56 réponses à ce sujet

[andy6915]

This might actually be more of a DAO question, but the actual subject matter has more to do with DAI since that's where we actually learn anything about them. Who was hanging out in the Crossroads... Before Morrigan had even left the wilds? Tamlen was looking into one when he sees "someone" and it notices him and makes him unable to look away and then practically fires the blight at him through the mirror. It's how you and he get tainted. He also said he saw a dark city on the other side, which is weird because they don't connect to other destinations directly (they connect to the Crossroads which then connect to other places). So who or what the hell was it? Morrigan only learns of them after the Archdemon is killed, so she's out. Could the Architect have known about it and how to get in? He did have the Eluvian that Morrigan later learns how to open that is in what becomes the Mother's nest after all, why couldn't he know how to use it? But what would be his motivation in corrupting 2 young elven Dalish who happened to be peering in, I don't trust him at all but that seems far more malicious than he's been shown to be. Could some random darkspawn have found an unlocked one and just stumbled in and led others, and that's why there were darkspawn all around the area and they were what used the blighted Eluvian to taint the 2 elves? Could it have been someone we never met before? And I still don't get why a dark city (some people speculated that it might have led to the Black City or the sunken Arlathan) was what he saw instead of the Crossroads, that goes against how the mirrors are supposed to act.

 

The more I learned about Eluvians and everything in DAI, the less I understand what was going on with the one in the Dalish origin.

[andy6915]

And now a double post, because the wiki mentions a few things that just add to the questions. Imshael knew how to use the network? So was that stupid Choice Demon the one that decided to screw with them by blasting them with blight, was he the one in the Eluvian?

[Reznore57]

We don't know what Talem was looking at , well beyond a city and something scary.

The Eluvians open up to normal Thedas , the Fade , and the Crossroad.

You use Morrigan's Eluvian to get back from the Arbor Wilds , and you go to the Crossroad and the Fade.

So one Eluvian is linked to multiple place provided you know how to use it.

 

Basically it means the ancient elves were moving between those three places (and walking the fade in the flesh) so I imagine what we think we know about this ancient civilization is only the tip of the iceberg.

 

Anyway the Eluvian network was closed down at one point , and it's a bit crazy if you think about it , the  network was probably the easiest way to move around .It's like a big country closing down all the airports.

I imagine they had no choice , there's probably something nasty hidden behind it.

What happened to Tamlen is a hint , also it seems Solas lock someone/something up behind a mirror ...

Now even if that thing was friendly back then , after thousand of years of being trapped , I imagine there's some bitter feelings going on.

 

About demons knowing about that , it doesn't mean much .

Imshael is an old thing , and you can't really keep informations from demons and spirits .

[Toasted Llama]

It could also be a slight retcon - like the crossroads got added later.

 

Or Tamlen saw what closed the Eluvian network as Reznore speculates.

 

The Crossroads could be huge, Tamlen might've seen one end and Morrigan's Eluvian was in the other.

[Vigilance97]

And I still don't get why a dark city (some people speculated that it might have led to the Black City or the sunken Arlathan) was what he saw instead of the Crossroads, that goes against how the mirrors are supposed to act.

 

 

The Eluvians open up to normal Thedas , the Fade , and the Crossroad.

You use Morrigan's Eluvian to get back from the Arbor Wilds , and you go to the Crossroad and the Fade.

So one Eluvian is linked to multiple place provided you know how to use it.

 

[Toasted Llama]

*snippeth*

 

I think the spoiler bit is just for the "Kieran runs into the Eluvian" part, because he says "Ooh interesting! And..."

[Navasha]

The Tamlen mirror was also corrupted.   We don't know exactly what that means, but it might not have even been connected to the Crossroads any longer.   Perhaps some unknown force is able to change the linked locations to certain eluvians, thus why they become corrupted.

[andy6915]

The Tamlen mirror was also corrupted.   We don't know exactly what that means, but it might not have even been connected to the Crossroads any longer.   Perhaps some unknown force is able to change the linked locations to certain eluvians, thus why they become corrupted.

 
That's a really interesting thought. Maybe it did indeed connect to the Black City of the underground and buried capital of the elven empire that Tevinter sunk beneath the Earth, if the destination was redirected. But if that's true... Then what in the Maker's name was the creature that was just on the other side of the mirror? Oh, that is creepy. That means something is still living in the Black City or Arlathan .
 

snip

Can't be. The Black City is the very heart of the Blight, it's the most corrupted place in the entirety of existence. It's where the magisters became darkspawn in the first place. The Inquisitior would have come out of that place looking like a darkspawn if that is true.

[Reznore57]

 

Actually I saw this on reddit , and somebody used flycam and the Black City is there (it's the same map used in Here Lies the Abyss)

Althought I'm slightly disappointed ,in Origins you couldn't miss the City , now you can barely tell it apart from all the rubbles floating in the fade.

[Beomer]

The Eluvians can lead to many places, INCLUDING the Crossroads. They don't all have to necessarily lead there.

I think that the one Tamlen and Dalish Warden run into could have led to some long forgotten blighted Dwarven Thaig. It is the most likely explanation because even in Witch Hunt there are Dwarven/Elven ruins and it is hinted that ancient Dwarves from before the time of men might have traded with the ancient elves of Arlathan, so an Eluvian leading to some lost thaig isn't all that implausible.

Then again it might have lead to some more sinister place, but the Dwarven thaig theory fits perfectly with the least number of assumptions.

Edit:

BTW if you subscribe to the theory that the Black City and Arlathan as the same place then yeah the mirror could have lead to the Black City also.

[andy6915]

Actually I saw this on reddit , and somebody used flycam and the Black City is there (it's the same map used in Here Lies the Abyss)

Althought I'm slightly disappointed ,in Origins you couldn't miss the City , now you can barely tell it apart from all the rubbles floating in the fade.

 

Ah... It didn't even look like a city in DAO. It looked like a torn up and wrinkled wizard hat that had a bunch of rubbish tied to it by strings.

 

 

 

Am I the only one that things it looks like a hat and not a city? And it's made of rock, it's not even a city. You know how I know? The structure in the above pic? It's right across the lake in the fade version of the Blackmarsh in DAA, and you can see it closely enough to tell that it isn't even a city at all. It's just a weird shaped mountain. Don't believe me? Go load up DAA and compare it to that image. Can't get any good screenshots, sorry to say.

[Ieldra]

Can't be. The Black City is the very heart of the Blight, it's the most corrupted place in the entirety of existence. It's where the magisters became darkspawn in the first place. The Inquisitior would have come out of that place looking like a darkspawn if that is true.

I'd be careful with statements like "Can't be". We still know almost nothing about the Black City and its nature. It is likely that it is the source of the Blight, but we don't actually know that. Also, Corypheus said the magisters took it into themselves, so the statement "Everyone who visits become infected" may be wrong. BTW, I refuse the term "corrupted" because that implies a value judgment. The Blight is a magical disease, not a supernatural "turn-you-evil" device.

[andy6915]

I'd be careful with statements like "Can't be". We still know almost nothing about the Black City and its nature. It is likely that it is the source of the Blight, but we don't actually know that. Also, Corypheus said the magisters took it into themselves, so the statement "Everyone who visits become infected" may be wrong. BTW, I refuse the term "corrupted" because that implies a value judgment. The Blight is a magical disease, not a supernatural "turn-you-evil" device.

No, corrupted is not a value judgement. At All. Period. In DA, that is the word used for anything tainted by the blight. Inanimate objects with blight on them are often called corrupted in this setting.

[myahele]

Looking at that scene again, I can't help but think whatever that "thing" was that Tamlen saw could have been one of the Elvhen gods.

 

In my interpretation, it looks like it wanted to be let out/noticed. The Blight/Taint could just be a security measure to prevent people from freeing whoever is inside.

 

When Tamlen was look through the Eluvian there were also whispers that can be heard

[Commander of the Grey]

There's also the fact that if you look close up at the Eluvian at Skyhold what you see is the reflection of the Temple of Mythal.

That's what it appears to be anyway.

[Dai Grepher]

He says it shows him some kind of city... underground. A thaig, obviously. The Deep Roads are full of darkspawn. Tamlen saw one of them in the form of a "great blackness". It could have even been the archdemon. The taint was sent into the eluvian in the Deep Roads and through the one in the elven ruins.

 

Some eluvians connect to the crossroads. Some connect to other eluvians. I'm not sure any connect to the Fade, but obviously with enough power and knowledge an eluvian can be redirected to the Fade, like how Kieran did with Urthemiel's soul. We also see eluvians in the Fade, both in Origins and Inquisition. But these could just be images of them, not ones that actually function. I doubt a real eluvian can connect to an imaginary one. If they exist in the Fade at all, then they must have physical form. Unless it is imaginary and some kind of magical force or some spell maintains them.

[King Killoth]

He says it shows him some kind of city... underground. A thaig, obviously. The Deep Roads are full of darkspawn. Tamlen saw one of them in the form of a "great blackness". It could have even been the archdemon. The taint was sent into the eluvian in the Deep Roads and through the one in the elven ruins.

 

Some eluvians connect to the crossroads. Some connect to other eluvians. I'm not sure any connect to the Fade, but obviously with enough power and knowledge an eluvian can be redirected to the Fade, like how Kieran did with Urthemiel's soul. We also see eluvians in the Fade, both in Origins and Inquisition. But these could just be images of them, not ones that actually function. I doubt a real eluvian can connect to an imaginary one. If they exist in the Fade at all, then they must have physical form. Unless it is imaginary and some kind of magical force or some spell maintains them.

I thought this as well it could have just opened in the deep roads and he got infected by a darkspawn they can infect others as it is said many times that all darkspawn bring with the the blight. I think it was more to set up the threat of the darkspawn for the story of origin then world building. just to give you a more personal reason to join Duncan and the wardens.

[Snowy-Ninja]

Perhaps Corrupted eluvian's connect to the void (whatever it or where it is) instead of the Crossroads and he saw one of the Forgotten ones perhaps? 

 

Most likely he just happened to spy an elevn gods wondering the fade or maybe even solas wondering about. I assume he's been awake a little while trying to work out how to activate the orb he had before handing his it to Cory. 

[Nimrodell]

       I think that the Blight itself was sort of 'safety measure' - some kind of fail-safe from the times when two factions were at war (read - ancient elven Arlathan nobility  and those who are nowadays known only as the Forgotten Ones). Solas is not afraid of the Blight nor he takes seriously Grey Warden efforts and Flemeth states in DA:O that even she will perish under the Blight, but nevertheless, she is very active while it lasts (saving two Wardens and Hawke's family) and it doesn't seem like she' playing with fire - especially when she's subtly telling Aveline what must be done about her husband.

 

     Eluvians may be corrupted but as a sort of collateral damage from the ancient conflict and it seem that the same fate has befallen Tevinter magisters too. After Jaws of Hakkon Forgotten Ones codex entry and Solas' personal path, it seems that the corruption itself was not a punishment from the Maker - it seems like it was a sort of a weapon or fail-safe mechanism made by Arlathan warring factions. The Blight doesn't seem as a punishment for the 'sin', it is something else. After all, Dread Wolf was actually dealing with Corypheus, meaning, he actually knows what Blight is and who are and were Old Gods (same as Flemeth/Mythal who sacrifices a lot to save their uncorrupted essence). I guess that some of the blighted eluvians are actually sort of booby trap or just mere product of collateral damage.

[Dai Grepher]

I thought this as well it could have just opened in the deep roads and he got infected by a darkspawn they can infect others as it is said many times that all darkspawn bring with the the blight. I think it was more to set up the threat of the darkspawn for the story of origin then world building. just to give you a more personal reason to join Duncan and the wardens.

 

I agree. There was no reason for the Dalish elf to go with Duncan except being tainted. Even Tamlen's description of what was happening seems to just be a... moderately appealing way of linking the taint with the "underground".

 

I have yet to play the Dalish origin myself, but I have watched a video on it. I think it would have been cool to actually find this underground eluvian in the Deep Roads and destroy it as kind of like a side quest while finding Branka.

[Dai Grepher]

       I think that the Blight itself was sort of 'safety measure' - some kind of fail-safe from the times when two factions were at war (read - ancient elven Arlathan nobility  and those who are nowadays known only as the Forgotten Ones). Solas is not afraid of the Blight nor he takes seriously Grey Warden efforts and Flemeth states in DA:O that even she will perish under the Blight, but nevertheless, she is very active while it lasts (saving two Wardens and Hawke's family) and it doesn't seem like she' playing with fire - especially when she's subtly telling Aveline what must be done about her husband.

 

     Eluvians may be corrupted but as a sort of collateral damage from the ancient conflict and it seem that the same fate has befallen Tevinter magisters too. After Jaws of Hakkon Forgotten Ones codex entry and Solas' personal path, it seems that the corruption itself was not a punishment from the Maker - it seems like it was a sort of a weapon or fail-safe mechanism made by Arlathan warring factions. The Blight doesn't seem as a punishment for the 'sin', it is something else. After all, Dread Wolf was actually dealing with Corypheus, meaning, he actually knows what Blight is and who are and were Old Gods (same as Flemeth/Mythal who sacrifices a lot to save their uncorrupted essence). I guess that some of the blighted eluvians are actually sort of booby trap or just mere product of collateral damage.

 

I think it's way too early to assume any of that about Solas or the Forgotten Ones. I highly doubt Solas just turned the orb over to the hideousness that was stretch-face magister. More likely, Solas met Corypheus while he was assuming the form of Larius or Jeneka. Solas probably thought that he could trick this unsuspecting Grey Warden into helping him unlock the orb, and he had no idea that it was one of the ancient Magisters, one who would actually know what the orb was.

[Absafraginlootly]

We don't know what Talem was looking at , well beyond a city and something scary.

The Eluvians open up to normal Thedas , the Fade , and the Crossroad.

You use Morrigan's Eluvian to get back from the Arbor Wilds , and you go to the Crossroad and the Fade.

So one Eluvian is linked to multiple place provided you know how to use it.

 

Basically it means the ancient elves were moving between those three places (and walking the fade in the flesh) so I imagine what we think we know about this ancient civilization is only the tip of the iceberg.

 

Anyway the Eluvian network was closed down at one point , and it's a bit crazy if you think about it , the  network was probably the easiest way to move around .It's like a big country closing down all the airports.

I imagine they had no choice , there's probably something nasty hidden behind it.

What happened to Tamlen is a hint , also it seems Solas lock someone/something up behind a mirror ...

Now even if that thing was friendly back then , after thousand of years of being trapped , I imagine there's some bitter feelings going on.

 

About demons knowing about that , it doesn't mean much .

Imshael is an old thing , and you can't really keep informations from demons and spirits .

 

Quarrantining areas by closing down the eluvians to them makes sense, for all we know the taint got to the deeproads through one of these mirrors.

 

I'm more interested in who rather than where, if they're still on the other side of that mirror Merrill fixing it could be really bad.

[andy6915]

I'm more interested in who rather than where, if they're still on the other side of that mirror Merrill fixing it could be really bad.

 

How could they be on a different one? Merrill made the one she has in DA2 from scratch, and it was even fully functioning. Problem was... She didn't know it took a key, and never made one.

[AlleluiaElizabeth]

How could they be on a different one? Merrill made the one she has in DA2 from scratch, and it was even fully functioning. Problem was... She didn't know it took a key, and never made one.

 

Merrill didn't make an eluvian from scratch. The one she's fixing in DA2 is the one Tamlen and Mahariel found. She says so.

[andy6915]

Merrill didn't make an eluvian from scratch. The one she's fixing in DA2 is the one Tamlen and Mahariel found. She says so.

Wrong. She uses the shards in hers, but she still makes the whole thing herself. She basically took the shards, made a functioning one using them, and unknowingly locked herself out of her own mirror.