1395 réponses à ce sujet

[DoomsdayDevice]

Bioware made such a mess with ME3 that they had to move their entire franchise to a new galaxy.

Think about that, let it sink in.

It's a really sad state of affairs and it's all too understandable people are rejecting the whole thing.

[Sartoz]

Bioware made such a mess with ME3 that they had to move their entire franchise to a new galaxy.

Think about that, let it sink in.

It's a really sad state of affairs and it's all too understandable people are rejecting the whole thing.

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Agreed.

Casey's decision to end the trilogy in such a manner prevented any further continuity in the Milky Way galaxy.   What a waste.

 

On the other hand, this new massive Cluster and the focus on exploration will sink the franchise, unless a rabbit or two is pulled out of a hat.  I hope MEA will be a SP success but massive and exploration reminds me of DAI's failure in that regard.

[fchopin]

We are not throwing MEA under the bus.

 

This is a new game in a different galaxy so Bioware will have to sell us the game again and not depend only on the Mass Effect name.

We need more info from Bioware.

[Lebanese Dude]

Bioware made such a mess with ME3 that they had to move their entire franchise to a new galaxy.Think about that, let it sink in.It's a really sad state of affairs and it's all too understandable people are rejecting the whole thing.

What an idiotic conclusion.

The game ended as a choice for players. Any choice would have created divergence that required a different setting in a game totally unrelated to the trilogy in that regard.

Making the ending be the same way no matter what you do would trivialize the choices in the past games since whatever you do the result is the same. The War Asset system is a good way to efficiently give some meaningful closure to most if not all loose ends from the previous games.

What better way to use that system that would respect the supposed permanence of those decisions while giving value to consequences? Making the war assets count as a way to unlock more choices for the player in a seamless manner ( excluding the initial fail of making MP required for the "top" ending ).

And no, the three endings and their respective variations are not the same. The game simply ends after.. the ending. Not gonna get into a debate about the endings themselves, but the fact is, they're different and result in massively different settings, at least in the short term after ME3 ends where it matters to the player.

Joke all you want about war assets, the choices, and the resolutions. They all tie in together. The only real way the game could justify the reaper threat as having Galaxy-wide consequences while respecting player choice would be to either make the game a prequel, a sequel far into the future with some reaper hand waiving. or making the setting in another galaxy independent of the first.

Pick your poison.

[Sartoz]

What an idiotic conclusion.

 Snip

Joke all you want about war assets, the choices, and the resolutions. They all tie in together.

 

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I suppose the massive outcry regarding the ending forcing Bio to release a free extended scene(s) to "clarify" the ending was just an illusion. Face it. Bio screwed up.

[Lebanese Dude]

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I suppose the massive outcry regarding the ending forcing Bio to release a free extended scene(s) to "clarify" the ending was just an illusion. Face it. Bio screwed up.

I agree. Then they fixed it. Get over it.

If you expected something other than a narrated slideshow ending, then it's obvious you've never played a BioWare game.

[pdusen]

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I suppose the massive outcry regarding the ending forcing Bio to release a free extended scene(s) to "clarify" the ending was just an illusion. Face it. Bio screwed up.

 

Sorry, that doesn't follow. The massive outcry was about the endings being bad, not about the endings being highly divergent, which is the *actual* reason a change in setting is needed now.

[Sidney]

Realistically the endings are irrelevant. They would have had to move it one way or another. How could you create a new game in same setting with just these two different choices:
1. Genophage cured or not
2. Geth/turians win

That isn't some little cosmetic difference or something out of the way a player might not run into. The entire nature of ME3 even before the endings required a move.

[Cyberstrike nTo]

It seems to me that moving the series to another galaxy was the only way forward: the set up is easy to explain, Element Zero in the Milky Way is running dangerous low (due to it being used up and/or destroyed in the Reaper War) and soon will run out. Without Element Zero FTL drives won't work and Galactic Civilization will collapse and with only a few relays working (and/or repaired since the end of the Reaper War) searching the galaxy is next to impossible because of the lack of Element Zero. The recent discovery of a mysterious stable wormhole to the Andromeda galaxy is seen as a both a miracle and a threat so the Council sends an elite team through the wormhole for two reasons:

1) Find Element Zero and use whatever means to secure it either through barter or by force.

 

2) Find out who or what created the wormhole and determine if it's a threat or not, And if it's a threat wipe it out. 

[dragonflight288]

It seems to me that moving the series to another galaxy was the only way forward: the set up is easy to explain, Element Zero in the Milky Way is running dangerous low (due to it being used up and/or destroyed in the Reaper War) and soon will run out. Without Element Zero FTL drives won't work and Galactic Civilization will collapse. with only a few relays working (and/or repaired since the end of the Reaper War) searching the galaxy is next to impossible because of the lack of Element Zero. The recent discovery of a stable wormhole to the Andromeda galaxy is seen as a both a miracle and a threat so the Council sends an elite team through the wormhole for two reasons:

1) Find Element Zero and use whatever means to secure it either through barter, dipomocy, or by force.

 

2) Find out who or what created the wormhole and determine if it's a threat or not, And if it's a threat wipe it out. 

 

3) Establish stable colonies so that races may survive the fight for resources back in the Milky Way. 

[Cyberstrike nTo]

3) Establish stable colonies so that races may survive the fight for resources back in the Milky Way. 

 

In other media that might work but in an RPG video game, I've yet to see it work right. 

[AlleyD]

I see no reason at present to jump on board the bus. This is a new adventure, new cast, new studio and completely new setting. All that carries over is the Mass effect name itself and I simply do not have enough brand loyalty to overlook the lack of information available

[Natureguy85]

I don't think ME3s ending - in isolation, i.e., ignoring everything else apart from that ending Catalyst sequence - is more nonsensical. It's a huge tone shift and introduces a bunch of stuff right out of nowhere. But stuff like making organic-synthetic hybrids using the powers of lasers isn't that out of left field for sci-fi. 

 

So it's not about how nonsensical something is, relative to some other nonsense, but whether your critical mind gives it a pass, based on whether it looks believable within already established lore.

 

This is why the introduction to the universe is so important. The world builder is asking us to accept several things at the start. Once we accept the basics, anything that flows naturally from them will also be acceptable. The Mass Effect and biotics are introduced early on, are shown, and are common, so we accept them despite their real world impracticality.  While something like Synthesis or the Citadel beam might work perfectly fine in other science fiction settings, they are so far outside the scope of what we've experienced in the series up until that point. That is what breaks that suspension of disbelief.

 

https://www.youtube....wErqSg&t=10m53s

 

I am totally good with the revised ME3 ending, the move to Andromeda, and the fact I know very little of what is coming for MEA.  Considering it's one of the most fun game series I've played (as it combines decent storylines with above average gameplay), i don't really see MEA being a let down.  My only issues with the ME series is the technical failues on the playstation system.  Crashes, long ass load times, cutting off dialogue, characters talking but not on screen.  I care a LOT more about Bioware getting the game technically presentable than any canon ending.  Bioware should (and probably will) just pick one, which will, i'm betting, take us back after the dust settles (ME5). 

 

It's crazy how many really bad games are out there, yet many posters here would prefer to just stall the game into Duke Nukem territory than accept something that crushes their emotional connection to their perception of how things should go.  I am more a supporter of the environment and the 'universe' of Mass Effect which can hold many more stories, and realistically, it is time Shepard retires (6 feet under or somewhere on a beach) and we follow some new characters. 

 

I guess people need to whine and ******.  The only way things can progress and improve is by doing and trying new things. Seems that people in general haven't really got the concept that things aren't tailored to their every desire.  Go try the real world some time.  With all the complaints, you'd think everyone would be very happy for the next upgrade in a franchise that has continually topped itself.   

 

When i pick up a science fiction novel, i completely expect there to be parts i wont understand or necessarily like, but that's part of challenging yourself, learning to see things in new and different ways. I think perhaps television has really screwed up science fiction as it is in a market medium that needs to be so commercially digestable it isn't allowed to be fresh or innovative.  That's what all these complainers are doing, watering down a creative work to a point where no one can really enjoy it as something fresh and stimulating.  

 

As long as Bioware sticks to their vision and ignores/laughs at the children crying about how hard it all is, MEA will be just fine.  Step up your game peoples, read a (non game-adapted) sci-fi book.  Here's some starters:  Friday by Robert Heinlein, Macroscope by Piers Anthony, and Valis by Philip K Dick.

 

What makes your post hilarious is that you say you're good with the revised ME3 endings. If they should just stick to their vision, why did you need the Extended Cut? If their vision is something stupid, is it good just because it's their vision? You do know that most art goes through some sort of editing process, right? There wasn't anything fresh, innovative, or challenging about the endings to Mass Effect 3.

 

I've always questioned why Saren needed the Conduit.

 

It's a backdoor to a very common area of the Citadel which he already would have had access to had he not thrown away his spectre status looking for the conduit. Noveria shows that he can very easily smuggle large amounts of Geth past security scanners, so it's not like getting an army of them onto the Citadel should have been an issue.

 

and Soveriegn knew that all he needed Saren to do was get to the master control panel in the Citadel tower in order to take control of the station.

 

At no point would they have needed to go after the conduit for anything except curiosity as to what it was.

 

Why would you need to smuggle anything in? Spectre Saren shows up in his brand new ship, uses his super spectre powers to order everyone off it, goes right into the Council chamber because Spectre reasons, and BOOM, reaper apocalypse. 

 

While I thought using the Relay Monument was a really cool Chekov's Gun, the problem was making the control panel in the Council chamber. When I heard Vigil tell me about the Conduit, I thought it would go to one of the hidden areas of the Citadel nobody had ever been to. That could have explained why Saren couldn't get there.

 

What an idiotic conclusion.

The game ended as a choice for players. Any choice would have created divergence that required a different setting in a game totally unrelated to the trilogy in that regard.

Making the ending be the same way no matter what you do would trivialize the choices in the past games since whatever you do the result is the same. The War Asset system is a good way to efficiently give some meaningful closure to most if not all loose ends from the previous games.

What better way to use that system that would respect the supposed permanence of those decisions while giving value to consequences? Making the war assets count as a way to unlock more choices for the player in a seamless manner ( excluding the initial fail of making MP required for the "top" ending ).

And no, the three endings and their respective variations are not the same. The game simply ends after.. the ending. Not gonna get into a debate about the endings themselves, but the fact is, they're different and result in massively different settings, at least in the short term after ME3 ends where it matters to the player.

Joke all you want about war assets, the choices, and the resolutions. They all tie in together. The only real way the game could justify the reaper threat as having Galaxy-wide consequences while respecting player choice would be to either make the game a prequel, a sequel far into the future with some reaper hand waiving. or making the setting in another galaxy independent of the first.

Pick your poison.

 

Realistically the endings are irrelevant. They would have had to move it one way or another. How could you create a new game in same setting with just these two different choices:
1. Genophage cured or not
2. Geth/turians win

That isn't some little cosmetic difference or something out of the way a player might not run into. The entire nature of ME3 even before the endings required a move.

 

Make one canon for the new game. Would some people get upset because "their choices didn't matter"? Yes, but when we move the entire setting, your choices still don't matter. So I guess the answer is to invalidate all choices instead of just some of them.

 

There's also the idea of simply making the new series in a universe where XYZ happened. I defeated the alien invaders in XCOM: Enemy Within but XCOM 2 is set in a universe where the aliens won.

 

Also, the War Assets were a joke and hardly a satisfying representation of choices made throughout the games. They were nothing more than points of which you needed a certain number. I didn't matter what they were or what kind of assistance they provide.

 

I agree. Then they fixed it. Get over it.

If you expected something other than a narrated slideshow ending, then it's obvious you've never played a BioWare game.

 

Origins slideshow wasn't narrated and was infinitely better because it was detailed.

[dragonflight288]

In other media that might work but in an RPG video game, I've yet to see it work right. 

 

Likewise, but imagine this.

 

We show up in Andromeda and are given the choice of two habitable planets. We do not have enough fuel to go anywhere else, it has to be one of these. These two planets each have unique resources and challenges that apply. On one world, we'll have plenty of food, resources to gather and is essentially a garden world, but in order to claim it we have to drive off or defeat a race that's already there. The other choice is an uninhabited world, but the resources are a lot more scarce, the ground less fertile, and in order to build a settlement, we'll have to rely on mining nearby asteroids, trade and where necessary, fight for them.

 

As we gather resources, we get to choose how the colony develops, and it visually grows as the game progresses, and we can interact with the growing colony.

 

One choice gives us everything the colony needs immediately and can guarantee our races survival but makes us invaders in the new galaxy, while the other choice is one that is going to be wrought with hardship and many colonists that come with us will die of starvation or exposure due to the lack of resources.

 

It's not likely what Bioware will do, and what I explained would probably be a better sandbox game, but I think that would be an interesting way to handle creating a new colony. 

[Cyberstrike nTo]

Likewise, but imagine this.

 

We show up in Andromeda and are given the choice of two habitable planets. We do not have enough fuel to go anywhere else, it has to be one of these. These two planets each have unique resources and challenges that apply. On one world, we'll have plenty of food, resources to gather and is essentially a garden world, but in order to claim it we have to drive off or defeat a race that's already there. The other choice is an uninhabited world, but the resources are a lot more scarce, the ground less fertile, and in order to build a settlement, we'll have to rely on mining nearby asteroids, trade and where necessary, fight for them.

 

As we gather resources, we get to choose how the colony develops, and it visually grows as the game progresses, and we can interact with the growing colony.

 

One choice gives us everything the colony needs immediately and can guarantee our races survival but makes us invaders in the new galaxy, while the other choice is one that is going to be wrought with hardship and many colonists that come with us will die of starvation or exposure due to the lack of resources.

 

It's not likely what Bioware will do, and what I explained would probably be a better sandbox game, but I think that would be an interesting way to handle creating a new colony. 

 

That would work great in RTS and/or a god game. My feeling is that they will treat any colonies that you can start in ME:A, (IF they do anything like that all), like the 3 Keeps in DA:I little more than glorified rest stops for your party. Now IMHO the 3 Keeps in DA:I work in terms of the story, but in terms of the gameplay they don't other than some WT operations,  a couple of quests, a pit stop, and a few stores.

[Sartoz]

I agree. Then they fixed it. Get over it.

If you expected something other than a narrated slideshow ending, then it's obvious you've never played a BioWare game.

 

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Sorry to disappoint.

I bought and played Baldur's Gate and the Ice Dale series, the three DA games, plus the three ME games plus the books, plus I have Dawn of the Seeker (2012) and the DA graphics novels.

 

ME3's ending never got fixed because is was unfixable the way the ending was originally presented.  Better if Shep had one choice..destroy the Reapers..... a better fitting for the apocalyptic finale.  War assets was a joke. I replayed the final ending so many times with different war assets percentages to see if Shep could survive or the endings change.... nada to all. And, by that I mean there was no major divergence .. all lead to the final choice of rainbow colours.

[Sartoz]

Sorry, that doesn't follow. The massive outcry was about the endings being bad, not about the endings being highly divergent, which is the *actual* reason a change in setting is needed now.

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Exactly. The ending was absolutely pis* poor.

 

"highly divergent" belongs to the guy I was replying to.

[Eryri]

I actually think the Extended Cut introduced more problems than it solved. The scene where Shepard takes a little break to evacuate his companions and Harbinger sportingly refrains from taking a single pot shot is particularly irritating. The synthesis epilogue is extremely saccharine, and the crash landing of the Normandy on the nameless jungle planet is rendered a pointless diversion because they repair the ship and fly away almost immediately.
It really didn't fix the endings for me. I actually disliked them slightly more, which surprised even me.

[Sartoz]

Realistically the endings are irrelevant. They would have had to move it one way or another. How could you create a new game in same setting with just these two different choices:
1. Genophage cured or not
2. Geth/turians win

That isn't some little cosmetic difference or something out of the way a player might not run into. The entire nature of ME3 even before the endings required a move.

 

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My take is that here is a better way to end the Trilogy. Let me take a shot at it.

 

Destroying the Reapers is the one and only concern to save the galactic races from outright genocide. The Geth/Genophage conflict presents a simple binary solution that has no influence on the main story arc.

 

A "better" way to end the story was to give the player the means to save Shep or not and to severely damage the Reaper fleets with the Prothean weapon, allowing for the Terran and Alien forces to eventually defeat the Reapers, down the road.  A simple cut scene in the end to explain that the galactic civilizations now had the time and resources to win the war and the Trilogy could end there.

[prosthetic soul]

In reference to the topic title....

 

You reap what you sow. 

[Sartoz]

I see no reason at present to jump on board the bus. This is a new adventure, new cast, new studio and completely new setting. All that carries over is the Mass effect name itself and I simply do not have enough brand loyalty to overlook the lack of information available

 

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Yes, yes, yes and yes.

 

The trilogy is ended. Leave it at that.

[prosthetic soul]

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Yes, yes, yes and yes.

 

The trilogy is ended. Leave it at that.

Ended...in a manner of speaking.

[Sartoz]

 

That would work great in RTS and/or a god game. My feeling is that they will treat any colonies that you can start in ME:A, (IF they do anything like that all), like the 3 Keeps in DA:I little more than glorified rest stops for your party. Now IMHO the 3 Keeps in DA:I work in terms of the story, but in terms of the gameplay they don't other than some WT operations,  a couple of quests, a pit stop, and a few stores.

 

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And that, boys and girls is what we will probably get. Oh, and  a massive number of planets to explore with our Mako.... sounds exciting. yes? Oh, wait again... forgot about the beautiful rendered terrain we will see during our Mako explorations. Perhaps some planets will have rain and we will get wet when searching for our 50 litres of Zero fuel with our advanced sonar.

 

Really, the ME4  "leaked" poll does appear to be something I would love to see in the game. But, as with the DAI poll, where Bio actually delivered a super diluted version of the choices it presented, I expect something similar with the upcoming game.

 

A reason for me to remain neutral regarding MEA.

[Natureguy85]

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Sorry to disappoint.

I bought and played Baldur's Gate and the Ice Dale series, the three DA games, plus the three ME games plus the books, plus I have Dawn of the Seeker (2012) and the DA graphics novels.

 

ME3's ending never got fixed because is was unfixable the way the ending was originally presented.  Better if Shep had one choice..destroy the Reapers..... a better fitting for the apocalyptic finale.  War assets was a joke. I replayed the final ending so many times with different war assets percentages to see if Shep could survive or the endings change.... nada to all. And, by that I mean there was no major divergence .. all lead to the final choice of rainbow colours.

 

You just made me think something; would people have been mad if there was no final choice and the "wildly divergent" endings would have come about as a result of what you'd done over the course of the series?

[Hanako Ikezawa]

You just made me think something; would people have been mad if there was no final choice and the "wildly divergent" endings would have come about as a result of what you'd done over the course of the series?

Well, the answer to that is yes since there will always be people who get mad. 

But I don't think the endings occurring based on the actions throughout the trilogy would have received the fallout the actual endings did. Some games are even praised for doing what you described.