639 réponses à ce sujet

[Innarra]

While I understand that some are frustrated or upset by this news, I must ask (since it's mentioned by several posters) what was done by BioWare, or the teams, to mislead players?  If there are examples, I am happy to try to address them here.

 

Billy

 

At no point in time previously did you lead us to believe this would happen, until now. That's misleading. We bought the game for the same price as the newer consoles and bought what we thought would be continued support for the game. It's laughable that you can't seem to see this, Billy. Were you somehow taken aback by the overwhelming storm of dissent from the community? 

 

Bioware ALSO mentioned a year ago that they'd support DA:IMP far beyond what they did for ME3. Well, that certainly didn't happen, did it?

cough: http://www.destructo...3--279147.phtml

 

Coming out midway through the life of the game with a decision to discontinue all support for a large number of gamers is just bad business.

 

Bioware won't have my support in the future for other games. If I end up buying a PS4 in the near future, it likely won't be to play this game. I enjoyed it while it lasted, you guys made a great game, and our PS3 community is full of wonderful people. I'm deeply saddened we won't have support to continue enjoying the future of this game. I'm unbelievably upset by your news.

 

To all of my friends and family on PS3, you guys are the best. I really connected well with you, more than I ever expected with this game. I hope we can stay in touch, maybe we'll find some other great games to play on PS4 later next year (likely when I'll pony up the cash for a new console). In the mean time, I'll be spending time with Shadows of Mordor, The Last of Us, and Dark Souls 2 which I have yet to play on my PS3.

 

All the best to you (and the worst to you Bioware, you make me a sad panda)

 

[flipperstudq]

If this post is for real, I can honestly say that a lot of us--myself included--will never buy anything from BioWare ever again.

 

This is such a let down. We spent money on this game. We stuck with the series despite it being a complete disaster for MONTHS. And instead of demanding our money back, Dragon Age fans continued to support BioWare.

 

And now, after all of that, BioWare is giving up on US?

 

I'm done. I love Dragon Age, but BioWare screwed me over one too many times. There are a lot of other really good games out there that actually work and have customer support. I will be playing them from now on.

[Spectr61]

At the time of the interview (prior to the launch of the game, just before PAX Prime 2014), the mode as a whole was being referenced. Not speaking to specific platforms.
 
Support does not refer exclusively to patches, or DLCs. It refers to a team continuing to actively work on the feature/mode/game. 
 
We are continuing support of the mode, with more weekly challenges that will extend far beyond what was delivered on ME3MP (I can say this with certainty, since I assisted with setting up the pipeline and content for that game and live service as well). Each weekly challenge is content that is created by the team here. That support will continue.
 
Billy

Billy, do you know why the old gens were included in the first place?

[Innarra]

At the time of the interview (prior to the launch of the game, just before PAX Prime 2014), the mode as a whole was being referenced. Not speaking to specific platforms.

 

Support does not refer exclusively to patches, or DLCs. It refers to a team continuing to actively work on the feature/mode/game. 

 

We are continuing support of the mode, with more weekly challenges that will extend far beyond what was delivered on ME3MP (I can say this with certainty, since I assisted with setting up the pipeline and content for that game and live service as well). Each weekly challenge is content that is created by the team here. That support will continue.

 

Billy

 

Supporting the "mode" doesn't mean fixing the things currently wrong with what we have, or developing any new ideas to change the current content. How hard is it to set up a weekly challenge in place for the PS3 and X360? The vast majority of the "challenges" you guys have come up with pertain to "kill 50 of these", or "level up these characters" or "use these weapons". 

 

That's not support at all. Don't try to sugar coat it, you guys are abandoning the PS3/X360 community, and leaving the game dead in the water there.

[PPF]

Does BioWare/EA expect you to buy another copy of Dragon Age: Inquisition?:

There is NO expectation that anyone who has bought the game on PS3 will buy it again on PS4, The same can be said about Xbox 360 and Xbox One.  The save importer was created to be available in the event someone started on PS3/Xbox 360, didn't complete the game, purchased/acquired a PS4/Xbox One since starting their original playthrough/MP progress, and wants to continue on the new hardware

 

...Uh, yes, in that scenario, that is exactly the expectation.  How else can someone buy the game on last gen, not buy it again on next gen, not get a courtesy upgrade, yet complete the game on next gen?  I appreciate that you are endeavoring to answer questions, but unless we are being given courtesy upgrades to continue to play the game we already bought, then the answer is unequivocally yeah, Bioware/EA does in fact expect us to buy another copy of DA:I.

 

Leaving aside paid DLC, which still sucks not to have access to but at least previous-gen isn't getting charged for, fact is that with this specific decision to discontinue free DLC and all patches, previous-gen players are now paying or will have paid for game they cannot play.  Player A pays $60 in November 2014 for the game, and gets the core, 10+ patches - quite a lot more than 10, if the team's assurances of long-term support are true, including apparently whole gameplay modes, maps, characters - and 2+ DLC.  Player B pays $60 in November 2014 for the game, and gets the core, 9 patches, 1 DLC.  Player B has, by any rational measure, paid for content they're not getting.

 

Xbox 360/PS3 players have paid for product they're not getting.  So as it stands, those patches and gameplay that are free for Customer A cost Customer B $30+.  That's not okay.

 

Nobody sane is suggesting handing out a bunch of free consoles, and while this should've been made clear before release, it wasn't.  I choose to believe that wasn't malicious and is just because the team did their best to keep up all five promised systems but failed.  Sucky, and an apology would help, but it's unfixable sans flux capacitor.  But courtesy upgrades of the game - so that two people who spent the same money on the same game can actually play the same game - are only rational, are feasible, are the right thing to do, would be good press, would smooth a lot of ruffled feathers, and would solve the market problem of previous-gen owners having been overcharged by having paid for product never delivered. 

 

I am sure it was not your decision and you are the messenger here, I get that.  So I am interested to know whether the decision to overcharge all those people is final, and whether it was made at the Bioware level, EA level, or Sony/Microsoft.

[flipperstudq]

...ok I don't usually double-post, but I have a legit question for Billy.

 

Billy--

 

You basically just told us PS3/Xbox 360 players that we need to buy a second copy of this game if we want access to everything that we thought we already paid for. So it may not have been BioWare's intention to mislead, but that doesn't mean we weren't mislead.

 

Whining on an online forum is obviously not going to solve anything, but many of us have invested too much time in this game to be ok with getting left in the dust. The ability to transfer data to a newer console is not a valid solution for many of us either, since many of us PS3/Xbox 360 players are using those systems because we cannot afford anything newer.

 

That said, what would you suggest we do to address this situation productively?

[Shadohz]

I have a few questions:

1. At what point in the development cycle was the decision made to offer limited (or drop) support to legacy consoles? Was it prior to the Nov 2014 release? Was it mid-year? Was it last week?

2. If the decision was made prior to the 2014 release, then why wasn't 't it disclosed or visibly transparent so consumers could make a informed decision on purchase?

3. Who was involved in the decision to offer limited (or drop) support for legacy consoles? Exclusively BW staff (PM, executives, QA, and Devs) or was EA involved as well?

4. What were the reasons for pulling partial support for legacy consoles?

 

5. Does the Development team use different toolsets for each platform compilation? Or do they have a conversion toolset that produces different complies that are compatible for each platform based off a single project?

It can be inferred from Luke's sigh of relief announcement of the Save Data importer (which I'm having trouble finding for some odd reason), that the BioWare staff was instructed to remain radio silent on the limited support change. To say people weren't misled is, at best, being intellectually dishonest. I understand how things work. If you advertise or make commentary on software enhancements then that puts your company on the hook to delivery. You have to maintain a level of secrecy and standoffishness so as to not make false promises. I however don't see this situation where that applies. BW and/or EA could have issued a press release prior to the game release that limited support would be offered to legacy consoles and how it would impact the users.

Stuff like this is what drives gamers into piracy, running their own private servers, malicious modding and/or not supporting game publishers. I harken back to the same complaint I had 4 years ago about ME3. Had EA/BW disclosed that all their console DLCs "required an internet connection", then I never would've bought DLCs. Four posts and 2 technical requests later, noone has resolved the issue. Now I'm stuck with a $170 game that doesn't work unless I connect it to the internet. No patches, no return ability, no help. This was the reason why I didn't buy DLCs for DAI. You guys are your own worst enemy. The game was rushed, the MP was plagued with bugs... and now this. Please explain to us why should we keep supporting you if these are the type of things we can expect in return? Why must people like me whip the crowd into a frenzy to get a respectable response to a situation that could've been avoid if you're just upfront about it. You're a game publisher. You live and die by your reputation.

If you're unable to answer any of the questions above, then feel free to illicit a response from someone higher up the food chain. La guillotine ne se soucie pas de votre noblesse grade.

 

[Geth Supremacy]

some good posts and some answers would be nice, but the way I see it.... What's done is done. I don't see any answer making the reality any better.  I just see the company as completely different now.  In the end its better to know what you're dealing with IMO, so this isn't completely a bad thing moving forward for reference.

 

Wipe the spit off of your face and keep it moving.  Just don't forget who/what you're dealing with in the future and don't support that.

[5\3\1]

Do we know what the breakdown per system is? How many play the MP on PS3, 360, PS4, XBONE?

[midnight tea]

Do we know what the breakdown per system is? How many play the MP on PS3, 360, PS4, XBONE?

 

I think that can be (very) roughly deduced from goals set in each MP challenge.

[5\3\1]

I think that can be (very) roughly deduced from goals set in each MP challenge.

Hey thanks for answering my question with actual numbers. Now go break out that T 86 calculator or abacus and gimme those numbers.

[Billy Buskell]

Billy, do you know why the old gens were included in the first place?

 

To allow as many players as possible to play the game.  As another poster pointed out, had we elected to not ship the game on PS3 and Xbox 360, we'd have received even more strongly worded messages, and lovely requests for us to choke on various items.  

 

I understand you're upset, but let's apply some logic here.  To everyone who asks "why even ship on PS3/Xbox 360??!?!!?", the alternative you're suggesting is that we should have shipped on PS4, Xbox One, and PC only.  In that alternative, you would not have been able to play the game at all.  At least without swapping to PC, or buying one of the new consoles.  I'm not seeing that as a solution for either side.

 

Some points I'd like to remind everyone of:

1) If you wish bodily harm or ill to the staff, that is a violation of the terms of service of the forums. You're upset. We get it. Check the full thread. If you are thinking of uttering threats or hoping to see someone on the dev team be harmed, please back away from the keyboard for a moment, take a deep breath, and don't post it (Would you ever say these things to someone's face? Try using that question as a filter going forward).

2) You're absolutely allowed to ask questions to others or the devs.  If we answer the question, that's the answer.  Ignoring the answer, possibly because it was not the answer you wanted to see, and spamming the same question, or commenting how we are refusing to address the issue will not lead us to answer further. In fact, this leads to the opposite reaction. There was a long period of time when the boards became so hostile that most of the dev team vacated them. I really never want to return to that.

3) If you're going to start a mass PSN/XBL message to everyone on your friend's list asking everyone to express their outrage regarding this topic double check you don't have any BioWare developers on your bulk message... seriously.

 

 

Billy

[ruggie]

Well screw it lets glitch lobby to sit 4000 points them jump t o ps4. They can't ban us any more on the ps3 if they don't patch us. I think it's s grand plan. Funny thing is I heard most good players are in older consules. That's what I'll be planning I'm doing going to ps4 with 3-4k points. Or just never buying anything bioware again. It was shitty service from the gate now this? Lol hands down worst developers ever.

[Billy Buskell]

Well screw it lets glitch lobby to sit 4000 points them jump t o ps4. They can't ban us any more on the ps3 if they don't patch us. I think it's s grand plan. Funny thing is I heard most good players are in older consules. That's what I'll be planning I'm doing going to ps4 with 3-4k points. Or just never buying anything bioware again. It was shitty service from the gate now this? Lol hands down worst developers ever.

 

You are openly admitting to planning on breaking the terms of service of the game. Doing this will result in bans.

 

Billy

[ruggie]

How can I be banned when we aren't getting any patches where our terms of service

[ruggie]

I'd assume by taking my money for a full game and I get half a game that would breach my tos.

Ruggie

[Billy Buskell]

...ok I don't usually double-post, but I have a legit question for Billy.

 

Billy--

 

You basically just told us PS3/Xbox 360 players that we need to buy a second copy of this game if we want access to everything that we thought we already paid for. So it may not have been BioWare's intention to mislead, but that doesn't mean we weren't mislead.

 

Whining on an online forum is obviously not going to solve anything, but many of us have invested too much time in this game to be ok with getting left in the dust. The ability to transfer data to a newer console is not a valid solution for many of us either, since many of us PS3/Xbox 360 players are using those systems because we cannot afford anything newer.

 

That said, what would you suggest we do to address this situation productively?

 

This was answered previously. The $60 purchase price is for the game. The unfortunate answer is that the PS3 and Xbox 360 are now just months away from being 9 and 10 years old, respectively.  This November will mark the 2 year anniversary of the new generation of consoles.  

[ruggie]

This was answered previously. The $60 purchase price is for the game. The unfortunate answer is that the PS3 and Xbox 360 are now just months away from being 9 and 10 years old, respectively. This November will mark the 2 year anniversary of the new generation of consoles.

[ruggie]

Which is why most companies are just putting games I'm new generation. Pc had got to be going on 30 years old but they still get dlc.

[scene_cachet]

Ahhh seems like my #BANruggie2015 campaign might be working  

 

[ruggie]

Also respectively you missed the point of his question it wasn't about how old the ps3 it was basically why should we buy the game twice..... especially with no offer of discount. Just saying because if like to know how this is fair too. Idc how old the console is if you put the game out on it why stop me content. Good day sir.

[Geth Supremacy]

Which is why most companies are just putting games I'm new generation. Pc had got to be going on 30 years old but they still get dlc.

 

LOL

 

This is absolutely right.  Age doesn't matter. You CHOSE to put the games on old gen.  Nobody forced them.  Nobody is crying about other games being PS4 games only.  That's a weak point.  I didn't expect DAI to be on PS3 and I damn sure don't expect ME: A to be.

[midnight tea]

Which is why most companies are just putting games I'm new generation. Pc had got to be going on 30 years old but they still get dlc.

 

Wat? PC - or Personal Computer - is not a brand/product name for a single type of console/computer, as PS3 or Xbox 360 is.

 

....You're not the brightest fish in the pond, aren't you?

[Geth Supremacy]

#Biocare

 

Trimming the fat since 2015

[Geth Supremacy]

Ahhh seems like my #BANruggie2015 campaign might be working

 

 

Looks like you have some karma coming your way.

 

#FREERUGGIE!