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An Open Letter to Bioware Regarding Explicit Content


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#676
Cyonan

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I actually don't sweat real age online most of the time.  If you conduct yourself with maturity (being a smartaleck doesn't mean you're immature ;) ) and some respect, then I don't even question it.

 

Guild conversations at 2am....half of the raid drunk on vent, the other half (me) sober and laughing hard.  I could never play WoW drunk.   Man, there were some conversations that would make a lot of people blush.  

 

There's a reason why the words "not rated for online content" are attached to online games.  When in doubt, cover your butt with paperwork.   :P

 

Tanking drunk is fun, especially when it's a faceroll easy raid like Naxx 10 when you're in ICC gear.

 

I had my guild master question my sanity a few times with 2am conversations =P

 

As far as things changing before you realize even at 26 I have days where I randomly think to myself "holy s***. I'm supposed to be a responsible adult". It feels not all that long ago that my biggest concern was coming up with a valid excuse as to why I skipped class in high school.



#677
rashie

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"All you old People", scoffed the arrogant 19-Year-Old.

 

Why am I always the youngest Person around?

Don't see it as something bad, aside from less life experience you are in your prime in the early 20s and 30s. :P



#678
sH0tgUn jUliA

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And then there's granny here. lol. Sigh. Why I remember when.... never mind. What I will say is that we've had a civil conversation. I have some strong feelings about censorship and art. A lot of the time I know I'm trolling like when I used the "e" word, but it's all in fun. I've learned since the ME3 forum blow up not to take forum chatter seriously.

 

And Feybrad, enjoy being the youngest. Soon you'll be the oldest. It goes by so quickly.


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#679
Grieving Natashina

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Don't see it as something bad, aside from less life experience you are in your prime in the early 20s and 30s. :P

I think this is the best birthday song.  You feel accomplished:

 

 

Sorry for the OT, but it has been fun.   :)



#680
rashie

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When my birthday hits, I'm not going to think of it as getting old.  I'm going to have this playing in my mind:


Sorry for the OT, but it has been fun.   :)

FFVI was better imo, but god I feel old remembering that.


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#681
Grieving Natashina

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FFVI was better imo, but god I feel old remembering that.

I've been playing it on my GBA over the last week.  It still holds up, and it's got a bonus dungeon for the port that doesn't suck for a change (glares at FFII and that utter waste of a bonus dungeon.)  I couldn't find that version, otherwise I would have definitely posted that instead.

 

Hopefully you guys can keep this intelligent and civil debate going.  Conversations like this are part of the reason why I still come around the forums.  <hugs>  Nap time for me all.

 

JXbxhAi.gif


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#682
themikefest

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I'm 36 in September.  So I'm old too.  Us old MMO vets should stick together.   :P

 

I am 36..and WE are NOT old, dag-nabbit!!! :P

You're not old. Age is just a number.

 

I'm 51, young'uns. ;)

Excellent. Right there with you

 

I am 30, if there are to be age comparisons, I am please I am in the middle

 

/inner Solas

Been there, done that

 

I feel young now at 26.

Wow. That's a long tine ago for me

 

"All you old People", scoffed the arrogant 19-Year-Old.

To be 19 again. I had so much fun at that age. I still do today :devil:


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#683
DaemionMoadrin

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I actually don't sweat real age online most of the time.  If you conduct yourself with maturity (being a smartaleck doesn't mean you're immature ;) ) and some respect, then I don't even question it.

 

Guild conversations at 2am....half of the raid drunk on vent, the other half (me) sober and laughing hard.  I could never play WoW drunk.   Man, there were some conversations that would make a lot of people blush.  

 

There's a reason why the words "not rated for online content" are attached to online games.  When in doubt, cover your butt with paperwork.   :P

 

In my experience, maturity has nothing to do with age. I still refuse to grow up and I'll be 35 soon. :P

 

I remember one raid in DAoC, we invited a new tank who sounded competent as replacement for ours who drank too much and fell asleep, snoring into his microphone. The new guy was professional, asked about our roles, then asked for the Teamspeak password. He joined the chat... and turned out to be 14. With a squeaky voice. The entire raid consisted of drunk and/or immature adults of all ages and the kid was trying his best to get us to behave... which resulted in even more laughter. He was so serious and by-the-book... and we were just joking and making small talk... it was hilarious. Raid went well, too. He let us off with a stern lecture about proper behaviour before he had to go to bed. ^^

 

And Feybrad, enjoy being the youngest. Soon you'll be the oldest. It goes by so quickly.

 

Yeah, no kidding. A long time ago, I was the youngest... and now ... I am not. Don't know what happened or where the last ~20 years went.


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#684
FKA_Servo

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31. Older and wiser than some, less so than others.

Maybe just older than some.
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#685
Steelcan

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A month past 20

#686
HuldraDancer

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Dang I feel pretty bad for feeling old then at 24. I blame this on one of my favorite book protagonist as a teen always describing herself as '28 and over the hill'.

 

 

Don't have much to say on topic other than the amount of resources and/or time needed to make a toggle for all that imo wouldn't be worth the cost. Though my knowledge on what it actually takes to make those things is highly limited but I've always heard that toggles are somewhat of a nightmare to make.



#687
dragonflight288

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OP, I thank you for the letter.

 

I don't think they'd be able to filter out strong language as it would either require a great deal of recording the voice actors, possibly recording scenes multiple times, or add in a bleep or something, and if a scene or characters says it too often where the bleep is near continuous, it would take away the mood or tone of the scene and the character.

 

Regarding the gore, I don't think that should be an issue. A simple filter on or off and some of the more graphic death and dismemberment would not activate. 

 

As for sex scenes. I can see with the filter turned on, it would show the characters start kissing or whatever they start doing, and rather than initiate the scene where they are together it simply skips it entirely and we miss nothing relevant to the plot or characters as we know they got together.

 

I have no objections to a filter being added for those who want them, and can remain off for those who want the M rated action. No one's content is truly reduced and the game is more open to others who otherwise would not buy the game. I know people who'll take one look at the Rating and warnings box of a game, and even if it's a game they'd love in all aspects except certain content, they'll avoid buying the game because of content. 

 

I also see no reason to mock those who advocate the desire, not necessarily the need, for such a filter, which I saw plenty of in this thread.

 

I for one agree that such a filter can be placed without any extra resources and it would in no way affect the quality of the game itself, and thus should not affect anyone's enjoyment. 



#688
Steelcan

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I for one agree that such a filter can be placed without any extra resources and it would in no way affect the quality of the game itself, and thus should not affect anyone's enjoyment. 

this isn't a matter of agreement, its not gonna be free to do it



#689
Lady Artifice

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I think a few people have already summed up my thoughts on this pretty well. I'm coming from almost the opposite direction the OP is. If they announced that Tarantino for some reason wanted to work as a writer on this game, I'd be thrilled.

 

I agree with those that pointed out that this would be a kind of censorship, even if the OP doesn't see it that way. I'm actually surprised to see OP say that this request is coming from the perspective of a writer, expecting other writers to willingly design an alternate version of their work for the sake of audience preferences. I would not warm to such a request myself, and I wouldn't expect any writer to do so. I also happen to believe that the cutting out of explicit content actually can irreparably damage flow and character development. 

 

An example: Sometimes they play the film Thinner (based on a Stephen King novel) on television. There's a scene where one of the characters seductively teases another, then coldly flips him off. They always seem to cut out the later action on television, rendering a scene that otherwise efficiently established the character's personality, completely useless.

 

I see a optional gore effect differently from optional dialogue, because there is a significant distinction between altering visual design and removing actual dialogue and story content.

 

Edit: I'm 26, since we're sharing. 


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#690
Asari Goddess

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is this really happening, this thread shaking my head -.- oh god i hope bioware sends you a letter saying how much they don't care 



#691
Asari Goddess

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rawwr_by_badpie1-d2ysd68.jpg

maxresdefault.jpg

[Takei] OH MY. [/Takei]

 

 

Mass-Effect-%D1%84%D1%8D%D0%BD%D0%B4%D0%       MIRANDA APPROVES THESE PICTURES 



#692
N7M

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Most of my thoughts on this have been summed up well by others too. I'm with the OPs idea of content toggles.
 
One thing I would like to add. These filters rather than limiting the creation of graphic content make allowance for more graphic content in the game. 



#693
AlanC9

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I'm 51, young'uns. ;)


I'll catch up to you in two days.
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#694
Brass_Buckles

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I can understand where the OP is coming from.  Sometimes the gore is overboard, and sometimes the language can seem a bit too much.

 

However, yes, adding a toggle WOULD cost more resources and more time to do, due to the coding, and the time taken to find those lines and bleep them out or replace them with something less offensive.  And then there's the whole "editing out the sex scenes" bit, even though those rarely show much in the first place.

 

What I would fully support is a "disable gore" option.  I don't care about the nudity since there's probably just going to be one scene per playthrough that includes it.  I mean, there's other risque stuff too, in Mass Effect.  If we're going to make optional censors for nudity and language, how then will we handle things like Chora's den?  The asari dancers?  Do we find a way to censor the drug use, smoking, prostitution as well?

 

Some scenes, and some dialogue, are part of who a character is or part of what a setting is.  If you're going to an exotic dance club, you're going to see nearly-naked dancers (why can't some of them be men?).  If you're on Omega, people are probably smoking, doing drugs, and having sex.

 

I don't want to disrespect the OP, because I get it.  Some of this stuff takes me out of my comfort zone.  I'm frankly less okay with the gore than I am with the sex and curse words.  Hearing language in this game won't do much to me, because I hear it in real life too (every time I boot up multiplayer, basically).

 

I don't think it's somehow "weak" to think that foul language, nudity, gore, etc. are going to morally corrupt you.  It's a valid concern and let no one tell you otherwise.  However, the effort to make toggles to hide all of this would likely take resources away from some other part of the game.

 

And let's be honest, Mass Effect has, thus far, even at its worst, been remarkably mild for an M-rated game on language and nudity and yes, even drugs.  Omega in the books seemed much worse than in the games, in terms of drugs and sex and violence. It has its moments, but then, for characters like Zaeed or Jack, their language depicts who they are.  I might not like it, but I wouldn't censor it--I've heard people who use far worse language.

 

I don't want to sound rude, but again, aside from a gore toggle, I can't support the "toggle all of the offensive things" idea, when it sounds like what you want is a really good, plot-heavy Teen rated game.  With a Teen rated game, you wouldn't need these toggles.  And yes, I know, it's not the same--it wouldn't be Mass Effect with the characters and setting you've come to know and love.

 

A gore toggle would be a great idea.  I usually had the gore turned off in DA:O and DA2.  I wanted the option in ME3, but it wasn't available.  It isn't that I can't handle the gore, but it's kind of gross and, well, in Dragon Age it looked more than a little weird when you were flirting with an LI while covered in the blood of your enemies.  So there's that.

 

OP, you may end up having to make a difficult decision to either give up Mass Effect (assuming ME:A is not much milder than previous titles), or to simply accept it as it is.

 

BioWare does listen, so it's possible they might at least consider adding language/nudity censor toggles, but I repeat that adding such toggles takes more resources than you seem to be aware.

 

Again, you have to go through and review all of the voice acting clips, and all of the video clips, and edit them *just so*, and then things sound awkward--or, you might just have to re-record every line with different words in place of the foul language.  The nudity would require editing every romantic scene clip that contained it.  That's not even mentioning how having dual versions of certain videos and sound files would bloat the size of the game itself.

 

If you want my honest opinion, I'd rather they did not expend resources adding censor toggles to their game(s), other than, again, the gore toggle (and in my case that was mostly an aesthetic thing).  The more resources they put into things like that, the less they can put into other areas of code, voice acting, voice editing, and video editing.


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#695
Asari Goddess

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I think a few people have already summed up my thoughts on this pretty well. I'm coming from almost the opposite direction the OP is. If they announced that Tarantino for some reason wanted to work as a writer on this game, I'd be thrilled.

 

I agree with those that pointed out that this would be a kind of censorship, even if the OP doesn't see it that way. I'm actually surprised to see OP say that this request is coming from the perspective of a writer, expecting other writers to willingly design an alternate version of their work for the sake of audience preferences. I would not warm to such a request myself, and I wouldn't expect any writer to do so. I also happen to believe that the cutting out of explicit content actually can irreparably damage flow and character development. 

 

An example: Sometimes they play the film Thinner (based on a Stephen King novel) on television. There's a scene where one of the characters seductively teases another, then coldly flips him off. They always seem to cut out the later action on television, rendering a scene that otherwise efficiently established the character's personality, completely useless.

 

I see a optional gore effect differently from optional dialogue, because there is a significant distinction between altering visual design and removing actual dialogue and story content.

 

I agree, the OP wants censorship but that will just show less of the characters personality than show more of it. for example jack's language is very deranged but that's how her character is made to be. it will be annoying having to hear a beep after every thing that comes out of jacks mouth. lol

 

Characterization

"Characters may be presented by means of description, through their actions, speech, thoughts and interactions with other characters"



#696
von uber

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I'm 36 in September. So I'm old too.


Bloody hell, you are old! I feel positively young compared to that - I'm only 36 in January.
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#697
AlanC9

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As for sex scenes. I can see with the filter turned on, it would show the characters start kissing or whatever they start doing, and rather than initiate the scene where they are together it simply skips it entirely and we miss nothing relevant to the plot or characters as we know they got together.


Note that this imposes contraints on the writers -- they have to make sure that nothing comes up in a scene with nudity or whatever that will be plot-critical later. (Unless they want to do alternate versions of the scene, in which case it's more work for the animators.) You can often see this in movies -- someone will cover up right before an exposition dump so they can do a broadcast TV edit.

#698
Nomen Mendax

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...

 

What I would fully support is a "disable gore" option.  I don't care about the nudity since there's probably just going to be one scene per playthrough that includes it.  I mean, there's other risque stuff too, in Mass Effect.  If we're going to make optional censors for nudity and language, how then will we handle things like Chora's den?  The asari dancers?  Do we find a way to censor the drug use, smoking, prostitution as well?

 

...

While browsing ME mods (I'm currently replaying ME with the excellent improved textures mod) I noticed there is a mod to replace the textures for the Chora's den dancers and a few other incidences of exposed female flesh. Only 30 downloads though, compared to 67,969 for the improved textures.



#699
NWN-Ming-Ming

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I for one agree that such a filter can be placed without any extra resources and it would in no way affect the quality of the game itself, and thus should not affect anyone's enjoyment. 

You're living in a fantasy world if you truly think (especially after one of the Bioware staff talked about expense breakdowns) that such filters and toggles could be implemented without any extra resources and without affecting the quality of the game, because creative content is *always* limited by the available resources of time, medium, and money.   You must take away from one aspect to pay for another, extra resources do not magically appear simply because one wishes it were so.


 



#700
Drone223

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*snip*

You're living in a fantasy world if you truly think (especially after one of the Bioware staff talked about expense breakdowns) that such filters and toggles could be implemented without any extra resources and without affecting the quality of the game, because creative content is *always* limited by the available resources of time, medium, and money.   You must take away from one aspect to pay for another, extra resources do not magically appear simply because one wishes it were so.

 

Not exactly, that only happens when a new feature is added late in development. Dev's usually tell the publishers what features their games are going to have before they start development so the publishers can give them the necessary resources they have in order to implement all those features.