108 réponses à ce sujet

[LOLandStuff]

Bad Monday and here to vent.

[Toasted Llama]

Companies can do whatever they want, I am not attacking that. I am talking about the consumers to buy into everything that companies do. That is the crux if my argument. The reason why companies does certain tactics is because they know people will buy it. When people stop buying it, companies abandon said tactic and move onto another profit making venture. Again, like the class clown.

 

The reason why it irks me is that not all companies treats DLC the same. There are some companies like Rockstar that does not treat DLC as small item packs that should have been in the base game (Think day 1 DLC or alternate outfits that are released a month after the game comes out for a price) Those are things that Bioware does a lot and they will continue because people like the ones in this thread will continue to throw money at EA all while EA goes and laughs all the way to the bank. If EA/Bioware is to do stuff like this, whats to say it doesn't term into more where we get to the point where a game releases with a small set of weapons and armor, only for the developer to gradually release more weapons and armor over the coming months for a price?

 

Yes, I understand capitalism and so on, but that does not mean that we consumers cannot be logical consumers and actually think about what we are supporting instead of just buying stuff because we have the "disposable income" to do so. 

 

And to add fuel to the fire, Bioware/EA decides to SEPERATE this DLC from the upcoming Qunari story related DLC (we all know its coming). Again, like the Spoils of the Avaar dlc....the contents in it should have been included in Jaws of Hakkon but wasn't. Instead, Bioware reserves some things so that they can sell at a later date. I doubt that the Spoils of the Avaar content wasn't ready when Jaws of Hakkon released, I am pretty sure they had all the content there, but put it asside because they didn't want to give it all away in one purchase, they wanted to milk it as much as they could and boy where they right because you all ate it all up without any pushback or question what so ever. Again, if I were EA, I would be happy that my consumers are the way they are and not really taking a stance against what they do in relation to DLC.

 

Again, this is EA when they read threads like this and see that people actually buy such DLC without really putting up any argument. 

 

So basically; you personally dislike the way Bioware/EA handles their DLCs and you hope that other consumers stop buying those DLCs as well by.... Antagonizing them?

 

Look; there's multiple companies whose business practices I do not like and whose DLCs I won't buy because I don't find them worth it. In fact I don't even personally own any of Inquisition's DLC because, again, I don't find them worth it.

 

But I'm not going to shame other people who want to buy those DLCs or support the business practices I dislike. It's pointless, destroys the community and creates a hostile environment.

These consumers don't affect you. Even if EA/Bioware starts to release games with 2 different types of armor/weapons and then release the DLCs later, you can always stop buying games from EA/Bioware. Buy them second hand if you really, really want to play those games. Or become a pirate. There's plenty of other companies out there so why care about EA/Bioware at all?

 

Something I learned after playing a pay2win MMO for 6 years, constantly being angry that the company was squeezing out all the money they could get and the fact that players who weren't willing to dish out amounts of money well into the 4 digits to even compete were completely ignored. The company didn't listen, obviously, because people kept sinking hundreds of dollars into pockets every month.

Eventually I gave up being angry, so I left and never looked back. Best decision ever; found other MMOs that had much better business practices that I enjoy so much more.

(Oh, and: That MMO is dying right now because nobody liked their business practice anymore. See? The free market corrected itself.)

[Giantdeathrobot]

For frick's sake, don't like it don't buy it. It's what I did; I bought JoH because it seemd nice, I didn't buy Spoils of the Avvar, and I won't buy Spoild of the Qunari. Simple as that. That 5$ less to EA already does more than shouting up and down the forums and accusing anyone that likes the DLC of being sheep.

 

Gaming would be a way less hostile and bitter environment if people stopped getting their panties in a bunch over what other people are doing with their money. 

[Balek-Vriege]

For frick's sake, don't like it don't buy it. It's what I did; I bought JoH because it seemd nice, I didn't buy Spoils of the Avvar, and I won't buy Spoild of the Qunari. Simple as that. That 5$ less to EA already does more than shouting up and down the forums and accusing anyone that likes the DLC of being sheep.

 

Gaming would be a way less hostile and bitter environment if people stopped getting their panties in a bunch over what other people are doing with their money. 

 

I'm going by this creed.  I do always buy story DLC good or not, but item pack DLC are totally optional.  I didn't buy Spoils of the Avvar but may buy Spoils of the Qunari (if they fix the Throne for cutscenes).  Only because it would be wicked for a Qunari playthrough which I haven't done but was interested in.

 

My opinion of course.  I don't care if no one else buys it or everyone else buys it.

[ShadowLordXII]

For frick's sake, don't like it don't buy it. It's what I did; I bought JoH because it seemd nice, I didn't buy Spoils of the Avvar, and I won't buy Spoild of the Qunari. Simple as that. That 5$ less to EA already does more than shouting up and down the forums and accusing anyone that likes the DLC of being sheep.

 

Gaming would be a way less hostile and bitter environment if people stopped getting their panties in a bunch over what other people are doing with their money. 

 

Are we really going to equate criticizing unethical business practices to aimless whining?

 

The reason why some folks get their "panties in a bunch" over what other people spend their money on is because those people are indirectly/directly supporting unethical business nonsense. And when that happens, that just encourages the guilty company's to keep doing it because they're convinced that they'll still make a profit regardless of criticism.

 

You don't have to agree and you're free to counter-argue. But don't just handwave it as whining. One way to make a better environment is to constructively discuss these issues and bring different viewpoints and facts to the table without pointing fingers or mud-slinging.

 

Personally, I don't see any proof that these item packs are an unethical business practice meant to squeeze out more money. And that's admitting that the Qunari PC got the shaft regarding unique armor and weapons compared to the other races. So I may end up getting the Spoils of the Qunari pack unless I see evidence that there is some bs at play.

[leaguer of one]

Well, if they support being nickle and dimed by EA for excluding content from a larger DLC to sell separately in another DLC then I guess that is on them.

 

Just don't come back and complain as to why the industry is exploiting the consumers through micro transactions and small item DLC packs that in many ways should have been included in the vanilla game.

You call this nickel and dimming? In the world were pay to play phone games and horse armor exists?

[In Exile]

Are we really going to equate criticizing unethical business practices to aimless whining?

 

The reason why some folks get their "panties in a bunch" over what other people spend their money on is because those people are indirectly/directly supporting unethical business nonsense. And when that happens, that just encourages the guilty company's to keep doing it because they're convinced that they'll still make a profit regardless of criticism.

 

You don't have to agree and you're free to counter-argue. But don't just handwave it as whining. One way to make a better environment is to constructively discuss these issues and bring different viewpoints and facts to the table without pointing fingers or mud-slinging.

 

Personally, I don't see any proof that these item packs are an unethical business practice meant to squeeze out more money. And that's admitting that the Qunari PC got the shaft regarding unique armor and weapons compared to the other races. So I may end up getting the Spoils of the Qunari pack unless I see evidence that there is some bs at play.

 

People don't understand how business practices work. Just because you don't buy a product doesn't mean the message you're sending is that you hate unethical business practices. The take-away for the company might well be that they're not being unethical enough to get you to spend the money. 

 

To put it differently, if you (and I note I'm just using the generally "you") don't buy Spoils of Qunari, the inference isn't necessarily that you are against cosmetic item DLC. It might just be they sold the wrong cosmetic item DLC (maybe it needs more horse armour). 

[Balek-Vriege]

Yeah a lot of the time the problem is this when it comes to DLC pricing:

 

-  You have a possibly a 100-200 hour long game that took thousands of man hours for say $59,99

-  Then a Story DLC which is 10-20 hours long that took hundreds of hours for $14.99

-  An item pack offering 0 hours of content which took less than a hundred hours to make for $4.99.

 

This may seem like a ripoff but it actually isn't in my opinion.  In fact I personally think its the opposite the more technologically advanced games become.  RPGs are fairly underpriced for the content and the amount of hours of play they offer these days.  Same with free to play MMOs where you can get away with paying like $100 for 2-5 years of playtime.  However, both are restricted by market forces and industry competition.  Why would I buy your 200 dollar RPG/MMO when I can buy the new action/person shooter with like 10 hours of unique play, but I will play for the same amount of time as an RPG and still have fun for $49.99?

 

Story DLC are somewhat limited by the same market forces because expansion packs have historically been 60% of the cost of the main game, even though some expansion packs of the past have offered far less or far more than current story DLCs. So story DLC is kind of limited to a $7.99-$19.99 price range from a one hour quests to expansion pack sized content called DLC in name only.

 

Item packs are almost completely independent from the competition and market forces of full games, expansions and story DLC.  First off they're a different kind of product that's utterly vanity based when not pay to win.  They're also probably the most profitable for time spent developing them.  Developers/Publishers feel more free to charge what they think is fair or to milk it because the people who would buy it will pay 99 cents, 5 dollars or even closer to 7 dollars for the vanity content (if its cool enough).  In the end you make loads of profit.  Free to play MMOs figured this out a long time ago and are able to keep up with subscription MMOs (or better) for profits.

 

Again, it seems unfair when comparing all three but the only reason you're not paying $200 dollars for an RPG and $50 dollars for a Story DLC is because of market forces in the overall gaming industry.  Also compare it do entertainment purchases like movies, plays and more and the pricing seems fairly cheap if you really get a kick out of gaming.

 

Who said business is fair in the first place though?  It's up to the consumers to decide what's comparibly fair pricing between various things then buy or not buy.  Cost adjustment naturally happens everytime a new product is introduced including item pack DLC.  It may go up because of demand, down because of a lack thereof or stay constant.

 

Nothing unethical about it.  Now if they charged for a $15.00 DLC that was advertised as a story DLC but turns out to be an item pack that would be unethical.  Or a $5.00 DLC item pack knowingly full of bugs and unfinished work would be unethical if it wasn't accidently released before it was ready.

[coldflame]

Actually, CDPR wouldn't do this "Free DLC" if they weren't beacked by Polish governement. And most of TW3 DLC were contents primarily considered for base game. They didn't had time to finish all of them. On the other hand, DAI is another story.

 

What EA/Bioware needs to learn from CDPR is how to PR. Both companies are doing basically the same thing with DLCs but look at how most people are painting CDPR as the hero and EA/Bioware as the villain

[Balek-Vriege]

True Coldflame.  CDPR basically tells fans what they want to hear PR wise and they gobble it up, but this is partially a confirmation bias developed from EA/Bioware mistrust.  EA/Bioware do the similar PR but no one trusts them because EA is a big evil corporate company.  CDPR gets away with it because it's seen as an indie developer rebelling against the corporate machine.  Actually that's the difference.  CDPR shamelessly plays that up while doing the exact same business practices which are actually legit for the industry.

[In Exile]

What EA/Bioware needs to learn from CDPR is how to PR. Both companies are doing basically the same thing with DLCs but look at how most people are painting CDPR as the hero and EA/Bioware as the villain

 

CDPR has this amazing talent to - just by meaninglessly praising the most vocal parts of the internet, without in any way giving them what they want - and they win out with fans. It's amazing to watch. 

[ShadowLordXII]

People don't understand how business practices work. Just because you don't buy a product doesn't mean the message you're sending is that you hate unethical business practices. The take-away for the company might well be that they're not being unethical enough to get you to spend the money. 

 

To put it differently, if you (and I note I'm just using the generally "you") don't buy Spoils of Qunari, the inference isn't necessarily that you are against cosmetic item DLC. It might just be they sold the wrong cosmetic item DLC (maybe it needs more horse armour). 

 

The idea is that folks who decide not to pay for unethical stuff do so because diplomacy and reasoning are falling on deaf ears. So they talk with their wallets on the hope that enough people join-in and get the company's attention. Maybe it won't work, but its better than screaming at a brick wall and it keeps money from being wasted.

 

Hence why I still haven't bought Tekken vs Street Fighter because of the on-disk dlc nonsense.

[Robert Trevelyan]

Again, people like you is why EA gets away with the schemes they do. In a way, I dont blame them and for their financial benefit, they should do the same with ME4 because people will buy it no matter what.

I dont blamr Bethesda for starting dlc with horse armor, I blame the people who continue to support such practices with their money.

I might not be a dev, but that doesnt mean that I cannot as a consumer voice my concern and opinion over a product.

Again, if EA wants to justify their actions on DLC, all they need to do is show this thread and the many people defending them.

 

 

Nobody is defending anybody. We're just taking an overview. Looking at the bigger picture of development and how it works.

 

If EA were charging me extra to purchase, say, the armours which are worn by the multiplayer characters in DAI - armours which already exist in the core game? I'd be hacked off. Because that's something already present in the game I have installed on my machine.

 

Yes, technically the multiplayer characters were worked upon by a separate team. It may have taken some time to get them working on the Inquisitor or Companions, but it was still content which was 'on the disc' if you follow me.

 

That's not what we're talking about for Spoils of the Qunari, though. Bioware never made any Qunari armour during the development of the main game. It is new and separate content. Never before seen in the game. 

 

If/when a Qunari story DLC is released then we could debate that maybe this content should have been part of that story DLC, rather than sold separately.

 

The problem that many of us have with your argument though is that your not arguing the minor ethics of such things. You seem to be arguing that ALL extra content should be free. Regardless. 

 

That's not realistic.

 

If t wasn't in the original game it's extra work. It has to be paid for, because it cost extra money to make.

 

Anything beyond that would be like commissioning a guy to paint a family portrait, and then coming back 6 months later demanding he also gave you any other portraits he's painted of other people since. Because you paid him once. And basically, you argue, that's effectively the same thing. 

 

It blatantly isn't, of course. 

[robertthebard]

Nobody is defending anybody. We're just taking an overview. Looking at the bigger picture of development and how it works.
 
If EA were charging me extra to purchase, say, the armours which are worn by the multiplayer characters in DAI - armours which already exist in the core game? I'd be hacked off. Because that's something already present in the game I have installed on my machine.
 
Yes, technically the multiplayer characters were worked upon by a separate team. It may have taken some time to get them working on the Inquisitor or Companions, but it was still content which was 'on the disc' if you follow me.
 
That's not what we're talking about for Spoils of the Qunari, though. Bioware never made any Qunari armour during the development of the main game. It is new and separate content. Never before seen in the game. 
 
If/when a Qunari story DLC is released then we could debate that maybe this content should have been part of that story DLC, rather than sold separately.
 
The problem that many of us have with your argument though is that your not arguing the minor ethics of such things. You seem to be arguing that ALL extra content should be free. Regardless. 
 
That's not realistic.
 
If t wasn't in the original game it's extra work. It has to be paid for, because it cost extra money to make.
 
Anything beyond that would be like commissioning a guy to paint a family portrait, and then coming back 6 months later demanding he also gave you any other portraits he's painted of other people since. Because you paid him once. And basically, you argue, that's effectively the same thing. 
 
It blatantly isn't, of course.

Actually, the better analogy along the painter line is expecting that painter to add any offspring you add to the family later for free, since you've already paid him.

[Robert Trevelyan]

Actually, the better analogy along the painter line is expecting that painter to add any offspring you add to the family later for free, since you've already paid him.

 

 

That'd work also.

 

Seriously, it frustrates me that some people still see the notion of DLC even at a purely conceptual level to be so objectionable to them that no matter what is actually on offer they will see it as a personal affront.  

[Majestic Jazz]

True Coldflame. CDPR basically tells fans what they want to hear PR wise and they gobble it up, but this is partially a confirmation bias developed from EA/Bioware mistrust. EA/Bioware do the similar PR but no one trusts them because EA is a big evil corporate company. CDPR gets away with it because it's seen as an indie developer rebelling against the corporate machine. Actually that's the difference. CDPR shamelessly plays that up while doing the exact same business practices which are actually legit for the industry.

Except the items and armor that CDPR releases is free whereas EA charges for it. Thats the major difference.

If Spoils of the Qunari was free, then I wouldnt mind because even though it should have been in the base game and even though it is 8 months later, at least EA gains goodwill and good PR by giving it too us for free, like they did with Black Emporium and the Extended Cut dlc for ME3.

In situations like this, we vote with our wallets. You support the industry's use of item packs, well buy them. Are you against this and believe companies like to nickle and dime consumers by selling them products that should have been with the original purchase? Then dont buy it.

It upsets me because this spills over into other EA products like ME:A and Dragon Age 4.

You wait 8 months after release to try to sell me content that was needed in the main game and expect me to buy it? Spoils of the Avaar I can understand cause we cant play as an Avaar so those are just bonus products. However playing as a Qunari was an highly anticipated feature. Hell, prior to launch before all the frustration over Qunari hair options, playing as a Qunari female was one of the most popular IQs. Then to add fuel to the fire, Qunari players found out that there are limited armors availabe, so bad for me that I had to delete my Qunari female and just play as a human sense there were more variety. Now EA wants to sell me this content and act like they are doing me a favor? If it was free then ok, but charging it?

If they can charge for this content....whats next?

[In Exile]

The idea is that folks who decide not to pay for unethical stuff do so because diplomacy and reasoning are falling on deaf ears. So they talk with their wallets on the hope that enough people join-in and get the company's attention. Maybe it won't work, but its better than screaming at a brick wall and it keeps money from being wasted.

 

Hence why I still haven't bought Tekken vs Street Fighter because of the on-disk dlc nonsense.

 

I get the idea; I'm just saying that people overestimate how easy this is to convey in practice, and how not buying something doesn't necessarily mean people will think you're not buying it for the reasons you're not buying it. 

[robertthebard]

I get the idea; I'm just saying that people overestimate how easy this is to convey in practice, and how not buying something doesn't necessarily mean people will think you're not buying it for the reasons you're not buying it.

Why does anyone need to know why someone doesn't buy something? In fact, why does anyone need to know if someone buys something? If one wants to buy DLC, it's between them and their wallet. Evidently, if one decides to buy it, they saw something of value in it. At the end of the day, that's all that matters.

[Giantdeathrobot]

Are we really going to equate criticizing unethical business practices to aimless whining?

 

The reason why some folks get their "panties in a bunch" over what other people spend their money on is because those people are indirectly/directly supporting unethical business nonsense. And when that happens, that just encourages the guilty company's to keep doing it because they're convinced that they'll still make a profit regardless of criticism.

 

You don't have to agree and you're free to counter-argue. But don't just handwave it as whining. One way to make a better environment is to constructively discuss these issues and bring different viewpoints and facts to the table without pointing fingers or mud-slinging.

 

Personally, I don't see any proof that these item packs are an unethical business practice meant to squeeze out more money. And that's admitting that the Qunari PC got the shaft regarding unique armor and weapons compared to the other races. So I may end up getting the Spoils of the Qunari pack unless I see evidence that there is some bs at play.

 

Denouncing what one sees as unethical business practices is one thing. For instance, I personally voiced my displeasure with the From Ashes BS and the Steam paid mods. There's no problem with that.

 

Calling people names because they spent their money on something you didn't is another thing altogether. And some of that has been going on in this thread.

[Balek-Vriege]

Except the items and armor that CDPR releases is free whereas EA charges for it. Thats the major difference.

If Spoils of the Qunari was free, then I wouldnt mind because even though it should have been in the base game and even though it is 8 months later, at least EA gains goodwill and good PR by giving it too us for free, like they did with Black Emporium and the Extended Cut dlc for ME3.

In situations like this, we vote with our wallets. You support the industry's use of item packs, well buy them. Are you against this and believe companies like to nickle and dime consumers by selling them products that should have been with the original purchase? Then dont buy it.

It upsets me because this spills over into other EA products like ME:A and Dragon Age 4.

You wait 8 months after release to try to sell me content that was needed in the main game and expect me to buy it? Spoils of the Avaar I can understand cause we cant play as an Avaar so those are just bonus products. However playing as a Qunari was an highly anticipated feature. Hell, prior to launch before all the frustration over Qunari hair options, playing as a Qunari female was one of the most popular IQs. Then to add fuel to the fire, Qunari players found out that there are limited armors availabe, so bad for me that I had to delete my Qunari female and just play as a human sense there were more variety. Now EA wants to sell me this content and act like they are doing me a favor? If it was free then ok, but charging it?

If they can charge for this content....whats next?

 

If you actually look at the whole gaming industry, item packs are all over the place because their isn't the same market forces at play.  There's item packs are free, 99 cents, $3, $5 and upward to $10.00.  EA/Bioware charging $5.00 for item packs is not unique and is actually the norm.  It's business and easy profits.  Treating it as if Bioware is starting something new with item packs and some special case of how not to do DLC is not the case.

 

Sure it helps PR to give away things for free, but you shouldn't get upset when a business treats their business as a business rather than endless PR.  If you don't like the price for a product don't buy it. Competition should work that out by itself and the fact is, item packs and even item skins are worth a good amount of money to a lot of people because they do in fact sell.  Most MMO's profit margins are based on this and it's very very successful.  All the power to CDPR for offering free stuff though. 

 

However, over the years I have read CDPR statements about DLC and other RPG Developers and they've come off as hypocritical and dishonest, because they pretty much support and promote arguments like "No DLC is a good DLC!  Everything should be included in the original game!"  or "(Insert name here) Pass/whatever!?!  You want me to prebuy DLC content without knowing what it is?!" or "Other game developers don't make true old-school RPG anymore but these guys do."  Instead of saying or admitting they're involved in the same business practices but explain why they're good, they try to pass their own versions as somehow different when they're really not to attract those disillusioned RPG players.

 

Which may eventually bite them in the you know where.  I think some of these disillusioned players are predisposed to wear rose coloured glasses when it comes to whatever company they're presently celebrating.  When they feel slighted in any way those glasses come off and are replaced by hate blinders forever when it comes to that company.

 

I also remember when ME3 ending became an issue CDPR devs were giving some passive aggressive statements alluding to Bioware writers not knowing how to write or create stories and the ending being an example of that.  Yeah right says the developer that hasn't made their own IP where Bioware has made two unique and successful ones.

 

It comes off as very self serving to me.

 

I don't really hold it against them though because it's pretty good PR and business marketing.  "The other guy isn't doing what you want come to us we're special and different."  It's just how I see it.

 

On your point about the Qunari DLC I would say that Qunari got the short end of the stick because of time/resource constraints.  This new Qunari item DLC is obviously an attempt to address the lack of unique armors and to create props for a more Qunari themed Skyhold.  That said, unique Qunari armors and Skyhold Qunari props were never marketed as features in DAI.  The direction for DAI actually seemed to be less armor choices, but cool looking and universal.  So they don't really owe anyone anything on that front.  I would also like them to address bugs and other more important concerns first rather than item packs, which they did with JoH and patch 7/8 (finally).

 

Imagine the complaints if Bioware was working on item packs before fixing a lot of the crash issues or fixing current armor bugs etc.

[The Baconer]

You call this nickel and dimming? In the world were pay to play phone games and horse armor exists?

 

This is a horse armor DLC.

[robertthebard]

This is a horse armor DLC.

Except that, other than it being the same in that it's a cosmetic choice, it's really not, eh? What it is, is a case of "I don't like EA, so everything they do is shady", and while true in some cases, it's not really true in all of them. However, it's a lot easier to just say "EA is robbing us", whether it's accurate or not, isn't it?

[In Exile]

Why does anyone need to know why someone doesn't buy something? In fact, why does anyone need to know if someone buys something? If one wants to buy DLC, it's between them and their wallet. Evidently, if one decides to buy it, they saw something of value in it. At the end of the day, that's all that matters.

 

Companies make important decisions based on their assumptions about why people buy things. It's fundamentally at the heart of product design. So it does matter that companies know why we buy stuff. It's just that the information isn't readily available, so companies have to make it up as the go along. 

[Majestic Jazz]

If you actually look at the whole gaming industry, item packs are all over the place because their isn't the same market forces at play. There's item packs are free, 99 cents, $3, $5 and upward to $10.00. EA/Bioware charging $5.00 for item packs is not unique and is actually the norm. It's business and easy profits. Treating it as if Bioware is starting something new with item packs and some special case of how not to do DLC is not the case.

Sure it helps PR to give away things for free, but you shouldn't get upset when a business treats their business as a business rather than endless PR. If you don't like the price for a product don't buy it. Competition should work that out by itself and the fact is, item packs and even item skins are worth a good amount of money to a lot of people because they do in fact sell. Most MMO's profit margins are based on this and it's very very successful. All the power to CDPR for offering free stuff though.

However, over the years I have read CDPR statements about DLC and other RPG Developers and they've come off as hypocritical and dishonest, because they pretty much support and promote arguments like "No DLC is a good DLC! Everything should be included in the original game!" or "(Insert name here) Pass/whatever!?! You want me to prebuy DLC content without knowing what it is?!" or "Other game developers don't make true old-school RPG anymore but these guys do." Instead of saying or admitting they're involved in the same business practices but explain why they're good, they try to pass their own versions as somehow different when they're really not to attract those disillusioned RPG players.

Which may eventually bite them in the you know where. I think some of these disillusioned players are predisposed to wear rose coloured glasses when it comes to whatever company they're presently celebrating. When they feel slighted in any way those glasses come off and are replaced by hate blinders forever when it comes to that company.

I also remember when ME3 ending became an issue CDPR devs were giving some passive aggressive statements alluding to Bioware writers not knowing how to write or create stories and the ending being an example of that. Yeah right says the developer that hasn't made their own IP where Bioware has made two unique and successful ones.

It comes off as very self serving to me.

I don't really hold it against them though because it's pretty good PR and business marketing. "The other guy isn't doing what you want come to us we're special and different." It's just how I see it.

On your point about the Qunari DLC I would say that Qunari got the short end of the stick because of time/resource constraints. This new Qunari item DLC is obviously an attempt to address the lack of unique armors and to create props for a more Qunari themed Skyhold. That said, unique Qunari armors and Skyhold Qunari props were never marketed as features in DAI. The direction for DAI actually seemed to be less armor choices, but cool looking and universal. So they don't really owe anyone anything on that front. I would also like them to address bugs and other more important concerns first rather than item packs, which they did with JoH and patch 7/8 (finally).

Imagine the complaints if Bioware was working on item packs before fixing a lot of the crash issues or fixing current armor bugs etc.

Nice post, but this isnt just EA related. Take Arkham Knight, they the new Batgirl DLC is said to be short with NO replay value and if you didnt buy the $40 season pass, you have to pay like $7 for this DLC! Sad thing is, people will still buy the crap cause they do not have the strength to say no.

Companies do what they do cause we allow them to do it.

[MaaEnyo]

*drops the popcorn* I can not keep lurking on these threads, it's a dead horse, so dead it's turning to dust and y'all keep beating it. 

 

Did you know people outside North America gets charged extra for DLC? I have to pay a whole extra dollar for the item packs and two or three for the story DLCs in a country where a dollar is worth ten times more than local currency, and is not like i'm importing an actual, physical product or anything. I'm charged extra to download the same product as everyone else, and i don't know where that extra comes from because i'm pretty darn sure the DLC does not come in the mail, and does not go through customs. So when i saw what the Spoils of- packs had to offer, i simply didn't pay for them. 

Because at the end of the day, after all this ridiculous argument and the super dense guy who doesn't freaking get it, you can discuss ethics in the gaming industry (???) all you like but if you don't want the DLC you don't have to pay for it. And if you do want it but for whatever reason refuse to pay for it -as is my case-, you just don't pay for it. If there's a complaint to be made to the company, there are certainly more direct and formal ways to voice them than repeatedly posting on the forums hoping one of the game devs or EA executives sees your rants and goes "hey, this guy is right, let's do things just how he wants us to or else we won't get his $5!". Cuz that's never gonna happen. Don't want it? Don't pay for it. Don't like it? Don't pay for it. Don't agree with the way things were done? Don't pay for the thing. Don't agree with how the company handles the thing? Don't support the company with your money. That's it. Expecting other people use or stop using their money the way you want them to in the hopes of bending the arm of the developers the way you'd like is nonsense and out of place. You won't get to control how people consume what they want to consume through childlish internet accusations of sheepleness.  

 

These DLCs are cosmetic, they're not vital or necessary for the enjoyment of the "vanilla game" at all! I have 7 Inquisitors, the first being a Qunari, and i don't feel in the least deceived or betrayed by Bioware for not giving me the Qunari golden booty throne for free when we got the game last year, nor do i think they should give it to me for free now because i know there's work behind it and it deserves to be payed; someone designed that content, someone rendered it, someone made it work in game, and if you've ever picked up a pencil or tried coding you'd get an idea of the work that went behind all that. My opinion here, not that anyone has to share it but if i pay for unnecessary DLC it would be because i like how it looks and want to reward its creative work and execution.  

 

If CDPR does it better and for free, like you want it and how you like it, go support CDPR instead! Is not a concept so difficult to grasp, is it? It really isn't. At this point i think most people who's into games has an idea of how the gaming industry functions, and at least those of us with bills to pay know when someone's trying to suck our wallets dry for naught. If i pay for an unnecessary cosmetic item pack then joke's on me because i may not eat for a week but that's my doing, my choice, and the consequences are mine alone to bear. If other people are so weak they can't resist whatever EA puts in front of them, that's their personal flaw and theirs alone to eventually correct or not, and the consequences of their decision is also only theirs. It is in no way yours to point at from atop that pedestal or self-rightousness you seem to be on. You MajesticJazz clearly can not deal with these facts of life and that's your problem, maybe you could work on that instead of judging what other people decide to do in their lifes with their money for their gaming experience. Getting so upset and so dense about it has, in all honesty, made me consider buying the DLC, just to spite people like you.