304 réponses à ce sujet

[Iakus]

Given how far out of the loop the Asari Councilor was regarding the archive, this project might have been started when the reapers first invaded, or maybe this was a Plan B they were working on in secret since the Battle of the Citadel.

 

Okay, the reapers are here. Thessia is lost. The Catalyst is lost.

 

"I never thought this day would come."

 

The major civilizations get a call - "Choose 30,000 to pack up and go into cryo."

Given the enormity of this project, one year or three years really don't make a lot of difference, ridiculousness-wise.

 

I mena, how long does it take to build a single dreadnought?  Now make a dozen.  And in that same period of time, develop an ftl-drive out of space-Cthulhu's corpse (without getting indoctrinated) and secretly move a few hundred thousand people into stasis. 

 

Three years?  Bah, it's only a matter of resources!  Just make sure the helmet keeps the brain intact! 

[They call me a SpaceCowboy]

Given the enormity of this project, one year or three years really don't make a lot of difference, ridiculousness-wise.

 

I mena, how long does it take to build a single dreadnought?  Now make a dozen.  And in that same period of time, develop an ftl-drive out of space-Cthulhu's corpse (without getting indoctrinated) and secretly move a few hundred thousand people into stasis. 

 

Three years?  Bah, it's only a matter of resources!  Just make sure the helmet keeps the brain intact! 

 

 

You know it's going to be an a$$-pull. It's got to be. Why stress over it? I'm more curious how they are going to get around the fact that they've established that an AI will always rise up and destroy all organic life in this universe. Andromeda should be devoid of life, fully controlled by skynet, since there were no reapers to 'save' them.

[Malanek]

You know it's going to be an a$$-pull. It's got to be. Why stress over it? I'm more curious how they are going to get around the fact that they've established that an AI will always rise up and destroy all organic life in this universe. Andromeda should be devoid of life, fully controlled by skynet, since there were no reapers to 'save' them.

They haven't established that. It was just a single case.

[Iakus]

They haven't established that. It was just a single case.

But the Catalyst said so!  It must be true!  

[They call me a SpaceCowboy]

But the Catalyst said so!  It must be true!  

 

What? You mean we spent billions of years slaughtering and tormenting various races for nothing? We were wrong about AI's killing off organics? oops, muh bad.

[leaguer of one]

There would be no way that such a project can be kept secret for long given the logistics of it, the shadow broker, STG and cerberus would learn of its existence eventually. It also raises the question of why the council took the defeatist approach and decided to flee the galaxy instead of trying to find a way to stop the reapers especially with something like the prothean beacon containing information of the crucible.

1. STG could be in on it.

2.The old Sw was killed off and the new one barely scratched the surface of the old ones info.

3. And Cerberus is not as wide spread as you think. They can only know as much as the alliance would know.

[Drone223]

1. STG could be in on it.

The STG has to answer to the council which can be all human and have Anderson on it, not to mention there are people sympathetic to Shepard's cause such as Jondum Bau.
 

 

2.The old Sw was killed off and the new one barely scratched the surface of the old ones info.

 

Liara can easily access such information with glyph and the SB would also keep track of what sort of information he sold.

 

3. And Cerberus is not as wide spread as you think. They can only know as much as the alliance would know.

 

They managed to learn of the beacon on Thessia and the female krogan on Sur'Kesh I'd say they can easily find the ark project.

[Pasquale1234]

Is the Geth VI on friendly terms with EDI? I know he doesn't trust organics very much, so wouldn't share it directly with us.

He doesn't trust Xen, with good reason. She wanted to dismantle him.

He was quite friendly with Shepard and most of the rest of the crew.

[AresKeith]

He doesn't trust Xen, with good reason. She wanted to dismantle him.

He was quite friendly with Shepard and most of the rest of the crew.

 

Yea, he was basically a Legion clone which I really disliked in ME3

[Computron2000]

Given the enormity of this project, one year or three years really don't make a lot of difference, ridiculousness-wise.

 

I mena, how long does it take to build a single dreadnought?  Now make a dozen.  And in that same period of time, develop an ftl-drive out of space-Cthulhu's corpse (without getting indoctrinated) and secretly move a few hundred thousand people into stasis. 

 

Three years?  Bah, it's only a matter of resources!  Just make sure the helmet keeps the brain intact! 

 

Assuming this happens during the war, if you chose to start from scratch, then yes, building dreadnoughts for an ark project while also trying to fill in casulaties from the war front would deplete your resources quickly.

 

If however, you had poor quality ships built for long term life in space already in place, such as the quarian lifeships, then replacing and upgrading systems for those ships (perhaps also interlinking them together into one giant structure) will be much less time and resource consuming. An alternate solution lies in the geth catapelliar ships which are basically empty and given they are made by geth, are likely designed to be manufactured quickly and efficiently. A poorer solution would be to salvage hulks of ships cut in half or with major portions intact and cobble them together. It'll save time but look like crap

 

The main problem lorewise is what if a player chose to let the quarians and geth burn in ME3 which reduces the available ships to a small number.

[Computron2000]

There would be no way that such a project can be kept secret for long given the logistics of it, the shadow broker, STG and cerberus would learn of its existence eventually. It also raises the question of why the council took the defeatist approach and decided to flee the galaxy instead of trying to find a way to stop the reapers especially with something like the prothean beacon containing information of the crucible.

 

When you make plans and contingencies, its never a Plan A or Plan B. Its always Plan A and Plan B so the council's decision would actually be rational.

 

The problem with the crucible was that no one knew what it really did. It was just known to give out a lot of energy with a hope that it could be directed like a weapon towards the reapers. As for the covert groups, none of them (except cerberus) would have any incentive to block it, same like the crucible. Ceberus was running into internal problems and their cell structure was not conducive for communication through the ranks. Add to the problem of priority where in terms of importance for cerberus, controlling the reapers trumps a project thats about escaping the galaxy, the ark project could simply be ignored as a low level priority

[SubjectZer0]

That would be a really cool tie-in IMO. If the Ark theory is correct, I'd actually love to start the game on the Ark when it reaches Andromeda. The reveal could be really cool way to introduce the new galaxy / cluster we're about to conquer colonize inhabit.

Yes yes yes! If that is the ark in that pic then it's huge and I think it would be a great place to start the game

[SubjectZer0]

Anyone else think Andromeda will take place in the year 2000 or so AS (after Shepard)?  
 
And that civilization, technology, humans etc. will already be long established in the Andromeda galaxy by the time the game starts?  That's my hunch.

Honestly I really really hope not. I like the idea of exploring a completely brand new unexplored galaxy a lot more!

[Drone223]

When you make plans and contingencies, its never a Plan A or Plan B. Its always Plan A and Plan B so the council's decision would actually be rational.

 

The problem with the crucible was that no one knew what it really did. It was just known to give out a lot of energy with a hope that it could be directed like a weapon towards the reapers.

Except there won't a plan A and B its just build an ark an flee the galaxy and make no attempt during those two years to find something to stop the reaper's. The ark project will just be built upon defeatism.

 

 

As for the covert groups, none of them (except cerberus) would have any incentive to block it, same like the crucible. Ceberus was running into internal problems and their cell structure was not conducive for communication through the ranks. Add to the problem of priority where in terms of importance for cerberus, controlling the reapers trumps a project thats about escaping the galaxy, the ark project could simply be ignored as a low level priority

 

I'd hardly call infiltrating an ark ship that's going to travel to another galaxy a low priority for cerberus. They would want to spread their influence as much as possible.

[Ahriman]

Given the enormity of this project, one year or three years really don't make a lot of difference, ridiculousness-wise.

 

I mena, how long does it take to build a single dreadnought?  Now make a dozen. 

Whoa, hold on there. Why not hundred then? Collector cruiser had million of stasis pods.

Alliance, having weakest economy among council races, managed to build two at the moment of ME3. I see no problem with asari building few dreadnought+ ark ships.

BTW Speaking of Council denial. Just played Citadel and saw that nice record of geth attack. Geth dreadnought is merely an official version, Spectre access shows that Sovy was classified as Reaper.

 

I'd hardly call infiltrating an ark ship that's going to travel to another galaxy a low priority for cerberus. They would want to spread their influence as much as possible.

Ok, TIM is evil Mary Sue which knows and has everything, that's a fact. But infiltrating crew which is gathered by asari is problematic at least.

[Drone223]

Ok, TIM is evil Mary Sue which knows and has everything, that's a fact. But infiltrating crew which is gathered by asari is problematic at least.

They managed to learn of the female krogan on Sur'Kesh from some one inside the STG so I wouldn't say infiltrating such a group isn't out of the question.

[Ahriman]

They managed to learn of the female krogan on Sur'Kesh from some one inside the STG so I wouldn't say infiltrating such a group isn't out of the question.

Such project will have indoctrination detection, so recent Cerberus employees will never make it, while old are either run away or just insane. Still all my arguments against Cerberus are pretty much pointless, since the only thing which can't be infiltrated by Cerberus is common sense.

[Computron2000]

Except there won't a plan A and B its just build an ark an flee the galaxy and make no attempt during those two years to find something to stop the reaper's. The ark project will just be built upon defeatism.

 

I'd hardly call infiltrating an ark ship that's going to travel to another galaxy a low priority for cerberus. They would want to spread their influence as much as possible.

 

The crucible was plan A but it was never a solid plan A when you didn't know what it was and whether it would actually work. The ark would probably be a contingency plan activated when it seemed like defeat was likely

 

As for infiltrating an ark ship, sure, they could try and push a few people into the project (to keep track of progress if nothing else) but there would be minimal attempts to stop the project, not when their resources were mainly towards controlling the reapers. By the end of ME3, the ark would be a non priority with a reaper controlled illusive man and the crucible being the main threat.

[Drone223]

Such project will have indoctrination detection, so recent Cerberus employees will never make it, while old are either run away or just insane. Still all my arguments against Cerberus are pretty much pointless, since the only thing which can't be infiltrated by Cerberus is common sense.

Not every operative in cerberus is indoctrinated, they also make use of sleeper agents and finding one operative out thousands of people is easier said than done so it'll quite easy for them to remain undetected.

 

The crucible was plan A but it was never a solid plan A when you didn't know what it was and whether it would actually work. The ark would probably be a contingency plan activated when it seemed like defeat was likely

 

Did you read my comment, they built the ark without even trying to find a way to stop the reapers it was never going to be a contingency plan they were going to flee as soon as the reapers arrive and not bother with saving the galaxy.

 

 

As for infiltrating an ark ship, sure, they could try and push a few people into the project (to keep track of progress if nothing else) but there would be minimal attempts to stop the project, not when their resources were mainly towards controlling the reapers. By the end of ME3, the ark would be a non priority with a reaper controlled illusive man and the crucible being the main threat.

 

Who said anything about stopping it, its about having taking advantage of every possible opportunity to further his agenda which includes ensuring the survival of the organizations ideals and acquiring new tech etc.

[Computron2000]

Did you read my comment, they built the ark without even trying to find a way to stop the reapers it was never going to be a contingency plan they were going to flee as soon as the reapers arrive and not bother with saving the galaxy.

 

 

Who said anything about stopping it, its about having taking advantage of every possible opportunity to further his agenda which includes ensuring the survival of the organizations ideals and acquiring new tech etc.

 

Unless there is some official word on the ME4's scenerio, you're assuming that the ark was started during ME2. It is more likely that the ark project was either

a) something else altogether (eg. an experimental craft testing new FTL tech) and repurposed during the reaper war

b ) cobbled together after the reapers attacked (similar to how the rather massive crucible was built)

 

The reason being simply that the council's position was that reapers were fake. Much like how garrus' constant pleas were handled, a token force was probably assigned to projects like these until the reapers started their invasion

 

As for cerberus, whether they want to further their agenda is rather irrelevant. If the ark is supposed to be a last chance for species survival, as long as its not stopped, no one cares whether the STG, spectres, cerberus, etc get new tech from it. Think about it. The ark is the last chance for survival. That means the STG, spectres, cerberus as organizations are ALL expected to be dead during its launch. You would at best get a handful of agents from the various covert organizations simply because there is no room.

 

Add to the fact that during the reaper war, new tech was coming out of everyone's noses (scorpion, hovertanks, dlc armor, protean weapons, etc). Any new tech an ark project could supply would not matter much and by its purpose, new tech is not a major priority but rather how many people you cram in with a good chance to survive.

 

As for survival of cerberus' ideals, think about if you're huddled in a small room while shells and bombs are going off around you. Do you seriously care if the person next to you believes that dogs will rule the earth or that vegetables are sentient (or some other wierd idea)? If the scenerio is truly a council project to ensure species survival, everyone onboard that ship will work together because its simply in everyone's best interest.

[Iakus]

Assuming this happens during the war, if you chose to start from scratch, then yes, building dreadnoughts for an ark project while also trying to fill in casulaties from the war front would deplete your resources quickly.

 

If however, you had poor quality ships built for long term life in space already in place, such as the quarian lifeships, then replacing and upgrading systems for those ships (perhaps also interlinking them together into one giant structure) will be much less time and resource consuming. An alternate solution lies in the geth catapelliar ships which are basically empty and given they are made by geth, are likely designed to be manufactured quickly and efficiently. A poorer solution would be to salvage hulks of ships cut in half or with major portions intact and cobble them together. It'll save time but look like crap

 

The main problem lorewise is what if a player chose to let the quarians and geth burn in ME3 which reduces the available ships to a small number.

You're still talking about a dozen or more massive ships, with enormous power requirements (keeping thousands if not tens of thousands of passengers in stasis for centuries) as well as engines which even as of ME3, violate known physical lows of the Mass Effect universe.  plus fuel requirements to zip around Andromeda until a planet suitable for colonization (and isn't occupied) can be found.  Actually two worlds, assuming dextros are coming along.

 

Hulls are the easy part, though still likely time-consuming.  It's the internal systems that make this implausible to say the least.

[shepskisaac]

Anyone else think Andromeda will take place in the year 2000 or so AS (after Shepard)?  

 

And that civilization, technology, humans etc. will already be long established in the Andromeda galaxy by the time the game starts?  That's my hunch. 

I'm expecting we may be playing first new-generation born in the Andromeda but 1000+ years after arrival? I doubt it, the tech looks way too similar to what we've seen in ME3

[Beerfish]

Still ridiculous. 

Not in the slightest, more like still a logical plan of action.

[Pasquale1234]

Yea, he was basically a Legion clone which I really disliked in ME3

 

The series accumulated replacements for characters who might have perished throughout.  It was pretty annoying, but the alternatives were also... problematic.
 

[Han Shot First]

Not in the slightest, more like still a logical plan of action.

 

Indeed, it would incredibly stupid for the galaxy to place all their bets on the Crucible. Hope for the best, plan for the worst.

 

The galaxy should have some plan to preserve life in the event that the Reaper War cannot be won. There are really only two ways of going about that. The first is to go the Prothean or Leviathan route and try to hide within the Milky Way. The other is to attempt to send life outside the Milky Way to colonize new planets, far from where the Reapers are known to operate.

 

Of the two plans the latter is far smarter. With Andromeda at least there is the possibility that the Reapers have never ventured there, while the Reapers are known to revisit the Milky Way roughly every 50,000 years.

 

In Exile, on 22 Jun 2015 - 4:14 PM, said:
"Reverse engineering" in science-fiction is typically space magic. It works at the speed of the plot, and trying to come up with a semi-coherent justification for what will get the Council races from A to B (if that's the way Bioware chooses to go) is a lost cause. IRL, even reverse engineering what (by sci-fi standards) amounts to effectively completely known technology that just involves a few technical innovations can take months, depending on the complexity. The example here, again, is Damascus Steel.

 

I'm not too concerned about how the Milky Way colonists get to Andromeda. Bioware has a couple routes they could go, all of which would not affect my ability to suspend disbelief in the least. Reverse engineering Reaper technology, zig-zagging between rogue star systems, jumping through a wormhole or previously dormant Mass Effect relay are all no more far-fetched than element zero, mass effect physics, the Lazarus Project, biotics, Reaper indoctrination, husks and other Reaper creatures, or humans mastering FTL travel after reverse engineering 50,000 year old alien technology left on the surface of Mars.

 

It does however seem to be an issue for some of the fans here, and solely because they don't like the game being set in Andromeda. Its not so much about 'this doesn't make sense,' since they had no problem suspending disbelief for equal or greater examples of space magic, as it is an example of 'I don't want this to be true so I'm going to try to find reasons why it can't be true.' It is a manifestation of denial, basically.

 

It is going to be long two years for some of them, because Ark Theory is probably happening.