233 réponses à ce sujet

[Amplitudelol]

I don't want Bioware to do that. And I don't think I'm the only one.

 

I'd like Bioware to show us the world after ME3. I'd like my Shepard's victory to mean something for the next game. I don't care that we're going to Andromeda - after all that makes the endings considerably easier to handle in-game - but I do want us to have left after the Reaper war.

 

I've said it before: A plotline set after ME3 - we survived, we rebuilt, and now we're once more questing out to explore the universe - feels like an affirmation of the fact that we won the Reaper War. For me, it makes ME3 feel worth something, rather than dodging the ending and making ME3 feel worthless.

 

And did the cyborg people with green eyes rebuild the galaxy and travel to Andromeda or the organics who defeated the reapers? Traveling to Andromeda after the war? Mordin would say problematic.

[JasonShepard]

And did the cyborg people with green eyes rebuild the galaxy and travel to Andromeda or the organics who defeated the reapers? Traveling to Andromeda after the war? Mordin would say problematic.

 

That was covered in the reason and method parts of my post - they found a relay which went there, and decided to find out who built this relay and why. Going to Andromeda doesn't have to be a Reaper evacuation, and doesn't have to be a ludicrous investment of resources.

[SNascimento]

That's exactly what I fear the most. 

An ark project that was developed in parallel to the Crucible with the same source of technology (ancient ruins). I mean, it's bad enough the reapers allowed the Crucible to be built, but an ark too? And how many ways to survive the reapers are there to be found? And Shepard doesn't know anything about it?

I honestly hope Bioware come with something better than that. 

[Eyes_Only]

its a good theory and makes sense. I like it.

[The Heretic of Time]

So again it boils down to Protean tech saving the day and humanity once again being the special snowflakes who save the Milky Way species (by finding this Ark tech first and leading the Ark initiative).

 

No, I don't like that, and I don't think it's very likely that this is the case. Everything from July 2186 and onward seems quite likely and I can see BioWare going down that route, but everything in this theory before that date is nonsense which I don't want to see in ME:A.

[Bacus]

TY op, now i understand the theory.

I don't endorse it but i believe it to be a plausible outcome.

[Chealec]

I've said it before: A plotline set after ME3 - we survived, we rebuilt, and now we're once more questing out to explore the universe - feels like an affirmation of the fact that we won the Reaper War. ...

 

... but what about if you didn't win the Reaper war? What if you chose the "screw you - I'm not gonna make that choice" option, let the Reapers win and ended ME3 with a Liara hologram attempting to explain the situation to the races of the next cycle?

[JasonShepard]

... but what about if you didn't win the Reaper war? What if you chose the "screw you - I'm not gonna make that choice" option, let the Reapers win and ended ME3 with a Liara hologram attempting to explain the situation to the races of the next cycle?

 

Forgive me, but I'm guessing that Refuse will be treated the same way as ME2's squadwipe ending.

[LoRD KYRaN]

I really like this scenario. Seems very plausible and explains things quite simply. Allows us to start afresh while still at least referencing ME1-3 and that makes it feel connected. 

[timebean]

This theory is almost exactly what i thought as well. Really nice job putting it together with so much detail!

 

I don't think Bioware is going to completely disregard the events of the ME1 through ME3 series, even if they go the ARK route. Maybe they will have some way that Andromeda folks will be communicating with Milky Way (quantum entanglement, maybe???).  Or maybe we will just have some sort of history lesson somewhere in the game that calls back to those events.

 

Bioware always seem to let the player choices from previous games be present in the newer games, at least in the DA universe.  The problem is...it tends to be very unsatisfying. Example...a letter from the warden on the war table. People were furious that we didn't get more.  I think they should have just kept the warden out completely OR integrated them more fully.  Soggy cereal tastes way worse then dry cereal, in my opinion.

 

Personally, I think they should go whole hog with whatever they do.  If is a  new universe with a new story, let it stand alone.  If  they want to make it a sequel, then integrate the past events in a meaningful way.  It is always a poor product when they attempt to do both.

[Kabooooom]

I figure we'll probably be getting to Andromeda via a method similar to this - some ancient technology gets discovered, (probably not Reaper-tech) that's effectively a relay leading to Andromeda.

Maybe the Andromeda relay takes ages to activate, or is costly to use, or gets destroyed shortly after we use it - regardless, there'll probably be some reason why we can't get back to the Milky Way in-game. (Or maybe there won't be, and we'd be able to visit a few key Milky Way locations, but with most of the plot taking place in Andromeda.)

Our reason for going? We found a relay that goes to Andromeda. Why wouldn't you use it? Wouldn't you want to know what might be at the far side, who built it? This is like finding a door out of your house that you've never seen before - of course you're going to find out what's on the other side, even if just for security concerns. And once you know that it's uncolonised space on the far side... well, various races will be lobbying to be doing the colonising, even if this is taking place during a period of peace.

But none of that is the real question being asked, is it?

The real question is: When are we leaving?

Ark theory is based around the idea that we completely dodge the ME3 endings. So we leave before the Crucible goes off. We leave as part of a Reaper-evacuation-plan.

I don't want Bioware to do that. And I don't think I'm the only one.

I'd like Bioware to show us the world after ME3. I'd like my Shepard's victory to mean something for the next game. I don't care that we're going to Andromeda - after all that makes the endings considerably easier to handle in-game - but I do want us to have left after the Reaper war.

I've said it before: A plotline set after ME3 - we survived, we rebuilt, and now we're once more questing out to explore the universe - feels like an affirmation of the fact that we won the Reaper War. For me, it makes ME3 feel worth something, rather than dodging the ending and making ME3 feel worthless.

And that's why the OP's suggestion is not what I'd like to see in ME:A. (With all due respect to Jen-Yu, who has put together a very nicely presented timeline there. If leaving-during-ME3 is ultimately chosen by Bioware, I wouldn't mind a timeline like this.)

The problem with this is that it completely ignores the out-of-universe reason why Bioware is moving the story to Andromeda - which is obviously to avoid the endings. I mean, lets be frank here - we literally predicted the move to Andromeda a year ago based on nothing but a single piece of concept art and the logical deduction that Bioware fucked up the Milky Way in future states that are so divergent that they are beyond reconciliation in any way that preserves player choice.

That's literally how obvious this was. Blatantly obvious. And so, I have a hard time believing that they will address the ME3 endings in the manner you suggest by having them leave after the Reaper war. More likely, if they address them at all it will be via QEC communication with the Milky Way or something. Which would be hilarious, because I can imagine everyone going "hey we won you guys can come back now!" And the Andromeda colonists are like "yeah...so we sort of destroyed the counterpart relay that brought us here..."

[Little Princess Peach]

Not a fan of this in any way, shape, or form. 

can you explain why though?

[JasonShepard]

The problem with this is that it completely ignores the out-of-universe reason why Bioware is moving the story to Andromeda - which is obviously to avoid the endings. I mean, lets be frank here - we literally predicted the move to Andromeda a year ago based on nothing but a single piece of concept art and the logical deduction that Bioware fucked up the Milky Way in future states that are so divergent that they are beyond reconciliation in any way that preserves player choice.

That's literally how obvious this was. Blatantly obvious. And so, I have a hard time believing that they will address the ME3 endings in the manner you suggest by having them leave after the Reaper war. More likely, if they address them at all it will be via QEC communication with the Milky Way or something. Which would be hilarious, because I can imagine everyone going "hey we won you guys can come back now!" And the Andromeda colonists are like "yeah...so we sort of destroyed the counterpart relay that brought us here..."

 

You're right, of course. We're almost certainly moving to Andromeda because staying in the Milky Way and being post ME3 was deemed too difficult - and nobody wanted a prequel. I'm not disputing that. And I'm aware that Ark-theory has been around for long before ME:A's announcement. (Though what was the concept art?)

 

I'm arguing that a move to Andromeda makes the endings easy enough to handle that they can be included - even if we left after the Crucible fired. Especially if some time has passed since ME3. Control and Destroy are similar enough if the Reapers stay behind in the Milky Way (and the Rannoch decision leaves the Geth's survival up in the air regardless of whether you picked Destroy). Synthesis is trickier - but would only affect anyone from the Milky Way, rather than every last bit of life that we encounter (because you can bet that Andromeda will have some native life of its own), and even then the individual effects of Synthesis are vague in the extreme.

[Chealec]

Forgive me, but I'm guessing that Refuse will be treated the same way as ME2's squadwipe ending.

 

Wait... it was possible to kill everyone in ME2?

 

First time I played through I lost Grunt and Legion and ME3 coped - but the whole squad?

[JasonShepard]

Wait... it was possible to kill everyone in ME2?

 

First time I played through I lost Grunt and Legion and ME3 coped - but the whole squad?

 

Yeah - though it required something of a conscious effort. Normandy ends up going home with just Joker and EDI on board, and you can't import the file to ME3.

[Navasha]

To keep it in the realm of even sci-fi possibility though, travel to Andromeda is almost going to have to be a natural worm-hole type of situation.    Travelling between galaxies just isn't within the realm of tech that they have defined for our galaxy.  

 

Sorry but 2.5 million light-years distance without any means to refuel, grow food, etc...    Its just not in the realm of Mass Effect's reality. 

 

Having a one-way wormhole solves a lot of questions and doesn't require them to come up with long drawn out explanation to cover literally thousands of impossible scenarios. 

 

I would say they would have had to also leave before the whole crucible event.   Why would they do it after?   Makes much more sense that a lifeboat of civilization was cast off when things were darkest.

[Ahriman]

Sorry but 2.5 million light-years distance without any means to refuel, grow food, etc...    Its just not in the realm of Mass Effect's reality. 

Reaper. Tech. Reaper engine can make it in about 250 years without need to discharge.

[Malanek]

Assuming the writers want to keep the galaxies separate and not have a story spanning both, I have a real problem with any technological solution that will get them there in less than 1000 years. I can accept all the logic presented in this theory, even though some of it is a stretch. What I can't accept is the clumsy way of storytelling in that it leaves a massive can of worms open. If the Protheans can create this so can the Reapers. Even if you create more contrivances trying to explain that the reapers wouldn't go there because reasons, they certainly would under control or synthesis. And they would probably go there faster and more efficiently.

 

But most of all what I can't stand is that it is all NEEDLESS contrivance. If they want get to andromeda, make it an accident. Wormhole is created from crucible explosion and swallows a bunch of ships, then closes. It's so simple, it keeps the galaxies separate, and all the pieces were perfectly set up in the ME3 story. It feels natural.

[Drone223]

Its very contrived not to mention the current technology level makes traveling to another galaxy impossible.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

 

can you explain why though?

Sure. I'll go panel by panel. 

 

 

1) It starts with yet another Deus Ex Machina device located in the ruins of Mars. It's also illogical that the Protheans would hide all of their Reaper countermeasures in a single location rather than spreading them out. 

 

2) The Cipher was not needed for everything else found in the Mars ruins. Both the basic Mass Effect technology schematics and the Crucible schematics were practically spoonfed to us with how simple to understand they were made to be. And only Shepard has the Cipher, yet was not involved with the project at any point in time. 

 

3) There is no way this was kept secret. Humanity didn't know there was anyone to keep it secret from at that point, and a discovery like this would have been front page news all over human space. 

 

 

 

1) Again, the ark would not be secret. Humanity would have revealed it to the Council races to earn points with them, just like we did all the other Prothean stuff we found. Even so, a bunch of the Council races' top scientists disappearing for some secret mission would draw attention. 

 

2) So Liara is a backstabber now? And how would she even be able to help. They still need the Cipher according to this timeline, and she doesn't have it. We know this because she doesn't understand Prothean while Shepard does. 

 

 

 

1) At that time all the races of the Milky Way are already devoting everything to either defending their worlds of to the Crucible. Also, why would they purposefully put stress on Shepard and the others by keeping a contingency secret, when telling them would be a tactically sound move since it relieves some of the stress knowing that everything does not depend on them. 

 

 

1) You can't secretly amass a flotilla of evacuees, live ships, agricultural vessels, resource processing platforms, and fabrication systems. A move of that scale will draw attention. Even the Crucible was known to be in production by the galaxy, and that was only involving military and scientists. When civilians get involved, the leaks will increase exponentially. 

 

 

1) So we are going to be playing as a coward? 

 

2) Why destroy the Ark? Even if the Reapers followed, they'd have to search the entire Andromeda galaxy for a single flotilla.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

So how do you guys think that humans and a bunch of other species that evolved in the Milky Way will be getting to Andromeda? And what's their reason for leaving the Milky Way?

There are a few ways.

They could leave after the endings, having had decades to reverse-engineer Reaper drives and/or the Reapers help build them. 

They could go through the Citadel Relay and discover it connects to another Citadel in Andromeda. 

They could fly through a wormhole. 

 

As for their reasoning, there are any number of reasons why people explore places never seen before. 

 

Yeah, but you're never a fan of anything.

Not true. I'm a fan of many things Bioware does. 

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Wait... it was possible to kill everyone in ME2?

 

First time I played through I lost Grunt and Legion and ME3 coped - but the whole squad?

Yeah, you can have it so the only survivors are Joker and EDI. Shepard, all the companions, and the rest of the crew can die. For obvious reasons, this ending didn't transfer to ME3. 

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

ARKCON had to be an Asari contingency. Why? Other species would be selfish about it and be concerned with only their own. Yet the Asari would invite other species, in fact probably enlist them because they prefer other species for mating. Thus sufficient numbers of the other species necessary to maintain or grow a population would be brought along. This is a true intergalactic ark that is powered by FTL drives and mass effect cores designed exactly like Sovereign's which require no discharge. The Ark is  so  big it contains other large ships and small ships necessary for starting a civilization.

 

So what is the way to solve the ending problem? Satisfy no one - Mac makes one canon change.... Shepard refuses.

 

The Opening of the  Game - You create your character -

 

1) The Battle of Nevos - You're one of the last people loaded into his/her cryo pod. The remnants of the Galactic Fleet under Admiral Hackett make their final stand and sacrifice themselves so that this Ark can get away. The Ark leaves its docking station under reaper fire but its shields and armor is strong being made out of the same  hull  material as a reaper. it goes into FTL and leaves. A few of the ships  in the fleet escape to FTL many are  destroyed. Hackett dies. The Normandy is destroyed.

 

2) days, weeks, months, years, decades, centuries pass until we finally arrive at the cluster. Then the ark stops. The story progresses from there.

 

I'd like our character to  be a nobody, and  have to earn our way.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

ARKCON had to be an Asari contingency. Why? Other species would be selfish about it and be concerned with only their own. Yet the Asari would invite other species, in fact probably enlist them because they prefer other species for mating. Thus sufficient numbers of the other species necessary to maintain or grow a population would be brought along. This is a true intergalactic ark that is powered by FTL drives and mass effect cores designed exactly like Sovereign's which require no discharge. The Ark is  so  big it contains other large ships and small ships necessary for starting a civilization.

These the same Asari whose leaders kept the largest Prothean data cache secret so they would have an advantage over the other races of the cycle? A data cache that could have helped us defeat the Reapers before they even showed up, sparing trillions of lives. Even the reason for bringing other races in your example is inherently selfish: diversify their genetic pool.

We are nowhere near that technology you describe yet.  

 

So what is the way to solve the ending problem? Satisfy no one - Mac makes one canon change.... Shepard refuses.

That makes the Refuse ending canon, meaning it will satisfy those fans while also going against Bioware's "There is no canon ending" statements. 

[Monica21]

There are a few ways.

They could leave after the endings, having had decades to reverse-engineer Reaper drives and/or the Reapers help build them. 

They could go through the Citadel Relay and discover it connects to another Citadel in Andromeda. 

They could fly through a wormhole. 

 

As for their reasoning, there are any number of reasons why people explore places never seen before. 

 

If they leave after the endings, then there has to be a canon ending. Bioware won't do that.

 

I'd rather not have another Citadel, because having a copycat galaxy seems like a cop-out. What would be the point of it? Are we going to fight Andromeda Reapers there too?

 

They could fly through a wormhole in an ark, too.

 

Yes, there are many reasons to explore places unseen, but from what little we know (which is admittedly very little) of Andromeda, they've taken much of the civilization of the Milky Way with them. There's a guy in N7 armor. Where did that come from? It's possible that humans on board an ark were Alliance military and kept the N7 program going. Many of the races that we already know of will be in Andromeda, and that's what fits most closely with the Asari councilor's statement about making preparations. Ensuring the continuity of civilization means just that. It's not just having a leg up technologically because that seems very small compared to what's at stake.