3411 réponses à ce sujet

[Hanako Ikezawa]

So because they've never done it before that's a reason they shouldn't be trusted to do it now?

 

You know that Mike Pondsmith is working with CDPR on this?

Well, it's not so much I don't trust them and more I have fears, doubts, and worries since the company hasn't made those kinds of RPGs. More so since I love cyberpunk and games in the genre are few and far between, especially RPGs, so I'm nervous. I want it to be good, but CDPR's aptitude for this kind of game is a huge question mark. 

Him working with them alleviates those somewhat and makes me more hopeful. 

 

Unfortunately I can't read Polish - but as I understand it, from a Polish work colleague who's a fan of the Andrzej Sapkowski series, it's dark and morally ambiguous because the books are dark and morally ambiguous.

 

... anyway, this is getting somewhat off-topic now and I've had enough posts deleted in this thread for that so I'm gonna drop it

Fair enough. As I've said before, the fact that they have the man who is one of the founding fathers of the genre working with them makes me hopeful that they could do it, but I just don't have solid evidence to help support that hope yet. 

 

Okay. If you want to talk more in PMs, I'll do that. 

 

That's poor logic tbh

Why is it poor logic to be nervous about someone doing something well when they've never done it before?

[wolfhowwl]

Since Elhanan hasn't presented any information I decided to do some research of my own.
 
When I went to the Nexus mod site for Dragon Age: Origins I saw that there was not a lewdness or profanity toggle among the most downloaded mods. Quite the opposite actually.
 
The most popular file was Better Sex Cutscenes with the most popular option from that mod being the "zesty" setting that offered content like "witch gone wild" and "Zevran gets saucy."
 

 
The third most popular file was Natural Bodies that offered character models like "seductress" and "mystic female elf."
 
It seems like it would be far more lucrative to spend resources on nude models and smokin' hot sex scenes than any sort of toggle.
 
On a completely unrelated note, I downloaded Dragon Age: Origins and am doing another run.

[Elhanan]

Yes; amazing research there. The PhD is in the mail.... *Post-hole Digger*

Already knew that soft porn was popular as mods; use a filter to avoid them on the Nexus. Hope to get the same for future Bioware titles.

[Felis Menari]

I have; skipped TW3 and purchased DAI for better compartmental control.

I feel sorry for you, being unable to enjoy games (or any form of entertainment, as I'm sure your aversion to mature themes extends beyond just gaming) simply because of content that is only offensive to those who have overly delicate sensibilities.

[Elhanan]

I feel sorry for you, being unable to enjoy games (or any form of entertainment, as I'm sure your aversion to mature themes extends beyond just gaming) simply because of content that is only offensive to those who have overly delicate sensibilities.

And I feel sorry for those that make assumptions; an unwise policy.

[Monica21]

Yes; amazing research there. The PhD is in the mail.... *Post-hole Digger*

Already knew that soft porn was popular as mods; use a filter to avoid them on the Nexus. Hope to get the same for future Bioware titles.

First, not a good attempt at a burn. Second, what kind of research do you actually have, beyond your own preference?

[Felis Menari]

And I feel sorry for those that make assumptions; an unwise policy.

It's a solid assumption, given your posts throughout this thread. If you cannot enjoy a game simply because of mature content, then it stands to reason that mature content in a movie, or maybe even a book if you're that delicate, would be so off putting to you that you'd avoid them.

[Paulomedi]

The same could be said of ME1 though ... it wasn't perfect but BioWare did make a pretty good stab at it; it's still a great game despite feeling a bit clunky now.

 

 

... ok, now I'm dropping it

 

Don't drop it. It's the only interesting discussion going on.

[goishen]

And I feel sorry for those that make assumptions; an unwise policy.

 

 

Look.   The people have spoken.  Over 90 pages worth.  You're simply not going to enjoy some parts of the game.  Either live with it or don't buy the game.  I dunno your reasoning for wanting a filter.  I don't even know that I wanna know your reasoning behind it. 

[Felis Menari]

Look. The people have spoken. Over 90 pages worth. You're simply not going to enjoy some parts of the game. Either live with it or don't buy the game. I dunno your reasoning for wanting a filter. I don't even know that I wanna know your reasoning behind it.

Didn't think of that before (late to the party, lol). If a developer's vision for their game involves potentially objectionable material, who are we to tell them "No, good sir! That is offensive to my sensibilities, and you should cater to my personal tastes!". It's kind of like getting offended by a comedian. It's not like they should modify their act just so your jimmies don't get rustled.

[Elhanan]

It's a solid assumption, given your posts throughout this thread. If you cannot enjoy a game simply because of mature content, then it stands to reason that mature content in a movie, or maybe even a book if you're that delicate, would be so off putting to you that you'd avoid them.

I do avoid them, but not because I am delicate. Assumption again; failure again.

[Elhanan]

Look.   The people have spoken.  Over 90 pages worth.  You're simply not going to enjoy some parts of the game.  Either live with it or don't buy the game.  I dunno your reasoning for wanting a filter.  I don't even know that I wanna know your reasoning behind it.

Then pls use the Ignore feature; avoid the frustration.

[Felis Menari]

I do avoid them, but not because I am delicate. Assumption again; failure again.

Being offended by coarse language on its own implies that you have delicate sensibilities. You said you wouldn't play through ME2 a second time simply because of Jack's dialogue, did you not?

[Elhanan]

Being offended by coarse language on its own implies that you have delicate sensibilities. You said you wouldn't play through ME2 a second time simply because of Jack's dialogue, did you not?

It was a partial reason. Also loathed thermal clips and some of the mechanics.

[Lady Artifice]

Basically, I'm asking for:

 

Language: Maintain it at the level they had it in ME1 or even ME3.

Nudity: Have it so either the person can skip the cutscene without missing anything, and/or have romances where either sex is optional or it is left ambiguous.

Gore: Yes, have the gore toggle from DA implemented into ME. Or even go more like how shooters are if not too straining on resources. 

Violence: Have an option for the player to fight in combat without having to kill enemy combatants, most likely through non-lethal ammo and biotic/tech powers. 

 

Why would a significant portion of the fanbase resent the option of non-lethal combat?

 

So, I see just about everyone active in the thread responded before I did.

 

The difficulty I would most expect from the sudden inclusion of non lethal weapons would mostly originate with the newness of it in the franchise, and the repercussion on the protagonist's reputation that you mentioned. The implication, or at least the common inference, would be that non lethal weapons are "paragon" and lethal are "renegade." With the thorian grenades, the people you have the option to spare were attacking against their will. Most of the people who attack the protagonist in a Mass Effect game aren't (Husks, Banshees, and indoctrinated Cerberus soldiers are also puppets, but they're zombie puppets and not eligible for potential rescue).

 

So, to even present the option to spare independently acting hostiles to the player would present a moral question that is foreign to the ME experience, to which the answer might perpetuate a rigid dichotomy that a majority of fans seem to want to move away from, as far as I can tell. 

[Felis Menari]

It was a partial reason. Also loathed thermal clips and some of the mechanics.

Ok, I'm with you on the thermal clips, lol. That was a radical change to a core gameplay aspect, one that was unnecessary in my opinion. I thought for a long time that ammo limits allowed the Mass Effect team to come up with more interesting and varied weapons.

But ultimately, they could have accomplished that while maintaining the cooldown mechanic of the first Mass Effect game. Or even go with a combination of the two, but a strictly expend/reload ammo system was clearly a step back. That became even more obvious with the addition of the Collector SMG and Lancer assault rifle to ME3.

[Elhanan]

Ok, I'm with you on the thermal clips, lol. That was a radical change to a core gameplay aspect, one that was unnecessary in my opinion. I thought for a long time that ammo limits allowed the Mass Effect team to come up with more interesting and varied weapons. But ultimately, they could have accomplished that while maintaining the cooldown mechanic of the first Mass Effect game. Or even go with a combination of the two, but a strictly expend/reload ammo system was clearly a step back. That became even more obvious with the addition of the Collector SMG and Lancer assault rifle to ME3.

I simply hated having to police clips after every battle; ruined the immersion of being under constant peril.

[slimgrin]

Movies and books? They can do what they want. Only in games do we have to go through this stupid rigamarole. 

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Movies and books? They can do what they want. Only in games do we have to go through this stupid rigamarole. 

It's probably because books and movies are passive entertainment, yet in video games we are an active participant. 

 

Plus movies at least do have censored versions, so not much need of a call for it when people know the censored versions will be available. 

[Hanako Ikezawa]

So, I see just about everyone active in the thread responded before I did.

 

The difficulty I would most expect from the sudden inclusion of non lethal weapons would mostly originate with the newness of it in the franchise, and the repercussion on the protagonist's reputation that you mentioned. The implication, or at least the common inference, would be that non lethal weapons are "paragon" and lethal are "renegade." With the thorian grenades, the people you have the option to spare were attacking against their will. Most of the people who attack the protagonist in a Mass Effect game aren't (Husks, Banshees, and indoctrinated Cerberus soldiers are also puppets, but they're zombie puppets and not eligible for potential rescue).

 

So, to even present the option to spare independently acting hostiles to the player would present a moral question that is foreign to the ME experience, to which the answer might perpetuate a rigid dichotomy that a majority of fans seem to want to move away from, as far as I can tell. 

True, but it's something I think would be fascinating to see and I think Bioware could pull the effects off very well, especially if they want to have a more grey story than a black and white story. There could be positive and negative results depending on which style you choose. Like if there is an alien faction who is more open to peace talks if you don't kill their people. Or maybe you lose support of a group who wanted you to kill another group. It could open up a lot more roleplaying possibilities that the kill or be killed mentality that has permeated into the combat of Bioware games.

[goishen]

True, but it's something I think would be fascinating to see and I think Bioware could pull the effects off very well, especially if they want to have a more grey story than a black and white story. There could be positive and negative results depending on which style you choose. Like if there is an alien faction who is more open to peace talks if you don't kill their people. Or maybe you lose support of a group who wanted you to kill another group. It could open up a lot more roleplaying possibilities that the kill or be killed mentality that has permeated into the combat of Bioware games.

 

 

See, I think about it just the opposite.  Suppose you have a LI that is that faction who it doesn't matter to either way you choose.  Having sex with that LI proves that you love him/her, and will make the decision that much harder.   Harder =/= Absolute.  Harder == Grey area.

[Monica21]

True, but it's something I think would be fascinating to see and I think Bioware could pull the effects off very well, especially if they want to have a more grey story than a black and white story. There could be positive and negative results depending on which style you choose. Like if there is an alien faction who is more open to peace talks if you don't kill their people. Or maybe you lose support of a group who wanted you to kill another group. It could open up a lot more roleplaying possibilities that the kill or be killed mentality that has permeated into the combat of Bioware games.

You know, "kill or be killed" is generally the mentality when people are waving guns at each other. Mass Effect is a war and you are a soldier, not a hippy.

That said, diplomatic options in role play have nothing to do with combat and they do exist in the ME universe. There are several occasions where you can choose the renegade option to shoot someone or not click the button. That's a valid RP mechanism built into the game that you're actively ignoring in your argument. You can stop Miranda from shooting Niket and Garrus from shooting Sedonis. Having non-lethal weapons has nothing to do with those choices.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

See, I think about it just the opposite.  Suppose you have a LI that is that faction who it doesn't matter to either way you choose.  Having sex with that LI proves that you love him/her, and will make the decision that much harder.   Harder =/= Absolute.  Harder == Grey area.

What are you referring to with "Harder =/= Absolute"? 

[Monica21]

Nonlethal methods in what is primarily a 'shooter' seems a little contradictory if you ask me.

Indeed. Which, again, goes back to the argument that if you don't like what you're playing, then don't play it. And for God's sake do not buy it and then whine about being forced to shoot people in a game that you know requires you to shoot people.