151 réponses à ce sujet

[von uber]

The most stupid race is the Reapers. They have to be, otherwise ME3 would last about 3 minutes.

[Barquiel]

That's making things worse. Also, They still liked to everyone else without preparinG contermeasures (well, except possibly the Ark...). Geth warships Are neither as big or as poweful as Sovereign. Which was clearly shown in ME to the Council.
Also, the very man Who saved the Citadel and investigated Saren told this, so I'd give him more credency.
Also, said Ahriman pointed out, Regardless of What They said to Shepard They did believe it was a Reaper. And yet They did nothing.

 

I wouldn't say they did nothing to prepare. The salarians built their stealth dreadnought fleet. It's mentioned that the asari upgraded their ships. The turians developed the Thannix cannons and were already bolstering their crew complements in ME2. It simply wasn't enough...
 

[AlanC9]

An all out war between the Salarians and the Alliance would always in Salarian victory, I'd dare to say even the Volus would  beat the Alliance when it comes to naval assets.

I don't think the latter is likely. The volus have always outsourced most of their military needs to the turians. Though if that ever changed, volus GDP probably substantially outclasses Alliance GDP, sure, so given a few years and the political will they could do it.

[Torgette]

It's actually the opposite, Earth fell almost immediately whereas the Asari and Turians held their own for months.

[Vespervin]

I'll admit that I'm a bit ignorant when it comes to ME lore, so go easy on me here, but....

 

Why didn't the Reapers concentrate on the Citadel instead of Earth? If they took control of the Citadel, couldn't they have shut down the Relay network? That would of made it a lot easier for them to complete their mission. I know that the Protheans done something to the Keepers, couldn't the Reapers have reversed this? Did they attack Earth because that's how BW wanted the story to be focused? I don't know..........

[von uber]

I'll admit that I'm a bit ignorant when it comes to ME lore, so go easy on me here, but....

 

Why didn't the Reapers concentrate on the Citadel instead of Earth? If they took control of the Citadel, couldn't they have shut down the Relay network? That would of made it a lot easier for them to complete their mission. I know that the Protheans done something to the Keepers, couldn't the Reapers have reversed this? Did they attack Earth because that's how BW wanted the story to be focused? I don't know..........

 

 

The most stupid race is the Reapers. They have to be, otherwise ME3 would last about 3 minutes.

[Master Warder Z_]

It's actually the opposite, Earth fell almost immediately whereas the Asari and Turians held their own for months.

Earth had a active resistance going on for the entire conflict.

[Mr_Commander_Shepard]

Their leaderships certainly were for the most part, especially the Council species. They didn't even bother to prep for or react to the Reapers until they were already being harvested. The minor Council affiliate species were similarly just along for the ride, being ruled by the big 3 as they had been for thousands of years. The turians put up a good fight given the circumstances, and the salarians do their best to avoid fighting altogether, but at least they are never overrun. It's the asari who really take the idiot ball and run with it by continuing to hide the beacon for months, only relenting when they start getting rekt.

The krogan hold the galaxy hostage until their cure is ready, despite knowing that everyone will die if the Reapers win. In fairness, it probably was their only opportunity at ever getting a cure and they were going to die either way if they didn't.

The geth acknowledge the threat and pledge to help, but subsequently spend their time building a useless Dyson sphere which gets blown up by the quarians, then they actually go and ally with the damn Reapers. 

The quarians acknowledge the threat and pledge to help, but then send their shiny newly armed fleet against the geth instead. In fairness, they wanted a place to offload their civilians so their ships could actually be useful in the fight, and Rannoch's the only place that would work for that.

Batarians get predictably annihilated offscreen for being a comical isolationist pariah state.

Leviathan sit in their goddamn ocean trench until someone comes along to tell them what a bunch of idiots they are for creating the whole mess by being the worst AI programmers in the universe.

Only the Rachni really commit and then don't do anything but prepare, but they get destroyed and their queen enslaved offscreen.

Very well put, the last three made me laugh, and they are so true. Anyway, humanity had/has shepard. So..

[Rannik]

I'll admit that I'm a bit ignorant when it comes to ME lore, so go easy on me here, but....

 

Why didn't the Reapers concentrate on the Citadel instead of Earth? If they took control of the Citadel, couldn't they have shut down the Relay network? That would of made it a lot easier for them to complete their mission. I know that the Protheans done something to the Keepers, couldn't the Reapers have reversed this? Did they attack Earth because that's how BW wanted the story to be focused? I don't know..........

 

For the same reason why Gandalf didn't fly the ring to Mordor.

[X Equestris]

I'll admit that I'm a bit ignorant when it comes to ME lore, so go easy on me here, but....
 
Why didn't the Reapers concentrate on the Citadel instead of Earth? If they took control of the Citadel, couldn't they have shut down the Relay network? That would of made it a lot easier for them to complete their mission. I know that the Protheans done something to the Keepers, couldn't the Reapers have reversed this? Did they attack Earth because that's how BW wanted the story to be focused? I don't know..........

They should have launched everything at the Citadel. I would have, in their position. Ultimately this was a "The plot demanded it" thing. I suppose you could try to claim that the Reapers were trying to apply their behavior in previous cycles to this one, but there's no explanation given in the lore that I know of.

[Master Warder Z_]

They should have launched everything at the Citadel. I would have, in their position. Ultimately this was a "The plot demanded it" thing. I suppose you could try to claim that the Reapers were trying to apply their behavior in previous cycles to this one, but there's no explanation given in the lore that I know of.

In the prior cycles the Citadel just unlocked and they flew in from Darkspace.

In this one they had to enter the Galaxy via Batarian space, which is bordered by Alliance space, presumably... It was just distance.

[X Equestris]

In the prior cycles the Citadel just unlocked and they flew in from Darkspace.
In this one they had to enter the Galaxy via Batarian space, which is bordered by Alliance space, presumably... It was just distance.

Yeah, but they could have blitzed through the relay network and taken the Citadel before anyone could have stopped them. Once they had the Citadel, they could have locked down the relay network. Instead, they divided their forces up in a way that let them take more casualties than they should have.

[Master Warder Z_]

Yeah, but they could have blitzed through the relay network and taken the Citadel before anyone could have stopped them.

Possible.

[KaiserShep]

Possible.

 

I'd say more than just possible. Had the reapers ignored everyone and beelined to the Citadel, they could have finished what Sovereign started, only this time the full bulk of their forces could defend it from anyone looking to interfere, and then they'd shut down the relay network and it's a wrap.

[ShadyKat]

the asari had the technology for thousands of year, and didn't do much better defending their own planet than humans who only just recently expanded in the galaxy.

Humans are just Mary Sue's, and need to look strong as possible.

[Master Warder Z_]

I'd say more than just possible

And I'd say it would have basically allowed every sentient race in the galaxy enough time to get ready to fight back,them leaving everyone alone in pursuit of the Citadel leaves everyone the time unite together and make sure they never get it.

Conventional victory would be unlikely but it would have been a sight to see

[Hanako Ikezawa]

And I'd say it would have basically allowed every sentient race in the galaxy enough time to get ready to fight back,them leaving everyone alone in pursuit of the Citadel leaves everyone the time unite together and make sure they never get it.

Conventional victory would be unlikely but it would have been a sight to see

It would have only taken them a few weeks or months more to get to the Citadel rather than Earth. Less if they used a Mass Relay. Plus without attacking Earth they would have caught the Council races completely by surprise like Earth was caught by surprise when the Reapers attacked them. 

 

Conventional victory would have been impossible. 

[Kabooooom]

Yeah, but they could have blitzed through the relay network and taken the Citadel before anyone could have stopped them. Once they had the Citadel, they could have locked down the relay network. Instead, they divided their forces up in a way that let them take more casualties than they should have.

I've written many posts about this, and it is my opinion that Mass Effect lore makes this an inefficient strategy, believe it or not. Here's why:

The games give the illusion of rapid travel from one end of the galaxy to another. In reality, it takes time. Relay travel from one relay to another is instantaneous, but in hub systems you have to travel via FTL between several relays in a system. This adds travel time. In the trilogy, we only have one single example of estimated travel time through the network: It takes 15 hours to reach the Citadel from Eden Prime.

Couple that with the fact that the Citadel monitors relay traffic. They know how many vessels are travelling through the relays. Itd be impossible to hide a massive invasion fleet traversing the network. The Citadel would have advanced notice by HOURS, and close the Citadel arms. The Citadel, presumably, is impenetrable even to the Reapers. The only reason why the Reaper's blitz attack worked previously is because they linked directly to the Citadel from dark space. Even Earth knew that "something big was coming" with an advanced notice of hours.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

I've written many posts about this, and it is my opinion that Mass Effect lore makes this an inefficient strategy, believe it or not. Here's why:

The games give the illusion of rapid travel from one end of the galaxy to another. In reality, it takes time. Relay travel from one relay to another is instantaneous, but in hub systems you have to travel via FTL between several relays in a system. This adds travel time. In the trilogy, we only have one single example of estimated travel time through the network: It takes 15 hours to reach the Citadel from Eden Prime.

Couple that with the fact that the Citadel monitors relay traffic. They know how many vessels are travelling through the relays. Itd be impossible to hide a massive invasion fleet traversing the network. The Citadel would have advanced notice by HOURS, and close the Citadel arms. The Citadel, presumably, is impenetrable even to the Reapers. The only reason why the Reaper's blitz attack worked previously is because they linked directly to the Citadel from dark space. Even Earth knew that "something big was coming" with an advanced notice of hours.

The Reapers could just use conventional FTL and come out literally on the Citadel's doorstep without alerting a single person until they show up. It would take longer, like a few more weeks or months, but since ships are impossible to track at FTL speeds nobody would know.

[DaemionMoadrin]

If the Reapers weren't morons, then they would have harvested the galaxy in ME1 already. Sovereign screwed up everything for them and Harbinger continued that trend in ME2.

 

Strategic goals of the Reapers in ME1 were:

 

1. Take control of the Citadel, shut down the relay network and open the relay to dark space.

2. Keep knowledge about their existence, technology and goals secret for as long as possible.

 

The attack on Eden Prime already risked N°2, why did Sovereign have to go there personally? Just send Geth ships.

How did Sovereign and Saren even know about the Conduit and what it does? Without that knowledge the entire gambit of finding the way to Ilos makes no sense.

Or how about the Cipher? Why did Saren need the Thorian for that? Didn't the Reapers harvest the Protheans? Shouldn't they have all their knowledge, culture and technology? Of course, if Sovereign had no Prothean data, then they would have to deal with the creepy plant alien. Why draw attention to it through Geth attacks though?

The villain's plan in ME1 was so convoluted and risky, it had a decent chance to fail even without Shepard. I can think of 3 or 4 easier, faster and more successful plans.

 

Strategic goals of the Reapers in ME2:

 

1. ... uh, Harbinger's hobby is genetics and crafting? Seriously, ME2 was about a lot of things but not about the war with the Reapers. Harbinger, through the Collectors, did some experiments (plague on Omega), gathered info and tried to establish a beach head by creating a human Reaper (with 3 eyes) ahead of the invasion.

 

Which, of course, revealed the Reaper's plans to Shepard. Even more stupid was the plot of Arrival. What was the point of Object Rho? Oh hey, let's leave some technology behind that can warn the enemies that we're coming back. Brilliant!

Not to mention that suddendly there is an Alpha relay in the network, which neatly replaces the Citadel as the Reaper's entry point into the galaxy.

 

By ME3 it was an utter clusterfuck. Strategic goals? Felt more like the Reapers were killing people just for fun. A massive fleet of ancient, hyper-intelligent AIs, each outclassing most dreadnaughts, each capable of indoctrinating organics, of modifying them into shock troops... and they lose the war.

 

Any decent gamer would have kicked ass if ME was a RTS and they were in control of the Reapers. They have all the advantages, they are massively overpowered and they become stronger the longer the war lasts because they can make their own troops out of their enemies. You'd have to fail on purpose to lose.

[Master Warder Z_]

Plus without attacking Earth they would have caught the Council races completely by surprise

Hardly; the Alliance knew the Reapers arrived when the deep space probes triggered combine that with the flood of refugees from Batarian space and the whole surprise angle goes out the window.

Unless if they plan to sail their armada through Batarian space and not harvest, let them make a few intergalactic phone calls and tell the galaxy anyway...surprise couldn't be achieved.

So that time period you'd have every conceivable military organization aware of the oncoming threat.

[KaiserShep]

And I'd say it would have basically allowed every sentient race in the galaxy enough time to get ready to fight back,them leaving everyone alone in pursuit of the Citadel leaves everyone the time unite together and make sure they never get it.

Conventional victory would be unlikely but it would have been a sight to see

 

The time they took to unite would ultimately prove irrelevant. The reapers only need a short window to take control over the Citadel, and ME3's endgame proves that if they really wanted to take the Citadel, they could. They even dragged it to the Sol system. In any case, even if a united fleet managed to reach the Citadel to fight the reapers, all they need to do is shut down the relay, then simply leave. Any ships that made it into the nebula would be stuck there and they would have no hope of reaching any other system indefinitely, while the reapers can patiently pick off each species one by one.

[themikefest]

Every species was stupid.

[KaiserShep]

Every species was stupid.

 

Except for the yagh. They were basically bad neighbors that hate everything and think lowly of everyone. Wisest species of all.

[Kabooooom]

The Reapers could just use conventional FTL and come out literally on the Citadel's doorstep without alerting a single person until they show up. It would take longer, like a few more weeks or months, but since ships are impossible to track at FTL speeds nobody would know.

This is a possibility, but it wouldn't take months - it'd actually take years. It takes the Reapers 6 months to travel 5,400 light years to the nearest primary relay system from the Bahak system. Ballparking approximately 75,000 light years to the Serpent Nebula, it would take them 6.8 years to get there.

So yeah, the galaxy is like, super duper vast.

I imagine an in-lore explanation for WHY they didn't do this even though they've waited millennia thus far is that the galaxy had access to Collector tech beyond the Omega-4 relay, and they didn't want to take the chance of them being even more prepared to fight against the invasion, even if they could shut down the entire relay network.