583 réponses à ce sujet

[Beerfish]

Worm hole obviously.

[Elhanan]

Space Hamster Drive System

[AlexiaRevan]

some crazy scientist find an eluvian and run innit and we follow him..TADA! Morrigan dissapear and welcome to Mass effect..now probe Uranus for mineralt cose the Normandy RS-3 won't fly without some 

[Saul Iscariot]

I had a towel to hand, a few lagers and some peanuts. The peanuts were for the salt.

[Elhanan]

Atomic Vacations; Gone Nuclear Fission....

[SNascimento]

Maybe we don't get there at all? There is some kind of independent development there, or something else is responsible for the rise of that particular galactic civilization that looks a lot like the one from the original trilogy?

I'd take something like that over an ark story. Or at least a ark story that is: "the galaxy was afraid of the reapers and sent an ark to Andromeda". 

[Iakus]

Javik's facility was also compromised in the final assault so it's unknown what that did to the available power, and pod integrity.

Victory specifies that the bunker's sensors were damaged, making automated reawakening impossible.  Nothing about the power supply itself being damaged.  

[Iakus]

 

Iakus, one thing I've noticed is that you really enjoy having as much of an airtight seal around lore, continuity and logic as possible. I have to admit I'm often like this too. I study Sciences and everyone often complains that I over-analyze things and don't just think of the simple way out and appreciate the whole thing as it is. I let little details bug me. It's good that we think in this way for some aspects of life, but do you think this mentality might be inhibiting your enjoyment of games in general, or is it something more particular in Bioware/Mass Effect that has made you been pointing out many faults in the games?

 

When it comes to entertainment, here is what I think: games, movies, books, etc. all require a certain suspension of disbelief in order to work. Some stuff just has to go conveniently in favor of the main character in order for there to be an interesting story, or even a story at all.

 

Take the Crucible for example. Was it convenient that it suddenly showed up in ME3? Yes. Was it convenient that the Reapers, for all their supposed power, couldn't locate the Crucible and destroy it? Most likely.

 

That's in the same way stuff in ME1 and ME2 was convenient. Was it convenient that somehow, after all this time, and just when we needed it, we had a dead Reaper lying around that Cerberus had already investigated and happened to have the last piece we needed to go through the Omega 4 Relay? Yes. 

 

Was it convenient that the Reapers, and Sovereign in particular, had absolutely no back up plan for the cycle besides using signals on the Citadel as a Mass Relay? After the Protheans scrambled the signal, Sovereign was delayed by thousands of years so he could build up the fleet and find the right organic (a supposedly inferior form) to finish a job that he could not. Or why did Sovereign simply not shoot a laser at him while he was scaling the Citadel tower? Saren knew he was Shepard was probably coming coming. Warning Sovereign to keep a few sensors scanning for Shepard couldn't have been that much of a hassle. The station was sealed, nothing to rush the Saren or Sovereign.

 

These may not be the best examples, but I hope you see my point. Suspension of disbelief is necessary for a stories to be told. For heroes to overcome the odds, for legends to be born. I agree that Bioware should try and limit these as much as possible, but expecting perfection in terms of plot hole coverage is unrealistic. No game, book or movie is immune to them.

 

Proper suspension of disbelief lets the reader/viewer/player believe that the magic fits in the world being described.

 

Let me put it this way:  one of my favorite fantasy authors is Brandon Sanderson.  He does magic in a very logical manner, so you understand how the magic works, even though it is in fact "magic" and can't possibly function in the real world.

 

He even has a set of "rules" like Clarke's laws.  His first rule is: "An author's ability to solve conflict with magic is directly proportional to how well the reader understands said magic"  

 

If there's a lore-friendly, rational reason how we're getting to Andromeda, that could make for good storytelling.  If it's just handwaved away with "A Wizard Did It" (like so much of the original trilogy) that's not interesting.  That's contrived.

 

Heck that's why I say ME2 and ME3 damaged ME1.  As not only did they ad more space magic via the Lazarus Project, and such, but they failed to expand on loose ends from ME1, like the Cipher.

 

And this is why I'm afraid intergalactic travel will simply be handwaved away as well.  "It's always a matter of resources"  How am I supposed to take a series seriously when conflict can just be swept away by a Crucible some mysterious discovery that gets the writers out of the corner they painted themselves in?

[Beerfish]

"If there's a lore-friendly, rational reason how we're getting to Andromeda, that could make for good storytelling.  If it's just handwaved away with "A Wizard Did It" (like so much of the original trilogy) that's not interesting.  That's contrived."

 

Sci fi is ALL ABOUT HAND WAVING.

 

This is just another post speculating on things we have little knowledge of at this point and in essence being an opinion piece.  Please explain to me what is hand waving vs what is not?

 

Mass Effect relays were a great big gigantic hand wave and are totally not plausible.  Wait, they built a few games with that in it so now it is 'lore' and we are okay with it.  Someone came up with worm hole travel, that is total hand waving!  But relays are not.

[Saul Iscariot]

Iakus, Whilst I find myself thinking that they will give a good description, or even let us play how we end up in Andromeda, I can see why you would have such concerns. The problem often rests on what we want to know and what the writer wants to concentrate on telling us. If they do not think it is important as to how we get to Andromeda, but why we are there and what happens, then we may both be disappointed by it. But if they neglect it to concentrate on a more important aspect of the story then I may be able to ignore it as well.

[In Exile]

Heck that's why I say ME2 and ME3 damaged ME1.  As not only did they ad more space magic via the Lazarus Project, and such, but they failed to expand on loose ends from ME1, like the Cipher.

 

And this is why I'm afraid intergalactic travel will simply be handwaved away as well.  "It's always a matter of resources"  How am I supposed to take a series seriously when conflict can just be swept away by a Crucible some mysterious discovery that gets the writers out of the corner they painted themselves in?

 

But that's how ME1 worked too. I suppose the Conduit itself wasn't so bad in that they lampshaded it a bit, but this is a series that exists because it handwaved away interstellar travel. 

[Iakus]

But that's how ME1 worked too. I suppose the Conduit itself wasn't so bad in that they lampshaded it a bit, but this is a series that exists because it handwaved away interstellar travel. 

It's not interstellar travel itself that I'm concerned with.  It exists in the Mass Effect universe because of these Magic Rocks called eezo.  Fine, I get it.  

 

But at the same time certain rules were made regarding how it works, and it's limitations.  Intergalactic travel would violate these rules and limitations.  How?

[In Exile]

It's not interstellar travel itself that I'm concerned with.  It exists in the Mass Effect universe because of these Magic Rocks called eezo.  Fine, I get it.  

 

But at the same time certain rules were made regarding how it works, and it's limitations.  Intergalactic travel would violate these rules and limitations.  How?

 

No, it wouldn't. One, this is made up BS. There's nothing wrong with introducing new made up BS that isn't logically inconsistent with your old BS. 

 

Intergalactic travel using conventional drives might violate the lore. That's it. 

 

Two, technology isn't exhaustive. So the fact that only so far mass relays dodge this issue doesn't mean they can't invent some other way to dodge the issue. 

[Saul Iscariot]

As we know the Reapers steered technology in the Milky Way to develop a particular way, what if some clever bod just said why don't we attach an engine to a Mass Relay?

[Iakus]

No, it wouldn't. One, this is made up BS. There's nothing wrong with introducing new made up BS that isn't logically inconsistent with your old BS. 

 

Intergalactic travel using conventional drives might violate the lore. That's it. 

 

Two, technology isn't exhaustive. So the fact that only so far mass relays dodge this issue doesn't mean they can't invent some other way to dodge the issue. 

Bolded is the important part.  Mass Effect doesn't have a good track record with logically consistent BS.  And setting the game in Andromeda is not a good omen that this cycle will be broken

 

And sure, some new way might be found which (again) begs the question of why didn't the Reapers use it?

[Saul Iscariot]

As others have said the Reapers may have had no interest in anything outside of the Milky Way due to their programming.

[In Exile]

Bolded is the important part.  Mass Effect doesn't have a good track record with logically consistent BS

 

And sure, some new way might be found which (again) begs the question of why didn't the Reapers use it?

 

Why would the reapers use it? It doesn't beg the question at all. Have we, right now, today, exhausted all possible technology? Or to use a different example, despite all their technological prowess, could 1930s Britain or Germany reproduce Damascus Steel? 

 

There's plenty of technology we haven't invented, and sci-fi is all about highly advanced precursor races blazing the trail. 

 

I get that you're really really really hung up on the reapers being the most advanced race ever, and there being no technology they don't possess, but that's repeatedly shown to be false in the series. Including in ME1. 

[dreamgazer]

Heck that's why I say ME2 and ME3 damaged ME1.  As not only did they ad more space magic via the Lazarus Project, and such, but they failed to expand on loose ends from ME1, like the Cipher.

That wasn't ME2's job, though. ME1's BS is ME1's BS, and there's plenty of it, all of which would've been left to stand on its own had the franchise ended with the first installment.

[Iakus]

As others have said the Reapers may have had no interest in anything outside of the Milky Way due to their programming.

Except that' not what we were told.

 

Their mandate is to preserve life.  Not "Milky Way life"  Whatever the cost.  And given the extremes they go to in fulfilling their mandate, I don't see them holding back to just this galaxy if they can spread further.

[Iakus]

 

I get that you're really really really hung up on the reapers being the most advanced race ever, and there being no technology they don't possess, but that's repeatedly shown to be false in the series. Including in ME1. 

They are the most advanced race ever.  They killed everyone else before they could get close.

 

And no they don't posses all technology. But they possessed the most advanced tech around by a wide margin.  So how is humanity going to surpass their engine technology in what, a few centuries?  Or worse, while at war with them?

[Il Divo]

The answer can't be: we just discover ancient tech of a different long dead civilization? 

[Nitrocuban]

Super secret Cerberus project powered by space magic, mass effect fields and dark matter.

And Miranda's bum.

[In Exile]

Except that' not what we were told.

 

Their mandate is to preserve life.  Not "Milky Way life"  Whatever the cost.  And given the extremes they go to in fulfilling their mandate, I don't see them holding back to just this galaxy if they can spread further.

Let's not even open that incredibly idiotic ME3 idea. Their notion of life is complete gibberish, somehow ignoring both what "organic life" is and what separates my intestinal bacteria from "me". 

 

Beyond that, if they could spread further, and if they did spread further, how would hand-waving away intergallactic travel be an issue at all? 

[themikefest]

How do we get to Andromeda again? Again? What? We've being there before? Hahahaha

 

Here's my very far fetched theory

 

I call this the Rubber Band Theory or The Slingshot Effect

 

A group of billionaires made up of all species, work together to find a way to leave the galaxy after learning about the reapers.They hire a Cerberus defector, who was TIM's top scientist. His name is Wile E. Coyote. SUUPER GENIUS. Wile E. Coyote was responsible for how Cerberus was able to build its massive fleet so quickly. He used ACME Corporation. They have instant delivery on all products. During the events of ME2, he was able to find the location of a wormhole just outside of the galaxy. Five huge ships were built each carrying up to 1000 people plus supplies

 

Wile built a gigantic slingshot that would send each ship in the direction to the wormhole and into Andromeda. He gave a crystal to the main character before being slinged to the wormhole and told he/she that the crystal is the key to building a colony. Something similiar to what Kal-El used for the fortress of solitude

 

The main character's ship lands on a planet. After searching for a nice location to build the colony, he/she throws the crystal. Failing to realize he/she can't throw as far as Kal-El, the colony builds beneath their feet. The main character and others start running to get away when they encounter a species that already has a settlement. Now the main character and others have to deal with them while trying to avoid being killed by the growing colony

[Iakus]

That wasn't ME2's job, though. ME1's BS is ME1's BS, and there's plenty of it, all of which would've been left to stand on its own had the franchise ended with the first installment.

No it wasn't.  But it was their opportunity for Author Saving Throws.