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An Open Letter to Bioware Regarding Explicit Content


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#926
Han Shot First

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Think that's crazy? Right now on Youtube, there are at least two videos of a man - Pit Dernitz - being eaten alive by lions in front of his family(he got out of his car on a safari to film the lions while they were eating, having no concept of 'zoom'). Admittedly, there's some debate over the authenticity of the footage, but it's generally agreed to be legitimate. And again, to be fair, the footage is counted as mature content. 

 

But still, Youtube is ok with allowing footage of a man being mauled to death by wild animals, but will take down any video showing nudity in short order. 

 

Even if that lion attack video is faked, there are plenty of graphic videos on youtube from Afghanistan, Iraq, and Syria of people being killed in close combat. This one of an insurgent being killed by US troops has been on youtube for 2 years. 

 

It somewhat odd that any video with nudity would get taken down immediately, but graphic vids of people dying aren't. 


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#927
caradoc2000

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It somewhat odd that any video with nudity would get taken down immediately, but graphic vids of people dying aren't.

As the slogan says: "Make war, not love"


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#928
Elhanan

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Perhaps yt needs a Toggle....

#929
Former_Fiend

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Perhaps yt needs a Toggle....

 

Well, like I said, it does have mature content filters, but of course those are laughably easy to get around; all they do is teach kids how to subtract 18 from the current year.

 

And of course you do have to actively go looking for this kind of thing, it generally isn't something that'll randomly pop up in your feed. 

 

My initial point was that we live in a culture that has made a conscious decision to deem images of graphic death and violence more acceptable to view than images of a woman's uncovered nipple. 

 

All arguments about personal preference and customizing experiences aside, can you honestly tell me that there isn't something deeply wrong about that?


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#930
Elhanan

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Well, like I said, it does have mature content filters, but of course those are laughably easy to get around; all they do is teach kids how to subtract 18 from the current year.
 
And of course you do have to actively go looking for this kind of thing, it generally isn't something that'll randomly pop up in your feed. 
 
My initial point was that we live in a culture that has made a conscious decision to deem images of graphic death and violence more acceptable to view than images of a woman's uncovered nipple. 
 
All arguments about personal preference and customizing experiences aside, can you honestly tell me that there isn't something deeply wrong about that?


I believe there is something wrong with yt; it is usually found in the Comment sections.

#931
Han Shot First

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So you might be offended by what motivates those asking for an option, in this case a Toggle? Considering religion is not discussed here on the forums, your bias may have to wait, or seemingly, envelop all who want such an option regardless. But that would be much like a Witch Hunt reaction; would not want that....

 

I don't have an issue with people asking for a toggle, since they aren't asking for outright across the board censorship. I do have an issue if people ask for across the board censorship based on their religious beliefs. That would bother me if that is where most previous threads on this topic (which unlike the OP, asked for removal of explicit content rather than a toggle) were coming from.

 

I have no issues with religion by the way, it is only fundamentalism I have a problem with. Asking for video game devs to censor their work so that it conform's to a player's religious dogma, even if devs or other players don't necessarily share those beliefs, would be an example of the latter. I could be wrong however in speculating whether that was the motivation behind those threads, so I'll make this my last post on religion in this thread so as not to derail it any further. 


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#932
Elhanan

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Only speaking for myself, but I prefer to purchase games with a less than M rating, as the content had generally been contained by the Devs themselves. If it is rated M, then I seek to look for options before purchase (eg; nudity contained to optional content, optional gore settings, offensive language manageable by benching characters or optional content).

And Yes; I lobby to have more games that fit these parameters, and pass on those that do not. Seems like most consumers do that. Hopefully will have more future titles that can be purchased than skipped, esp if all that is needed is a possible Toggle.
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#933
Chealec

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I believe there is something wrong with yt; it is usually found in the Comment sections.

 

No sane human should ever venture into the YT comment sections ... ever ... that way madness lies!


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#934
Former_Fiend

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I don't have a problem with someone lobbying for Bioware to make more T-rated games. I just have a problem with people lobbying for Mass Effect or Dragon Age to be those games.


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#935
jak11164

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You can always look at the box and option is yours. You do not want gore sex and explicit content you do not buy the game. If there is no Pegi 18 + sex + violence on ME:A box I just will not buy it

Mass Effect trilogy was product targeted to adult audience and during that trilogy I didn't see content that night disturb me.

To be true Pegi 18 in my opinion was too high rating it should be 16 as there was nothing in the game that could prove that it should be for adult only. I didn't have had any objections to allow my adolescent son to play it.

If I buy product marked Pegi 18 I want it to be that way. I do not want censored love scenes like ME1-3. I understand that if I head shoot it will blow up. This is the life.

 



#936
Elhanan

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I don't have a problem with someone lobbying for Bioware to make more T-rated games. I just have a problem with people lobbying for Mass Effect or Dragon Age to be those games.


Cannot see why, as long as the requests are constructive and civil. As for others, that is another reason for the Ignore function.

And the design call should be made by the Devs; not some vocal majority. Final call should be the consumer, as whether to purchase or not.

#937
Chealec

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...

I understand that if I head shoot it will blow up. This is the life.

 

.. the hell are you shooting it with?!



#938
Former_Fiend

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Cannot see why, as long as the requests are constructive and civil. As for others, that is another reason for the Ignore function.

And the design call should be made by the Devs; not some vocal majority. Final call should be the consumer, as whether to purchase or not.

 

Because I actively do not want Dragon Age and Mass Effect to be T rated games. I appreciate them as M rated games and think that they should stay the course and I don't want anyone messing that up for me. 

 

I don't go on to the official forums for developers of T-rated games and lobby for those games to be bumped up to an M rating just to satisfy my own preferences. I let the developers make the game they want to make; in this case I'm confident that Bioware's going to be staying the course with the ratings for their games and I'm happy about that.


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#939
Elhanan

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Because I actively do not want Dragon Age and Mass Effect to be T rated games. I appreciate them as M rated games and think that they should stay the course and I don't want anyone messing that up for me. 
 
I don't go on to the official forums for developers of T-rated games and lobby for those games to be bumped up to an M rating just to satisfy my own preferences. I let the developers make the game they want to make; in this case I'm confident that Bioware's going to be staying the course with the ratings for their games and I'm happy about that.


That is your option and opinion. Mine is different. Neither is superior or inferior to the other, as a rule.

As long as we remain civil and respect the rights (as set by ToS) of all to have differing opinions, then it should be fine. If you were to ask for T rated games to become M, that is your right to do so. And it is my right to ask for the Devs to consider 'messing them up' for me.
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#940
jak11164

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.. the hell are you shooting it with?!

I use anti-material rounds with M-98 Widow Anti-Material Rifle.

Any modern sniper rifle  is to kill not  to wound weapon



#941
SnakeCode

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I don't have an issue with people asking for a toggle, since they aren't asking for outright across the board censorship. I do have an issue if people ask for across the board censorship based on their religious beliefs. That would bother me if that is where most previous threads on this topic (which unlike the OP, asked for removal of explicit content rather than a toggle) were coming from.

 

I have no issues with religion by the way, it is only fundamentalism I have a problem with. Asking for video game devs to censor their work so that it conform's to a player's religious dogma, even if devs or other players don't necessarily share those beliefs, would be an example of the latter. I could be wrong however in speculating whether that was the motivation behind those threads, so I'll make this my last post on religion in this thread so as not to derail it any further. 

 

Wholeheartedly agree. But I think this should be expanded to censorship based on any ideological beliefs. Religious or not. 



#942
Elhanan

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Wholeheartedly agree. But I think this should be expanded to censorship based on any ideological beliefs. Religious or not.


Thought police; George Orwell must be soooo pleased.....

#943
DaemionMoadrin

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Only speaking for myself, but I prefer to purchase games with a less than M rating, as the content had generally been contained by the Devs themselves. If it is rated M, then I seek to look for options before purchase (eg; nudity contained to optional content, optional gore settings, offensive language manageable by benching characters or optional content).

And Yes; I lobby to have more games that fit these parameters, and pass on those that do not. Seems like most consumers do that. Hopefully will have more future titles that can be purchased than skipped, esp if all that is needed is a possible Toggle.

 

Lobbying is an annoying practice. It favours those who have more resources than others, in your case it seems the resource is time.

 

How would you know what most consumers want? If you have that knowledge, than it is worth your weight in gold. Or are you extrapolating from your own anecdotal experience again like you always do? There is no factual evidence supporting your claim, especially since it runs counter normal human behaviour. Who would want to get less when they could have more?

 

Your possible Toggle is a bad idea, as has been pointed out over and over again and honestly, it's an unrealistic idea. If it was as possible as you think it is, then there would be games with such a feature in existence already. Name one and I'll retract my argument.

 

 

Cannot see why, as long as the requests are constructive and civil. As for others, that is another reason for the Ignore function.

And the design call should be made by the Devs; not some vocal majority. Final call should be the consumer, as whether to purchase or not.

 

Elhanan, civility is just something you hide behind. As many in this forum, you do not observe the art of discussion, of conversation etiquette... all you care about is an absence of profanity. That's the main reason why discussions with you will never be constructive. It's just an endless repetition of the same tired request over and over again, shored up by increasingly transparent arguments.

 

That is your option and opinion. Mine is different. Neither is superior or inferior to the other, as a rule.

As long as we remain civil and respect the rights (as set by ToS) of all to have differing opinions, then it should be fine. If you were to ask for T rated games to become M, that is your right to do so. And it is my right to ask for the Devs to consider 'messing them up' for me.

 

As a rule, opinions are equal, that is correct. Arguments on the other hand, are not.

 

I freely admit that your actions in this forum irritate me, because you simply never stop. You already asked the devs to consider your opinion, your idea. What's your reason for repeating this request endlessly? Because if your intent is to abuse the illusion of truth, then you haven't understood how a forum works. While it is correct that things we hear and see more often become familiar and are eventually accepted as truth by our mind, that only works if they are not immediately refuted by something else. Guess why I am responding to your posts so often? ;)

 

What you are doing here is lobbying, you aren't even trying to argue your point, you're just droning on and on...

 

Thought police; George Orwell must be soooo pleased.....

 

Have you read 1984? Seen the movie?

 

I wonder, was there a censored version more palatable to your tastes?


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#944
SnakeCode

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Thought police; George Orwell must be soooo pleased.....

 

Ironic.


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#945
Farangbaa

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That is your option and opinion. Mine is different. Neither is superior or inferior to the other, as a rule.

As long as we remain civil and respect the rights (as set by ToS) of all to have differing opinions, then it should be fine. If you were to ask for T rated games to become M, that is your right to do so. And it is my right to ask for the Devs to consider 'messing them up' for me.


Judging by your icons, you have a lot of messed up games.

You like messed up stuff, don't you? ;)

#946
SnakeCode

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Judging by your icons, you have a lot of messed up games.

You like messed up stuff, don't you? ;)

 

Klling, torture and rape are fine, so long as the characters don't swear or expose themselves whilst it's happening.


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#947
FKA_Servo

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Klling, torture and rape are fine, so long as the characters don't swear or expose themselves whilst it's happening.

 

Need to keep the language PG as well. Baffling.


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#948
Elhanan

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Judging by your icons, you have a lot of messed up games.

You like messed up stuff, don't you? ;)


The icons are not messed up by the contextual definition, as M was the norm. Messed up is T, and that might be for NWN1 in my library. But I do support the idea of making more T eligible content, and if not, options and Toggles.

#949
Elhanan

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Need to keep the language PG as well. Baffling.


Not really, seems many here like it all. As for myself, dislike the profanity, and can generally skip most of the nudity and sexual content. But a Toggle is a good idea.

#950
DaemionMoadrin

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The icons are not messed up by the contextual definition, as M was the norm. Messed up is T, and that might be for NWN1 in my library. But I do support the idea of making more T eligible content, and if not, options and Toggles.

 

You weren't asked about the icons, you were asked about the games.

 

Why can't you support good ideas for a change?

 

Not really, seems many here like it all. As for myself, dislike the profanity, and can generally skip most of the nudity and sexual content. But a Toggle is a good idea.

 

Indeed? How do you know that?

 

Nope, content toggles are never a good idea.


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