3626 réponses à ce sujet

[Former_Fiend]

  

Ugh my bad had a case of the lags.

TIM is well aware she's going to be on the frontlines in the SM. He'd had her trained (assuming she didn't do such on her own) and outfitted.

 

TIM had no idea what the hell the Suicide Mission is going to be. That's why we were tasked with recruiting such a wide range of individuals instead of just soldiers. No one had any idea what was on the other side of the Omega Relay, so we were being prepared for every contingency. That's why we have people like Thane and Kasumi. Really, when you break down the squad makeup I'm thinking that the head on assault scenario we got was considered very unlikely, given that the only squadmates really geared for that kind of engagement are Garrus, Jacob, Zaeed, and Grunt, and Grunt wasn't even our intended squadmate, Okeer was. Whatever TIM was expecting on the other side of the Relay, it wasn't the straight up fight that we got. 

 

Also, it doesn't necessarily follow that just because we use Miranda as a squadmate on the ground that that was TIM intended us to do with her. Mordin's job is to come up with a solution for the seeker swarms; the fact that we take him into battle is, if anything, out and out foolish since it puts our primary scientific asset at risk. Yes, he is combat trained form his days in the STG, but that doesn't mean putting the guy you're relying to come up with a countermeasure against enemy tech into the line of fire is anything resembling a good idea.

[Majestic Jazz]

 

 

I do genuinely wonder how well received would be a male character who was dressed in such skin tight Lycra material that you could see his bellybutton and the shape of his genitals.  Would people still be okay with it?  If we also had females dressed like Miranda and EDI, would it be okay to have a male who you could actually see the outline of penis?

 

I would not care at all because I do not have to bring him in my party during missions IF his appearance was that offensive.

 

Sorry, but this forum is the a representation of the LARGER Mass Effect audience. The typical dudebro who played ME2 and Saw Miranda's butt probably liked it and that it was a good addition. 

[Grieving Natashina]

Jacob's the closest to it, but to be fair, he didn't have the same 'ass definition' that Miranda did and he certainly didn't have EDI's cameltoe problem. 

Oh, he has as much definition to that booty as Miranda did.  He was just spared the butt-cam treatment.  I agree 100% about EDI.  I just think both catsuits looked absurd.  <shrug>

[dreamgazer]

You're correct, of course. We should probably swing this thread back to how Mac Walters and Casey Hudson should take a writing class again. It's gotta be ten pages since it last came up.

 

Wouldn't pen that on Mac, actually. 

 

Most intriguingly of all, Karpyshyn mentioned a discarded plot idea for the beginning of Mass Effect 2 that sounds similar to what Walters and the Mass Effect 3 team eventually chose for the trilogy's ending (er, spoilers):

 

"There was some ideas that maybe Shepard gets his essence transferred into some kind of machine, becoming a cyborg and becoming a bridge between synthetics and organics - which is a theme that does play up in the game," Karpyshyn concluded. "At one point we thought, maybe that's how he survives into Mass Effect 2."

 

http://www.eurogamer...-trilogy-ending

 

That's also the same guy who came up with the sentient plant and its "essence of being a Prothean" through absorbed/digested bodies, so, yeah. 

[Majestic Jazz]

Jacob's the closest to it, but to be fair, he didn't have the same 'ass definition' that Miranda did and he certainly didn't have EDI's cameltoe problem. 

 

How is EDI's "cameltoe" or Miranda's sexy body a problem? Unless you are disgusted by the female body, I do not see the logic. 

 

Again, the average male gamer who saw this content probably enjoyed it. Might have been a guilty pleasure type of enjoyment but they liked it. The opinions of those wanting women to be "less sexualized" IS NOT the majority opinion, especially when it comes to heterosexual men. 

[Agent69]

I think if it's part of Bioware's artistic vision, they should support it wholeheartedly. Right?

 

They should do it. If nothing more it would be an interesting socialogical experiment. I can't say I paid much attention to what the guys looked like at all except that James was buff and liked to do pull ups and Garus liked calibration. I remember his physical appearance the best and then Garus but that's probably because they were my favorite bromances in the game. Sorry Carth but strangely he was the only male I romanced with my fem shep.

[Grieving Natashina]

What's funny about the "dudebro" comments is that Manveer Heir said flat out that the Butt-Cam was a mistake and they wouldn't do it again.  Guess who's still on the ME team?  I've seen guys that were straight, that didn't like the constant butt-cam.  That have made fun of the cameltoesis as well.  Some "dudebros" may like it, but I've seen plenty of straight and bisexual men that didn't.  "Dudebros" aren't the "core" of this audience.  

 

Oh and I'm aware of that outdated poll.  You had to have an Xbox Gold account, and had to have played right when the game came out.  It doesn't account for the current fanbase, the men and women that have played ME3 for the first time long after that poll closed.  That's while ignoring the fact that 1/5th of an audience is a huge portion to overlook.

 

I'd like to think the core audience of ME are fantasy/sci-fi/sci-fantasy RPG fans.  Hopefully mostly over the age of 18.

 

 

[FKA_Servo]

Wouldn't pen that on Mac, actually.


http://www.eurogamer...-trilogy-ending

That's also the same guy who came up with the sentient plant and its "essence of being a Prothean" through absorbed/digested bodies, so, yeah.

Fine. Am I still ok in blaming his influence for stretching some sidequest cannon fodder into a two game train wreck, or have I been living a lie these past few years?

[Majestic Jazz]

 

What's funny about the "dudebro" comments is that Manveer Heir said flat out that the Butt-Cam was a mistake and they wouldn't do it again.  Guess who's still on the ME team?

 

I've seen guys that were straight, that didn't like the constant butt-cam.  That have made fun of the cameltoesis as well.  Some "dudebros" may like it, but I've seen plenty of straight and bisexual men that didn't.

 

 

 

 

What's funny about the "dudebro" comments is that Manveer Heir said flat out that the Butt-Cam was a mistake and they wouldn't do it again.  Guess who's still on the ME team?

 

I've seen guys that were straight, that didn't like the constant butt-cam.  That have made fun of the cameltoesis as well.  Some "dudebros" may like it, but I've seen plenty of straight and bisexual men that didn't.

 

 

Again, I doubt he thought it was a mistake because the majority of hetersexual men disliked it. I hate to say it, but it was mostly due to Bioware looking at the forums and seeing how many female gamers as well as homosexual males may have found it offensive. Like I said, Bioware is sensitive when it comes to SJW's demands and I hate to bring that name up, but this has SJW written all over it.

 

Does this picture offend you?

[KaiserShep]

Is that a proper still from the game or is the camera drawn back a bit? I recall bringing Garrus on Zaeed's loyalty mission and I don't recall seeing a full body shot of him looking over the railing.

[OhNoWhyHow]

How is EDI's "cameltoe" or Miranda's sexy body a problem? Unless you are disgusted by the female body, I do not see the logic. 

 

Again, the average male gamer who saw this content probably enjoyed it. Might have been a guilty pleasure type of enjoyment but they liked it. The opinions of those wanting women to be "less sexualized" IS NOT the majority opinion, especially when it comes to heterosexual men. 

 

So?  Bioware has explicitly stated they don't do game design by committee.

[daveliam]

@ Nat

 

For sure.  I totally agree that catsuits are ridiculous combat armor.  But I'm firmly in the 'more objectification; not less' camp with regards to the casual wear.  If a lady wants to trot around with her cameltoe protruding, I'm cool with it as long as there is a dude hanging around in something equally revealing.  Doesn't need to be VPL, per se (although that's the equivalent of cameltoe).  I'll take shirtless, tight shorts/jeans, etc.

 

@ Majestic Jazz

 

The game isn't just for dudebros though.  It's for a wider audience.  Sure the 'dudebros' might be the majority of the players, but the series wouldn't be the success that it is without the rest of the audience that is loyal too.  That being said, I'm not saying that it's a problem.  I'm saying it's only a problem if people treat it like it's serious and not a joke and/or it's one sided and not something that all players can enjoy.  Again, more is more when it comes to objectification.

 

Also, no one is saying we're offended.  I'm not offended in the least.  Finally, if you are using SJW in non-sarcastic way, then that tells me all I need to know.  You might as well be referencing the boogeyman.

[Grieving Natashina]

No, that image of Kasumi doesn't bother me, because it is for one scene and every character is shown like this for Zaeed's loyalty mission.  What got old, as someone who is bisexual, was the following.  Putting the larger images in spoiler tags

 

:

 

Spoiler

 

Spoiler

 

Nice try with using a scene that any character can be in.  Not the same thing.

[X Equestris]

How is EDI's "cameltoe" or Miranda's sexy body a problem? Unless you are disgusted by the female body, I do not see the logic.

Again, the average male gamer who saw this content probably enjoyed it. Might have been a guilty pleasure type of enjoyment but they liked it. The opinions of those wanting women to be "less sexualized" IS NOT the majority opinion, especially when it comes to heterosexual men.

My issue is mainly that some things, like the constant Miranda butt shots, were completely gratuitous. Here and there would have been fine, but they had no reason to pop up as often as they did. And I'm speaking as a straight male that romanced Miranda a fair number of times.

Also, since when did the majority opinion become the right one? Assuming, of course, that you're correct and that is a majority opinion. If creators implemented the ideas of large parts of their fanbases, you would probably end up with an incoherent trainwreck.

[dreamgazer]

Fine. Am I still ok in blaming his influence for stretching some sidequest cannon fodder into a two game train wreck, or have I been living a lie these past few years?

 

There's plenty of blame to be thrown around in that regard, I'll say that much.

[Majestic Jazz]

No, because it is for one scene and every character is shown like this for Zaeed's loyalty mission.  What got old, as someone who is bisexual, was the following.  Putting the larger images in spoiler tags

 

:

 

Spoiler

 

Spoiler

 

Nice try with using a scene that any character can be in.  Not the same thing.

 

 

So what! There is a shot of a rear of a woman with an attractive body. So where is the crime? 

 

How did this bring down the value of the gameplay, setting, characters, or story?

 

I mean of all the things that ME:A could do better.....people want to focus on making women less sexualized?

 

What about better, more feminine animations for females? What about better hair options for females?

[OhNoWhyHow]

Again, I doubt he thought it was a mistake because the majority of hetersexual men disliked it. I hate to say it, but it was mostly due to Bioware looking at the forums and seeing how many female gamers as well as homosexual males may have found it offensive. Like I said, Bioware is sensitive when it comes to SJW's demands and I hate to bring that name up, but this has SJW written all over it.

 

Does this picture offend you?

 

Actually no because any companion who isn't Zaeed in your party will do that.  People used to post ass shots of Garrus in that exact spot in the Garrus thread.

[RZIBARA]

Is this guy being serious about a character having cameltoe in a frigging video game being completely cool and normal? HAH

[FKA_Servo]

My issue is mainly that some things, like the constant Miranda butt shots, were completely gratuitous. Here and there would have been fine, but they had no reason to pop up as often as they did. And I'm speaking as a straight male that romanced Miranda a fair number of times.
Also, since when did the majority opinion become the right one? Assuming, of course, that you're correct and that is a majority opinion. If creators implemented the ideas of large parts of their fanbases, you would probably end up with an incoherent trainwreck.

I would add to this that RE the cameltoe - I was not personally offended. It's just that when I saw it, my eyes rolled so hard that they fell out of my skull and now I'm blind.

Gratuitous is a good word for it. Crushingly stupid is also applicable.

At the end of today, I think derpquake probably sums up this and most of the design decisions though.

[X Equestris]

So what! There is a shot of a rear of a woman with an attractive body. So where is the crime? 
 
How did this bring down the value of the gameplay, setting, characters, or story?

Would you be fine with a crotch shot of a male character? And have that happen almost every time you talked to that character?

[KaiserShep]

How is EDI's "cameltoe" or Miranda's sexy body a problem? Unless you are disgusted by the female body, I do not see the logic. 

 

Again, the average male gamer who saw this content probably enjoyed it. Might have been a guilty pleasure type of enjoyment but they liked it. The opinions of those wanting women to be "less sexualized" IS NOT the majority opinion, especially when it comes to heterosexual men. 

 

I actually wasn't aware of EDI's little problem myself, because I always used the more armored looking alternate appearance, rather than that lame white catsuit that looks like she was raiding Miranda's closet, so at least that issue is more a matter of a specific getup than with EDI in general. 

 

As for Miranda, it's really a matter of context. Images convey all sorts of messages, so what are we supposed to get out of the shot of Miranda's honeycomb-festooned posterior when the characters are talking about something serious? If, say, Shepard walked into his quarters and Miranda was there waiting for him ready to coax him into some sexy times, then yeah, that shot would make sense, because now the image is in line with the context of the situation. But if Miranda is talking about saving her sister, or finding her father or evading Cerberus, it just looks stupid.

[Grieving Natashina]

So what! There is a shot of a rear of a woman with an attractive woman. So where is the crime?

Crime, no.  In the realms of bad taste to do it over and over again? Yes.   That's just three examples between 2 games.  There is a lot more out there.  The problem is that I'm not talking to her butt, especially if I'm doing things like talking about her sister, or warning her about Kai Lang.  That served no purpose other than to block most of the shot.  Also, I frankly think that the scales on the catsuit are ugly.  

 

Shoot, I don't care if Sheploo or FemShep is checking out some booty (like with Kaidan) and the camera focuses there for a moment.  It's from Shep's point of view.  The butt-cam is annoying, poorly done and serves no point other than having a big white butt shoved in the face of the player that might not appreciate it.  That includes some straight men too.  I've seen some straight men really dislike the Butt-Cam, because they felt it was distracting from the conversation. 

 

I'm not offended.  I do enjoy looking at beautiful women.  I do think that camel toes and the Butt-Cam was immature and silly.

[AresKeith]

So what! There is a shot of a rear of a woman with an attractive body. So where is the crime? 

 

How did this bring down the value of the gameplay, setting, characters, or story?

 

Other than it being stupid?

 

I mean of all the things that ME:A could do better.....people want to focus on making women less sexualized?

 

What about better, more feminine animations for females? What about better hair options for females?

 

You're acting as if this is the only thread for ME:A 

[Majestic Jazz]

Would you be fine with a crotch shot of a male character? And have that happen almost every time you talked to that character?

 

Honestly? I wouldn't care. If they did the same for Jacob, I would not care cause I would know who it was "intended for" and perhaps I am just not who was supposed to "get the joke".