The Acolyte, the ****ing Acolyte... it should banned... if I see another "class-specific" solo using this weapon, I think I'm going to puke. It is pathetic and depressing, and unfortunately, some classes are just so bad that using this god-forsaken thing is the only way to make them viable on platinum. As a result, the vast majority of recorded platinum solos make use of this ridiculous weapon to some extent.
Well, clearly you read some of this thread, since you've decided that some effort was put into it.
Biower made BS enemies like Phantoms, then had to make BS weapons to counter them. Also powers like Pull were and still are crap without Acolyte
I can't imagine Cerberus without Phantoms, and tbh, I love fighting those sexy witches - but dispatching them with an acolyte is so... unsatisfying. Yeah pull should've had a shield-penetration evo like lash.
lol, well the title couldn't have exuded effort since not even the word Acolyte was spelled correctly
So what you mean that wall of text is lorem ipsum, anyway?
Looooooool no, sounds like an L2P problem
Already covered this with Techno. Presumably all classes are viable with other weapons, but not optimal. N7 Fury is one example.
But honestly, the path to excellence and competence are one and the same. Excellence just takes longer.
What you consider optimal may not be the same for other people - a Venom on the Fury is a better option than an Acolyte imo. Youre trying to argue about variety then make the point that certain kits shouldnt be able to use certain weapons as effectively as others which is silly.Already covered this with Techno. Presumably all classes are viable with other weapons, but not optimal. N7 Fury is one example.
But honestly, the path to excellence and competence are one and the same. Excellence just takes longer.
Youre trying to argue about variety then make the point that certain kits shouldnt be able to use certain weapons as effectively as others which is silly.
It is already the case that certain kits cannot use certain weapons as effectively as others. You have class specific weapon bonuses for geth and collector classes, and still, many players (myself included) routinely use non-geth or non-collector weapons on those kits. But... anytime I decide to use a geth or collector class, I do consider the fact that certain weapons may be more viable. So I might bust out the Collector AR just for $#!+$ and grins if I'm rocking the collector adept, even though I would never use it as an AR typically.
I personally enjoy using native weapons on my classes. I think it adds to the immersion of the ME3MP experience. Would like to see that trend continued in ME:A MP.
a Venom on the Fury is a better option than an Acolyte imo.
But since you can essentially carry the acolyte for free, you might as well just take them both. Will make boss shields/barriers drop faster at the very least.
I agree with most of the original post but on host phantom bullshit makes me love having the option of the acolyte.
Already covered this with Techno. Presumably all classes are viable with other weapons, but not optimal. N7 Fury is one example.
But honestly, the path to excellence and competence are one and the same. Excellence just takes longer.
That's the thing though. The Acolyte isn't optimal, generally Arc Pistol, Talon, Wraith are going to surpass it if we're talking optimal TTK. Acolyte is however easier to use.
Another interesting side effect of the Acolyte is the prevalent use of SMGs (particularly the hurricane) on caster classes to take down armor. If only Bioware had not given us the Acolyte...
Realize that this completely contradicts the original roles of the SMG and heavy pistol weapons classes! Up until the Acolyte was introduced, SMGs were better at taking down shields, while heavy pistols were better at taking down armor, as it always should have been. ME1 and ME2 players know this (it was actually given as advice on the in-game loading screens).
But then the Acolyte came along... followed by the Hurricane... and the rest is history.
Imagine if there was no Acolyte... what a wonderful ME3MP world we would have... you might think twice about taking that Hurricane w/ HVB because now you need to deal with shields, and you might actually use those hard hitting heavy pistols for what they were designed for.
What would you put on your Fury now? Piranha perahps, Talon maybe? Whatever you may choose, I'm sure it would have been more entertaining than using the Acolyte.
Yes, Acolyte Hurricane combo is quite nuts together. At basically no weight penalty too. So you can have it all.
tl;dr. Also...
You don't have to actually read a wall-o-text to know it's a wall-o-text.
Like I've said. Acts like bot, talks like bot, trolls like a bot. Jay Leno must be his programmer (I hear he's retired too now. What a coincidence).
Maybe so, but wouldn't it be nice if the optimal weapon to use with a certain class was in fact unique to that class, as opposed to being optimal for the majority of classes?
Ultimately, I think that the answer lies in granting hefty class-specific weapon bonuses (either in the form of weight reduction, increased damage, increased RoF, increased recoil compensation, increased reload time, etc) to the different races for their respective weapons.
If you think about this, it only makes sense. There is no way that a Volus should be able to wield the Claymore or the Graal with the same effectiveness as a Krogan. Nor should a human be able to wield the Phaeston to the same effect as a Turian.
The lack of class-specific bonuses results in the vast majority of players using a only small subset of the weapon base, which is pretty lame, but understandable, since the behavior of competitive human beings converges towards optimality. And since only a small subset of the weapons yield optimal play, these weapons are used disproportionately. The Acolyte, IMO, exemplifies this point, but it is not the only culprit.
In a perfect ME3MP world, or ME:A MP as I envision it, each racial class would have class-specific weapons at the common, uncommon, rare, and ultra-rare levels that synergize near optimally with some kits in the class. Asaris should get more mileage out of the Disciple than the Wraith, Turians should do better with the Phaeston than the Harrier, etc, etc.
This problem does not have a trivial solution, but I would love to see it addressed in the next game.
Yes, but I sometimes wish the better players used this knowledge to make weaker kits and weapons work better, as me, instead of going full out optimum on the most optimum kits and weapons. So I blame BioWare. Because I love ME3mp players.
OP, how would you feel about a purely acolyte-centric build? I sometimes play my pullguard with only an acolyte and just ignore big armored targets until the wave budget is depleted. The try-hard build involves an smg but occasionally I can't be bothered to switch weapons so I forsake the smg. Surely the loss of DPS vs health and armor makes up for its anti-shield efficacy thus achieving "balance".
sidenote: Scorpion is way more cheesy for platinum solos in my limited experience. All of my successful attempts involved heavy use of one.
Why do people take so much effort in writing stuff nobody is reading?
Balance discussions are the most interesting topics on BSN. And it's what becomes more and more apparent as one plays a specific game more and more. So these type of topics are only natural.
That and you don't have to read them. Not every thread is for everyone. Or every joke for everyone. "Don't worry be happy."
The Acolyte was introduced to fix an injustice : tech powers are effective against both shields and barriers, while biotic powers are effective only against barriers.
I, however, sometimes agree with you OP, especially when I equip both the Acolyte and the Hurricane while maintaining a 200% power recharge speed. But then I think about how great the Justiciar and the human adept are with this gun and I'm fine with it.
The Acolyte allows a more agressive gameplay, has made a few biotic powers less useless / better for gold and above, and has probably enabled more people to play platinum. I think that globally its impact on ME3 MP has been positive.
But there should be an answer to everything. Some kits and weapons should have some weaknesses. Acolyte & Hurricane removes all weakness. And you have 1 of 5 chances of a new pug starting a manifest to recieve a Hurricane in the starter gift pack, which effectively removes any need for any other weapon for quite some time by a longshot. How is this balanced?
tl;dr
... but I'd just like to add; I'd prefer it if they added very little from ME3:MP into ME:A MP ... I want a new game damnit not just a rehash with prettier graphics!
I agree that it allows a more aggressive solo gameplay,
Solos should never be possible on the hardest difficulty in a team game. That's how you know a game has serious balance issues.
The Acolyte would have been fine if it were an Ultra Rare.
I don't get it. 
OP, how would you feel about a purely acolyte-centric build? I sometimes play my pullguard with only an acolyte and just ignore big armored targets until the wave budget is depleted. The try-hard build involves an smg but occasionally I can't be bothered to switch weapons so I forsake the smg. Surely the loss of DPS vs health and armor makes up for its anti-shield efficacy thus achieving "balance".
sidenote: Scorpion is way more cheesy for platinum solos in my limited experience. All of my successful attempts involved heavy use of one.
Acolyte is still more OP then Scorpion in my opinion.
And yes, mook focus is were it's at.
Unless of course it was intended (hint Lone Wolf challenge)Solos should never be possible on the hardest difficulty in a team game. That's how you know a game has serious balance issues.
Claim: Equipping this weapon on any kit, either as a primary or secondary weapon, renders the kit optimal.
In other words, taking the Acolyte will almost always help a kit more than any other weapon taken in its place.
I think it probably just has a little too much going for it but could be balanced with a few tweaks. It's not just the damage to shields/barriers but the splash AOE effect as well. Maybe reduce the AOE on the thing, reduce the stunning effect on infantry, increase the weight a little and it would be a lot more balanced. I do like the idea of the Acolyte, it just needs a little tweaking to be viable yet not OP. I think that's what we need to see in the next game is weapons that do some things well and others not so well.
I think it probably just has a little too much going for it but could be balanced with a few tweaks. It's not just the damage to shields/barriers but the splash AOE effect as well. Maybe reduce the AOE on the thing, reduce the stunning effect on infantry, increase the weight a little and it would be a lot more balanced. I do like the idea of the Acolyte, it just needs a little tweaking to be viable yet not OP. I think that's what we need to see in the next game is weapons that do some things well and others not so well.
Don't most folks run it with Incindiary or Disrupter? So since it always primes ammo powers and shield strips all mooks, it would still = instant stagger.
I have seen somebody use a TGI with Acolyte ONLY ..they still scored like 200k
That's why the Acolyte is awesome. Was it a solo that you happened to watch on YouTube?I have seen somebody use a TGI with Acolyte ONLY ..they still scored like 200k
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