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I really hope SpaceV3gan never visits this thread
I was thinking the same thing. Hah
I just came in now, and I wish I hadn't come 
What a gore fest, especially Cirvante's pics 
Well, I am not really into brainwashing people, but I think you all could give a chance to some compassionate and ethics based eating habits one day... 
I just came in now, and I wish I hadn't come
*throws veggies at relentless tide of meat*
I just came in now, and I wish I hadn't come
Well, I am not really into brainwashing people, but I think you all could give a chance to some compassionate and ethics based eating habits one day...
do you take this
do you take this
I do, and you should too. Vitamin B12 deficiency is not just a vegan health issue, it can affect anyone.
I'm a breatharian
http://www.breathari...ileybrooks.html
http://gawker.com/59...l-sunlight-diet
I reject the thoughtless slaughter of animals and plants.
Veganism and breathtarianism are worlds apart from each other. We, like all animals, need nutrients to survive and to live a healthy life. Breathtarianism is compassionate, but unreasonable.
Also, the thoughtless slaughter of animals isn't comparable to the slaughter of plants. Plants cannot suffer. Animals, particularly the warm blooded and sociable mammals and birds that most people eat, suffer from birth to slaughter.
Never heard of "Breathtarianism" before today. To me, it's beyond stupid. I think even being a vegan is unreasonable, since animals don't have to suffer to deliever their natural products. I can understand the vegetarian point of view though.
Never heard of "Breathtarianism" before today. To me, it's beyond stupid. I think even being a vegan is unreasonable, since animals don't have to suffer to deliever their natural products. I can understand the vegetarian point of view though.
Animals don't have to suffer. But when commercial practices override their welfare, they inevitably suffer. The egg and dairy industry normally operate in pretty nasty ways, and one can easily find their practices all over the internet, like how cows are kept pregnant all year long and calves are removed from their mothers at birth and sold as veal meat or how male chicks are ground up alive. There are people who are OK with all of this and people who are not - and for some among these people, veganism can be a reasonable alternative.
there is still biological,totally normal operating farms which sell animal products. happy cows and chicken all around like in... um... "animal farm" xD those products are way more expensive though. i don't know where you are coming from but here (i am from germany) every animal product is marked (biological or factory farming). that way you can still be a vegetarian (a way to avoid having "guilt" of or support brutal animal breeding). that's it for germany though...don't know about other countries which might not mark their food or mark it not correctly. another thing to go for, if you really wanted it, is going directly to a farm, check it and buy stuff there.
personally, i don't like what's happening to the animals (mass breeding etc.) but there's no way to stop the farming industry doing so. i'm neither vegan nor vegetarian, though i rarely eat meat...don't like the flavor :=) most of Cirvante's pics i find disgusting to eat T.T... except the sausage...reek sausage...yummy...
there is still biological,totally normal operating farms which sell animal products. happy cows and chicken all around like in... um... "animal farm" xD those products are way more expensive though. i don't know where you are coming from but here (i am from germany) every animal product is marked (biological or factory farming). that way you can still be a vegetarian (a way to avoid having "guilt" of or support brutal animal breeding). that's it for germany though...don't know about other countries which might not mark their food or mark it not correctly. another thing to go for, if you really wanted it, is going directly to a farm, check it and buy stuff there.
personally, i don't like what's happening to the animals (mass breeding etc.) but there's no way to stop the farming industry doing so. i'm neither vegan nor vegetarian, though i rarely eat meat...don't like the flavor :=) most of Cirvante's pics i find disgusting to eat T.T... except the sausage...reek sausage...yummy...
cows won't ever be happy that you milk them though. see where I'm getting at
@ErySakasegawa
Those "biological", "totally normal" organic farms you're talking about work like this:
- The cows and chickens are given larger enclosures and generally lead more comfortable lives. In ideal farms their diets are more organic.
- In order for cows to produce milk, they need to calve. Instead of being slaughtered straight away, the calves and mothers are allowed a three week 'bonding period'. The calves are then either slaughtered or sold for slaughter, to be used for veal and rennet (the stuff they put in cheese to solidify it). This is exactly the same fate as most other calves, they just live 20 days longer.
- Chickens are bred specifically for either meat or laying eggs - one or the other, but not both. Male chicks are considered an unwanted biproduct of the egg industry, as they cannot lay, and they are unsuitable for meat. All male chicks, and all sick female chicks, are destroyed before they are 24 hours old. On "happy cows and chicken" farms, they are macerated and die within a few seconds. On other farms, they are either gassed (two minutes of choking), or ground.
The cows and chickens that live may well be living better lives than they would be on other farms, and if the industry must go on then I'd rather more farms operate like this. But to say that there are happy cows or happy chickens on these farms, or that these farms are at all humane, is objectively wrong.
@SpaceV3gan
As a hobbyist weight lifter and fitness enthusiast, my largest area of difficulty regarding a vegan diet is protein intake. I shoot for about 160 to 180 grams of protein a day. Many sources of vegetarian protein, such as black beans, simply aren't very effective at building or retaining muscle mass. Other sources like nuts, peas and some grains are great for adding a little bit of protein to the daily intake, but are simply not practical enough (or in the case of nuts and grains, contain incomplete amino acid profiles) to consume protein en masse. I'm aware of tofu and vegan protein powders, but are there any other easy sources of vegan protein you may be aware of? Cheaper the better, but I'll take more expensive options if there aren't many of the former
it seems you both are offended by the word "happy" which clearly was meant to hyperbolise. one even can discuss here what is means to be happy and if animals on farms can be happy at all.
i also know roughly what happens on a farm. i wanted to seperate those "biolocigal totally normal farms" from "not species-appropriate animal breeding" aka factory farming. i know there's slaughtering on both type of farms which can't be avoided. animals get slaughtered for their meat/skin.
i'm living in a little village here, maybe 1k residents. we've like 3-5 farms here which all are very small. the technique in those farms must be 20-30 years old at least :=) my sole argument here is, that if you are a vegan and want to taste animal products (being a vegetarian) you can go directly to a farmer of your choice.
edit: btw...just curious...is being a vegan a thing on this forum? two quick response plus spacevegan, i assume that's three vegans...i met only one vegan in my whole life.....which didn't drink any beer (he couldn't me tell why) but ate a whole bar of chocolate (i didn't stop him eating it but smiled inside) until he finished and i told him there was milk inside xD
I don't think anyone who's responded to you so far has been offended One mustn't be quick to assume negative tonality in a forum discussion where tone and body language are incapable of contributing to communication, though perhaps that is in part the responsibility of the poster, not the reader - thus I should have been clearer. Passion especially can be miscommunicated very easily as negativity. Personally, I'm impressed that the Dragon Age forums have yielded discussion this productive (albeit I'm simultaneous a little surprised I'm asking for vegan bodybuilding nutrition advice on the multiplayer segment of a fantasy video game forum 
)
As for your point, I agree. As far as I understand, technically a vegan could indeed have their own flock of well treated, well fed chickens, and eat the eggs they lay. No rooster, high calcium diet etc. The only rule I can see being bent there would be the purchase of the chickens in the first place, but I suppose there are ways to source more humane suppliers.
Thanks for your point of view!
i meant with "offended": "you don't like to word happy"...didn't meant any negative tonality in there...lack of face expression makes communication sometimes harder as it should be :=)
@SpaceV3gan
As a hobbyist weight lifter and fitness enthusiast, my largest area of difficulty regarding a vegan diet is protein intake. I shoot for about 160 to 180 grams of protein a day. Many sources of vegetarian protein, such as black beans, simply aren't very effective at building or retaining muscle mass. Other sources like nuts, peas and some grains are great for adding a little bit of protein to the daily intake, but are simply not practical enough (or in the case of nuts and grains, contain incomplete amino acid profiles) to consume protein en masse. I'm aware of tofu and vegan protein powders, but are there any other easy sources of vegan protein you may be aware of? Cheaper the better, but I'll take more expensive options if there aren't many of the former
I've never consumed that much protein in my life, not even when I was working out (oh, my life pre-DAMP, lol) so I would have troubles myself having that much protein with good variety in my diet.
Soy is certainly the cheapest and most widely available source of vegan protein. Also, it happens to be one of the most complete vegan proteins you can find. However, It is not uncommon to hear/read within the vegan community (as well as outside of it) that by having different sources of plant based proteins you can optimize the overall amino acid profile. For instance, beans alone do not give provide you with a complete protein source, but beans and rice complement each other. I am not an expert in nutrition though, I am just passing information that I've come across.
If I am not mistaken, Quinoa is a complete protein source, though it can be pretty expensive depending on where you live.
I've tried Pea protein power and Rice protein powder and both are great. A little pricey though, about the same price as high quality Whey.
Also, you can always add some Seitan on your diet. It is delicious and protein heavy, though it is considered borderline junk food, so probably you wouldn't want to have too much of it.
All male chicks, and all sick female chicks, are destroyed before they are 24 hours old.
For those who have no idea what this is like, I have a gif here to illustrate.
It can be VERY disturbing for some viewers, so I will put it inside a Spoiler tag.
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