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[Obadiah]

Just started the game (only completed a couple of missions) and am EXTREMELY underwhelmed by the back-from-the-dead story thus far. However, after reading this thread, I have some hope and will persevere. Sounds like there is some good character development to be had.

Modifié par Obadiah, 29 janvier 2010 - 02:06 .

[drhelio212]

jeckaldied wrote...

I personally think the Illusive man maybe working with a yet unseen threat, Soveriegn was too full of itself to give itself the air of anything other than a two dimensional kill machine. Harbinger however, was different.

If you listen to his tauntings throughout the encounters with him, he frequently sounds reluctant saying things like he'll kill you if he has too and things of that nature, and at the end, as the base is about to go off (either the radiation or the explosion) he says that humanities fate is still the same, it will be saved through destruction (or something like that).

To me it sounds like the Reapers come ever 50,000 years, and build a Reaper or two out of each race, or at least the ones they find worthy. From harbinger's comment about being saved (or a similar word), it would seem that by turning a large population of a race into a reaper, they can preserve it's legacy from...something.

Harbinger seems to very much want to make a human Reaper, since he says at the end he will find another way.

I think that the first Reaper was a race that intended to preserve itself from something by turning it's population into a single, massive entity, and every 50,000 years, they try to 'save' more races that way. Perhaps the Illusive man is working with this other threat, whatever it maybe, for whatever goals it may have.

No matter what his real intentions are, I think the Illusive man is either a full partner with whatever mysterious allies he may have, or he may be being tricked into thinking he's got equal power, for he certainly does not seem the type to serve, like Saren was.

Or he's just a smaller player on the galactic stage who is really trying to elevate his group to great power with the technology he is gaining. What is said about the illusive man in the novels is that he was born human, and is still very much human. He has an extensive network of spies and agents all working to further humanity. His group was instrumental in introducing biotics to humanity, albeit through shady means. Perhaps there is something deeper there, but I just don't see it. The Reapers seem to be the end-all evil of the ME universe. If there is something outside of the Reapers that is greater, then we're all pretty screwed. The Reapers are a massive enough threat as is. As far as I am concerned, I just want to preserve the galaxy as it is. Save humanity. Save the aliens. Destroy the machines. Yes? Simple. Precise. And beautiful!

[drhelio212]

Korsriddare wrote...

I am more curious about the state of the star behind him, seeing how it is now white-ish blue. Seems like it was forcefully aged, perhaps? Like what was happening in the system you rescued Tali from, but on a much faster time scale.

Lol. I believe he's in a darkened room, and that's just a decoration on the wall. He finds it beautiful and watches it. It does add a certain mystery to him.

[Bryy_Miller]

vallix wrote...

Miranda was not loyal to me, and I chose to destroy the base. However, an order for her to stop me was never sent to her.

Miranda was with me for the boss, and she told him to sod off. She was not loyal.

Modifié par Bryy_Miller, 29 janvier 2010 - 02:05 .

[cainx10a]

ahall88 wrote...

conglomerator wrote...

BTW has anyone noticed that the Illusive Man's face appears very briefly in the crack in the roof a few moments before you contact him from the Collector base? It's as if he is spying on you from outer space... On my first playthrough I thought I was just seeing things, but on my second it happened again so it's either a graphics bug or a somewhat hidden, but intended hint. I'll try to take screenshots the next time I play through the suicide mission.

I saw that as well. I was like WTF!
Do we even know where the hell his little room is? 
Hell this could just be some giant game of chess where one side controlled the Collector's and the other tried out the humans, or something to that effect.

Wow, here I was thinking I may have been lacking sleep. That's really weird, and oh my god, I can't wait for ME 3, just glad I was able to save everyone,except Kelly, was sad to watch her turn into goo. :sick:

[MA5Bergey]

Just an idea... the whole sun thing... maybe it could be a lead as to how we finish the fight in ME3. Perhaps it's a bigger threat than you realize, and the sun could go supernova. Maybe at the end of ME3, there'll be a circumstance where all hope is lost of defeating the Reapers and the only way to defeat them and preserve all life in the galaxy is to make the sun explode, incinerating the entire Reaper fleet... I'm just randomly musing now though.

[Marco_Alberts]

I was certain he was working with the Reapers. He's all about the advancement of humanity, and Harbinger kept on saying crap like "we are your genetic destiny" or whatever. Didn't help with him basically tossing you and a couple thousand colonists to the wolves. That human reaper looked like a potential advancement for humanity...if you're crazy.



Shepnator may have been a renegade, but he ain't gonna advance humanity to be a giant T-800.

[Korsriddare]

MA5Bergey wrote...

Just an idea... the whole sun thing... maybe it could be a lead as to how we finish the fight in ME3. Perhaps it's a bigger threat than you realize, and the sun could go supernova. Maybe at the end of ME3, there'll be a circumstance where all hope is lost of defeating the Reapers and the only way to defeat them and preserve all life in the galaxy is to make the sun explode, incinerating the entire Reaper fleet... I'm just randomly musing now though.

Reverse Freespace 2 finale, haha.

[Annora]

MA5Bergey wrote...

Just an idea... the whole sun thing... maybe it could be a lead as to how we finish the fight in ME3. Perhaps it's a bigger threat than you realize, and the sun could go supernova. Maybe at the end of ME3, there'll be a circumstance where all hope is lost of defeating the Reapers and the only way to defeat them and preserve all life in the galaxy is to make the sun explode, incinerating the entire Reaper fleet... I'm just randomly musing now though.

Whoa whoa whoa. I think you're actually on to something. Remember that Quarian sun going nuts because of dark energy? Maybe the Illusive Man is behind it, testing his new tech.

[p0mt3]

I just beat the game for the first time, and to my shame, I chose to preserve the Collectors' ship and hand it over to Cerberus. However, seeing Illusive Man's devious, almost evil grin at the very end (Plus learning of Jack's reaction to it post-credits), convinces me that from now on my subsequent playthroughs will always end with me blowing that ship to hell and telling Illusive Man to get bent if he doesn't like that decision. I'm sure it will put him at odds with me, but I could honestly care less. I never liked the guy, even though I went quite renegade in this game.

[p0mt3]

Anastassia wrote...

MA5Bergey wrote...

Just an idea... the whole sun thing... maybe it could be a lead as to how we finish the fight in ME3. Perhaps it's a bigger threat than you realize, and the sun could go supernova. Maybe at the end of ME3, there'll be a circumstance where all hope is lost of defeating the Reapers and the only way to defeat them and preserve all life in the galaxy is to make the sun explode, incinerating the entire Reaper fleet... I'm just randomly musing now though.

Whoa whoa whoa. I think you're actually on to something. Remember that Quarian sun going nuts because of dark energy? Maybe the Illusive Man is behind it, testing his new tech.

Yes, I think the dying star is quite important. Just got a feeling. As to how it involves Illusive Man and all, I really don't know yet, but these are good theories anyhow. 

 . . . let's just hope if it DOES go supernova, it won't end with Spock sending a vengeful romulan into the past. That would just ruin the story . . .


 

[SrslyUnfriendly]

I chose the Paragon option, and Miranda did not say anything about leaving Cerberus or my decision (she was only Normal, I couldn't talk to her after backing Jack during their little cat fight & never got high enough in Paragon to fix it).

Although, she wasn't actually with me when I made it, so I can't say anything about that.

Modifié par SrslyUnfriendly, 29 janvier 2010 - 06:37 .

[Annora]

p0mt3 wrote...
Yes, I think the dying star is quite important. Just got a feeling. As to how it involves Illusive Man and all, I really don't know yet, but these are good theories anyhow. 

 . . . let's just hope if it DOES go supernova, it won't end with Spock sending a vengeful romulan into the past. That would just ruin the story . . .


 

I liked the new Star Trek movie immensely.

I get the feeling the Illusive Man isn't actually human, and that we might see more of the Protheans/Collectors. At the end when Harbinger relinquishes control of the Collector, it looks like it has no idea what the hell is going on.

[Matterialize]

MilosMilos wrote...

I would assume hes been augmented with the best tech money can buy, if he spent billions on shepard imagine what he would do for himself

Nothing, because he's flat broke since I blew up his reaper factory and jacked his cool spaceship. Dude will have to sell his magical eyeballs to afford three meals a day.

[SrslyUnfriendly]

Matterialize wrote...

MilosMilos wrote...

I would assume hes been augmented with the best tech money can buy, if he spent billions on shepard imagine what he would do for himself

Nothing, because he's flat broke since I blew up his reaper factory and jacked his cool spaceship. Dude will have to sell his magical eyeballs to afford three meals a day.

This is true...I wonder how he'll make a recovery from how much money you've cost him. Don't forget about building the Normandy, paying for Zaeed, and all he had to do just to RECOVER your body! 

[Sursion]

I saved the Collector base. I thought it was a good idea at the time. It would take a long time to make a Reaper for ourselves, but something is better then nothing.



During the end cinematic I told TIM to F off, but that smile he had when he looked at the base, and then the entire crew telling me it was a bad decision. I really regret handing it over...

[p0mt3]

Anastassia wrote...

p0mt3 wrote...
Yes, I think the dying star is quite important. Just got a feeling. As to how it involves Illusive Man and all, I really don't know yet, but these are good theories anyhow. 

 . . . let's just hope if it DOES go supernova, it won't end with Spock sending a vengeful romulan into the past. That would just ruin the story . . .


 

I liked the new Star Trek movie immensely.

I get the feeling the Illusive Man isn't actually human, and that we might see more of the Protheans/Collectors. At the end when Harbinger relinquishes control of the Collector, it looks like it has no idea what the hell is going on.

lol, I loved Star Trek. I was just trying to make a joke. 

And of course Illusive Man isn't quite human. Just like Shepard is no longer quite human. The eyes give that away from the get go. But is he merely an improved vessel built for enhancing his already-present strengths, like Shepard? Or, is he programmed to be servant, just like Saran was?

Or an even more scary thought . . . what if Shepard is the slave, and doesn't know it? If Cerberus truly is the evil empire many seem to think it is, wouldn't it make sense to use Project Lazarus as a method to install some sort of controlling chip into Shepard without his knowledge? There was never a guarantee Shepard would have helped them willingly, and even less of a chance he will continue answering to Illusive Man in ME 3, so installing some sort of 'failsafe' just in case they needed to force him doesn't seem like that far of a stretch to me. 

[p0mt3]

Sursion wrote...

I saved the Collector base. I thought it was a good idea at the time. It would take a long time to make a Reaper for ourselves, but something is better then nothing.

During the end cinematic I told TIM to F off, but that smile he had when he looked at the base, and then the entire crew telling me it was a bad decision. I really regret handing it over...

I'm in the same boat you are, my friend. Same exact boat. No way am I making that mistake again. 

[Marco_Alberts]

p0mt3 wrote...

Or an even more scary thought . . . what if Shepard is the slave, and doesn't know it? If Cerberus truly is the evil empire many seem to think it is, wouldn't it make sense to use Project Lazarus as a method to install some sort of controlling chip into Shepard without his knowledge? There was never a guarantee Shepard would have helped them willingly, and even less of a chance he will continue answering to Illusive Man in ME 3, so installing some sort of 'failsafe' just in case they needed to force him doesn't seem like that far of a stretch to me. 

If you talk to Miranda after you first meet TIM, she says how she would have installed such a chip if she were the one in charge, but that TIM didn't want to use one. She could have been lying, but I don't believe she was.

[stuman89]

SwobyJ wrote...

My own opinion is that he wishes to integrate with the Reapers like every great species before the Protheans and beyond, BUT he wants to do it on his own terms. Foolish, and for all I know he's being in some way indoctrinated behind the scenes. My mainShep will keep the base!, but will not be helping TIM, and will be working hard to take control of Cerberus if at all possible, and even bring it into the daylight.

This! I hope this is the story and The Illusive Man is trying to help 'evolve' humanity, just like he did by forcing the Biotics on people.

Maybe he thinks that humanity will make the best Reapers ships and that the human-flavor Reapers would come to control the Reaper fleet? That would explain a lot and make him wanting to become a Moses type to lead humanity to the promise land.

I just blew your mind. Boom.

[Valhak]

As a commentary to all the talk of the destruction of the base and how he reacts to saving or destroying it...

Firstly, whatever TIM is he is not stupid. He of all people knows the risks of holding such a base and the risks of even a partially finished/destroyed reaper causing indoctrination upon the people researching it especially after the fiasco with the derelict reaper. That means he doesn't care that his scientists and researchers would become the reaper's puppets, because there's no way he doesn't expect or at least hold suspicions of that happening. He says it himself, information is his only weapon.

Question is, if he really is putting humanity first what would he possibly have to gain from that? A lose of human lives and strengthening of the opponent for likely no gain. The only reason intel was recovered from the derelict reaper was because of Legion gathering it and you saving his ass. So if he's not putting humanity first that means he's lying. Not to mention he has other priorities, and neither of those can be trusted.

In ME3 I suspect he'll either mess everything up and cause some huge issue if you let him take the base or hunt you down if you blew it up.

[CrazySockpuppetMan]

Atti Ito wrote...

ahall88 wrote...

conglomerator wrote...

BTW has anyone noticed that the Illusive Man's face appears very briefly in the crack in the roof a few moments before you contact him from the Collector base? It's as if he is spying on you from outer space... On my first playthrough I thought I was just seeing things, but on my second it happened again so it's either a graphics bug or a somewhat hidden, but intended hint. I'll try to take screenshots the next time I play through the suicide mission.

I saw that as well. I was like WTF!
Do we even know where the hell his little room is? 
Hell this could just be some giant game of chess where one side controlled the Collector's and the other tried out the humans, or something to that effect.

Maybe he's really the G-man...

"Wake up Commander...wake up and smell the ashes..."

If Shep died at the end of your M2 you play as Gordon Freeman in ME3, makes sense to me...
but really,
I don't think TIM would want to team up with the reavers, he is too concerned with humanity/himself. He is a clever bad guy with goals. He knows the reapers need to be defeated but I think he sees a chance to further his/humanities power after the conflict (ie letting the reapers cripple the rest of the galaxy followed up by Humans saving the day and becoming the dominate power or something like that). 

Just my two cents (at 2 in the morning).

My alternatively theory is that he is going to manipulate shep by promising him a cerberus network code with his digital download and then cleverly hiding the code so shep can't find it. 

Modifié par CrazySockpuppetMan, 29 janvier 2010 - 08:30 .

[CynixV]

thats exactly what i thought to the TIM is going to try to manipulate or use the reapers against the other races so humanity ends up on top after the final battle is over. be a pretty boring galaxy tho if humans were the only ones left.

[CynixV]

Oh another thing The normandy does have the IFF friend or foe thing , very possible the collector base could manufacture or help create more for the alliance fleets so when the reapers do come they dont attack the human ships

[Inverness Moon]

CynixV wrote...

Oh another thing The normandy does have the IFF friend or foe thing , very possible the collector base could manufacture or help create more for the alliance fleets so when the reapers do come they dont attack the human ships

You're assuming that the reapers are as dumb as rocks and can't tell that someone is using their IFF. The IFF is for things like the relay that can't identify things on its own.