720 réponses à ce sujet

[They call me a SpaceCowboy]

Missed that,the rest of it is still incorrect quible though, of things I never even said - one of which I even adressed in a post earlier talking about Japanese citizens calling non-asian/mixed race people "foreign".

 

 

I seem to fail to understand your point. If your point is white people go through bullshit too; I know. It's a snowball effect.

 

If your point is "We tried to say sorry but they still hate us!" good on you for apologizing, but again, I know. Go to tumblr. The pendulum is swinging, once all you've done all you can do is wait untill it settles in the middle. I'm expecting this will happen once the anger over previous racism has died down. Considering some countries are still struggling with racism, this could take a while.

 

Your response to me: I don't know what you mean by 'addressed it'. I don't usually follow every other conversation I'm not part of.

 

Your response to Zazzerka:

 

What do you mean snowball effect? As in 'what goes around comes around'? This seems to suggest "White people started it!!!". This attitude is simply wrong. If this isnt what you were saying then fine, feel free to disregard that.

 

I have never been racist to anyone in my life. I suspect same with Zazzerka. If someone is racist to me, I don't expect anyone should tell me I should suck it up because 'you guys started it'. I'm not responsible for some other jerk treating you badly just because I share some superficial characteristics.

 

Yes, I know 'you didn't say that', but it's implied every time a topic like this comes up on the internet. Somehow every 'white male' is to blame by proxy for all the bad crap that has ever happened in the world.

 

Like that Turian said on the ME2 citadel, "you humans are all racist". Many are, regardless of where our grandparents were born. Sadly it's in our nature, as a species. Maybe some day we will all get over it and get along with each other, but to suggest that one group 'started it' or is somehow worse than all the others is absurd.

[They call me a SpaceCowboy]

Yes. It's sort of a manner of speaking, but mostly appears as a general sort of voice. Kind of hard to explain, but it's pretty recognizable. It's a regional/cultural thing, just like the New York accent, Boston accent, Mid-Atlantic accent, Texas accent, Southern accents, and so on.

 

 

Alright. Hmm, I don't think it's however sth that needs new english voice for protagonist. Regular american/british accent should be enough no matter what race protagonist is in my opinion, otherwise there just would be so much accents it wouldn't make sense.

 

 

I noticed it in Oblivion. Every Redguard (read black Nirnian) has the same accent (because its the same actor, lol). That's what the stereotypical 'black American' accent sounds like. Of course, some groups of white americans may sound like that too. *shrug*

[Woodstock504]

I feel the same way about that.  I mean we had Jacob in ME2 but could not recreate his skin tone or his low-cut wavy hair style, though we had something similar it just didn't hit home. Not to mention how difficult it is to get the Afro- and Asian facial attributes.  If I remember correctly, some lore mentioned that most humans of the time are mixed which makes complete since. then we got Jacob as a squad member. but our protagonist/hero could not be one of true color or Asian origins. imo If you're going to have customization, do it all the way or don't do it at all. We are all human and none of us deserve to be left out.  my characters were all funny looking one way or another. Its just boring and selfish to be restricted to the same attributes for every game. Lets be real.

 

[They call me a SpaceCowboy]

I feel the same way about that.  I mean we had Jacob in ME2 but could not recreate his skin tone or his low-cut wavy hair style, though we had something similar it just didn't hit home. Not to mention how difficult it is to get the Afro- and Asian facial attributes.  If I remember correctly, some lore mentioned that most humans of the time are mixed which makes complete since. then we got Jacob as a squad member. but our protagonist/hero could not be one of true color or Asian origins. imo If you're going to have customization, do it all the way or don't do it at all. We are all human and none of us deserve to be left out.  my characters were all funny looking one way or another. Its just boring and selfish to be restricted to the same attributes for every game. Lets be real.

 

 

Yeah Bioware isn't exactly known for its consistency in cases like this.

[Indigenous]

Vivienne had a good reason for not mentioning her parents too. She was from the circle, where you are forced to forget your family ties. I'm still not sure where you are going with that.

 

Sorry for the other comment, it was more a general comment made in response to other conversations in the thread.

"I don't think its realistic to believe Bioware - a mostly white male company - will go that extra mile to appeal to different groups. Remember Vivienne? Ever wondered why her parents were not brought up in conversation or why she was bald?"

 

Is it not obvious what my point was? Vivienne's backstory was not given as much attention as all the other companions in Inquisition. She was not a well written character and this might be the reason why.

 

I am really surprise people go to war before they admit they have no clue what they are talking about. Next time more questions less statements and I will try my best to help you.

 

Mention it then. Because Sera and Bull definitely don't say anything about their families. 

Cassandra barely mentions hers, and Varric talks a bit about his family, but in DA2. 

 

Only Dorian's family is directly brought into the game.

Also, where are you going with this?

I am sorry but you could easily search in google and find the answers. Apart from simply talking to them of course.

 

Where am I going with this? How can you respond to me in such a combative manner and then ask me what I mean? I'm sorry but that is simply ridiculous. (Google is your friend.)

 

By the way, where were you going with that? The information is easily verifiable.

[Natureguy85]

Yes. It's sort of a manner of speaking, but mostly appears as a general sort of voice. Kind of hard to explain, but it's pretty recognizable. It's a regional/cultural thing, just like the New York accent, Boston accent, Mid-Atlantic accent, Texas accent, Southern accents, and so on.

 

I know exactly what you mean. I like picking it up when I hear people call in to radio shows. It makes sense if you think about it. If ethnic groups share certain physical attributes, it is reasonable that this would include vocal cords.

 

I seem to fail to understand your point. If your point is white people go through bullshit too; I know. It's a snowball effect.

 

If your point is "We tried to say sorry but they still hate us!" good on you for apologizing, but again, I know. Go to tumblr. The pendulum is swinging, once all you've done all you can do is wait untill it settles in the middle. I'm expecting this will happen once the anger over previous racism has died down. Considering some countries are still struggling with racism, this could take a while.

 

I can't speak to other countries, but here in the USA it will never die because certain people benefit too much from the strife. It's profitable to be a constant victim. It's also beneficial to certain people to divide a nation into groups and keep them at each other's throats. So they keep picking at scabs and fanning flames. Also, there is no such thing as "enough" because once you give a little, they know they can get more. It's the "if you give a mouse a cookie" idea.

[Toasted Llama]

Your response to me: I don't know what you mean by 'addressed it'. I don't usually follow every other conversation I'm not part of.

 

Your response to Zazzerka:

 

What do you mean snowball effect? As in 'what goes around comes around'? This seems to suggest "White people started it!!!". This attitude is simply wrong. If this isnt what you were saying then fine, feel free to disregard that.

 

I have never been racist to anyone in my life. I suspect same with Zazzerka. If someone is racist to me, I don't expect anyone should tell me I should suck it up because 'you guys started it'. I'm not responsible for some other jerk treating you badly just because I share some superficial characteristics.

 

Yes, I know 'you didn't say that', but it's implied every time a topic like this comes up on the internet. Somehow every 'white male' is to blame by proxy for all the bad crap that has ever happened in the world.

 

Like that Turian said on the ME2 citadel, "you humans are all racist". Many are, regardless of where our grandparents were born. Sadly it's in our nature, as a species. Maybe some day we will all get over it and get along with each other, but to suggest that one group 'started it' or is somehow worse than all the others is absurd.

 

I adressed it as in; someone else brought up the same point - that not just white people do it and I pointed out that it also happens in Japan (and Africa, and Latin-America and <every other continent/race goes here>)

 

 

And I mean the snowball effect as in people keep throwing insults back and forth because every insult against them is ammo. "You insulted me so that gives me a right to insult you back!" is the logic on both sides. You know, the kindergarten-level behaviour stuff. An eye for an eye... And at one point people will fall down to the good old "people of demographic x have cooties and are icky" and then proceed to be toxic and hostile to everyone because a few of them are bad apples. Which is basically what is happening right now and why everyone is so angry about everything.

 

I don't know who started it and I won't go point fingers, but nobody deserves to get caught into this mess.

 

Either way I'm strongly against toxic behaviour, I'd rather everyone forgive and forget and move on but alas. I doubt that happens anytime soon.

 

 

I can't speak to other countries, but here in the USA it will never die because certain people benefit too much from the strife. It's profitable to be a constant victim. It's also beneficial to certain people to divide a nation into groups and keep them at each other's throats. So they keep picking at scabs and fanning flames. Also, there is no such thing as "enough" because once you give a little, they know they can get more. It's the "if you give a mouse a cookie" idea.

 

Things were getting better in my country untill ISIS happened, refugees started to overflow the country and we had our own case of "cop kills person of colour" followed by riots. Right now I'm glad I barely read the news anymore.

 

Somewhere it's hilarious that despite all the achievements humanity has done like the moon landing, quitting to argue and fight like little children over petty things like melanin seems to be the impossible.

 

Still, we have improved over the years so I still have hope. Somewhere.

[FaWa]

I liked Mass Effect 2's strategy of putting a cloak over Kasumi's eyes so that no one would realize 

[Dunmer of Redoran]

I know exactly what you mean. I like picking it up when I hear people call in to radio shows. It makes sense if you think about it. If ethnic groups share certain physical attributes, it is reasonable that this would include vocal cords.

It's not a genetic thing, just a cultural thing, like the regional accents I mentioned. It depends upon where you live and who raised you, who you're around, etc. rather than ancestry. But since we get it in Mass Effect, I don't see why it wouldn't fit in with Andromeda.

[Heimdall]

It's not a genetic thing, just a cultural thing, like the regional accents I mentioned. It depends upon where you live and who raised you, who you're around, etc. rather than ancestry. But since we get it in Mass Effect, I don't see why it wouldn't fit in with Andromeda.

From what my linguistics professor told me, accents and speech mannerisms are typically picked up from peers growing up, not parents.

Just FYI

[Statichands]

I'm curious, what made you make this thread? It's easy to make non white characters in the Mass Effect Trilogy. I mainly play as default femshep though because she's a bad ass. 

[Dunmer of Redoran]

From what my linguistics professor told me, accents and speech mannerisms are typically picked up from peers growing up, not parents.

Just FYI

 

Doesn't surprise me at all. It's all about culture.

[Natureguy85]

It's not a genetic thing, just a cultural thing, like the regional accents I mentioned. It depends upon where you live and who raised you, who you're around, etc. rather than ancestry. But since we get it in Mass Effect, I don't see why it wouldn't fit in with Andromeda.

 

Then we're talking about different things then. While what you're talking about is true, there is a way the voice sounds, not how the words are pronounced, that I identify with black people.

[DuskWanderer]

I think the problem is that white is always a default, why game developers don't mix it up sometimes?

Because the character is going to change it anyway? If this is the sort of things that offends SJW's, it's little wonder they aren't taken seriously. 

[Evamitchelle]

I'm going to go with "because they are expecting the vast majority of their players to be white". I'm not agreeing with the reasoning, but I suspect that's what it is.

 

I also suspect games made in Japan for Japanese audiences have Japanese protagonists.

 

Bioware did try to 'mix it up' on gender selection for DAI. It came off as awkward to me though. Female is the default option, but it is also the second option when reading the radio buttons from left to right. Why not make female the first option then?

 

It would be like they make the default be a dark skinned protag, but the face they defaulted to was third on the list.

 

Female is not the default option. It's random. 

[DaemionMoadrin]

Female is not the default option. It's random. 

 

Indeed, and they fucked that up anyway.

 

You see the default character in the cutscene before you go into the character creator and then have to create your PC with the atrocious lighting from the Fade. How that got approved I will never know...

[Panda]

Because the character is going to change it anyway? If this is the sort of things that offends SJW's, it's little wonder they aren't taken seriously.

So there is no reason to only have white defaults then.

[Steelcan]

So there is no reason to only have white defaults then.

yeah no reason to have defaults at all really, how about just an amorphous blob in the CC to start out with

 

seriously though, something has to be default, and a randomly generated character popping up every time just seems a tad excessive.

[LiL Reapur]

yeah no reason to have defaults at all really, how about just an amorphous blob in the CC to start out with

 

I could live with that....

[NWN-Ming-Ming]

Hold on here...

 

I dunno how this topic got derailed here, but for my part when I asked for better CC options to better reflect ethnic features, it's a simple and honest request.  It's not about being a SJW or being reverse racist or even racist.

 

I just want my character to look like me, to be a character I can identity with.  I'm an Asian-American.  I'd like my character to have some similarities with me, it's really simple. 

 

I think the expectation that any of us demand new voicesets is silly and ridiculous in the extreme, so please don't put words in my mouth.  In terms of DA, the characters don't speak any 'Earth language' nor do they necessarily have any official Earth accents.  They speak English in the meta-context of the game because this is a North American market (and I presume that the voice acting is dubbed for foreign markets), so that's what we as players hear.  True there's those outrageously funny Orlesian accents that are supposed to differentiate the Ferelden ear and tone, but that's artistic license.  Similarly I don't necessarily presume that in the far future of Mass Effect, everyone still speaks Standard English at all, we might be speaking Mandarin or Esperanto for all we know, but the meta-narrative is given in English cause that's what we as the demographic audience listen to.  So I don't see any additional expense being needed, just the one male and female voice actor and that's it. 

 

But appearance is something that we can tweak in the game, and it's there to personalize the look of our characters that we make, roleplay, and identify with.  If we can get better features for a wider range of 'ethnic looks', that's not being racist or reverse-racist, it's just asking for some variation that we can match a given look with.  It's not more or less weird or bigoted than asking for tattoos or eye colors.  I don't get the backlash against wanting to make a character that isn't Caucasian.  It's like making a female or a male character, just an aesthetic choice that helps us better empathize and identify with the character, it helps with our immersion.

 

There's a reason why games like Shadows of Mordor or Assassin's Creed aren't really part of the RPG genre, because you're not really allowed to deviate from the character, to customize it, to truly make it yours.  As much as DA or ME have diverged from the RPG roots, they still support the idea of 'make your character' and that is what makes them appealing, because the player can swap themselves into the role of the protagonist. 

 

So if the CC has steadily improved with technology, but there's certain looks that are better rendered than others, it's not a bad thing to ask for improvement across the board.  I've seen some beautiful Caucasian and Black avatars, but less common representations of East Asian phenotypes, and as many have commented on these forums, it can take a lot longer to achieve satisfactory results, particularly with a lack of suitable presets.

 

All I'd like to see is the next step from DAI's CC.  More choices, more variety, and perhaps more varied presets.

[Natureguy85]

Hold on here...

 

I dunno how this topic got derailed here, but for my part when I asked for better CC options to better reflect ethnic features, it's a simple and honest request.  It's not about being a SJW or being reverse racist or even racist.

 

 

1) The thread is poorly titled and gives the impression that it's about something entirely different. I certainly wasn't expecting the innocent and reasonable request of the OP from the title.

 

2) Some racist was on here ranting about white, heterosexual males, but thankfully they are gone now.

[Overdosing]

Not trying to sound like an SJW here, but BioWare should just do their best in having a character creator with the ability to create a good-looking character, regardless of race. Afros, dreadlocks, hair sticks can be cool.

 

BioWare should just do what they can.

[DuskWanderer]

So there is no reason to only have white defaults then.

 

I mentioned this before, but it's easier to see facial features such as scars on a lighter colored face. 

[tracesaint]

I haven't had any trouble making other races. Three black Shepards, two male and a female, as well as a male with Japanese ancestors. I have a few presets I build from. Also, there are Asian eyes in Mass Effect...not all asian eyes look like the ones people typically think of (which the ME asian eyes are), but they are there.

Just take your time and mess with the cheekbones, jaw line, and brow height...just take your time is all.

[N7Jamaican]

Technically, there are other default Shepards, if you cycle through all the selections, however, the one that we commonly see, is what we get.  Again, for the millionth time, if I can create my own character that resembles myself, I would be happy!