So basically you want them to do what they did with Cassandra, but without actually showing her breasts?
I wouldn't say that is what I want exactly, since nudity doesn't bother me at all. That is the route I'd prefer they go however if they opt for fades to black and no nudity.
If they opt for no nudity I'd also prefer a scene similar to Liara's in ME3 than a fade to black. It used camera angles and shadows to obscure or hide the naked bits, but nudity was implied.
Fair point - but it would still cost less than the i18n work... Microsoft translated Windows into Welsh ffs - that must have cost a packet and only benefits 7 people and a couple of hundred thousand sheep - putting blurs and bleeps into a Mass Effect game would be considerably less work and would be appreciated by more people (i.e. probably more than 7)
I still have a hard time buying that it would be that many more.
Really? So asking to eliminate profanity and nudity is on the same level as asking for a companion? I don't think so.
Regardless of what you think the merits of said art, censorship of art is wrong. If you don't think art has merit then don't partake do not ask for the integrity of said art to be changed. Asking for a toggle is asking to censor the art. The fact that the original poster can't see this is yet another sign of immaturity. Just because you want only to censor the art for yourself or those that are like minded doesn't actually make it non censorship.
Sorry to say but artistic integrity is very much at the heart of this discussion, you desire to try and make it not so doesn't actually change it. Games are part art and while you may not view ME as art or think it lacks merit, I think you will find the fact that ME1 was pushing the boundaries of nudity in games and making a commentary about nudity by its inclusion will land it squarely in the realm of art as commentary. I suspect that art history classes will begin to include games if they haven't already. So yes the integrity of art is very much at the heart of this issue. And I firmly believe that art doesn't exist to make our lives more palatable but rather to illuminate and comment on society, and we see themes within ME that do this very thing. So I am utterly against anything that allows people to ruin a piece of work's integrity just to make it palatable.
If you find a piece of art unpalatable don't partake. Problem solved.
The content of a video game is changed because of budget constraints, technical constraints, fan feedback, marketing opportunities, demands of the producer and a myriad other things. All of these things could be said to be interfering with the creators "artistic vision". Yet the only things that people are claiming to be sacrosanct are nudity and profanity. I really don't get it.
I wouldn't say that is what I want exactly, since nudity doesn't bother me at all. That is the route I'd prefer they go however if they opt for fades to black and no nudity.
If they opt for no nudity I'd also prefer a scene similar to Liara's in ME3 than a fade to black. It used camera angles and shadows to obscure or hide the naked bits, but nudity was implied.
That's what I meant, sorry.
Personally I find it no less jarring or unnatural to have it fade back to them being dressed than fading back to them being not dressed.
Yeah, no. I do understand the problem and I already wrote something about it earlier.
So you see, the problem is that such a toggle would affect me even if I choose not to use it.
It would place limits on the writers because they'd have to create characters and write dialogue in a way that's compatible with the toggle without changing their intent, the character in question or the context of the conversation no matter which version you are listening to.
Which leads to the little experiment I proposed: You start with the original, mature dialogue and then try to make it kid friendly as it would be under the toggle. Then you compare both versions. The result is that something (content or character) would be changed by it. Since the writers can't have that, they'd have to change the mature version to something that is compatible with a toggle.
Try the experiment, choose any movie or game or book you like. You'll see that I'm right.
Well, you are wrong in the end if you presume authorial intent will be restricted fully over a toggle. That makes no sense regarding game design and kind of defeats the purpose of the toggle in the first place; if the writers are restricted by a mechanic, why have the mechanic when it's easier to do it once?
See, what you are assuming is the content is censored before it is released, and the toggle has nothing to do with that, but to censor content because of a toggle defeats the purpose of having that option in the first place. It's like how they had the blood and gore toggled on and off in Dragon Age all the time, you can censor most of that to make it cleaner, but it doesn't stop it from showing up in the game.
Your experiment is not an experiment by the way, it's a trap that proves your assumptions correct, and a bad one at that because it again misses the point, the scene is not changed at all and neither is the dialogue, only your ability to hear it over a beep.
Some of you guys have weird hangups about nudity and profanity.
When did the BSN get to be so puritan?
Anything less would'st be idle, English.
Yea, and a toggle for showing some text or not (which is already there for subtitles anyway) is even way simpler than a profanity bleep option.
The former takes about 10 lines of code to write. The latter would require someone to go through all the voice recordings with profanities, flag them, write down the exact time and length of the word in question, then write an extra track in the dialogue system for the bleep, that then gets played back at the exact right time and length.
I don't know about Frostbite but at least in UE3 (if you did this for the trilogy) there was no system in place for one sound to overwrite another and then let it smoothly go back to the original, so an entire class would have to be custom written for that feature as well.
So yea, this is one toggle I'd rather try and avoid, if I were developing the game (which gets rated M anyway).
EDIT: I will admit that it would probably be less work than translating Windows into Welsh though.
10 lines of code?
10 lines of code?
People really shouldn't say things when they have no idea what they are talking about. Try:
10 lines of code to add the toggle to the options menu
x lines of code in EVERY SINGLE CONVERSATION IN THE GAME to swap out dialog files for the 'clean' version.
x lines of code and x hours spent adjusting cutscenes to hide 'objectionable images'
x hour spent analyzing what needs to be censored, when
x hours spent going through each line of spoken or written text in the game to ensure no objectionable content is missed
x hours spent remastering dialog files to add bleeps
x hours spent making sure the newly bleeped lines still match the cutscene as far as lip syncing and timing go
x hours spent testing to make sure the right lines play, display at the right times according the the dam.. err I mean darn toggle.
all to find out people complain that they didn't edit out #!@$ because they didn't consider it objectionable enough.
10 lines my lily white @$$
That's what I meant, sorry.
Personally I find it no less jarring or unnatural to have it fade back to them being dressed than fading back to them being not dressed.
It's jarring because real people don't behave that way. Or at least they don't if everything has gone the way its supposed to.
Something went drastically off the rails if two people are standing around fully clothed in awkward silence after having had sex. I suppose it would provide some unintentional comedy however. 
The problem with fades to black is that they can come across as jarring and unnatural. Its just odd to have the scene fade out as the characters kiss or what have you, and then have it fade back in with the two characters standing around fully clothed and not talking.
If they are going to use fades to black to avoid showing any naughty bits, I'd rather it fade back in to the two characters in bed, with implied nudity, and have a section with dialogue. Its more cinematic and would feel a lot more natural.
What?
ME1 was nearly accused from being pornography in TV for showing nudity, it was quite big affair.
Nudity in ME1 is reason why in next installments love interest were always in underwear.
Indeed - the damned media (don't remember which channel it was) jumped on that like a damned pack of starving wolves -.- (while the same media guys and girls probably read "50 Shades of Grey" (or similar works - like all those romance novels for women (many of which are pretty detailed when it comes to sex, too!)) in their off hours...but enjoying something like that in a video game? - We apparently are deviants and sickos -.-) as if there aren't more important things to report about, like wars that are more or less still happening but no one writes about or reporting on government spying (but no: the media doesn't dare to do that anymore (after all governments sick their "hounds" on them...in Britain they went after The Guardian for example!) - here in Germany writers of a blog have been accused of TREASON (!) because they wrote about the German equivalent of the FBI (they had internal documents - no, not secrets that would endanger Germany!)...freedom of the press my ass -.- thanks NSA that's because of you shitheads (because German secret services work with the NSA) and the incompetent politicians in Washington who are unable to control that terrorist organization!)...video games is a far saver topic is seems (unless you ****** the wrong fans off and get a well deserved shitstorm!) -.-
greetings LAX
ps: @OP: It's a game for adults - if you don't like nudity and explicit content, gore, swearing etc. then, please: Go play games for kids (it's not meant to be condescending, but most adults play these games exactly for all the things you want to turn off!)
Far less jarring than watching waking couples kissing passionately with morning breath....
Prefer imagination to simulated sexuality.
Do you also prefer a fade to black when the main the character is about to blow some mook's head to smithereens?
If not, why do you find two characters kissing more offensive than one character killing another?
Do you also prefer a fade to black when the main the character is about to blow some mook's head to smithereens?
If not, why do you find two characters kissing more offensive than one character killing another?
With BioWare's facial animation, I just might...
Far less jarring than watching waking couples kissing passionately with morning breath....
Prefer imagination to simulated sexuality.
How's that jarring? 
10 lines of code?
10 lines of code?
People really shouldn't say things when they have no idea what they are talking about. Try:
10 lines of code to add the toggle to the options menu
x lines of code in EVERY SINGLE CONVERSATION IN THE GAME to swap out dialog files for the 'clean' version.
x lines of code and x hours spent adjusting cutscenes to hide 'objectionable images'
x hour spent analyzing what needs to be censored, when
x hours spent going through each line of spoken or written text in the game to ensure no objectionable content is missed
x hours spent remastering dialog files to add bleeps
x hours spent making sure the newly bleeped lines still match the cutscene as far as lip syncing and timing go
x hours spent testing to make sure the right lines play, display at the right times according the the dam.. err I mean darn toggle.
all to find out people complain that they didn't edit out #!@$ because they didn't consider it objectionable enough.
10 lines my lily white @$$
Please read my post more carefully, thanks.
Seriously man! Watch the language! The OP will have a nervous breakdown because of you.
"Did anyone just hear Cap say 'language?'"- Tony Stark
"I say what the heck y'all doin' over there? Dag nabbit! There's dynamite in those sheds! Y'all gonna get yore gol' darned heads blown off!"
Well if we're going for comedy this works for the "crusty but benign old man."
But even bleeping cuss words uses resources. It requires scripting. The game will get rated M anyway so you kiddies out there ain't supposed to play it anyway. That means you ain't supposed to hear words you been usin' every day at school, and don't tell me you don't use those words, 'cause I know you have. See I went to middle school once upon a time myself and those words were there a long time before I was ever around.
We just don't need a scene like a last 5 minute monologue by Al Swearengen from Deadwood in the episode "The Trial of Jack McCall". http://www.imdb.com/...0018340/quotes Now that's some swearin'.
Although with ME: Andromeda bein' a frontier environment it just might fit.
The way they did Mass Effect 2 on language was fine by me. It was really softened in ME3. The nudity was really softened in ME2 from ME1. We have the conservative right in America to thank for this. I don't mind Cassandra's scene. I don't mind the scenes in TW3. Funny though they're still reluctant to show male frontal nudity.
Do you also prefer a fade to black when the main the character is about to blow some mook's head to smithereens?
If not, why do you find two characters kissing more offensive than one character killing another?
I would prefer the camera angle not show the person getting shot but just the person shooting and the gun in that scenario. Sort of like what they did with killing Fist in Mass Effect 1.
How's that jarring?
that really doesn't work well in every situationI would prefer the camera angle not show the person getting shot but just the person shooting and the gun in that scenario. Sort of like what they did with killing Fist in Mass Effect 1.
Lack of immersion; No brushing, no gargle, no mints....
Bah, you just get in there after being with someone for a while.
The problem with fades to black is that they can come across as jarring and unnatural. Its just odd to have the scene fade out as the characters kiss or what have you, and then have it fade back in with the two characters standing around fully clothed and not talking.
If they are going to use fades to black to avoid showing any naughty bits, I'd rather it fade back in to the two characters in bed, with implied nudity, and have a section with dialogue. Its more cinematic and would feel a lot more natural.
I never found fade to black to be jarring.
But I have no problem with your idea.
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