162 réponses à ce sujet

[TheKomandorShepard]

Did you even read my post? Seriously?
 

Yes i read your post if i didn't i wouldn't be able to reference to things you have said... 

[Dai Grepher]

Yes i read your post if i didn't i wouldn't be able to reference to things you have said... 

 

Yet you wrote, "You assume every HoF would care about other wardens dying or not". And where in that post (that you totally read) did I make such an assumption? Was it in the paragraph where I gave an example of one of my own Hero's who did not care about other Wardens dying or not? Or was it in the sentence about helping average people who happen to become infected with the taint?
 

[TheKomandorShepard]

Yet you wrote, "You assume every HoF would care about other wardens dying or not". And where in that post (that you totally read) did I make such an assumption? Was it in the paragraph where I gave an example of one of my own Hero's who did not care about other Wardens dying or not? Or was it in the sentence about helping average people who happen to become infected with the taint?
 

In most of your post pretty much this was reason why hof wanted to find cure , then i responded on other part if you failed to see. Also curing the calling ≠ curing the taint.

[Aren]

In most of your post pretty much this was reason why hof wanted to find cure , then i responded on other part if you failed to see. Also curing the calling ≠ curing the taint.

Actually i believe that this is just one of the many things that DAI did it wrong,references.

In DAI they use the word blight to address the taint,the use the word calling "cure for the calling" to address again the"cure for the taint" while they are obviously two different things.

[KaiserShep]

To be fair, people would probably just keep making fun of it if they used the word taint. Heh, cure the taint.

[TheKomandorShepard]

 

Actually i believe that this is just one of the many things that DAI did it wrong,references.

In DAI they use the word blight to address the taint,the use the word calling "cure for the calling" to address again the"cure for the taint"

 

Possible ,but as far nothing suggests it is quest to remove taint only the calling.

[Aren]

Possible ,but as far nothing suggests it is quest to remove taint only the calling.

In DAI Fiona is mentioned as the example, ridiculous is when Morrigan say this line

"something removed the blight from grand enchanter Fiona" , i have presumed that Fiona was a woman,not a land.

But then again remove the taint have as benefit to cure the calling as well,the contrary however is untrue,actually it does not even make sense to me,since the calling is just the final stage, a symptom of the disease,it is just a magical call that was emulated by both the nightmare and Corypheus,it is not a disease that need to be cured.

[Aren]

To be fair, people would probably just keep making fun of it if they used the word taint. Heh, cure the taint.

i know it sound bad,i hope that they will find another word to address the taint,maybe something elven,

for example i do not like the word "well of sorrow" it just seem something sad, Cabelas word is more fun Virabubblesun

Abelas "the vira-bubble-sun must be preserved"

[Aren]

What she said is and not just something you will find great intrest of you ,in first place why the warden would care about according to you not very special book that s/he wasn't even searching in first place. 

 

 

i have completed WH right now,there are two books! one is the Dalish book, a big book,there is another that is more small,the gift i presume,maybe some book that she have found and that can help the warden,but then again i do not believe that is very valuable.

[TheKomandorShepard]

 

In DAI Fiona is mentioned as the example, ridiculous is when Morrigan say this line

"something removed the blight from grand enchanter Fiona" , i have presumed that Fiona was a woman,not a land.

But then again remove the taint have as benefit to cure the calling as well,the contrary however is untrue,actually it does not even make sense to me,since the calling is just the final stage, a symptom of the disease,it is just a magical call that was emulated by both the nightmare and Corypheus,it is not a disease that need to be cured.

 

It doesn't matter that fiona is mentioned as example because avernus is mentioned as well and he didn't cure the taint only removed the calling for a very long period of time.

Removing the taint is the same for removing the calling what saying i will kill every animal to kill every tiger.It makes sense as to remove calling you don't need to remove taint and the calling is in fact only negative effect and pretty much in his/her letter ,the warden talks about specifically about removing the calling rather than taint.

 

 

 

 

i have completed WH right now,there are two books! one is the Dalish book, a big book,there is another that is more small,the gift i presume,maybe some book that she have found and that can help the warden,but then again i do not believe that is very valuable.

Well, thanks for info.Then she left something else for the warden as i claimed ,It is apparently valuable for every warden from dao and daa ,at least according to morrigan.

[Aren]

It doesn't matter that fiona is mentioned as example because avernus is mentioned as well and he didn't cure the taint only removed the calling for a very long period of time.

Removing the taint is the same for removing the calling what saying i will kill every animal to kill every tiger.It makes sense as to remove calling you don't need to remove taint and the calling is in fact only negative effect and pretty much in his/her letter ,the warden talks about specifically about removing the calling rather than taint.

 

 

 

 

 

The cure for the calling it can simply mean then,a magical defence against the voices,but it will not help the GW to survive against the deleterious effect that the taint have into their body,in times they lose their sight (Utha white eyes) and their body becomes corrupted and ruined.

Avernus has controlled the taint in his body this is way is calling have never arrived,cure the calling is pointless because eventually if the taint in the body is not removed their body will be corrupted to the point of monstrosity.

This is way i mentioned Fiona,GW need to remove or control the taint within their body with this supposed cure,not just lock the voices of the calling,because the calling actually is just the last stage,an alarm that say 

"your body is too corrupted game over"

[Greypaul]

As Aren has mentioned The calling is the end result of the taint when the warden is talking about finding a cure he's talking about removing the taint as Morrigan mention's "It will mean a long life for him , perhap's for them all" .

[TheKomandorShepard]

 

The cure for the calling it can simply mean then,a magical defence against the voices,but it will not help the GW to survive against the deleterious effect that the taint have into their body,in times they lose their sight (Utha white eyes) and their body becomes corrupted and ruined.

Avernus has controlled the taint in his body this is way is calling have never arrived,cure the calling is pointless because eventually if the taint in the body is not removed their body will be corrupted to the point of monstrosity.

This is way i mentioned Fiona,GW need to remove or control the taint within their body with this supposed cure,not just lock the voices of the calling,because the calling actually is just the last stage,an alarm that say 

"your body is too corrupted game over"

 

The calling is moment when grey wardens stop being immune on blight and start turn into ghoul (like every individual who isn't grey warden , voices are only effect of turning into one) and for that reason most wardens go to die on deep roads ,so to stop voices you need to stop moment you stop being immune on blight.As i said curing taint would be wholly different thing than just curing the calling ,in first case you aren't grey warden anymore in second case you are still grey warden ,you just don't have to go through the calling. 

 

But from what i see either there is something more to the calling or you are right and they just mixed up words because description of the calling in dai seems rather not fitting ,maybe somone should ask one of devs about it.  

As Aren has mentioned The calling is the end result of the taint when the warden is talking about finding a cure he's talking about removing the taint as Morrigan mention's "It will mean a long life for him , perhap's for them all" .

The calling is as i said moment when grey warden ceases to be immune on it ,from what i see on wiki the warden is talking about negating the calling ,not removing taint.And as i said above if you remove the calling what is in first place reason why most grey wardens go to die on deep roads they will have long life.      

[Greypaul]

The warden's are not Immune to the taint its killing them alright slower then someone who has'nt taken the joining but still they are dying or will end up as a ghoul the calling is a wardens way of knowing it's time to go to the deep roads or degrade into a mindless disease ridden darkspawn . So to cure only the calling would not prevent the warden dying from the taint .

[TheKomandorShepard]

The warden's are not Immune to the taint its killing them alright slower then someone who has'nt taken the joining but still they are dying or will end up as a ghoul the calling is a wardens way of knowing it's time to go to the deep roads or degrade into a mindless disease ridden darkspawn . So to cure only the calling would not prevent the warden dying from the taint .

They are for a time thus they don't turn into ghoul immediately and don't suffer negative effects of it until the calling.Yes removing the calling would prevent warden from turning into ghoul because the calling is the time they start succumb to taint ,so if they never reach the calling they won't die/turn into ghoul because the calling is simple side affect of succumbing to the blight.Pretty much removing the calling would mean removing point when grey warden succumbs to the blight thus achieves full immunity on its negative effects.Hell technically even changing time of point when the calling comes for example on 100 year would have almost the same effect.   
 

[ME3EndingH8er]

What bothers me the most is that at the end of DA2 Cassandra mentions that the HoF was missing along with champion. If Leliana knew, then wtf, why did she not mention that to Cassandra. 
It seems like Bioware had bigger plans for the fate of Hawke and the HoF when Hawke was intended to be the protagonist of DA:I. But then the huge backlash towards DA2 happened and they just seemed to scrap all plans. Would explain why they came up with the shitty reason Hawke couldn't be found, Varric lied The most anticlimactic solution possible 

[In Exile]

What bothers me the most is that at the end of DA2 Cassandra mentions that the HoF was missing along with champion. If Leliana knew, then wtf, why did she not mention that to Cassandra. 
It seems like Bioware had bigger plans for the fate of Hawke and the HoF when Hawke was intended to be the protagonist of DA:I. But then the huge backlash towards DA2 happened and they just seemed to scrap all plans. Would explain why they came up with the shitty reason Hawke couldn't be found, Varric lied The most anticlimactic solution possible 

 

Bioware's "big plan" was to have an actual Act 4 to DA2, whereby you'd play out the plot in the present. For example, the cut Exalted March Expansion would have involved the Temple of Mythal. It's pretty obvious Hawke was going to end up being the Inquisitor. 

 

I'd wager the "HOF is missing" line was just the product of someone forgetting you had another ending besides going through the Eluvian. 

[ME3EndingH8er]

Bioware's "big plan" was to have an actual Act 4 to DA2, whereby you'd play out the plot in the present. For example, the cut Exalted March Expansion would have involved the Temple of Mythal. It's pretty obvious Hawke was going to end up being the Inquisitor. 

 

I'd wager the "HOF is missing" line was just the product of someone forgetting you had another ending besides going through the Eluvian. 

Before DA:I came out, after reading The Masked Empire, i really thought The HoF and Hawkes disappearance would be related to whatever killed Felassan. But noooooo, they really were just not able to be found. Probably the most realistic situation in a pre-electronic communication world like Thedas, that people 'missing' were just outside civilized areas and thus couldn't be found (although i doubt the writers had that in mind), but it hardly makes for compelling storytelling. That Leliana thing bugged me so much, talk about ****-tease dialogue

[dsl08002]

What bothers me the most is that at the end of DA2 Cassandra mentions that the HoF was missing along with champion. If Leliana knew, then wtf, why did she not mention that to Cassandra. 
It seems like Bioware had bigger plans for the fate of Hawke and the HoF when Hawke was intended to be the protagonist of DA:I. But then the huge backlash towards DA2 happened and they just seemed to scrap all plans. Would explain why they came up with the shitty reason Hawke couldn't be found, Varric lied The most anticlimactic solution possible

Indeed because I was happily looking forward a joint adventure between hawke and the HoF, similar like it was in the halo 2 between arbiter and master chief where you played both characters. personally I think that Hawke and HoF would be a good duo, but even if the character doesn't like eachother depending of how you play they would work together well.

but in the interview with DG recently it was planned in the very beginning of having the characters in DAI to return but it was scrapped.

[ME3EndingH8er]

Indeed because I was happily looking forward a joint adventure between hawke and the HoF, similar like it was in the halo 2 between arbiter and master chief where you played both characters. personally I think that Hawke and HoF would be a good duo, but even if the character doesn't like eachother depending of how you play they would work together well.

but in the interview with DG recently it was planned in the very beginning of having the characters in DAI to return but it was scrapped.

I can understand how it would almost be impossible to bring the HoF back as an NPC, they have no easily definable personality. They are arguably the most complex character in the game universe because they are often a representation of the real people who play as them,a shade of grey. But i thought it would be relatively simple to bring them back as a playable character, just make sure to replicate the character creator from Origins with the new engine, and then provide optional voices, but let the player choose whether or not they are silent or not. And if they don't want to play as the HoF or their HoF died, then do an Awakening and have it be the Orlesian Warden 

[robertthebard]

I can understand how it would almost be impossible to bring the HoF back as an NPC, they have no easily definable personality. They are arguably the most complex character in the game universe because they are often a representation of the real people who play as them,a shade of grey. But i thought it would be relatively simple to bring them back as a playable character, just make sure to replicate the character creator from Origins with the new engine, and then provide optional voices, but let the player choose whether or not they are silent or not. And if they don't want to play as the HoF or their HoF died, then do an Awakening and have it be the Orlesian Warden

Or, since the HoF is so easily replaceable, replace them with someone else, and write one game instead of 3.

[Iakus]

Bioware's "big plan" was to have an actual Act 4 to DA2, whereby you'd play out the plot in the present. For example, the cut Exalted March Expansion would have involved the Temple of Mythal. It's pretty obvious Hawke was going to end up being the Inquisitor. 

 

I'd wager the "HOF is missing" line was just the product of someone forgetting you had another ending besides going through the Eluvian. 

I actually doubt Hawke was ever going to become the Inquisitor.  Though I do think Cassandra would have met the Champion eventually if Exalted March had happened.

 

And the HoF does go missing according to the ending slides of Awakening.

[Aren]

I can understand how it would almost be impossible to bring the HoF back as an NPC, they have no easily definable personality. They are arguably the most complex character in the game universe because they are often a representation of the real people who play as them,a shade of grey. 

Warden a complex  character?

The complexity of what you are talking about is just into the realm of headcanon and is not realeted directly with the character,the Warden is a complete puppet into the players hand S/he somehow is just an   interface to the world of Thedas.

[ME3EndingH8er]

Warden a complex  character?

The complexity of what you are talking about is just into the realm of headcanon and is not realeted directly with the character,the Warden is a complete puppet into the players hand S/he somehow is just an   interface to the world of Thedas.

Exactly
Everyones vastly different headcannon would mean that the Warden could never really be represented as an NPC, as they would anger most of the Origins players
The only way to bring them back would be to make them playable

[Kakistos_]

Avernus... Avernus... Oh, right.  That guy I killed, and whose potion I destroyed, for conducting brutal experiments on fellow wardens.  His methods are lost to the ages.  Simply not available.  Well, at least in some of my playthroughs.

 

See?  It's just best to leave the HoF alone.  His/her time is gone.  

You could make the same arguments about Kieran, Alistair and Logain. In each case there was a contingency or they simply did not exist. In the case of Avernus, regardless of what you do to him his research and findings still exist and become known. Everyone's unique play-through is accommodated as with Leliana and Varric responding accurately to their relationships with various companions. Even the codex changes based on your world state.

 

You assume every HoF would care about other wardens dying or not  ,search for the cure is pretty much pointless as outside few exceptions wardens don't possess personal wealth ,not to mention warden can end up in far better position with proper choices. Search for the cure have only sense when your warden either cares for other wardens or/and don't want be involved in blood magic/sacrifice assuming it was part of avernus method.

The search for the cure makes perfect sense, even if they are only interested in self preservation. Every Warden that lives, regardless of their choices becomes and remains the Warden Commander of Ferelden throughout Inquisition and after per Awakening. As various epilogues suggest, that may not always be the case but it is for the time being. Whatever happened to the Wardens in Ferelden, whatever is happening with the Wardens in the Anderfels and the fallout from Corypheus' manipulation of Wardens the Warden Commander as a prominent figure and Warden of high rank is involved.

 

 

Bioware's "big plan" was to have an actual Act 4 to DA2, whereby you'd play out the plot in the present. For example, the cut Exalted March Expansion would have involved the Temple of Mythal. It's pretty obvious Hawke was going to end up being the Inquisitor. 

 

I'd wager the "HOF is missing" line was just the product of someone forgetting you had another ending besides going through the Eluvian. 

I disagree. There seems to be a lot going on with the Wardens behind the scenes that we don't know about yet. We saw a glimpse of that in Inquisition with the Orlesian Wardens and Corypheus' manipulation. Corypheus, being free and lucid for a number of years now may have added to it before the events in DA:I but there was other things besides him hinted at in DA2 not related to Legacy. The Hero also wasn't the only Warden in Ferelden that went missing. They all did. This is part of a bigger plot.

 

 

I can understand how it would almost be impossible to bring the HoF back as an NPC, they have no easily definable personality. They are arguably the most complex character in the game universe because they are often a representation of the real people who play as them,a shade of grey. But i thought it would be relatively simple to bring them back as a playable character, just make sure to replicate the character creator from Origins with the new engine, and then provide optional voices, but let the player choose whether or not they are silent or not. And if they don't want to play as the HoF or their HoF died, then do an Awakening and have it be the Orlesian Warden 

I agree that bringing the Warden back as a playable character would be easy. The Warden however was never truly silent. They never spoke full dialog while interacting with other characters but there were a number of audible responses during combat, lock picking, etc. I don't understand why extending speech to dialog would cause heads to explode. In my opinion adding a voice to my Warden would be a positive addition.

 

As for the definable personality, Hawke showing up as an NPC is a good template. Hawke's cameo may not have been ideal for some but I prefer it to nothing. I think that a simple solution to bringing back a semblance of our Hawke and Warden's personality and views are more options added in their section of the World State as well as adding the Orlesian Warden in place of Heroes that died. For example, adding the personality choices we had at the Character Creator in Origins and adding the same point system tied to the choice of Divine. Pro Mage decisions and Mage romances would add points to pro Mage dialog, the same with dialog on Blood Magic and Wardens, etc.

 

Exactly
Everyones vastly different headcannon would mean that the Warden could never really be represented as an NPC, as they would anger most of the Origins players
The only way to bring them back would be to make them playable

I disagree. I think that most of us are mature enough to understand that what we imagine in each of our individual heads cannot ever be duplicated in a game. Plenty of people's headcannon probably didn't have their Hawke or Varric and Leliana for that matter anywhere near the Inquisition but I for one think their presence added to the game significantly. Bioware being able to cater to every individual's headcannon is unreasonable.