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An Open Letter to Bioware Regarding Explicit Content


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#3176
9TailsFox

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That was the beauty of DAI:  the armor's appearance changed depending on who wore it.  SO characters were able to maintain a unique theme for themselves while allowing the player to select from a variety of looks.

 

We should not all be subjected to Samara, the aescetic warrior, to be flashing her blueberries in combat.

Bat DA:I didn't maintain unique theme for themselves. Some armor covered Varric manliness. And Cass don't even have flashing blueberries armor. And worst you can put Solas in grey warden armor, come on seriously it's insulting Solas would take grey warden armor and stick it to your ass.



#3177
Iakus

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Bat DA:I didn't maintain unique theme for themselves. Some armor covered Varric manliness. And Cass don't even have flashing blueberries armor. And worst you can put Solas in grey warden armor, come on seriously it's insulting Solas would take grey warden armor and stick it to your ass.

 

But the armor you put on Varric will look different if you put the same armor on Cole which will look different if you put the same armor on Sera.

 

No Cassandra doesn't wear a Breast Plate, but if you wanted her to wear a chain mail bikini (and survived the attempt to put her in it :D ) I'd be fine with it as long as I can still put her in sensible armor.

 

For that matter, Iron Bull has plenty of outfits that show off his "bosomy man-pillows" But I have the option to put him in proper armor, so we both win there.

 

Solas, gosh I had no idea there was only Grey Warden armor available for him /sarcasm



#3178
Mr.House

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DAI companion armor way is the only way to go.


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#3179
Seboist

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No - but you are saying that Jaime is lucky his sister is attractive as otherwise he wouldn't want to commit incest?

 

 

The logic doesn't follow. If Jaime's sister was unattractive, Jaime wouldn't be unlucky. He'd just have an ugly sister and he'd get with someone else. Unless there's some advantage that the incest part provides...

 

Is the notion that I find Cersei/Lena attractive that hard to comprehend?



#3180
9TailsFox

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But the armor you put on Varric will look different if you put the same armor on Cole which will look different if you put the same armor on Sera.

 

No Cassandra doesn't wear a Breast Plate, but if you wanted her to wear a chain mail bikini (and survived the attempt to put her in it :D ) I'd be fine with it as long as I can still put her in sensible armor.

 

For that matter, Iron Bull has plenty of outfits that show off his "bosomy man-pillows" But I have the option to put him in proper armor, so we both win there.

 

Solas, gosh I had no idea there was only Grey Warden armor available for him /sarcasm

I survived putting Solas in grey warden armor and he is god, And Cass like my Inquisitor I will be fine. I can put armor character wouldn't like on all except Cole and hats/helmets. :lol:

tumblr_nb8jc5UcHU1r3srs9o1_1280.gif


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#3181
von uber

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Is the notion that I find Cersei/Lena attractive that hard to comprehend?

 

No, but the notion of you saying Jaime is lucky to have an attractive sister is.



#3182
Hanako Ikezawa

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Well I think about companion armor I see no reason to allow us to change it. How character dress is big representation of personality and character itself. Like character Grey Fullbuster as child he was training to be ice wizard in cold mountains naked, and got habit to take of clothes. You may not like it but it's part of personality and backstory, it's fine to not like character but it's your problem not character. You don't like Samara fine take Tali she is great and have forced suit 24/7.

Characters having personal looks is fine, as long as those looks make sense. Samara wearing the outfit she wears in places that are vacuum, toxic, radiated, etc does not make sense. 


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#3183
Chealec

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We should not all be subjected to Samara, the aescetic warrior, to be flashing her blueberries in combat.

 

Perhaps Samara's been wearing that same suit since she was a maiden and it doesn't fit right now that's she's filled out... Asari wonderfabrics, last for millennia, just not really stretchy enough.



#3184
9TailsFox

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Characters having personal looks is fine, as long as those looks make sense. Samara wearing the outfit she wears in places that are vacuum, toxic, radiated, etc does not make sense. 

But space magic force biotics. Nothing in mass effect make sense in space opera. And boobs are great, more clothes like Samara :rolleyes:

guardian_chiss.jpg


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#3185
Seraphim24

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"graphic sexual scenes"=/= romance.

 

Also, getting annoyed that the counter to giving feedback on this matter seems to come down to "Well I'm happy with it, so go away" along with condescending "Go play Mario games instead"  Rather than looking fro ways to provide more options for everyone, the focus is instead on how to marginalize a point of view and belittle their concerns.

 

Ok, let me just clarify this is somewhat long though, it seems you and some others misinterpreted my post, please try and exercise more care in that the next time.

 

First, in a sense it is promoting or at least informing players of other options for everyone by suggesting everyone go play Mario or Rayman  if you want that. Then DA/ME can be whatever DA/ME are and those other games can be those other games. Mario and Rayman have well, no graphic sex scenes if that is a problem for the OP.

 

The OP was an attempt to change DA and ME, whereas I was saying based on his preferences you know there are other games (action RPGs, even) out there that have that already...

 

Second, DA and ME focused on, and have continued to build on, the obsession with romance and really in some ways cinematic elements generally as well as the resulting increase in cinematic presentation, which gradually included increased sex scenes and so on until finally getting to even more graphic or explicit ones. This isn't the kind of game I want to play. I want to play games that are fun games. I don't consider it inherently all by itself an acutely sovereign sin, but it shows a shift in priorities that inherently diminishes what should be an experience focused on the player. There are bits and pieces that are not so much in the wrong arena, but the trend has been going as the OP did correctly say more in favor of higher octane cinema, romance, and occasionally sex.

 

Third, Games are designed to empower players, romance (and sex scenes) are focused on someone else and as I read somewhere dev-driven concerns/desires, these detract from the power of the experience. Romance means another person, another person and their issues, concerns, desires, problems, hopes, whatever, whereas a good video game that focuses on the player themselves. The focus should be on them and making them happy and feeling heroic and good. It's not really a novel point of course it's still a core value in Nintendo games as an example. Some of Pasquale1234's posts were harping on this such as

 

My interest is the characters and the role-play. The more freedom I'm given to create my own story / narrative, the better my experience with the game.

 

So while it may seem odd to advocate more of the game focus when as stated they've had a focus on those things early on, the reality is they vary and affect the quality of the experience. KOTOR for example (part of a classic Bioware period I guess you could say) has romantic elements and all that but overall has a much greater focus on the game itself. Moreover, many games have romantic elements certainly, it is very common, it's certainly fair to place Bioware in their classic period in recent times as falling decisively closer to emphasizing them very strongly.

 

Moreover, something like Inquisition was clearly an attempt to recapture the gameplay focus of Origins, but there is no magic formula for that and in practice the game was probably really in a sense Dragon Age 2: 2.

 

As I say, it's not a sovereign sin or something, each game and situation is different, Origins in particular reminded me of where there was a greater gameplay focus and thus more fun to play, but later entries in both DA and ME trended towards eliminating and focusing more on companion characters and other elements.

 

Anyway, hope that makes more sense to you now. =]



#3186
Hanako Ikezawa

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But space magic force biotics. Nothing in mass effect make sense in space opera. And boobs are great, more clothes like Samara :rolleyes:

The lore establishes that shields and biotics do not protect people from the things I listed. If characters wear stuff like that on the ship or safe places, there is nothing anyone can really say, but in places where it doesn't make sense it should not be there. 



#3187
Seraphim24

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LIke (continuing the point), consider Bastila Shan, a very popular and well-received Bioware character yes? Does she have a graphic sex scene? Or an extensive romance? No, of course not, although I suppose you could argue the second point a bit, and yet that didn't seem to detract at all from most player's experiences.

 

The same for Lady Aribeth from NWNOC and HotU, the fact that you didn't have this culmination of a sex scene, or even comprehensible romance, didn't mar their popularity or make them any less appealing, enhanced it really.

 

For those who don't know... from earlier Bioware games, Aribeth and Bastila.

Spoiler

 

As a side note, consider their long since lost technique of modeling long hair, they should dive into the archives and re-discover this ancient and long lost technology.



#3188
9TailsFox

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The lore establishes that shields and biotics do not protect people from the things I listed. If characters wear stuff like that on the ship or safe places, there is nothing anyone can really say, but in places where it doesn't make sense it should not be there. 

I understand what you saying I just don't care. If Shepard can be broth back from the dead after experiencing entering planets atmosphere from space. Asari can survive naked in space. Well Javik definitely can.



#3189
Seraphim24

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Ok I think I see what your problem was Iakus, lumping in DA/ME as cinematic romance heavy and graphic sex oriented games seems somewhat complex given their role among other games and the climate generally, although actually the best examples are probably from TV and film which often focus on these things pretty obsessively.

 

There are games which focus purely on interactive cinema and often have very larges doses of focusing on romance/sex and things of that nature, for example, Heavy Rain from what I understand.

 

Then there are games like Rayman and Mario which obviously go the other direction.

 

DA/ME and others fall somewhere in between in general, in all objectivity. It is not fair to lump them together with other games. You could say they are more clearly hybrid CRPG/cinematic games. However, as the OP pointed out, the trend is in the direction of moving towards the Heavy Rain style, certainly not Mario and Rayman. As I pointed out, KOTOR, NWN, and possibly JE are all more clearly those hybrids rather than cinemized (is that word??? Should be!)

 

Cherry picking out examples like specific scenes in ME or DA and lumping them as games with the likes of GTA5 or something is bad form, and something some people other do, although I didn't do that, and there is no need for you to imagine that I did.

 

This is why I clarified I don't like freak out at the side of breasts or abs or whatever, it's just I'm looking for exciting games focused on the player, and these things can detract in various ways.

 

I'd also add that I'd still prefer DA and ME, whatever is going on, over media that focuses on a slick "puritan" presentation, because oftentimes the simplest way to put it is that puritan presentation is mostly just by people simply following their local church's prescriptions and pastors without their own personal interest or invocation of those norms. A harsh way to put it is that it is dishonest, but at any rate certainly isn't resonant when someone does something not because they believe it but because it's just what they were told.

 

I'd take an honest partially romance fixated game over a 1-800-JESU borrowed bumper sticker message any day.


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#3190
Lady Artifice

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The logic doesn't follow. If Jaime's sister was unattractive, Jaime wouldn't be unlucky. He'd just have an ugly sister and he'd get with someone else. Unless there's some advantage that the incest part provides...

 

Proximity maybe? 

 

If we're actually examining pros and cons of incest itself, anyway. Which I'm not necessarily convinced we should do. 



#3191
Fredward

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Sense8-style orgy or I'm cancelling my pre-order.


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#3192
AlanC9

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The logic doesn't follow. If Jaime's sister was unattractive, Jaime wouldn't be unlucky. He'd just have an ugly sister and he'd get with someone else. Unless there's some advantage that the incest part provides...


Well, incest did let him put his son on the throne....

#3193
Seboist

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No, but the notion of you saying Jaime is lucky to have an attractive sister is.

 

Bruh, you and kaiser are looking for far too deeply into a tongue in cheek comment.

 

Well, incest did let him put his son on the throne....

 

That's the definition of wincest, and he can't help it if what's said to be the most attractive woman in westeros "just happens" to be his sister(that's just details).



#3194
Sartoz

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                                                                                                    <<<<<<<<<<()>>>>>>>>>>

 

Since this thread seems to keep going, I decided to make another suggestion.

 

More like this Bio!

source: https://www.youtube-...s=0&;showinfo=0



#3195
Fandango

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                                                                                                    <<<<<<<<<<()>>>>>>>>>>

 

Since this thread seems to keep going, I decided to make another suggestion.

 

More like this Bio!

source: https://www.youtube-...s=0&;showinfo=0

 

Put a NSFW tag on that dude - come on now!



#3196
Chealec

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Third, Games are designed to empower players, romance (and sex scenes) are focused on someone else and as I read somewhere dev-driven concerns/desires, these detract from the power of the experience. Romance means another person, another person and their issues, concerns, desires, problems, hopes, whatever, whereas a good video game that focuses on the player themselves. The focus should be on them and making them happy and feeling heroic and good. It's not really a novel point of course it's still a core value in Nintendo games as an example.

By that standard ME2 should be considered the worst game in the series as a huge chunk of it is basically pandering to the needs of your space buddy NPCs - the loyalty missions aren't romance necessarily but they are all about "another person and their issues, concerns, desires, problems, hopes, whatever". Yet ME2 is considered by many to be the best game in the trilogy.


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#3197
Sartoz

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Put a NSFW tag on that dude - come on now!

                                                                                                   <<<<<<<<<<()>>>>>>>>>>

 

I don't do Twitter, Facebook, tags or hashtags, so I have no clue what NSFW means.

 

Besides, it's so funny....

                                                                                                   
 



#3198
Chealec

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                                                                                                   <<<<<<<<<<()>>>>>>>>>>

 

I don't do Twitter, Facebook, tags or hashtags, so I have no clue what NSFW means.

 

Besides, it's so funny....

 

Not Safe For Work - it's not a new thing it's been a forum staple since 1807!



#3199
Iakus

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By that standard ME2 should be considered the worst game in the series as a huge chunk of it is basically pandering to the needs of your space buddy NPCs - the loyalty missions aren't romance necessarily but they are all about "another person and their issues, concerns, desires, problems, hopes, whatever". Yet ME2 is considered by many to be the best game in the trilogy.

Not by me.  Just for the record.


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#3200
Il Divo

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By that standard ME2 should be considered the worst game in the series as a huge chunk of it is basically pandering to the needs of your space buddy NPCs - the loyalty missions aren't romance necessarily but they are all about "another person and their issues, concerns, desires, problems, hopes, whatever". Yet ME2 is considered by many to be the best game in the trilogy.

 

That's largely how I felt. ME2's loyalty missions were a little on the blunt end of the spectrum in terms of throwing companion quests at you, but simply given Bioware's history of focusing on companions, I definitely preferred this to ME1's approach with fewer companions/less narrative focus (Wrex aside).

 

That's also a huge part of why I enjoyed DA:I so much, as the advisors were essentially 3 extra companion characters.