3626 réponses à ce sujet

[OhNoWhyHow]

No, I understand your arguments. I didn't at first because I was going off of the replies instead of your original post. When I went back and read your OP I saw that it was about unrealistic armor in combat for females AND males which extended to Jacob and Thane. It was then when I went back again to realize that despite your original post, the thread (even before I came into it) was mainly about the representation of females in the game.....in AND out of combat. So many people took your original concept and twisted it to a way that kinda derails your original intention. Like I keep saying, look at AWTEW's reply and you'll understand what I am talking about. She isn't the only one but is the most recent one. 

 

I understand what you were trying to do with this thread initially, but instead many others came and twisted it in a way that aligns with their particular sensitivities that really has no basis in your OP which again was about combat situations where Shepard is all protected and people like Jack and Thane are not. It went from, both men and women going into combat with unrealistic armor to....female genitalia being displayed while in combat. 

 

If I am wrong, then perhaps I comprehended your OP in the wrong way. 

 

The thing is that your insistence that catsuits and such only be discussed in combat doesn't get to the heart of the issue.  The underlying problem is that Bioware is so devoted to the catsuits that they start making stupid design decisions to maintain the prominence of the catsuits.  One of the symptoms of this problem is that characters (male and female) wear their silly skin tight catsuits into battle.  Another problem is that you get stupid camera angles emphasizing the catsuits in non combat conversations that have *nothing* to do with the character's sex appeal. 

 

No one is saying "don't have sexy characters/outfits."  People are asking that the developers not go into absurd design territory to constantly emphasize how sexy the characters/outfits are *supposed* to be.  If they are sexy, I will notice.  I don't require weird camera angles or lack of armor in combat to notice Varric's chest hair.  I spend most conversations with him staring at it and for people who don't care about it, nobody has to deal with a hairy chest cam.

[Quarian Master Race]

This thread's going in circles.

I hope Biower hires Anita Sarkeesian as a character design consultant.

[maia0407]

This thread's going in circles.

I hope Biower hires Anita Sarkeesian as a character design consultant.

That's a fabulous idea! I think it's hilarious that so many people here invoke her name like it's a dirty word. She's awesome!

[FKA_Servo]

That's a fabulous idea! I think it's hilarious that so many people here invoke her name like it's a dirty word. She's awesome!

 

I generally agree with you, but I bet this thread's gonna get pretty funny for the next few pages all the same.

[The Elder King]

Popcorn, anyone?

[Altair_ShepardN7]

That's a fabulous idea! I think it's hilarious that so many people here invoke her name like it's a dirty word. She's awesome!

Sure she is... 

Spoiler

I'm pretty sure we are joking, right? No need to start a new war that will last for several pages and get the thread locked, right?

[Hazegurl]

If cut scenes reflected gameplay, we'd watch Ashley and Wrex shoot at each other for a few minutes until Wrex finally takes her out and takes the Virmire choice away from us. There's a lot of value in brevity. 

 

Actually, I'd pay to see this.

This is actually why I like the Citadel shoot out between Wrex and Shepard more than any of the "kill Wrex" Virmire scenes.  Wrex seems far more of a threat on the Citadel and doesn't go down with just one shot.

[The Elder King]

This is actually why I like the Citadel shoot out between Wrex and Shepard more than any of the "kill Wrex" Virmire scenes. Wrex seems far more of a threat on the Citadel and doesn't go down with just one shot.

Agreed. Not that I saw it in my Canon .

[maia0407]

Sure she is... 

Spoiler

I'm pretty sure we are joking, right? No need to start a new war that will last for several pages and get the thread locked, right?

Good grief, no! No joke! I love her video series on gaming. She makes some excellent points.

 

I'm one of those scary feminists here to ruin your games! Ya' know, cause I don't think men own gaming and I advocate for games that don't alienate me. It's really too bad if that threatens people to the point where the thread will get locked. 

[SolNebula]

This thread will go south pretty quickly

 

 

 

Good grief, no! No joke! I love her video series on gaming. She makes some excellent points.

 

I'm one of those scary feminists here to ruin your games! Ya' know, cause I don't think men own gaming and I advocate for games that don't alienate me. It's really too bad if that threatens people to the point where the thread will get locked.

 

Nope she sounds dead serious.....time for me to take my leave....Lol.

 

I'll be thrilled if the none of the characters, particularly women, are sexualized. And, please, spare me the "but, what about the menz?" moaning. Sexism does not affect men like it affects women. Full stop. I don't care about any BS arguments to the contrary as I'm confident that I've heard them all and that they've all been shot down. At any rate, DAI did a good job of not sexualizing the women and presenting them as strong characters. I hope ME follows in their footsteps. If not, I'll be here complaining and pointing out, once again, how ridiculous the sexualized characters are.

 

More LOL! She is serious.....the bolded part makes you look like a fem-n-a-z-i

[OhNoWhyHow]

I generally agree with you, but I bet this thread's gonna get pretty funny for the next few pages all the same.

 

I actually mostly agree with her as well, but my issue with her is that in the 2 or 3 videos of hers I watched she almost invariably brings up *old* games.  I'm always like "that's a GTA game from 8 years ago and I can think of 5 games from the last 2 that do better."

[Indigenous]

Bioware is not CDPR so I doubt you need to worry too much about overlysexualised characters.

 

What do you mean by 'overly sexualised' anyway? Is Cassandra overly sexualised? She doesnt look like she would be much use in a fight.

[OhNoWhyHow]

Edit: derailing the thread is also precisely what that poster wanted.  No theatricality is necessary. 

[Quarian Master Race]

That's a fabulous idea! I think it's hilarious that so many people here invoke her name like it's a dirty word. She's awesome!

yep. Immature gamers just can't handle the truth so they get buttmad and start whinging about vaguely defined SJWs. Typical anti intellectualism.

[Hazegurl]

Why?I know They used it on her.
My point was that I Though the user was referring to something related to character's design only. I misunderstood his point.
Well, people mentioned Jacob and Thane. But if the discussion goes back Miranda because people accuse others of being SJW or Not want ing attractive people, it's Not their fault. If someone wants to discuss Miranda's outfit, I'll discuss it. If someone wants to discuss Jacob or Thane, I'll do. I'm not going to repeat everything every time, otherwise I should just copy and paste a post.
My major problem with all those outfits is that the game don't recognize ad being protective. No character outside the squad wear them. I wouldn't have as many problems If Bioware recognizes them as some ultra-light protective material, and some Npcs wear different kind of it.
Well, I'd still have problems with Thane, Jack, Zaeed, Samara and Grunt having unprotected exposed skin.
I'm Not going to lie, I'd still prefer armours, expecially if different based on characters, but it'd be better then Not addressing it.
What I said above.

What does BW have to do to make you believe it is ultra light protective gear other than having the characters wear them?  Should they proclaim the gear as protective at some point in the story?  I would just assume it is by the fact that they are wearing it.  Especially a biotic who can put up barriers.  As a matter of fact, with all the biotics who use very light to nearly no armor, could their be an argument that biotic Shepard and Kaidan are doing it wrong by wearing full/heavier gear?

[Patchwork]

Bioware is not CDPR so I doubt you need to worry too much about overlysexualised characters.

 

What do you mean by 'overly sexualised' anyway? Is Cassandra overly sexualised? She doesnt look like she would be much use in a fight.

 

How so?

[FKA_Servo]

I actually mostly agree with her as well, but my issue with her is that in the 2 or 3 videos of hers I watched she almost invariably brings up *old* games.  I'm always like "that's a GTA game from 8 years ago and I can think of 5 games from the last 2 that do better."

 

She makes a lot of good points, but yeah - the examples and sources she draws from aren't always the greatest. Par for the course with academic criticism, sometimes you spin the sources to fit the argument. I was an english major once, too.

 

It still makes no sense that people freak out so heavily over a little bit of literary criticism and deconstruction in their games when all the other media they consume has been subject to it for forever. But then, I get the sense that the type of person who thinks the sky is falling when Anita makes a video probably doesn't have a particularly rich inner life.

 

As I said in another thread, criticisms like hers are gonna get other games made, maybe. And that is the worst case scenario. CDPR is still gonna make the Witcher. GTA is still gonna do it's thing. Attention like hers is just a sign that games are actually starting to be taken seriously as an artistic and storytelling medium.

[camphor]

Good grief, no! No joke! I love her video series on gaming. She makes some excellent points.

 

I'm one of those scary feminists here to ruin your games! Ya' know, cause I don't think men own gaming and I advocate for games that don't alienate me. It's really too bad if that threatens people to the point where the thread will get locked. 

You realize most sensible people hate Anita Sarkeesian because she in at least in respect to video games a moron, and has no real credibility. Certain parts of the feminist movement do great things the push for female protagonists is great but anita has a bad habit of nitpicking and or simply pointing out gender identifiers in 8 bit graphics yes they had ****** or bow that because they took up 4 pixels and it was an easy way to convey a message in a day in age when all your base belongs to us was top notch writing. yes some people hate Anita because shes a feminist, i think most hate her because shes a bad representation of feminists who if anything is setting the movement back by damaging their credbility. 

 

Most feminists want to be treated equally, Anita wants to be treated special,

[Altair_ShepardN7]

Good grief, no! No joke! I love her video series on gaming. She makes some excellent points.

 

I'm one of those scary feminists here to ruin your games! Ya' know, cause I don't think men own gaming and I advocate for games that don't alienate me. It's really too bad if that threatens people to the point where the thread will get locked. 

This thread will go south pretty quickly

 

Nope she sounds dead serious.....time for me to take my leave....Lol.

 

More LOL! She is serious.....

I actually mostly agree with her as well, but my issue with her is that in the 2 or 3 videos of hers I watched she almost invariably brings up *old* games.  I'm always like "that's a GTA game from 8 years ago and I can think of 5 games from the last 2 that do better."

 

Anyone else wants some popcorn?

[In Exile]

It's a needed criticism in the sense someone should probably point this stuff out about games, but it's really just a series of trite statements that are universally true about pop culture (though gaming is a bit worse than other media today) without much notable analysis targeted particularly at the industry and not especially revolutionary as ideas. The prominence comes from the fact a subset of gamers are out to lunch when it comes to these issues and refuse to acknowledge their existence (and some are out and out loons, see e.g. the death threat stuff). 

[dreamgazer]

I thought Majestic Jazz had already flounced out of this thread.

He picked the mic back up.

[PhroXenGold]

Ah hell, I'll jump into the shark pool.

 

While Anita Sarkeesian does raise some good points, (and certainly is in no way deserving of the treatment she has recieved by certain portions of the internet community), she ruins anything good she puts forward by filling her videos with lies and misrepresentations. The classic Hitman one is the most egregious example (a game where you can kill men left right and centre has one scene where you can kill women, and depsite the game encouraging you not to, this apparently makes it deeply sexist....), but her work is littered with such things.

 

She makes those videos first and foremost to publicise herself.

[Indigenous]

How so?

Kind of confused. Do you mean how could she be overly sexualised, or how could she be 'not much use' in a fight? I think both questions have the same answer. Cassandra doesnt seem to be packing much muscle and yet her role is 'the muscle'. So they must have made her skinny for a reason.

[The Elder King]

Bioware is not CDPR so I doubt you need to worry too much about overlysexualised characters.

What do you mean by 'overly sexualised' anyway? Is Cassandra overly sexualised? She doesnt look like she would be much use in a fight.

What?

What does BW have to do to make you believe it is ultra light protective gear other than having the characters wear them? Should they proclaim the gear as protective at some point in the story? I would just assume it is by the fact that they are wearing it. Especially a biotic who can put up barriers. As a matter of fact, with all the biotics who use very light to nearly no armor, could their be an argument that biotic Shepard and Kaidan are doing it wrong by wearing full/heavier gear?

I don't assume it is protection when no biotics in the game Except the squadmates have Them, and have a type of armour. Why should I believe Miranda, Jack, Samara and Thane Are doing it right and the (majority) rest Are doing it wrong?
Beside, I never said a Biotic has to wear a heavy armour. I specifically said in other posts in this thread that I want a variety of armour, and that it makes sense that characters that rely more on mobility and agility should wear lighter armour, and that I want similar option for the PC.
I just don't think those squadmates' outfits Are protective At all, since nobody in the game wear that kind of outfit.

[dreamgazer]