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People throwing Mass Effect Andromeda under the bus a full year before its release.


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#876
Sartoz

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                                                                                          <<<<<<<<<<0>>>>>>>>>>

 

For the sake of my sanity, I choose to believe the following:

 

The Old Stuff

1. Andromeda and the Helious Cluster has no Reapers and never will.

2. The Catalyst is a very advance AI created by organics to find a solution to prevent the cycle of  intelligent machines taking over their organic 

    creators.

3. The catalyst controls the Reapers and the  Relays and holds the key to their destruction.

4.  I'll settle for a Codex Entry on how the Pathfinder Initiative and the ARKCON crew got to Andromeda

     Pathfinder patch here: http://forum.bioware...der-initiative/

5. The N7 emblem in the light armour of the individual in the teaser cinematics is there to grab your attention as in "Hey, this is a Mass Effect 

    game" and won't be seen in the actual game.

 

The New Stuff

I'm hoping the game holds true to:

 

You are a pathfinder, a combat trained but un-tested explorer leading an expedition into the Helius cluster to establish a new home for humanity. As you explore this sprawling series of solar systems (over 4x the size of Mass Effect 3), collecting resources and building colonies, you will encounter the savagery of untamed lands in the form of cut-throat outlaws and warring alien races. To survive and colonize the wild reaches of space, you will need to grow your arsenal, your ship, your crew and make strategic (and often uneasy) alliances to fight against increasingly menacing foes. Along the way, you will encounter the remains of a once powerful and mysterious alien race, the Remnant, whose forgotten technology holds the key to gaining power in this region of the galaxy. As you uncover who the Remnant were, and the mysteries their ruins contain, you are drawn into a violent race to find the source of their forgotten technology that will determine the fate of humanity.

 

The above, by itself, is enough for Bio to tell a compelling story. With a max of six squadmates and limited romance options, the word budget allocated to each member is sufficient for better character development than in DAI.  Also, I don't expect any large combat deviation from the previous titles but I do expect some tweaks in Powers and Class (ie: Pathfinder), perhaps even a new slug thrower or three.

 

A key worry is the words Massive and Exploration (from  Bio) focus, which can make the italicized paragraph meaningless, given my DAI experience.  

 

Old Races

Human, Solarian and Krogan are confirmed races. The Solarian from a tweet paraphrased to "solarians are looking good"

 

New Races.

The teaser shows a hostile race with hoofs. No LI there I'm sure. However, I expect the friendly race to be human like and the new alien LI.

 

 

All in all, It's much to soon to criticize what is virtually an unknown game.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


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#877
Rovay

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Who said I was talking about KotoR 2?

 

The Old Republic pretty much canonized several aspects from Knights of the Old Republic regarding Revan.

 

(Steps out of the shadows)

 

Actually, I think that was LucasArts doing. They made certain choices canon from KotOR 1 and 2 a few years before SW:TOR was released and Bioware had to roll with it. I might be wrong on that though.

 

(Steps back into the shadows)


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#878
Dantriges

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Until they show us how the Pathfinder proect gets to Andromeda we have no clue if conventional flight there is a possibility becuase of the discharge problem or if you can run a FTL drive for 500 years. The wiki entry indicates that there is a limit even without the discharge problem.



#879
jak11164

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sartoz

Is "Pathfinder Initiative and the ARKCON crew" official sterile clean white spacecraft with gazillion of procedures (ISO1000000 and 1'st Directive) , breeding tanks and star fleet officers dressed  in stiff irreproachable uniforms?

Or it is like Mayflower or other ships that were bringing hungry shady characters to the new word so they colonized it, in wild west style, with blood relations, vendetta  gunfight and love ......?

This is basic question before I buy the game. I do not want official mission form government. I want it Omega style like NY was in XVIII century true colonization.



#880
Natureguy85

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There are 3 key aspects in ME1 that point to the Messiah archetype in ME1 and they just keep coming in next two games. 

 

1st point hell first point in the game - You are given the name Shepard you cant change it. Shepard means nothing to the Prophet Archetype, but carries significant weight towards the Messiah archetype as one of the name Jesus is give is 'The shepherd.' Shepard and shepherd are phonetically identical. The epilogue actually uses the term 'The Shepard.'

 

2nd point - You are given 'divine knowledge.' Yes this is used in both the prophet archetype and the Messiah archetype but If all the other points point towards a Messiah archetype which is do you think this point making allusion to? Is it the prophet archetype or the Messiah?  Your comment is equivalent to me saying 'That is a cherry. It grows on a tree and it is red just like a strawberry or a cherry. it also has pit.' And you saying, 'Strawberries aren't cherries.' Well I never claimed the two were the same. i just said strawberries and cherries shared the feature of being RED.

 

3rd point - No one believes Shepard's warnings with the exception of the disciples. Gathering people from the station from all walks of life on a divinely inspired mission well doesn't that sound similar to Jesus.

 

Me2

 

4th point - Death and resurrection You don't get anymore on the nose to the Messiah archetype then this. The name of the project is a biblical reference to resurrection. It isn't exactly subtle here.

 

5th point -Continues the theme of the Disciples hell there are even 12 of them.

 

6th point -  Transformation of the holder of a divine truth to an icon - Shepard goes from the person with the divine knowledge from the prothean beacons to the Icon/the symbol of resistance against the hidden threat. A symbol that both fights against this threat but also evangelises along the way. Warning the galaxy of the threat which is solidified in ME3 when the rest of the galaxy realises Shepard was right all along.

 

7th point - The messiah figure does something seemingly bad for a greater good. With jesus it is beating he money leaders out of the temple. With Shepard it is the destruction of the alpha relay. Maybe this person isn't the messiah after all. doubt creeps in.

 

ME3

 

8th point - Arrested - The messiah character is rendered low by the authorities. Shepard and Jesus both arrested. The messiah archetype is a constant theme running through the games it is not isolated nor did it just appear in me2 out of left field.

 

9th point - ascension - Shepard can become a god in one of the endings do I have to explain how this is part of the messiah archetype?

 

10th point - Shepard sacrifices him or herself to save the galaxy. Even in the 'breath ending' Shepard's helmet is shown when cutscene talks about the losses suffered. A plaque with Shepard's name is clearly visible for a ceremony at the ships memorial for their dead. The allusion here is Shepard is being honoured in death for his or her sacrifice.

 

You might not like the messiah archetype but it was consistently told in the series and it wasn't just added in ME2. The death scene in ME2 only makes sense in the context of the Messiah archetype. The messiah Archetype is part of our culture it makes sense why may stories use it. Neo from the matrix is another messianic character in Sci fi. As an atheist have have no problem with the messianic character in fiction.

 

I'd love to know how using the term "The Shepard' was a huge slap in the face? It was a confirmation of the entire series that Shepard was a messianic figure. The games starts with this point of your name and it ends with Shepard actually being given the same title as Jesus, one of them at least.

 

The name Shepard just means he's going to lead and protect. It can be used in either. Yes, the summary you said does sound similar to Jesus but it also sounds similar to John the Baptist and other prophets. Not being believed widely believed is almost universal for prophet characters.

 

I'm going to stop there because after that you move on to ME2 where I already stated they definitely dive into the "Messiah" vision of Shepard. However, it's still stupid. Shepard's death and resurrection are both meaningless and change nothing. Shepard never becomes that icon, however. People still don't take him  seriously and even in the 3rd game, where the Reapers are there, Shepard still needs to do everyone a favor before they help him. The Arrival DLC is ultimately pointless. Shepard didn't do it if you didn't play the DLC. The game makes some Alliance unit do it in that case. Nothing is gained or learned from having done it.

 

There is no comparison to Neo. From the beginning of the 2nd film, most people, including the governing body, believe Neo is special and is their hope for victory, with a few exceptions. Neo is the icon. Shepard never reaches that status. The people in power doubt him and he has to do favors for people to get them to join up.

 

"The Shepard" was a slap in the face because it took the three games and said "It was all a story". Again, you're right that they ended up going the Messianic route but it was done poorly and didn't work. You can look at certain things in the first game and make them fit with just a little effort, but it didn't take shape until ME2.



#881
LinksOcarina

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And yet a non-canon game was used to showcase how they handle canon.

 

Makes sense....  :huh:

 

What an asinine defense...

 

Did BioWare state that their own game between games is canonical/non-canonical, or was it Lucas Arts before they shut down?

 

You know what...why am I even bothering. Us Nerds will argue this pointless **** for hours just to feel right. 



#882
9TailsFox

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                                                                                          <<<<<<<<<<0>>>>>>>>>>

 

For the sake of my sanity, I choose to believe the following:

 

The Old Stuff

1. Andromeda and the Helious Cluster has no Reapers and never will.

2. The Catalyst is a very advance AI created by organics to find a solution to prevent the cycle of  intelligent machines taking over their organic 

    creators.

3. The catalyst controls the Reapers and the  Relays and holds the key to their destruction.

4.  I'll settle for a Codex Entry on how the Pathfinder Initiative and the ARKCON crew got to Andromeda

     Pathfinder patch here: http://forum.bioware...der-initiative/

5. The N7 emblem in the light armour of the individual in the teaser cinematics is there to grab your attention as in "Hey, this is a Mass Effect 

    game" and won't be seen in the actual game.

 

The New Stuff

I'm hoping the game holds true to:

 

You are a pathfinder, a combat trained but un-tested explorer leading an expedition into the Helius cluster to establish a new home for humanity. As you explore this sprawling series of solar systems (over 4x the size of Mass Effect 3), collecting resources and building colonies, you will encounter the savagery of untamed lands in the form of cut-throat outlaws and warring alien races. To survive and colonize the wild reaches of space, you will need to grow your arsenal, your ship, your crew and make strategic (and often uneasy) alliances to fight against increasingly menacing foes. Along the way, you will encounter the remains of a once powerful and mysterious alien race, the Remnant, whose forgotten technology holds the key to gaining power in this region of the galaxy. As you uncover who the Remnant were, and the mysteries their ruins contain, you are drawn into a violent race to find the source of their forgotten technology that will determine the fate of humanity.

 

The above, by itself, is enough for Bio to tell a compelling story. With a max of six squadmates and limited romance options, the word budget allocated to each member is sufficient for better character development than in DAI.  Also, I don't expect any large combat deviation from the previous titles but I do expect some tweaks in Powers and Class (ie: Pathfinder), perhaps even a new slug thrower or three.

 

A key worry is the words Massive and Exploration (from  Bio) focus, which can make the italicized paragraph meaningless, given my DAI experience.  

 

Old Races

Human, Solarian and Krogan are confirmed races. The Solarian from a tweet paraphrased to "solarians are looking good"

 

New Races.

The teaser shows a hostile race with hoofs. No LI there I'm sure. However, I expect the friendly race to be human like and the new alien LI.

 

 

All in all, It's much to soon to criticize what is virtually an unknown game.

So speculations what we will invade explore and attack aliens who just protect her home dirty aggressive savages who don't want accept our democracy. Is true?



#883
9TailsFox

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What an asinine defense...

 

Did BioWare state that their own game between games is canonical/non-canonical, or was it Lucas Arts before they shut down?

 

You know what...why am I even bothering. Us Nerds will argue this pointless **** for hours just to feel right. 

If it's not in book, game, move I read play watch right now it didn't happen unless stated otherwise. 



#884
dreamgazer

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Mass Effect is nothing but a Herculean power trip fantasy. In which the player assumes the role of Commader Shepard, a uber BAMF Space Marine, unstoppable Juggernaut. So unstoppable that not even death nor the 2km tall death machines that are Godlike creatures, can stop Shepard. Shepard is so awesome and special that he/she can decide the fate of the entire galaxy. Also, along the way Shepard can bang all sorts of hot aliens and human s alike. Men want to be him, and women want be under him.

Ultimate Herculean power trip fantasy.


If it were so "Herculean", we'd be able to save all lives in the Battle of the Citadel and preserve the lives and tech remaining on the Collector Base for the organization of our choosing. Instead, the first two games ended with gated choices to complete each story that demanded massive sacrifice instead of simply conquering the odds.
 

And other than ME1 clearly not being the end of a larger story, that would be fine. Despite some silliness, ME was a decent story by itself.


Decent or not, it's absolutely packed with contrivance, from Benezia's immunity to indoctrination and the "irrefutable" geth audio bank delivered by one its creators to fundamental things like the functionality of the MacGuffin Conduit (both its age and its stationary place on an orbiting planet), the Mako's safe landing on the Citadel, and the systematic fragmented nature of the beacon messages themselves. The cipher has a taste of intriguing mystery behind it, but it's also nothing but magical mumbo-jumbo that's created by a sentient plant digesting bodies ... and elaborating further on it in that story would be like "explaining color to a creature without eyes". Let alone the fact that ME1 is also the source of the only true deus-ex-machina in the trilogy: Vigil's datafile, that conveniently grants access to the Citadel's functions. Oh, did I mention that the entire trilogy only exists because a dude was napping during the geth attack on Eden Prime?

Yeah, you'll have to forgive me for not feeling as if ME1 is some beacon of "promise" that ME2 and ME3 didn't live up to, and that's ignoring the fact that Karpyshyn liberally "borrows" from numerous sources in creating the universe, from Revelation Space to Babylon 5.
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#885
DaemionMoadrin

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If it were so "Herculean", we'd be able to save all lives in the Battle of the Citadel and preserve the lives and tech remaining on the Collector Base for the organization of our choosing. Instead, the first two games ended with gated choices to complete each story that demanded massive sacrifice instead of simply conquering the odds.
 

Decent or not, it's absolutely packed with contrivance, from Benezia's immunity to indoctrination and the "irrefutable" geth audio bank delivered by one its creators to fundamental things like the functionality of the MacGuffin Conduit (both its age and its stationary place on an orbiting planet), the Mako's safe landing on the Citadel, and the systematic fragmented nature of the beacon messages themselves. The cipher has a taste of intriguing mystery behind it, but it's also nothing but magical mumbo-jumbo that's created by a sentient plant digesting bodies ... and elaborating further on it in that story would be like "explaining color to a creature without eyes". Let alone the fact that ME1 is also the source of the only true deus-ex-machina in the trilogy: Vigil's datafile, that conveniently grants access to the Citadel's functions. Oh, did I mention that the entire trilogy only exists because a dude was napping during the geth attack on Eden Prime?

Yeah, you'll have to forgive me for not feeling as if ME1 is some beacon of "promise" that ME2 and ME3 didn't live up to, and that's ignoring the fact that Karpyshyn liberally "borrows" from numerous sources in creating the universe, from Revelation Space to Babylon 5.

 

Yes, yes, yes!

 

Quoted for emphasis. :D

 

The entire story from ME1 to ME3 wouldn't work outside out of a video game. It barely works within.



#886
Natureguy85

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Decent or not, it's absolutely packed with contrivance, from Benezia's immunity to indoctrination and the "irrefutable" geth audio bank delivered by one its creators to fundamental things like the functionality of the MacGuffin Conduit (both its age and its stationary place on an orbiting planet), the Mako's safe landing on the Citadel, and the systematic fragmented nature of the beacon messages themselves. The cipher has a taste of intriguing mystery behind it, but it's also nothing but magical mumbo-jumbo that's created by a sentient plant digesting bodies ... and elaborating further on it in that story would be like "explaining color to a creature without eyes". Let alone the fact that ME1 is also the source of the only true deus-ex-machina in the trilogy: Vigil's datafile, that conveniently grants access to the Citadel's functions. Oh, did I mention that the entire trilogy only exists because a dude was napping during the geth attack on Eden Prime?

Yeah, you'll have to forgive me for not feeling as if ME1 is some beacon of "promise" that ME2 and ME3 didn't live up to, and that's ignoring the fact that Karpyshyn liberally "borrows" from numerous sources in creating the universe, from Revelation Space to Babylon 5.

 

Oh there's definitely some chuckle-worthy stuff in there but I rolled with most of it because the story was told well. Lore straining or breaking stuff like the Conduit being able to connect a planet and the Citadel bothers me a bit more than something that's just hokey like the Thorian having the Cipher. How is the datafile a deus ex machina though? All you really control is the station's arms and it made sense to me that Protheans would have that. If they wanted to write it only slightly differently, it's not even necessary. You're just undoing Saren's command. Maybe I'm forgetting something though.



#887
DaemionMoadrin

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Oh there's definitely some chuckle-worthy stuff in there but I rolled with most of it because the story was told well. Lore straining or breaking stuff like the Conduit being able to connect a planet and the Citadel bothers me a bit more than something that's just hokey like the Thorian having the Cipher. How is the datafile a deus ex machina though? All you really control is the station's arms and it made sense to me that Protheans would have that. If they wanted to write it only slightly differently, it's not even necessary. You're just undoing Saren's command. Maybe I'm forgetting something though.

 

The better question is: How did Saren/Sovereign even know about the Conduit?

 

Follow up: Why would they go to all that trouble, exposing themselves and warning the galaxy of the Reaper threat if there are a much easier ways for a Spectre to walk into the Council chambers (you know, like Shepard does all the time)?

 

Another question: Why draw attention to the Thorian with the attempt to destroy it? No one would have known about it without the Geth attack.

 

Yet another: Why would Sovereign go to Eden Prime itself, if Geth ships could do the job just as well?

 

Last one: Why clone Krogans? Whatever are they good for?



#888
EmissaryofLies

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With the way gaming is nowadays, I cannot help but not be surprised.



#889
pdusen

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All in all, It's much to soon to criticize what is virtually an unknown game.

 

I agree emphatically.



#890
Maniccc

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One thing to consider about controlling the reapers is there is evidence for the reapers not being independent. Quite strong evidence.  That evidence is how the cycles seem to create technologies based on the biology of the current cycle. In the prothean cycle that manifested in the beacons and communication via touch. In the Leviathan cycle it is domination of minds. Reapers use this technology in the form of indoctrination because that is how Leviathan control things. I think it is no great leap of unsupported logic to view the Leviathan's creation, the catalyst using this form of control on the reapers. It is how the Leviathans control and it is how the Reapers control why would the AI built by the Leviathans and Created the reapers to use this form of control not use it itself? It wouldn't make any sense for it NOT to use mind control to control the reapers when it built them with it.

 

I am pointing out that there are internally consistent reasons within the story for there not to be any Reapers any where in ME:A, at least not as a threat.  This whole discussion about the reapers was because of some people's QQing at the series being in Andromeda. And this fanciful Idea that you have to use magic hand waving to explain why there are no reapers in Andromeda. Its just sour grape that ME3 wasn't the ending they wanted and they hoped ME:Next would really be ME4 and fixed all the bad in me3. The reapers crisis is solved and as bad as the game was in implementing the endings they did do one thing, they all end the reaper crisis. If there was one thing they did it was that.

This doesn't make any sense.  There is a huge difference between the Reapers and the organics they harvest, and the husks they create, the technologies they subvert to aid their harvests.  If you think about it, actually, it's better to have each Reaper as an individual capable of independent thought in order to deal with localized unexpected issues.

Besides, ignoring the whole each Reaper is an individual nation line, we know that each Reaper is a vessel for unique DNA, embodying a species.  

 

These things actually disagree with your conclusions.



#891
In Exile

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The reaper being a fridge for DNA storage doesn't mean very much. We have laboratories that keep jars of DNA on file, but the test tube doesn't have to be sentient.

#892
Maniccc

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The reaper being a fridge for DNA storage doesn't mean very much. We have laboratories that keep jars of DNA on file, but the test tube doesn't have to be sentient.

But the Reapers are not mere storage...I mean come on, you're not even trying.

 

Look, it might be the case that they are mere vessels/tools with no awareness.  But I see no indication to arrive at that conclusion.  The dialogue lines we get state quite the opposite, and while some may wish to handwave all of that into oblivion because it's convenient for their opinion. the lines are still there.  Sure, some may have been exaggerations, or lies even, such as the whole being eternal business.  That could certainly be a statement of supreme arrogance as well as a bit of psychological warfare.  But that does not mean everything said was a lie, or even exaggerated.  If you're going to claim this or that line was a lie, then you need to prove it.



#893
LinksOcarina

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If it's not in book, game, move I read play watch right now it didn't happen unless stated otherwise. 

 

I know that.

 

My point though is the fact that BioWare chose a canonical ending to the first game in the KotoR series. And the defense is essentially, well it's not canonical anymore so it doesn't count.

 

Seriously...what the **** is wrong with that logic?



#894
Nohvarr

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  All in all, It's much to soon to criticize what is virtually an unknown game.

That's not how the Internet works. People are guilty of the crimes/mistakes/etc until proven otherwise and sometimes not even then.



#895
Milkmaid79

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No they don't have the right idea. As much as I love Deus Ex, they lost a lot of respect from me by doing the whole "We aren't addressing the thing(choices) that we sold you as very important". 

Bioware has already done that- "Leliana dead? I don't think so, players." "You killed the Rachni queen? We found another one." "Destroyed the Collector base? It didn't even slow Cerberus down." "Your Revan was a woman or wasn't interested in bratty Bastila? Too bad, our Revan impregnated her and started a Shan dynasty."


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#896
Milkmaid79

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I haven't seen you, or anyone for that matter, propose a satisfactory way that they could simultaneously address all divergent states of the galaxy while also not canonizing an ending.

Because it can't be done.

Like at all.

And so we are left with two choices: Canonize an ending and keep the setting in the MW. Or move the setting to some region of space that is completely divorced from the prior setting. That's it. There are no other true options for a "sequel" set in the same timeline as the Reaper war. And if you think there are other options that aren't completely stupid, I would like to hear them.

Personally, I would rather move the setting than canonize an ending. I guess you would disagree, judging from your posts. That's fine, of course, but I don't see a third option. So there's no use really in saying that they are running away and not addressing their mistakes...because the mistakes were so bad that they honestly can't address them in the way that you want them to.

If they are that bad at writing a story why would you trust them to write a good game just because it has a new setting?



#897
Sartoz

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sartoz

Is "Pathfinder Initiative and the ARKCON crew" official sterile clean white spacecraft with gazillion of procedures (ISO1000000 and 1'st Directive) , breeding tanks and star fleet officers dressed  in stiff irreproachable uniforms?

Or it is like Mayflower or other ships that were bringing hungry shady characters to the new word so they colonized it, in wild west style, with blood relations, vendetta  gunfight and love ......?

This is basic question before I buy the game. I do not want official mission form government. I want it Omega style like NY was in XVIII century true colonization.

 

                                                                                                    <<<<<<<<<<0>>>>>>>>>>

 

I'm sure Bio will reveal more at the next E3/PAX convention.
 



#898
Nohvarr

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If they are that bad at writing a story why would you trust them to write a good game just because it has a new setting?

Because people recall more good times than bad with the ME series, and the idea of a new setting, fresh and unencumbered by the baggage of the past appeals to those same people?



#899
Sartoz

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But the Reapers are not mere storage...I mean come on, you're not even trying.

 

Look, it might be the case that they are mere vessels/tools with no awareness.  But I see no indication to arrive at that conclusion.  The dialogue lines we get state quite the opposite, and while some may wish to handwave all of that into oblivion because it's convenient for their opinion. the lines are still there.  Sure, some may have been exaggerations, or lies even, such as the whole being eternal business.  That could certainly be a statement of supreme arrogance as well as a bit of psychological warfare.  But that does not mean everything said was a lie, or even exaggerated.  If you're going to claim this or that line was a lie, then you need to prove it.

 

                                                                                               <<<<<<<<<<0>>>>>>>>>>>

 

No, but they are controlled by the Catalyst (ie: the Star Child). To recap the Purpose of the reapers.

 

From Wiki: http://masseffect.wi...m/wiki/Catalyst

 

The Catalyst serves as the architect and overseer of the Reapers and their cycles. As it explains to Commander Shepard, the Catalyst was created by the Leviathans, who noticed that many of the organic races they commanded were eventually felled by their own synthetic creations. To prevent such events from happening, they created the Catalyst - which they referred to as "The Intelligence" - to oversee relations between organic and synthetic life. The Catalyst was programmed to ensure the continued existence of life in the galaxy through any means necessary.

 

In order to fulfill its task, it created pawns that spread throughout the galaxy, collecting physical data from various organics in the cosmos. It studied the development of civilizations, and its understanding grew until it found a solution.

 

The Catalyst determined that organics create synthetics to improve their own existence, but those improvements have limits. To exceed those limits, synthetics must be allowed to evolve. They must, by definition, surpass their creators. The result is inevitable chaos and destruction, so the Catalyst chose to resolve the problem of organic-synthetic conflict by putting in place a system which would prevent any civilization from reaching such a point.

 

The Catalyst's solution took the form of the Reapers. The Intelligence turned on its creators, using its pawns to slaughter the Leviathans and process them into a construct based on their likeness. This construct was the very first Reaper, known to the modern galaxy as Harbinger. The memories of the Leviathans used to create Harbinger were preserved as the Reaper's gestalt consciousness, which in turn was incorporated into the Catalyst itself.

 

 
320px-Ert_%2B_citadel_-_control_2.png

The Catalyst's solution dictated that all spacefaring organic and synthetic species would be harvested, with millions of bodies and minds from each race being processed and converted into new Reapers made in Harbinger's image, even as the Reapers themselves worked to destroy their civilizations. By doing this, the Reapers synthetically preserved the harvested race's genetic makeup and collective knowledge, while simultaneously allowing for more primitive races to advance. This harvest ensured that the threat of complete annihilation of organics by synthetics was effectively averted.

 

While the Catalyst regarded this solution as near-perfect, it strove to fulfill its purpose and reach a superior solution. To this end, it commanded the Reapers to build the mass relays, speeding the development of civilizations during each cycle and increasing the efficiency of the entire process. The entire galaxy became the Catalyst's "experiment" as it continued to harvest races and collect ever more data in an effort to find the ultimate answer to the conflict. The Catalyst came upon the idea of merging organic and synthetic life as a possible solution and attempted to do so numerous times in the past, but it always resulted in failure. It blames organics for the failure, stating they were not "ready" and that the process cannot be forced.

 

Several cycles before the present harvest, the Catalyst became aware of a concept that could potentially be used to destroy the Reapers. It attempted to eradicate this concept, unaware that the idea evolved and survived into the present in the form of the Crucible.

Discovery
 
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When Shepard encounters the Catalyst during the closing stages of the war, it chooses to represent itself as a transparent projection, taking the form of a young boy the Commander saw killed during the Reaper invasion of Earth. The Catalyst expresses irritation at Shepard's arrival in its chambers if the galaxy is ill-prepared, or conducts itself in a more neutral manner if otherwise. Nevertheless, Shepard comments on it being a mere AI, and the Catalyst retorts that it's "just an AI" in as much as Shepard is just an animal when the construct begins explaining its nature.

 

In the presence of the completed Crucible now docked into the Citadel, the Catalyst muses that organics are clearly more resourceful than previously realized. It further relates that Shepard is the first organic being to stand in its chamber to converse with it, which caused it to reassess its solution. It cannot, however, bring about a change without Shepard's intervention.

 

The Catalyst is presumed lost in some of the possible choices Shepard can make. The Destroy option wipes out all synthetic life, and a digital copy of Shepard's consciousness replaces the Catalyst as the Reapers' master AI if Control was chosen instead. It is unknown what happens to it if Shepard merges organic and synthetic life, or if Shepard refuses to use the Crucible, though the Stargazer narrating the tale of eras long gone claims to be free of the Reaper threat in their time



#900
In Exile

In Exile
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But the Reapers are not mere storage...I mean come on, you're not even trying.

 

Look, it might be the case that they are mere vessels/tools with no awareness.  But I see no indication to arrive at that conclusion.  The dialogue lines we get state quite the opposite, and while some may wish to handwave all of that into oblivion because it's convenient for their opinion. the lines are still there.  Sure, some may have been exaggerations, or lies even, such as the whole being eternal business.  That could certainly be a statement of supreme arrogance as well as a bit of psychological warfare.  But that does not mean everything said was a lie, or even exaggerated.  If you're going to claim this or that line was a lie, then you need to prove it.

 

The suggestion that the mere fact that the reapers have DNA vats leads to sapience is, to say the least, nonsense. Bioware's never bothered to go into what makes reapers "alive", and ME3 effectively dropped any semblance of a role for individual reapers (apart from that one reaper on Rannoch). 

 

The idea, however, that what makes repears special (or even alive) flows from their being filled with organic slurpee doesn't make sense, even within ME3's nonsense science.