24 réponses à ce sujet

[orange_apples]

So I've been playing for about a month and just got the duelist (my last unlock) and I just don't see how you're supposed to stack Elusive for when you need it when ranged enemies can strip you of all your elusive when those attacks do such little damage. What am I missing? I find my guard dagger to be more reliable than the Elusive token and that thing's only 2 guard on hit. And I only have 1. I've only done a couple of routine missions with her and I'm thinking of ignoring Elusive.

[KalGerion_Beast]

On routine you can ignore elusive.

 

It becomes much more useful as the difficulties escalate, and the damage increases.  

 

Dodging 2 damage with elusive is a waste

Dodging 500 damage with elusive is a life saver.  

[orange_apples]

Oh I understand that, I just don't see how it is supposed to be possible to stack enough Elusive for it to be there when you need it.

[KalGerion_Beast]

Oh I understand that, I just don't see how it is supposed to be possible to stack enough Elusive for it to be there when you need it.

l2p issue.

 

Let the tank (or anyone else really) run into the enemies first to grab their attention.

If using flashing steel try to vendetta multiple enemies and cluster them beforehand.

If using flank attack, you can get 4 elusive at once if you line two enemies up.

I dont think you can generate more than 1 elusive per ambush.  

 

And of course, dead enemies cant take away elusive (channel your inner Geth Infiltrator). 

[Headbasher]

Oh I understand that, I just don't see how it is supposed to be possible to stack enough Elusive for it to be there when you need it.

 

 

It's absolutley awesome  .  You just have to move  , archer arrows are not heat seeking.  Once you figure it out you cant tank just about anything. .

[konfeta]

Elusive isn't there to let you tank crowds, it's there to avoid incidental damage and tank damage in 1 on 1 situations (duelist, remember?). It also helps a lot against knockdown attacks because it nullifies the knockdown (think Terrors/DemonCommander/Despairs/Shieldnerds/Hammernerds.)

 

The perk that lets Elusive negate damage over time effects is a godsend against fire wraiths (and fire dragons) as well.

[K_A_Rnage]

Get the upgrade for 4 stacks and the Unyielding passive. Jump into Perilous/Nightmare and let something hit you without any Elusive or Guard (just as a test). You'll take 1-3 hits before you Flash red. Once you flash red, hit Broadsides to spread your Vendetta, Ambush the centre mob then Spin to win. If you have HoK you'll come out with a coupla coins a bit of health and some Guard. Those next 2 hits won't hurt at all. Keep your Stamina up, wait for cool downs by LoSing (not very long) and go again. This method can carry a team with 3 players down (adding significant dmg to you) as Elusive can absorb infinite dmg hits. It also prevents DoT effects and certain CC such as The Revenants Grappling Hook. Izzy can easily solo at high lvls and do it quicker than the AW.

Tl:dr She's a gun on higher difficulties that can tank and dps.

[N7 Tigger]

I'd post my usual 'Not sure if...' jpeg but the mods keep deleting them.

[Dekibra]

short answer to topic title:

 

 

 

long answer: see KalGerion & KARnage posts

[Silversmurf]

Tl:dr She's a gun on higher difficulties that can tank and dps.

 

If you have a good Lego tanking you can hold bolt and rotate your right stick only moving the camera..... GUN TURRET !

 

Right stick is great for Reaver too in a crowd 

[orange_apples]

If you have a good Lego tanking you can hold bolt and rotate your right stick only moving the camera..... GUN TURRET !

 

Right stick is great for Reaver too in a crowd 

 

I don't really hang around here much, what do you mean by "Lego"?

 

 

Elusive isn't there to let you tank crowds, it's there to avoid incidental damage and tank damage in 1 on 1 situations (duelist, remember?).

 

I didn't say anything about tanking crowds. It's the smaller ranged enemies that take away elusive I have issue with. I just feel as though there should have been some sort of minimum damage threshold before Elusive activates or something. Like if an attack would do 5% or less of your max health in damage it will bypass elusive and deal damage normally. 

I have no idea how health is actually calculated, so I'm just going to use 200 as an example. Any attacks that do 10 or less damage will just calculate normally, but any attack that does 11 or more will use Elusive.

 

I just started playing Threatening last week so I have no idea what dangerous/weak attacks in Perilous or Nightmare look like.

[kaileena_sands]

Lego is the Legionnaire.

 

And as others have said before, elusive is amazing. I don't know, maybe Izzy is one of the characters that needs to have a bit more good gear under your belt for her to feel awesome. Just continue playing her and you'll see. Archers/Arcane horrors/RT horrors are one of the worst enemies for her since as you said they will eat your elusive stacks real quick (despair demons too if you don't take care of them quickly). The archers and horrors can be easily eliminated and the arcane horrors... gotta approach them carefully so that you don't faceplant.

 

What build are you using for her?

[tempest238]

As others have said. Let other players run ahead first to get the mob agro. As a beginner you should use Izzy as ranged dps at first, Only getting elusive as needed. Then when you get more confident in her abilties and your skill to use them, you will be able to charge in first anyways.

 

One trick about Izzy compared to the other dagger rogues. Have your highest dps dagger in the left slot as you are looking at the screen. (Which is actually her right hand). Izzy's damage is only based on the left dagger slot (unless that gets patched). The right slot you can put anything. I have what most Izzy players have in that right "offhand" slot. Which is audacity, iirc a lvl 13 or so purple dagger. Just for the explode on kill effect.

 

As for her abilities. Feel free to grab them in any order you wish. But most people run with bolt, spin to win, broadsides, and ambush. Although I recommend getting broadsides as soon as you can.

In no particular order then possibly rushing to broadsides

The right skill tree. - work your way down to broadsides. Grab both upgrades to bolt and broadsides. Grab all the passives in the right tree. (only things left should be two abilties you wont grab.

The left skill tree - Work your way down to ambush, grab unyielding to the right of ambush. And the upgrade to spin to win.

 

That is essentially the goto build for izzy.  From that point on if my memory serves me correctly. You should have 3-4 skill points to use at taht point in time. Grab whatever else you want.

[lJustAlexl]

Elusive is great, but it becomes more valuable in the higher difficulties where incoming damage is greater and with better gear where you'll be able to quickly kill enemies and stack elusive so you'll essentially never take damage. And elusive is not meant to be used as a means of facetanking, but more as a means of avoiding seemingly unavoidable attacks that would have crippled or killed you. As a quick example, a single stack of elusive prevents the Revenant from grabbing you and pulling you to him (and the elusive doesn't go away either). You can safely kite him around the room while your team whittles him down. It also shields you from all knockdowns, as mentioned above. Very useful to have and to maintain.

 

To your point, I agree that it's kind of annoying that some enemies (I'm looking at you Red Templar Horror) have seeking, multi-hit attacks that can totally wipe out all stacks of elusive unless you see it coming and get behind an object. But the benefits really outweigh that one weakness.

 

So give it time. The strengths of the class will become more apparent as you gear and level up.

 

As a sidenote, I use the build tempest described and it makes for a very entertaining and effective duelist.

[K_A_Rnage]

Right stick is great for Reaver too in a crowd

Ah the Reaver. I put Dragon Rage on R1 and only use Auto Attack to heal on Rampage. Otherwise it's hold R1 and point yourself in the direction of your next victims. Pure KARnage

[Cirvante]

Elusive is useful. Go play on higher difficulties and you will notice that the attacks that take away your elusive would otherwise take away half of your health bar.

 

There used to be an attack from enemy archers that was triggered by damaging them with abilities. They would quickly run away, turn around and shoot an arrow in your face for about 1500 damage ... on Threatening (basically instakill without barrier). It has since been patched out, but there are still some high damage attacks that elusive can negate for you.

[K_A_Rnage]

I just started playing Threatening last week so I have no idea what dangerous/weak attacks in Perilous or Nightmare look like.

Lots of great advice here.

Follow Tempest's build guide and get some practice.

It's note worthy to mention that you should aim Ambush at mobs that are attacking someone else/have their back to you. The dmg is uber.

And if you ever come across the dagger Audacity that was mentioned then you've just found Izzies sugar dady. That thing turns her into an AOE monster, capable of pure KARnage

[ottffsse]

Lego is the Legionnaire.

And as others have said before, elusive is amazing. I don't know, maybe Izzy is one of the characters that needs to have a bit more good gear under your belt for her to feel awesome. Just continue playing her and you'll see. Archers/Arcane horrors/RT horrors are one of the worst enemies for her since as you said they will eat your elusive stacks real quick (despair demons too if you don't take care of them quickly). The archers and horrors can be easily eliminated and the arcane horrors... gotta approach them carefully so that you don't faceplant.

What build are you using for her?

I use ambush for those troublesome enemies and usually try to flank and one hit them. Would definitely recommend that approach.

[orange_apples]

But most people run with bolt, spin to win, broadsides, and ambush. Although I recommend getting broadsides as soon as you can.

 

Neat, those are the 4 abilities I have already settled on. 

 

So it's just one of those practice makes perfect types of things.

[kaileena_sands]

I use ambush for those troublesome enemies and usually try to flank and one hit them. Would definitely recommend that approach.

 

I do that too while using teammates as bait. Wish I could one shot the arcane horrors too, but my dps is a bit too low to do that on perilous. xD

[Ispan]

Keel haul is also a nice alternative to ambush, though it may be harder to use a ranged-only build if crit chance isn't high enough to keep a lot of stamina coming in. Even if it only hits one target it will impede most units' movement which is incredibly useful against shadows, charging shield guys, charging animals, etc and I think it can make archers easier deal with if they're tied to a melee unit who sort of drags them around. It's also just really fun to watch chained enemies slip and roll around, especially when they somehow end up chained to a corpse

If you use line of sight and move a lot while firing with Bela you can avoid a decent number of archers' attacks. Since someone recommended strafing in one direction for two or three bolts then quickly strafing back the other direction for one or two, I've significantly reduced the amount of damage taken and elusives stolen by archer units. The passive that increases your speed per elusive that you take on the path to ambush really helps with this too

[Darth Krytie]

My fave build with Isabela is flashing steel, bolt, flanking attack and swashbuckle. If you get the passive to give you four elusive slots, plus upgrade bolt, you can take down a most things with swashbuckle if you have a full stack. It does a lot of damage, especially if you're getting lots of crits. You really do need a decent dagger in your main hand for her to be at her best, though. Her passives are pretty awesome, though. I've actually promoted Isabela 17 or 18 times.

[K_A_Rnage]

Neat, those are the 4 abilities I have already settled on.

So it's just one of those practice makes perfect types of things.

Now your on the money!

Let's quickly talk gear. You NEED:
Your highest base dmg dagger in main hand.
Off hand should have a cool effect.
Stamina Amulet.
Crit chance upgrades to weapons.
Heal on Kill.

Once you have this set up and have a promotion or 2 under your belt: welcome to Perilous!
Izzy has all you need at lvl 14 and you can start xp grinding with confidence as she really shines there.

Good luck on your new adventure

[Angelus_de_Mortiel]

Elusive is useless. Don't listen to these other people. What you really want is called "Aggro". Get all the Aggro you can, and forget Elusive. Time. Of. Your. Life.

 

(Sarcasm, Obviously)

 

I did make a build guide for the Duelist using only crossbow skills. While it certainly was fun and not "bad", it definitely wastes a lot not having Elusive of the more damaging daggers abilities like Flashing Steel or Ambush.

 

[Aetika]

I think the trick is in keeping elusive up. It´s not really like, you gather your three/four coins and then are safe to do whatever you want for a while, but more like chaining your attacks the way you are always replenishing the coins you just lost. Bit like Arcane Warrior, chaining his attacks to keep barrier up.