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[MisterJB]

Urthemial was the drunken cousin you don't invite to feast day

That's my son you're dissing.

[Master Warder Z_]

You'll mention Riordan bringing down Urthemial as a viable alternative, and then say this without any shred of irony.

No: I pointed out one good smack to the wing membrane was enough to make the wings that haul that massive ******* around useless, or did you ignore that?

I actually had a eye twitch the first time I saw the scene.

[MisterJB]

If I had been Urthemiel, as soon as the wing was damaged, I'd have thrown myself off Fort Drakon, headfirst.

 

Maybe it just takes very long to respawn.

[Master Warder Z_]

That's my son you're dissing.

My condolences

[The Baconer]

No: I pointed out one good smack to the wing membrane was enough to make the wings that haul that massive ******* around useless, or did you ignore that?

 

While citing Riordan as an example, oblivious to the multitude of good smacks the Archdemon in Last Flight takes to its wings, it's face, it's sternum, it's organs etc.

[Master Warder Z_]

If I had been Urthemiel, as soon as the wing was damaged, I'd have thrown myself off Fort Drakon, headfirst.

Maybe it just takes very long to respawn.

Huh...

Would the rebirth work if they suicides?

[Caddius]

If I had been Urthemiel, as soon as the wing was damaged, I'd have thrown myself off Fort Drakon, headfirst.

 

Maybe it just takes very long to respawn.

No evidence to back it, but my headcanon is that the process is like what we saw with Corypheus respawning, but more dramatic. And yeah, Urthemiel should have waited for the Wardens to get all the way up, and then flung himself off. So long as he avoids those pesky Grey Wardens, the Blight is fine.

[Master Warder Z_]

While citing Riordan as an example, oblivious to the multitude of good smacks the Archdemon in Last Flight takes to its wings, it's face, it's sternum, it's organs etc.

That's really not the point though.

Its dragon hunting 101 to ground them first.

[The Baconer]

That's really not the point though.

Its dragon hunting 101 to ground them first.

 

What makes you think they weren't trying that?

[Boost32]

Blood magic is good for one thing. It cuts you off from the Fade... It's magic with a clear mind. Potentially.
 
 
Except you have to get that blood from somewhere... and it's usually not very nice.

Not even for that. Issaya heard whisper of demons when she casted blood magic.

[Master Warder Z_]

What makes you think they weren't trying that?

Did they try any other method, documented in the novel please,other then the blood crazed griffons?

I mean goodness Clarel primal blasted her way through the guts of a high a corrupted high dragon, hence my incredulity.

Sure their bones, hide and muscle are tough, but straight up magical force can work, and if that can work, why not kinetic force via a gigantic arrow or etc?

It just seems to me that they purposely only planned to do it this one way despite a multitude of options.

[The Baconer]

Did they try any other method, documented in the novel please,other then the blood crazed griffons?

 

Yes... why would you think bloodraging griffons would be Plan A??

 

 

I mean goodness Clarel primal blasted her way through the guts of a high a corrupted high dragon, hence my incredulity.

Sure their bones, hide and muscle are tough, but straight up magical force can work, and if that can work, why not kinetic force via a gigantic arrow or etc?

It just seems to me that they purposely only planned to do it this one way despite a multitude of options.

 

"Even muffled by the dragon’s body, the force of the fireball’s impact ruffled Revas’s fur and washed over them in a tide of heat. It seared through the corrupted Old God’s hide, eliciting another roar of fury." [...]

 

"But the mage persevered, and the shimmering blue lines of a crushing prison formed in the air around the Archdemon. The spell was nowhere near strong enough to hold an Old God. The Archdemon was pinned for only a heartbeat in its grasp; then its scaled bulk shook the magic off like so much rainwater. The prison’s outline shuddered, breaking apart. But it lasted long enough for Calien to hit it with a second spell. Isseya couldn’t see what he cast. Her vision was growing blurry as the vortex neared. She couldn’t focus on anything harder than breathing, which was rapidly becoming impossible. The air was sucked back out of her lungs before she could draw it in again. She felt the shockwave, though. Whatever Calien threw at the Archdemon caused the waning vestiges of his first spell to explode in a massive nova of concussive force. It knocked both griffons from the vortex and sent them spinning helplessly through the sky, tumbling away from the Archdemon far faster than any of them could have flown. Isseya’s head snapped back as if she’d been punched by an ogre. Blood filled her mouth, threatening to choke her as she fought to breathe again."

[MisterJB]

It wasn't the griffons who ruptured the Archdemon's wings, at least not both. It was an arrow who did in the left one and it could still fly, albeit weakly.

 

The griffons were mostly there because they couldn't hurt it otherwise.

[Master Warder Z_]

Yes... why would you think bloodraging griffons would be Plan A??

Weren't they created expressly for this battle? To engage the dragon?

[Master Warder Z_]

It wasn't the griffons who ruptured the Archdemon's wings, at least not both. It was an arrow who did in the left one and it could still fly, albeit weakly.

The griffons were mostly there because they couldn't hurt it otherwise.

...regular arrow?

[Boost32]

I thought she just heard them in general. Weren't there whole narrative passages when she was bugged by voices, when she was casting spells?
 
That's how all mages are supposed to be, in any case. 
 
 
It would be cool to get a more clear explanation of the "science" of magic in this setting. I wonder if they're keeping it confusing on purpose. For example, the descriptions between DAO and DA2 blood magic are noticeably different.

This I dont know, just remember reading something about it.


Like how templars cant dispell blood magic, but a templar Hawke can dispell Idunna's magic.

[Master Warder Z_]

This I dont know, just remember reading something about it.


Like how templars cant dispell blood magic, but a templar Hawke can dispell Idunna's magic.

Killing her was one of the funniest bits of the game.

"No! Nooooooooooooo!"

[Boost32]

Killing her was one of the funniest bits of the game.
"No! Nooooooooooooo!"

"Apostate prostitues? Apostitutes!"

[The Baconer]

Weren't they created expressly for this battle? To engage the dragon?

 

They fight the Archdemon more than once in the book. The Joined griffons were used because they were unable to harm the Archdemon, and also to turn the tide of the war.

 

 

...regular arrow?

 

The arrow passed through the webbing of the dragon's left wing, and lodged itself in the right wing's joint.

[MisterJB]

Weren't they created expressly for this battle? To engage the dragon?

 

No, they were being used during the course of the Blight. A Griffon contracted the Blight and Isseya, feeling pity for the rider, attempted the Joining through a blood magic ritual. Normally, Joining the Griffons was impossible, not because they were immune but because they actually tore themselves apart afterwards due to feeling the Taint within.

Through blood magic, Isseya forced the original Griffon to accept it and it did. It became much stronger and faster and with greater stamina. Noticing this, the First Warden ordered Isseya to perform more Joinings on Griffons.

Unfortunately, the Taint lead to them growing into madness at the sight of the Darkspawn, going so far as to turn against their riders.

As time wore on they became more and more uncontrollable. In the eve of the final battle, they decided they had to use anything they had which included the Joined Griffons due to their increased prowess.

Isseya was controlling them through blood magic so they wouldn't berserk. During the battle, she lost control.
 

[Caddius]

Weren't they created expressly for this battle? To engage the dragon?

The technique itself was developed several years prior. Garahel took Wardens close to their Calling, and had Iseya taint their griffins. (The Army was likewise composed of outcasts, albeit with a contingent of Orlesians led by the founder of the current imperial dynasty.) 

They had the griffins drop incendiaries into Ayesleigh to make Andoral think they could keep the bombardment going forever. So Andoral charges out with his army. The griffins are supposed to harass and lure him back to the army where they would have archer contingents and ballista in addition to Griffin-Riders. But the griffins were blood-crazed, and kept pressing the attack against Andoral. As the Baconer quotes, they tried magic, but it didn't seem to work. I could have sworn it wasn't archers that injured the wing. Wasn't it griffins tearing at Andoral, a whole flock of them? Then when he's injured, he flies down to Ayesleigh. The darkspawn are fighting the main army in the field outside the city, and the Wardens get lured into an ambush of darkspawn archers inside the city. Many of the Wardens die. Garahel and two others manage to make it past the darkspawn and engage Andoral, and manage to kill him.

All of this makes me really resent that we didn't have griffins to have a proper aerial battle with Urthemiel back in Origins. 

Someone who's read the book more recently correct anything I got wrong. 

[MisterJB]

This I dont know, just remember reading something about it.


Like how templars cant dispell blood magic, but a templar Hawke can dispell Idunna's magic.

I didn't think he was dispelling it, even a non-Templar, non-mage Hawke can do it.I just assumed Hawke's willpower overpowered Idunna's.

[Master Warder Z_]

Huh so a regular arrow struck all but crippled a wing...I only wonder how a arrow could sail that far and strike true, must have been a hell of a archer.

Or lucky as sin, either way.

Neat.