245 réponses à ce sujet

[Akiza]

 

And yes she deceive you with a bunch of things, why would I be so mad with her because of that, when I don't lose anything important over it? Maybe you just expect people to have ONE view on things, but they don't... What Morrigan does in the game, all those lies and other questionable things, something similar have done to me a lot of people in my life and from my perspective, I gained a lot from that, it kept me on my toes at least so to speak, so I could be more successful later. I don't care much about my dignity or honor or whatever... what do I get from that, a warm feeling? I didn't grow up in environment filled with comfort or honesty, I had to pretty much learn how to "see into people", how to hide some intentions from them, how to be calculating and how to put up with uncomfortable things, that's just the way of my life. What I try to do at least, is take a look on the world from different perspective and don't throw away ideas, just because I don't initially like them. I value a lot of stuff that Morrigan in the game values, like knowledge, power and ability to reach your goals even through some sacrifices, very highly... other people might value different things, that's all fine and well and that's the way it ought to be... life would be pretty boring, should all people have the same ideas and opinions, if you ask me. 

 

So no, I don't support Morrigan, because I would be some fanboy of her (I don't like being a fanboy of anything in fact)... I just had certain experience in my life that allows me to put up with Morrigan's approach rather easily. I don't mind that you don't like her, that's perfectly fine and you should be perfectly fine with me (or others) to like her and go along with her. I hope I kinda enlightened the reason I sort of support her...

A warm feeling? Or more likely a better world!

I see this post more as an elegy to the lies and dishonesty and the so called grey morality relativism of the 21st century who wish to paint the truth equal as the lie

(who is this Illuminati world view?),and wish to deny the inherent benefit of a society built into the order and progress ,quality that only the truth possess,

(i live in Denmark for all that matters and i'm perfectly happy here and i also spent a lot of time in Germany and Swiss) so i do not have to face Morrigan's problem or whatever other country problem due to a society built on dishonesty of their leaders or disorganization or primitive mindset and traditions.

Sure there are plenty of lies that surround the world, big ones either,this does not disqualify the fact that truth is what humans should aspire in every camp.

Morrigan is the product of a distorted and primitive world (brutal wilds,with barbarians people)and she always lie to protect herself from what she saw as a danger,(each case that i mentioned are case in which Morrigan wish to defend herself)

Ironically i believe that she is perfect for the Orlesian society,a country build on lies and stupid games in which nobles kill themselves for power.

Come to see the northern Europe it doesn't work in this way here and i don' t wish to trade this model with anything,that's how imho the whole world should work,rather than being fiiled with sharks ready to devour each other for stupid thing like power or money,things that are way bheind the serenity of an happy life.

So i did admit that i grow up in an environment filled with honesty but not for the comfort of a warm feeling  like you claimed,and of course that i will fight for it, to maintain this enviroment as beautiful or even more beautiful than what i have found not just for me but for all the others as well who in return will do the same for me.

Of course that i do not wish to become one of these sharks like Morrigan or the Orlesian nobles and be the product of a dark world of whom i will end up to fill even with more lies in a never ending cycle.

Life would be pretty beautiful(rather than boring like you claimed) if only humans would stop in being dishonest with each other just for power and their personal gain,which is what Morrigan of DAO represent,the embodiment of lonelyness,sadness,selfishness and false irony used as a form of shield to protect herself from the cold truth,that she suffer,she is a sad character under the surface,why i should take some ispiration from her?

i will look to Cassandra(my favourite),to Wynne,to Aveline to Tegan to Zevran (whom is a very heart  of gold  inside despite having worse life than Morrigan ) rather too all this sadness.

Did you even see on how far from the camp and the others she is for an entire year?

That is really telling of everything on how your philosophy which is also Morrigan's Philosophy is a failure for an human which is a social animal who need happiness not loneliness,isolation and sadness.

Morrigan is someone who valued power and survival and in order to obtain them she destroys both her and others life with lies,i'm someone who valued serenity,progress and honesty and in order to obtain this i don't use lies because my environment was developed by peoples who valued those things and it is because of them if i'm not in Morrigan or other people situation.

When i see injustice over the world i do not react like Morrigan or Loghain which is basically turn the head because this is the reality of the world and we need power and to lie in order to survive,that is how animal should live not intelligent beings.

If you believe that is too idealistic then keep in being remissive like Morrigan just because someone else (in Morrigan case being her mother) that things are the way they are and cannot be changed in better as a form of general rule,of course that is not me is only the sad Morrigan.

[Illegitimus]

 

What? Are you serious i see only bias of Morrigan fan there,also what's the point? A lie is a lie because the person who receive those lies are still   unaware of the truth

 

 

I'm serious that my character can't justifiably be angry about a lie my character doesn't know exists.  That would be like getting mad because Leliana never tells you that she was working for the Seekers the whole time she was with you, or getting mad because she told you that she was captured in Orlais when really she was captured while on an espionage mission into Denerim.  My character can't get mad about those things because my character will never know those things.  And your whole list consists of the same lie, over and over, except for the "bird" joke.  

[Secret Rare]

I'm serious that my character can't justifiably be angry about a lie my character doesn't know exists. 

It doesn't makes sense in WH the warden is completly aware of Morrgan's lies(there is the 2nd confrontation,she even confess) also there is the possibility to discover this lie during Flemeth quest a clever Warden is needed,simply agree with Flemeth not kill her,return to Morrigan and then tell her that you discovered her double game(be honest and not lie to Morrigan),she will leave the party ,also i do agree that Morrigan is not a character of whom philosophy i will take

anything

If you are not even upset of someone who putted in danger your life against her mother without telling to you the truth to one of your question that can even possibly abandoned the group if you refuse to kill your benefactor Flemeth, that is your business not of my warden(whom i already said was already angry due to her attitude at the alienage with her whole stupid darwinist thing).

and kill Flemeth? are we serious,someone who have be proven only to be a benefactor,someone who have never lied to you?If i will not do this Morrigan will abandon me (and no i don't lie to her just to keep her  otherwise i will just be a Morrigan 2.0)

I wll never understand what's the point to kill someone who have never done something bad to the world,quite the opposite,Mythal the protector a wonder,who only protected things into the world,i see killing and attacking Flemeth as one of the most sad thing to do,she is not her daughter who lie and possibly abandon you,she only offered without demand anything,if you want to do the DR is ok,if you dont want to she is not there to call you a moron and give to you a middle finger.

Of course that i would have allowed her to have the soul of the old god and trusted her more than Morrigan,she is into the world for many years and never used her powers for her own benefit,only to protect others wonders

[Tidus]

Here's the way  I play my city male elf warden..

 

The only Shem he has grown to trust and love is Leliana. Even though he had a short relationship with  Morrigan he knows she can not be trusted  but, plays along with her plan knowing he will not kill Flemeth. His reasoning is simple he needs her magic in the coming battles..

 

He  will do the ritual for one reason and one reason only.. He will not sacrifice his life protecting Shems-the very ones that has abused and killed his kind for centuries, sold his family and friends into slavery and murdered his mother. 

 

My female elf is more complicated.

[Vlada47]

 

A warm feeling? Or more likely a better world!

 

...

 

Did you even see on how far from the camp and the others she is for an entire year?

That is really telling of everything on how your philosophy which is also Morrigan's Philosophy is a failure for an human which is a social animal who need happiness not loneliness,isolation and sadness.

 

 

I don't see how my dignity makes the world better, but ok...

 

If someone doesn't detriments my efforts or goes against me (or efforts of people I care about), they can have all the secrets and lies they want. And I don't see how Morrigan goes against that in case of my Warden.

 

The thing is... you believe that there's one way of life that is best of everyone... there isn't, you can have a way that is best for majority maybe, but not for everyone. Neither every human is sociable, I for one find no special joy of being constantly around others. Yes I know, it's not usual, but that's the way I feel and I definitely won't deny anybody the same thing. I have the feeling that you expect that I want my way of life for everybody, when I really don't... or the way, to which everybody should aspire to, as you say. I'm not saying my way is generally good way, it's a good way for me and perhaps for some people, who are like me. And I don't think your preferred way would work for me either. I also don't say you should take inspiration from Morrigan, do I? You can take the inspiration from whoever you want or nobody at all, that is your choice.

 

Edit.: As for the northern Europe, I actually wanted to go visit there for some time, believe it or not. And you know what I like about countries there for example? Their population density numbers... in my country, we have about 35 people per km2, in Scandinavian countries it's pretty much a half (cold environment I guess, another thing I enjoy  ).

[Akiza]

I don't see how my dignity makes the world better, but ok...

 

If someone doesn't detriments my efforts or goes against me (or efforts of people I care about), they can have all the secrets and lies they want. And I don't see how Morrigan goes against that in case of my Warden.

 

The thing is... you believe that there's one way of life that is best of everyone... there isn't, you can have a way that is best for majority maybe, but not for everyone. Neither every human is sociable, I for one find no special joy of being constantly around others. Yes I know, it's not usual, but that's the way I feel and I definitely won't deny anybody the same thing. I have the feeling that you expect that I want my way of life for everybody, when I really don't... or the way, to which everybody should aspire to, as you say. I'm not saying my way is generally good way, it's a good way for me and perhaps for some people, who are like me. And I don't think your preferred way would work for me either. I also don't say you should take inspiration from Morrigan, do I? You can take the inspiration from whoever you want or nobody at all, that is your choice.

 

Edit.: As for the northern Europe, I actually wanted to go visit there for some time, believe it or not. And you know what I like about countries there for example? Their population density numbers... in my country, we have about 35 people per km2, in Scandinavian countries it's pretty much a half (cold environment I guess, another thing I enjoy  ).

Sorry for my posts they are often harsh while your attitude i must admit was mostly polite (more than mine),but this is happen only when i'm genuinely interested in something.

I didn't say anything about personal way of life,everyone is different,but there is an huge difference in being what you want to be, and forced to be someone other than yourself. 

I do believe that Morrigan and Loghain are the product of their environment in a toxic way,in the sense that they do not retain any longer their spontaneous behaviour,they were completely changed by their environment and this is one of the reasons that leaded my to spare Loghain out of mercy.

You may enjoy a specific way of life because of your personal reasons,but this is not Morrigan's case(she did not chose, she was brainwashed),she do not enjoy the way in which she was forced to live by Flemeth and she have the courage to admit this to herself and Flemeth only after 10 years.

Morrigan of DAO is a walking contradiction because there are two persons inside of her.

I still remember when she told to the Warden on how much she respected Flemeth,only to contradict herself with Zevran in a banter

"I will not become like mother considering that my mother live in a hut ecc i think i will pass"

Or when the warden said to her that there are worse things than death

(is true in this fantasy setting i know worse fate than death in Thedas just look Maric of the silent grove or worse the broodmothers),she disapproves because she believe in survival.

Then she contradict herself again with Zevran and she say to Zevran in a banter about the crows

"there are worse thing than death"

exactly what the Warden told to her.

(Zevran is one of the few characters of whom she opened herself a bit)

Under the surface Morrigan is a shy character who do not want to admit that she wish to experience love and friendship,because she always wear this armor that Flemeth created for her.

I genuinely believe that you confuse the true Morrigan, with that mask created by Flemeth(this is why i mentioned Orlais,Morrigan is good when it comes to wear masks)

the true spontaneus Morrigan is the one  who was destroyed by Flemeth since the time of childhood,remember the whole mirror thing that Flemeth smashed on the ground?

You can observe Morrigan  beyond the surface when you gave to her the mirror gift,or the 2nd grimoire,or the whole ring conversation,as much as she try to mislead the Warden by sayng that the ring is a gift of praticality,this  is completly false she gave that ring because she wanted to be understood better by the Warden,even about things that she is not capable to comunicate out of shame and fear.

Do really others players think that i was unable to understand all of these things when i played DAO?

Still i do not justify her for what she do in Redcliffe,abandon the Warden and call him a fool or say to a romanced warden:

"you shall live in regret bye,bye" and then smile

DO i really need to be the only one to understand people? If she is not willing to do this in return with my Warden and understand that i'm not willing to use a child to buy a soul,or to force Loghain to do anything, than is her loss not mine,she will lose the only friend in her life.

In the DLc is the same she maintain this bitter attitude and is not willing to apologize until that the warden will tell her coldly to leave to never be seen again.

o yes i admit that i have attacked her as i already said for several reasons (i do believe tha she is unstable and dangerous) because  my warden is a person not a saint and her patience have a limit.

So i really do not understand other user like Sylvanerie who mentioned people who gaze into the abyss and become monsters,monsters of what?

Morrigan had plenty of possibility and occasions to change my opinion about her with my Warden and she burned them all.

(at the circle,with the city elves,during Flemeth quest,with the little girl and the demon cat,at Redcliffe twice! both durin Eamon quest and during the final battle and in the final dlc where she was tryng to blame my warden to have abandoned her)

there are people who had a worse life than Morrigan who was protected by Flemeth since her childhood,think about how miserable are the noble human Warden and the commoner dwarf warden (imho the one that suffered the most) they lost everything and their blood get even tainted for a stupid blight which a magister was to blame

 So i'm not willing to be pitiful towards her because is Morrigan or because "little crocodile tears from comic Aimo, Sylvanerie proofs" or to invent some bias excuse like Andy "she cares about you,if she care she stay no matter what is simple!"

Without having any child,you wish a child you have to romance a man like every other sane woman of the planet,not use them like Flemeth taught to you,and then tell to them to get out and that you will raise their child on your own without interference of them, WTF you think you are?!?

and i can only show disdain for people who create Kieran just to save their skin and let Loghain or Alistair do this against their original will and lose a son forever,is evil,is the ultimate evil

not like Sylvanerie said you let a man die? Yes to reedem him and make him a great hero and not gamble the world rather than be an evil jerk and force him to do a stupid ritual just for saving my skin with an infant,who is the monster between us now?.

i bet that she need to reconsider what is the less shady path of DAO,which is spare Loghain for mercy and redeem him,not follow a Dark ritual.

 

Edit

 for the scandinavian country population yes too me is a good thing,i don't like noisy place either for living,serenity of the environment is what i valued the most,  with some degree of civilization of course not like the Korckary wilds.

[Tidus]

One of the things I noticed during my 12 play throughs   ( started my 13th last night as a mage) is there's several ways you can play this game.

 

You can choose if you want to be agreeable with everything, rebellious by not agreeing with everything or be a vile and despicable  warden.

 

As far as Morrigan.. While she is a despicable woman her magic power is needed in the coming battles since miss goody goody two shoes Wynne is more of a white mage healer then a black mage fighter.

 

As far as Morrigan's vile comments put her in a bag with Sten  shake them up and dump the bag and I'm not sure which one would fall out first as the vilest.

 

Our rag time group consist of:

 

A gung-ho near idiot, a preachy bard, a vile black mage, a drunken dwarf, a fool that would lead our small band in  attacks against the darkspawn, a busybody of a white mage and a golem that wants to crush things.

 

No wonder my poor elf said he/she needs a drink..

[Vlada47]

Akiza

 

No worries... I've seen harsh and believe me, your posts are still pretty far from it (you're just invested, as you said).   And don't worry I see this broken part of Morrigan too, that's the way I try to open to her in the game if I have an opportunity. You should also know - I've yet to play DA:I, so I don't know, how she develops in the meantime, I talk about these things from the point, where Witch Hunt ended. You are pretty much right about that a part of her personality wasn't created at her own volition, I agree with that, but there's a lot in her I see in myself, that's why I feel whatever I feel about her. What you've said about her having two different personalities... that's something I am very, very familiar with, because I am aware I have them too, I just learned how to suppress one or the other, when appropriate. You wonder, why I sound polite in these conversations? Because I have (imaginary speaking) chains on myself that stops me from going spontaneous the moment I think of something. What I believe is that Morrigan doesn't have the same restraint I put on myself, that's part of the reason, why she gets confused, when confronted with certain situations in the game and is often dismissive and sometimes contradicts herself. Hmm, great I just spent some serious thoughts on comparing my own personality with an artificial character, I go crazy sometimes... 

 

As to why my canon Warden agreed to do DR with her... he's attracted to these things (arcane stuff, rituals...) and see it as an opportunity to do, what no one has done before, something that might change the way people look at old gods, origin of darkspawn and so on (that works for myself too, just substitute magic stuff with science and technology  ). It also makes Warden's story arc more interesting for me... If I would be in shoes of my Warden at the moment, I'd probably do it too, since I don't see something evil in that and the lore question about nature of old gods, darkspawn and this ancient history just bothers my mind to no end.   I am definitely more interested in that, than a lot of side stories or even main stories that Bioware puts in the game.

 

 

 

Our rag time group consist of:

 

A gung-ho near idiot, a preachy bard, a vile black mage, a drunken dwarf, a fool that would lead our small band in  attacks against the darkspawn, a busybody of a white mage and a golem that wants to crush things.

 

I'll drink to that. 

[Aren]

tell to them to get out and that you will raise their child on your own without interference of them, WTF you think you are?!?

 

Emphasis just for this,among all the things that leaded me to refuse the Ritual this was one of the point on the table.

I bet that some players may be interested more with this metaphysical nonsense

(the old god soul, the essence the spirits,the old religions ecc..)

but the struggle of that point is pretty much more realistic,Morrigan went beyond the limit of comprehension.

Ironic is the fact that if you try to do the same with her in the Dlc she immediately is ready to refuse and be beyond your reach,so why i should be the moron in this case just to appease her?

AT that point it was by far more easy for me to kill the old god soul and not have to worry about the implications of anything,as a benefit Loghain get redeemed and Flemeth failed.

[Illegitimus]

It doesn't makes sense in WH the warden is completly aware of Morrgan's lies(there is the 2nd confrontation,she even confess) also there is the possibility to discover this lie during Flemeth quest a clever Warden is needed,simply agree with Flemeth not kill her,return to Morrigan and then tell her that you discovered her double game(be honest and not lie to Morrigan),she will leave the party ,also i do agree that Morrigan is not a character of whom philosophy i will take

anything

If you are not even upset of someone who putted in danger your life against her mother without telling to you the truth to one of your question that can even possibly abandoned the group if you refuse to kill your benefactor Flemeth, that is your business not of my warden(whom i already said was already angry due to her attitude at the alienage with her whole stupid darwinist thing).

and kill Flemeth? are we serious,someone who have be proven only to be a benefactor,someone who have never lied to you?If i will not do this Morrigan will abandon me (and no i don't lie to her just to keep her  otherwise i will just be a Morrigan 2.0)

I wll never understand what's the point to kill someone who have never done something bad to the world,quite the opposite,Mythal the protector a wonder,who only protected things into the world,i see killing and attacking Flemeth as one of the most sad thing to do,she is not her daughter who lie and possibly abandon you,she only offered without demand anything,if you want to do the DR is ok,if you dont want to she is not there to call you a moron and give to you a middle finger.

Of course that i would have allowed her to have the soul of the old god and trusted her more than Morrigan,she is into the world for many years and never used her powers for her own benefit,only to protect others wonders

 

Are you kidding me?  You did not just seriously claim that Flemeth never lies to the warden.  Of course she lies to the Warden.  Whether or not Morrigan knows the plan for sending her from the start, Flemeth certainly does.  And at the end of the day, I still don't know whether Flemeth actually steals babies from the Chasind in order to raise them as her daughters and then devours their souls and possesses their bodies but there is reason to think just that.  And the reason why Flemeth can't abandon you is because she wasn't there to help you in the first place.  

[Tidus]

Flemeth, Is IMHO worst then her daughter. She didn't save two Grays just to "Well we can't have all the wardens to die.", she saved the ones that would fit her scheme in getting the soul of the old God. There was other wardens present but,what's better then a formidable new recruit and one that isn't all that bright?

 

It was Flemeth that had Morrigan  watch the wardens in the wilds and bring them to her so, she could pick the best two candidates. I'm satisfied Flemeth or Morrigan watched,the joining  and later Flemeth watched Alistair and the PC and plucked them from the  tower and that dialog between mother and daughter was nothing more then a put on so,the wardens would think she was helping them by sending her daughter with them because "She knows the wilds,the way around the Darkspawn horde and her magic will be useful". Sounds good doesn't it?

[Secret Rare]

Are you kidding me?  You did not just seriously claim that Flemeth never lies to the warden.  Of course she lies to the Warden.  Whether or not Morrigan knows the plan for sending her from the start, Flemeth certainly does.  And at the end of the day, I still don't know whether Flemeth actually steals babies from the Chasind in order to raise them as her daughters and then devours their souls and possesses their bodies but there is reason to think just that.  And the reason why Flemeth can't abandon you is because she wasn't there to help you in the first place.  

 

Flemeth, Is IMHO worst then her daughter. She didn't save two Grays just to "Well we can't have all the wardens to die.", she saved the ones that would fit her scheme in getting the soul of the old God. There was other wardens present but,what's better then a formidable new recruit and one that isn't all that bright?

 

It was Flemeth that had Morrigan  watch the wardens in the wilds and bring them to her so, she could pick the best two candidates. I'm satisfied Flemeth or Morrigan watched,the joining  and later Flemeth watched Alistair and the PC and plucked them from the  tower and that dialog between mother and daughter was nothing more then a put on so,the wardens would think she was helping them by sending her daughter with them because "She knows the wilds,the way around the Darkspawn horde and her magic will be useful". Sounds good doesn't it?

Flemeth never lied or did anything against your cause quite the opposite,she sent Morrigan for the dark ritual,but unlike Morrigan you never asked too Flemeth anything.

Flemeth never lied,never betrayed the warden,never possessed the body of her daughters,while Morrigan tried to kill her.

[Akiza]

Are you kidding me?  You did not just seriously claim that Flemeth never lies to the warden.  Of course she lies to the Warden.  Whether or not Morrigan knows the plan for sending her from the start, Flemeth certainly does.  And at the end of the day, I still don't know whether Flemeth actually steals babies from the Chasind in order to raise them as her daughters and then devours their souls and possesses their bodies but there is reason to think just that.  And the reason why Flemeth can't abandon you is because she wasn't there to help you in the first place.  

 

You are just kidding yourself,Flemeth never lied to the Warden because you never ask too FLemeth anything.

In order to consider something as a lie,someone have to lie to you,the fact that Flemeth know about the Dark ritual just like Morrigan is not important,because you don't ask her of why she sent Morrigan,had the game provided this and she not answered then it would have been a lie.

Morrigan lie and abandon the Warden,she even betray her mother (Flemeth do not intended to possess her) Morrigan was incompetent to not translate that book.

Morrigan betrayed both Flemeth and the warden by not remained with the Warden until the end of the blight and by sending the warden to kill her

If Flemeth do not attacked and killed her in DAI it is only because she care for her,my Warden however is not Flemeth and she gutted her with no remorse

[Aren]

Are you kidding me?  You did not just seriously claim that Flemeth never lies to the warden.  Of course she lies to the Warden.  Whether or not Morrigan knows the plan for sending her from the start, Flemeth certainly does.  And at the end of the day, I still don't know whether Flemeth actually steals babies from the Chasind in order to raise them as her daughters and then devours their souls and possesses their bodies but there is reason to think just that.  And the reason why Flemeth can't abandon you is because she wasn't there to help you in the first place.  

1)Flemeth did not lie to the Warden because you never ask

2)I don't want to be one of those retarded soldiers at Ostagar who believe in everything that an old legend say.

[Tidus]

Flemeth knew exactly what she wanted and I don't believe for one second she would have cared if all the wardens died if she didn't want the soul old God...

 

She needed two wardens and that  "well, we can't have all the wardens die" was a lie just like sending Morrigan to help because "she knows the wilds,how to get around the horde and you need her magic".

 

What she really meant is I need Morrigan to go with you to do my bidding and that's the only reason  I saved you..

 

If you talk to Flemeth  after Morrigan joins and just before leaving and ask her about coming with you she will reply "I already did more then the world deserves". That comment is what made me think Morrigan was up to something when I played my first game.

[Vlada47]

 

If you talk to Flemeth  after Morrigan joins and just before leaving and ask her about coming with you she will reply "I already did more then the world deserves". That comment is what made me think Morrigan was up to something when I played my first game.

Heh, interesting, never tried to talk to her at that moment... I wonder if she believed at that moment that by setting things in motion for the Dark Ritual, she actually does whole world a favour or if she talked about something else.

 

For the discussion - Flemeth doesn't lie directly, she just hides her intentions... she is basically just much more experienced in that kind of thing than Morrigan could be. She actually has some sort of admiration from me for that, believe it or not.   Morrigan then tries to cover it up by some lies here and there, but she doesn't do any real damage with those lies either. Another thing - when Morrigan asks you to slay her and you go into the Wilds to investigate, Flemeth really doesn't tell you in the slightest, what the truth is (if she plans to posses Morrigan's body or not), you just don't know at this point. My Warden didn't come to her to slay her on sight, like Morrigan probably wants, he really wanted to hear her version of this (Morrigan could be wrong in this, that's entirely possible)... and if she convinced him that she wouldn't posses her daughter's body in the end, he would let her go. But since she really doesn't tell you... I'm still kinda 50/50 on this decision, but it's sort of branded a little meaningless, because even Morrigan tells you, you won't kill her permanently, you just buy her some time to be better prepared in the future.

[Tidus]

Vlada47,Flemeth does beat around the bush by saying "That's a old, old story Flemeth has heard and has told."  Not exactly a lie nor is it a direct answer to the question of her taking over Morrigan's body. I'm yet to kill Flemeth on Morrigan's say so simply because my warden doesn't trust her. 

 

 

I'm playing my 13th DA:O game as a mage  and I still  get into the game and it seems I learn something new in every game.

 My elf is a reluctant warden with one thing on  her mind-finding and killing  Jowan--not to worry..She never kills him in my few mage games.

[Vlada47]

Like I said it's pretty much "toss of a coin" thing, you don't have any info that would convincingly indicated one or the other. So it boils down to, what is your's Warden take on Morrigan (and maybe Flemeth herself).

[Vlada47]

World is full of double- triple- quadruple- standards, when you think about it... you'll get used to it eventually. 

 

Yes, well this is clear display of hypocrisy, what you describing here, I agree. Wonder if that can be classified as a slip up in writing or if it's just a extreme of Morrigan's opportunism, either way... interesting stuff.   My Warden told the trader to share, so he didn't hear it. 

 

Just to be clear - I never called anyone stabbing Morrigan a monster, I just didn't like doing it for some reasons people here presented, that's all... so don't go to me with some talk of double standards. 

 

About Flemeth... I said she didn't lied to the Warden exactly, she just didn't tell him about some stuff and didn't say anything to contradict Morrigan's accusation of her stealing her daughters' bodies. When a companion comes to me believing he/she is in problem, I won't treat it as child tales, unless I find a evidence that it is just a child tale. No matter said companion's personality or motivations...

[Illegitimus]

 

You are just kidding yourself,Flemeth never lied to the Warden because you never ask too FLemeth anything.

 

Bunk.  You are perfectly free to ask Flemeth what she's up to after she rescues you.  Just don't expect her to tell you.  And she certainly misrepresents the reason why she is telling Morrigan to go with you.  

[Tidus]

Flemeth  raised Morrigan the way she is so ,they're two of a kind but, Flemeth is far better at covering her intentions.

 

Warden to Morrigan: So,why did your mother rescue me?

 

Morrigan: I have ask that question myself..I would have rescued the king since he is worth more.

 

 

Warden to Flemeth: So,why did you rescue us?

 

Flemeth: Well,we can't have all the wardens  to die now can we? Of course not!  What she really means I need you two to help my daughter get the sprit of the old God and what better candidates could I choose then a raw recruit and a not so bright gung-ho  warden?

 

What Flemeth fails to mention she had Morrigan (in animal form) to watch you while in was in the Wilds. I am fully persuaded that Flemeth (in animal form) watched the joining and kept a close eye on your whereabouts-how else would she know you was in the tower? 

 

Next time you play resist the idea of going on a suicide mission and fighting the blight and listen closely to what Flemeth says.

 

Even that mother/daughter discussion about Morrigan  going was a put on.

[Akiza]

World is full of double- triple- quadruple- standards, when you think about it... you'll get used to it eventually. 

 

Yes, well this is clear display of hypocrisy, what you describing here, I agree. Wonder if that can be classified as a slip up in writing or if it's just a extreme of Morrigan's opportunism, either way... interesting stuff.   My Warden told the trader to share, so he didn't hear it. 

 

Is not a sleeping in writing,is Morrigan.

She was like that also during the circle of magi quest,if you follow her advice and you kill all the mages,then at the end of the quest she will say to Gregoir basically that the templars are so bad for have killed the mages of the tower more or less,even if she suggested this in the first place a living contradiction.

Also i find as being hypocrite the whole "Protect me from my mother intrusion/possession but let this child be possessed by the old god soul"

Really the DR remind me of the movie selfless,two will one body,is just something aberrant for me,one person as to have it's own body.

 

 

 

What Flemeth fails to mention she had Morrigan (in animal form) to watch you while in was in the Wilds. I am fully persuaded that Flemeth (in animal form) watched the joining and kept a close eye on your whereabouts-how else would she know you was in the tower? 

 

Next time you play resist the idea of going on a suicide mission and fighting the blight and listen closely to what Flemeth says.

 

Even that mother/daughter discussion about Morrigan  going was a put on.

Flemeth didn't watch the joining because she doesn't need to do this,she was waiting the warden long before,is one of Mythal ability,the foreshadowing and be capable to predict to a certain degree the events,she ask to Morrigan to accompany the warden to her,because she was already aware of the Warden arrival

last statement is an undeniable truth.

[Tidus]

Akiza,I play the game different then most seeing my Elf GW doesn't share Alistair's enthusiasm about raising a army and killing the AD so,I get several different answers and when you revisit Flemeth  tell her "I want the truth" and listen closely to the old hag's reply-if you haven't already. My GW doesn't completely trust Flemeth and certainly  doesn't trust Morrigan but, he/she needs Morrigan magic.

[thewatcheruatu]

Gaider wrote and Aimo illustrated a lovely short comic strip about the conversation Morrigan has with Alistair right before she goes to speak to the warden on that night that really captures a lot of what a high approval Morrigan is experiencing before making her offer.  The one on the bioware blog only shows the first page, the other links are broken to the other pages.  This one on the artist's blog is complete.

 

http://momochanners....ry-single-brick

 

This is weird. This seemed like a different character to me from the Morrigan I knew I my playthrough. 

[Illegitimus]

This is weird. This seemed like a different character to me from the Morrigan I knew I my playthrough. 

 

Ever go through the "Morrigan begs you to dump her" scene?