everyone make this leap in logic?
"If the Reapers can get to Andromeda, that means they're waiting for us there!"
Why would they split up? It would make each harvesting cycle more inefficient and still leave them waiting the same length of time around between cycles. If they all attacked en masse every time they would harvest faster and get to other galaxies faster.
How is this a leap of logic? Please look at the post I responded to. You need one relay located where you are, and one relay located where you want to go. How did one relay end up in the Andromeda galaxy, unless the Reapers put it there?
I don't know about you, but this is not a leap of logic. This is only logical.
They used "long after the ME trilogy" in their description of when the events of ME:A take place.
My most logical explanation is that, irrespective of the state of the reapers and how you acquire their technology, you simply use it to traverse through dark space.
Perhaps you end up on Andromeda by accident.
Either way, it's a damn interesting concept and it's as much as a clean slate as they can get.
I'm thinking worm hole or cryo ark. Or both. If it's wormhole, I hope they explain why Reapers couldn't follow behind. If it's Cryo, as long as they give a detailed codex on all the details, I'm ok with that too.
Honestly, I think it's a cool idea. It means every species (besides the rachni and maybe the geth) may survive even the refuse ending, as long as they left before the ending. So if I prefer the refuse ending, I'm not getting screwed over. Allowing any canon to work. So if Andromeda group finds a way back, then there's the excuse for why we have Non-synthesis humans, krogan, and turians running around the Milky Way. Or why Quarians are still around in suits, and why some aren't. etc.
Because they have a mandate to "protect life" at all cost. WIth no specified limits. All Milky Way Reapers have to do is start another "Reaper Brood" and the Andromeda harvests could proceed without further interference from the Milky Way Reapers. Just have to get the ball rolling, and the Andromeda Reapers will build up their numbers the same way: harvests.
Thus the big problem with any route to Andromeda: Why wouldn't the Reapers use it?
If they're in Andromeda, why wouldn't they be in Triangulum, Magellanic Clouds and every other galaxy in the Local Group/Supergroup? They sure should be widely spread after at least a billion years of existance. With such numbers and breaks of 50k years, they would have zero issues sending reinforcements to any particular galaxy that may have won against a local 'brood'. So logically, we should be fightining no one but them forever. If it's 1 galaxy it simple, but if it's more than 1 then why not all/as many as possible?
The Reapers are enforcing the will of the Leviathans, and the Leviathans only care about the Milky Way.If they're in Andromeda, why wouldn't they be in Triangulum, Magellanic Clouds and every other galaxy in the Local Group/Supergroup? They sure should be widely spread after at least a billion years of existance. With such numbers and breaks of 50k years, they would have zero issues sending reinforcements to any particular galaxy that may have won against a local 'brood'. So logically, we should be fightining no one but them forever. If it's 1 galaxy it simple, but if it's more than 1 then why not all/as many as possible?
Yeah, but they didn't have to keep their energy-hogging FTL drive engaged for 570 years.According to the Cerberus Daily News, humanity has had the basic tech for this since at least 2075, which is when the Manswell Expedition attempted to reach Alpha Centauri using a sub-light sleeper ship to ferry it's 300 passengers.
If they're in Andromeda, why wouldn't they be in Triangulum, Magellanic Clouds and every other galaxy in the Local Group/Supergroup? They sure should be widely spread after at least a billion years of existance. With such numbers and breaks of 50k years, they would have zero issues sending reinforcements to any particular galaxy that may have won against a local 'brood'. So logically, we should be fightining no one but them forever. If it's 1 galaxy it simple, but if it's more than 1 then why not all/as many as possible?
Now you see the problem inherent in letting humans spread to other galaxies so easily.
If we could do it, the Reapers should have long, long ago.
Now you see the problem inherent in letting humans spread to other galaxies so easily.
If we could do it, the Reapers should have long, long ago.
Wasn't really my point. I was debating implications of having a relay that connects both galaxies. Relay in Andromeda = Reapers in Andromeda = in many other galaxies. By giving us a more "lore established" method of getting there we're making the Reapers interested in preserving life in the entire universe, instead of just 1 galaxy that was relevant to Leviathans and their directive for the Intelligence
If they're in Andromeda, why wouldn't they be in Triangulum, Magellanic Clouds and every other galaxy in the Local Group/Supergroup? They sure should be widely spread after at least a billion years of existance. With such numbers and breaks of 50k years, they would have zero issues sending reinforcements to any particular galaxy that may have won against a local 'brood'. So logically, we should be fightining no one but them forever. If it's 1 galaxy it simple, but if it's more than 1 then why not all/as many as possible?
The Reapers could travel as one giant fleet to maximize their effectiveness during each harvest rather than being in many, smaller fleets. The cycles could just be the time between when they leave, harvest all other galaxies/dwarf galaxies in the domain, and return.
Thus since they are either defeated or in the Milky Way for centuries, we won't have to worry about them since it'll be a long time before we have to face them again. After all even for Reapers it would take 231.7808 years to reach Andromeda, and that's if they beeline it.
Frankly I think people are ascribing a lot of motivations to the Reapers that aren't supported by the canon. I don't see how "protect life at all costs" automatically translates to "hunt down all forms of life in the universe." There would have to be defined parameters on the problem being investigated and the proposed solution. Just because our ten minute chats with the Leviathans and the Intelligence didn't give us a detailed blueprint doesn't mean one didn't exist. Until you can point me at anything other than a vague, general mandate, I don't buy the premise that the Reapers would automatically be interested in going to another galaxy just because they have the capability to do so. If they preserved organic life in the Milky Way, then they have fulfilled their mandate regardless of what is going on in other galaxies.
@Iakus: "Spreading" to another galaxy is not what seems to be going on here.
I really don't believe the Milky Way is going to be flourishing at the beginning of this game and these colonials/explorers are just an extension.
However they got there - I'll wager the trip was one way, their "civilization" will be confined to a flotilla like caravan of ships (or that massive picture that's floating around).
I don't get the feeling this is just some casual day trip to the Andromeda galaxy.
And why wouldn't the Reapers be able to get there? The question is, why would they come? The Reapers answer the Citadel dinner bell do they not? They came to the Milky Way because the thing was being used (for hundreds of years if I'm not mistaken).
So, these survivors get to the Andromeda galaxy... there's no need for the Reapers to follow... at all. IF they still exist (and I believe they will) they're going to be the "boogey men" between galaxies... waiting for someone to trip the dinner bell (I believe there will be an Andromeda Citadel)
The Reapers don't magically detect advanced civilization... the whole point of the Citadel is that the mindset of such civilizations that would reach space is careless and would gobble up the trojan horse Citadel tech... thereby tripping the dinner bell.
Survivors would know what it is... they could quarantine such a place - the Reapers would never return to the Andromeda galaxy.
Now you see the problem inherent in letting humans spread to other galaxies so easily.
If we could do it, the Reapers should have long, long ago.
They might have.
Perhaps that is why there are no species in Andromeda as advanced as the Reapers, or the Leviathans before the Reapers took them down a few pegs. The Reapers could also be the reason why there is a species known as the Remnant, who are the remains of a once great but fallen civilization.
The Reapers could travel as one giant fleet to maximize their effectiveness during each harvest rather than being in many, smaller fleets. The cycles could just be the time between when they leave, harvest all other galaxies/dwarf galaxies in the domain, and return.
50k years cycle would only allow 1 massive fleet to cover so many galaxies. Even at their speed they would never manage all galaxies within Local Group or Supergroup in 50k years. At some point a split would have to occur
@Iakus: "Spreading" to another galaxy is not what seems to be going on here.
I really don't believe the Milky Way is going to be flourishing at the beginning of this game and these colonials/explorers are just an extension.
However they got there - I'll wager the trip was one way, their "civilization" will be confined to a flotilla like caravan of ships (or that massive picture that's floating around).
I don't get the feeling this is just some casual day trip to the Andromeda galaxy.
And why wouldn't the Reapers be able to get there? The question is, why would they come? The Reapers answer the Citadel dinner bell do they not? They came to the Milky Way because the thing was being used (for hundreds of years if I'm not mistaken).
So, these survivors get to the Andromeda galaxy... there's no need for the Reapers to follow... at all. IF they still exist (and I believe they will) they're going to be the "boogey men" between galaxies... waiting for someone to trip the dinner bell (I believe there will be an Andromeda Citadel)
The Reapers don't magically detect advanced civilization... the whole point of the Citadel is that the mindset of such civilizations that would reach space is careless and would gobble up the trojan horse Citadel tech... thereby tripping the dinner bell.
Survivors would know what it is... they could quarantine such a place - the Reapers would never return to the Andromeda galaxy.
Well, the Reapers also would have a vanguard hidden in the Andromeda galaxy that would wake up periodically to check on the development of the galaxy.
But, we would be able to do what the Protheans planned to: prepare the current cycle for the Reapers. We have technology that can put up a good fight, and can advance even more during the centuries or millennia and spread that knowledge and tech to the native species before the vanguard notices, giving the galaxy a fighting chance. Essentially what happens in the Refuse ending: the next cycle was prepared because of our cycle and were able to defeat the Reapers.
50k years cycle would only allow 1 massive fleet to cover so many galaxies. Even at their speed they would never manage all galaxies within Local Group or Supergroup in 50k years. At some point a split would have to occur
They would be able to harvest all of the galaxies in dwarf galaxies in our local group, since as far as galactic groups go we are in a relatively small and empty one. When it gets to traversing galactic clusters and superclusters then yeah it becomes impossible to do so as a single fleet. Maybe it has happened and the fleet we know of is the one stationed for our Local Galactic Group.
@Hanako Ikezawa: In truth, I think they're going to simply keep the Reapers in the background. I wager the Andromeda galaxy was recently cleansed... doesn't the vanguard wake up at ridiculously long intervals? And searching a galaxy for advanced life would take a great deal of time... even for the Reapers.
I think this would be in the 10s of thousands of years... so I don't think we'll be dealing with Reapers ever again (even though I absolutely believe the specter of them will linger as a threat "out there")
They would be able to harvest all of the galaxies in dwarf galaxies in our local group, since as far as galactic groups go we are in a relatively small and empty one. When it gets to traversing galactic clusters and superclusters then yeah it becomes impossible to do so as a single fleet. Maybe it has happened and the fleet we know of is the one stationed for our Local Galactic Group.
And thus in case of emergency other stationed fleets could borrow some reinforcements to get the revolting Milky Way in order. Defeating a machine race that controls entire superclusters of galaxies would be just too farfetched in the first place.
@Hanako Ikezawa: In truth, I think they're going to simply keep the Reapers in the background. I wager the Andromeda galaxy was recently cleansed... doesn't the vanguard wake up at ridiculously long intervals? And searching a galaxy for advanced life would take a great deal of time... even for the Reapers.
I think this would be in the 10s of thousands of years... so I don't think we'll be dealing with Reapers ever again (even though I absolutely believe the specter of them will linger as a threat "out there")
I agree. The races in Andromeda according to the leak sound like they are between harvests. So the Reapers wouldn't have any reason to come for thousands or possibly tens of thousands of years. And yeah, the vanguard wakes up once every few centuries to check up on the galaxy. The vanguard could have just gone to sleep again when we arrive, giving at least several centuries before it is alerted to us. I say at least because like you said even it it does wake up while we're in Andromeda, if we are in a small enough part of Andromeda it may not notice us.
Meanwhile them tampering with Andromeda would leave things like Mass Relays around, allowing travel across Andromeda possible when we get to that point, and as stated earlier having the races of Andromeda be equal or even slightly less advanced technologically than us, meaning we won't have to face Leviathan-tier races. Speaking of the Mass Relays, when asked about whether they will be in the new game Bioware said they couldn't answer that yet. Why can't they answer that if the Relays had no role in the story?
So yeah, their relevance to the plot of this new story would be they are a lingering threat in the shadows, but also serve as a connection to the past games both in a meta sense and an in-universe sense for the reasons we talked about.
And thus in case of emergency other stationed fleets could borrow some reinforcements to get the revolting Milky Way in order. Defeating a machine race that controls entire superclusters of galaxies would be just too farfetched in the first place.
True, though even with Reaper FTL we are looking at a trip of hundreds of thousands to even millions of years. The Reapers in other fleets could only donate a certain amount of ships otherwise risk losing control of their domain and it gives our local galactic group a ton of time to advance, and the reinforcements would arrive sporadically since they are different distances apart from the local galactic group. Meaning by the time the Reapers show up we could match or even overpower them in numbers and firepower. But Bioware wouldn't even have to tell this story if they don't want to, especially since the universe would be nigh-unrecognizable as Mass Effect by that point, but just leave it out there.
@Hanako Ikezawa: Totally in agreement.
The relay/citadel mix is the perfect way to police every galaxy - so I think it would make perfect sense for the Andromeda Galaxy to already have a Relay network set up and ready to be utilized.
New civilizations could spread like wildfire right under their radar. I believe this is going to be a huge thing for ME4... finding homeworlds for the surviving races.
Retour en haut
