Which is crap, because Xebenkeck is a true Desire Demon.
Also, there are several Desire Demon statues in the game. So I don't understand why they can't be enemies too.
I want to see how The Iron Bull would react to a Desire Demon. Would he be afraid of it, or attracted to it. And if attracted, what gender(s) would the Desire Demon be? And would he let one ride him? These are important questions.
Iron Bull: If I can stick it I hit it.
We'll get nudity, but I bet we never see another broodmother. Bioware seems far to hung up on not offending people... the pity is, if you can't include anything offensive, you can't tell a real story.
I feel your pain.
It's a mystery.. I don't know why they weren't featured in this game. But I sure as hell missed them.
Bsn already have its desire demon 
Yeah I was pretty excited for them, too. A shame we never got to see a real one in this game. I believe they mentioned thinking about making a female and a male version (I think that was in an interview, not sure though...), so I was really looking forward to the new designs and how they'd incorporate the decisions, that would make the demon appear as you liked them to be, in the game.
Wasted potential right there. 
Yeah I was pretty excited for them, too. A shame we never got to see a real one in this game. I believe they mentioned thinking about making a female and a male version (I think that was in an interview, not sure though...), so I was really looking forward to the new designs and how they'd incorporate the decisions, that would make the demon appear as you liked them to be, in the game.
Wasted potential right there.
The desire demons were one of my favorite things from Dragon Age Origins and Dragon Age 2. The have this very feminine sensuality to them.
they are clearly something that must be cutted from a politically correct game.
Of course; like how sloth demons were clearly cut because they were politically incorrect to lazy people and hunger demons were clearly cut because they were politically incorrect to people who eat a lot. Oh, and ash wraiths? Clearly cut because they were politically incorrect to dirty people.
If it was not because it was clearly a case of political correctness going mad, I would almost say that a possible explaination could be that despair, rage and fear would likely be more prevalent emotions when people's lives are thrown into chaos by elements that they have no control over and barely understand.
Nope, it is all down to politically correctness. Of course.
Of course; like how sloth demons were clearly cut because they were politically incorrect to lazy people and hunger demons were clearly cut because they were politically incorrect to people who eat a lot. Oh, and ash wraiths? Clearly cut because they were politically incorrect to dirty people.
If it was not because it was clearly a case of political correctness going mad, I would almost say that a possible explaination could be that despair, rage and fear would likely be more prevalent emotions when people's lives are thrown into chaos by elements that they have no control over and barely understand.
Nope, it is all down to politically correctness. Of course.
As soon as something involves sex it is "extra offensive". Hence why they got removed.
As soon as something involves sex it is "extra offensive". Hence why they got removed.
Except what they represent is not solely sexual despite the impression their demonic model might give to some: "Desire demons use the yearnings of the victims - lust, wealth, power - to their advantage.Their abilities to affect the mind allow them to assume disguises and even alter the enviroment to their purpose. (...) While Desire demons may resort to an outright mind control, they seem to take greater pleasure in more subtle deceit".
Desire is: "a sense of longing or hoping for a person, object or outcome" but the desire demon model places an emphasis on desire being sexual desire. I'd argue that while I love the design, it puts too much an emphasis on one aspect which is why I feel a better representation and portrayal of what a desire demon is, is shapeshifting.
As an example: take Kitty from Origins' "The Stone Prisoner" - While Kitty was the case of a desire demon trapped in a form, it was a form that worked far better to help her endear herself to Amalia because it was that of a cat who promised companionship and friendship. The desire demon could exploit her form to better assume a personality that Amalia would trust.
Mouse from the Mage Origin similarly worked well because of his form and assumed personality: He appeared harmless and tried to strike a connection with the player by posing as a victim of the Harrowing and a fellow mage. While he is implied to be a Pride Demon, his example still holds well in my opinion because even if his motive was not the same, his modus of operandi fitted with how Desire Demons' modus of operandi supposedly is. His manipulations were more or less subtle and when he tried to influence how the player thought of the Circle and its Templars, it came across as making mostly sense because of who he claimed to be. By the end of the Harrowing dream, he tries to use the trust he believes he has built with the player to possess them, trying to make them believe they were strong enough to ressist actual posession.
The current desire demon model is very overt and actually sells them short because it primarily emphasises one aspect and depending on who it is attempting to entice, a form that might fail in a lot of situations. It would make little sense for it to assume a form that would cause alert in it's intended victims by presenting itself as clearly something supernatural. A desire demon that employs shapeshifting would work far better: a child could tug at heartstrings, a coward could appear harmless, a witty person could befriend. Each role could be played to gain trust and work subtle manipulations with.
If by "hence why they got removed", you are referring to the cancelled plotline in which after "Champions of the Just", a demon impersonates Leliana in an attempt to seduce the Inquisitor and manipulate them, I should note that the demon in question was the Envy Demon, not a Desire Demon.
Desire demons have not been removed from the lore and not from Inquisition since, despite his insistance, Imshael is classified as a desire demon according to the Wikipedia albeit one who identifies itself differently. As a note, that fits with that it is ancient and: "purpotedly one of the first demons to come in contact with human Magi." I would also like to note that Imshael also does not turn into a despair, envy or sloth demon so it is not the desire demon that was solely left out.
In addition: Dorian makes mention of a desire demon who he met and refers to with male pronouns which supports the idea that desire demons likely model themselves in accordance to what their intended victim is most comfortable with. Secondly, If speculation is correct then there is a pair of large sculptures which both has the appearance of a desire demon.
They've also appeared nine times in the previous games: four times in Origins and Awakening as well as five times in II so I would consider it well enough to focus a bit more on other demons especially the newly introduced ones who fit better with the emotions that would be invoked from what is happening in Inquisition.
TL:DR - Despite my actual love of the design itself, I feel it actually wrongly represents what a desire demon is suppose to be the manifestation of by associating it primarily with the definition of sexual desire and not the definition of desire. I also disagree with the notion that desire demons were removed from the game so I decided to write a smaller essay explaining why.
As a note: I should have worded my previous post a bit more politely.
Which is crap, because Xebenkeck is a true Desire Demon.
We'll get nudity, but I bet we never see another broodmother. Bioware seems far to hung up on not offending people... the pity is, if you can't include anything offensive, you can't tell a real story.
We'll get nudity, but I bet we never see another broodmother. Bioware seems far to hung up on not offending people... the pity is, if you can't include anything offensive, you can't tell a real story.
Because broodmothers are clearly offensive to... who exactly?
Also define what you consider a "real story" and "offensive" if you would so kindly, since I've seen examples that in my opinion lends credence to the idea that a work, be it in literature or other medias, does not need to include possibly offensive material to create a good story.
Because broodmothers are clearly offensive to... who exactly?
Also define what you consider a "real story" and "offensive" if you would so kindly, since I've seen examples that in my opinion lends credence to the idea that a work, be it in literature or other medias, does not need to include possibly offensive material to create a good story.
99% games involve killing and you personally doing it, so you wrong, you can't make good story without some conflict. Some people go crazy just by seeing nipple I don't even talking about full naked body or penis. I am curies how people feel who actually experience event there someone was killed, can people even play games at all?
Political correctness according to some sources:
"In a practical sense, political correctness involves choosing language which the user believes show empathy with people of different races, genders, physical abilities, ethnic group, sexual orientation, religious belief, and ideological worldview, among other Things. The Speaker attempts to use language percieved to be non-pejorative.
Opponents of such language apply the terms politically correct, political correctness, and PC as pejorative objections to what they see as over-sensitivity at the expense of common sense and practicality." - (Political correctness - Wikipedia)
"1. Not politically correct; considered to be disrespectful to a particular group of people.
The word "Frog" is a politically incorrect term for a French person." - (politically incorrect - Wiktionary)
"1. Not politically correct; potentially offensive to a particular group of people:
politically incorrect jokes" - (Politically incorrect - Dictionary.com)
Examples of politically correct language would include; The use of "Mental Illness" in the place of "Crazy", "Homosexual" or "Gay" in place of "Fairy" or "F*g", actual ethnicity or "person of color" in the case of unknown ethnicity in the place of "******" or "Pieface" and "Mental Illness" or the actual term of the mental condition in question in the place of "Retard", "Mongol" or "Idiot".
The application of politically correctness is, to my understanding, primarily geared towards language and dismantling damaging as well as false terms. It has, however, been adopted by some as a way of advocating censorship as well as a way of protesting censorship especially in regards to content and freedom of speech.
Desire demons have always been the demon version of cannon fodder. Now Sloth, that is a real demon =). Anyway, Imshael in Emprise is a desire demon.
.
Oh yeah, well...
Imshael is really sexy. Exactly the kind of desire demon that could seduce me any time... 
I don't disagree necessarily with you shechinah, I would just like to say that I feel murder is a lot more offensive and should be more offensive than nakedness in a video game. I think the industry in general is behind on the times when it comes to what is acceptable in a video game and isn't or what's offensive and isn't offensive.
I agree that a game doesn't require offensive material to be good, still.
It isn't really the industry itself though, it's the "fans" (or a vocal minority of them) that lose their **** every time we see a female nipple or a lot of cleavage. The devs seem to be perfectly comfortable with including that kind of content, if they think there's a place for it in the story or art style. It's the vocal minority of the fanbase that are offended by sexualised or sexy women in games.
Oh and if you've been keeping up with Sarkeesian or McIntosh's twitter feeds over E3 then you'll know that violence is the next great evil to be purged from gaming. Claiming that there's something "mentally wrong" with gamers cheering for something as hyper violent as the new DOOM trailer. They really are the new Jack Thompson.
Remember folks "We're not trying to take your games away."
1. 99% games involve killing and you personally doing it, so you wrong, you can't make good story without some conflict. 2. Some people go crazy just by seeing nipple I don't even talking about full naked body or penis. 3. I am curies how people feel who actually experience event there someone was killed, can people even play games at all?
1. Saphiron123 specifically said; "the pity is, if you can't include anything offensive, you can't tell a real story". Their wording gave me the impression they were not referring solely to Bioware in this regard and meant it as an application to stories in general. Saphiron123 also did not say conflict, they said offense. Conflict is an important part of a story and it takes a great of skill to create a story in which it is absent but offense I would not consider a necessary part of a story.
2. There is still a a lot of nudity in the game and there are examples of bodies far more exposed than a desire demon which is why I disagree with the argument that their sensuality and nudity was why their model did not appear.
3. I believe, it usually it depends on the circumstances of what happened since the trigger might not be that a person died but how they died. If say, a person's parent or friend is killed by someone who was let in through the door after ringing the doorbell or knocking, a trigger might be whenever someone knocks or rings the doorbell. That's one example, of course. I think a better answer would be researching a bit about triggers since my explainations is likely lacking.
Whenever I recommend someone playing Dragon Age: Origins, I always take care to note what happens in some of the Origins since I know it can be triggering to some especially the City Elf Origin even if what happens does not ultimately happen to the player.
It isn't really the industry itself though, it's the "fans" (or a vocal minority of them) that lose their **** every time we see a female nipple or a lot of cleavage. The devs seem to be perfectly comfortable with including that kind of content, if they think there's a place for it in the story or art style. It's the vocal minority of the fanbase that are offended by sexualised or sexy women in games.
Oh and if you've been keeping up with Sarkeesian or McIntosh's twitter feeds over E3 then you'll know that violence is the next great evil to be purged from gaming. Claiming that there's something "mentally wrong" with gamers cheering for something as hyper violent as the new DOOM trailer. They really are the new Jack Thompson.
Remember folks "We're not trying to take your games away."
"We just want to change it so it would be nothing what you liked" Oh an funny part mostly people who complain don't even like video games at all. Sarkeesian just very good con artist/professional victim.
It isn't really the industry itself though, it's the "fans" (or a vocal minority of them) that lose their **** every time we see a female nipple or a lot of cleavage. The devs seem to be perfectly comfortable with including that kind of content, if they think there's a place for it in the story or art style. It's the vocal minority of the fanbase that are offended by sexualised or sexy women in games.
Oh and if you've been keeping up with Sarkeesian or McIntosh's twitter feeds over E3 then you'll know that violence is the next great evil to be purged from gaming. Claiming that there's something "mentally wrong" with gamers cheering for something as hyper violent as the new DOOM trailer. They really are the new Jack Thompson.
Remember folks "We're not trying to take your games away."
My friend jokes about that on mumble. "But they don't want to take your games.." What will I have left then if violence were banned from games? That slippery slope is scary considering they are actually getting laws changed in the UK which may or may not affect sales of games with the controversial subjects. Sad times are ahead.
Well, strictly speaking they aren't trying to take your games away, they're just trying to remove anything that people find remotely fun about playing them. It's hilarious to me that they consider themselves to be progressives when they have more in common with the puritans than any other group. Instead of everything being a sin, everything is "offensive" or "triggering." Very progressive indeed.
I'm a liberal but these people have gone so far left that they've come out on the right again.
It isn't really the industry itself though, it's the "fans" (or a vocal minority of them) that lose their **** every time we see a female nipple or a lot of cleavage. The devs seem to be perfectly comfortable with including that kind of content, if they think there's a place for it in the story or art style. It's the vocal minority of the fanbase that are offended by sexualised or sexy women in games.
Oh and if you've been keeping up with Sarkeesian or McIntosh's twitter feeds over E3 then you'll know that violence is the next great evil to be purged from gaming. Claiming that there's something "mentally wrong" with gamers cheering for something as hyper violent as the new DOOM trailer. They really are the new Jack Thompson.
Remember folks "We're not trying to take your games away."
Ah yes, I remember the good ol' "video games makes people better at murder". I also remember how playing Tekken and Mortal Kombat did not turn me into a person capable of performing martial arts nor did it give me a liking of seeing real life people beat bloody or having their bodies crushed in various and very creative ways.
Ah yes, I remember the good ol' "video games makes people better at murder". I also remember how playing Tekken and Mortal Kombat did not turn me into a person capable of performing martial arts nor did it give me a liking of seeing real life people beat bloody or having their bodies crushed in various and very creative ways.
What do Mortal Kombat and Prince's Purple Rain have in common? A parent saw the game/listened to the album and tried to censor it. Without Purple Rain, and without Tipper Gore freaking out, we wouldn't have ended up with the Parental Advisory stickers. That was a compromise to make sure that music couldn't be censored by a few knee-jerk politicians. The ESRB rating system came about after some folks tried to ban MK.
This is my only comments about Ms. Sarkessian: She doesn't have as much power as people like to think. Also, I don't take her that seriously. She recently spoke out against Doom 4 for glorying violence against others. That awesome bit of footage showing the PC slicing up a demon with chainsaw at E3 and she got angry about that.. Yeah. 
In a game where your goal is to fight back demons from Hell on Mars, she thinks it's promoting violence. Whenever I hear someone claim that Anita and "her ilk" have this much power in games, that is not true. That's what radical feminists like Anita want. Even human on demon violence is bad.
Oh and trust me, I was quick to point out that she was awful quiet when MKX was coming out. My husband chuckled when he sent me the article, because he knew that it was gonna tick me off. There are different branches of feminism and we are not all like that at all. I really dislike radical feminists as a group. They might be nice individually, but as a group.....er....I don't like the way they go about things. That's a nicely delicate way to put it.
Look, as I stated before, people are giving radical feminists far more credit then they deserve. It's completely ridiculous and utterly paranoid. As was pointed out, there is a Desire Demon statue in the Fade. Radical feminists would not stop at just that. They would have gotten rid of all nudity, including toplessness, and Iron Bull certainly would not have been a romance. The violence and blood (which there certainly is some) would have gone away. Leliana being tortured in the Bad Future? That would have never happened if the cries of "Feminists like Anita ruined everything" were true.
So, there is one demon type that didn't make it in. In a game with a lot of violence and mild nudity. t's not the end of the world, and not the end of the end of their inclusion. If anyone thinks that means that the Sliced Juicy Watermelons have won, then they need to look into what Anita has actually said that she wants. Then realize that the Sliced Juicy Watermelons of the world haven't "won" anything.
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