782 réponses à ce sujet

[Feybrad]

Yeah, 'straight guys' didn't 'get shafted' when it comes to numbers.  They got the same number of options as both of the previous games, as well as the same number of options as gay men, lesbians, and straight lady dwarves/qunari.

 

But I can certainly understand feeling like the options that they were given weren't great.  While I personally think that Cassandra seemed badass (not great enough for me to roll a straight guy, mind you), I can see why she's not everyone's preference.  Josephine, I can certainly understand not finding appealing because she was unappealing enough for me to have my dwarf bail on her part way through the romance and go with Blackwall instead.  I wasn't thrilled with either of my DA2 options, either, so I can appreciate having to 'make do' with the options that you get and hope that the next game is better.

 

I'd give you a Like, but then you ****-talked Josie. As a straight Guy, I was perfectly content with my Romance Options 'cause she was amongst them.

[Grieving Natashina]

I'd give you a Like, but then you ****-talked Josie. As a straight Guy, I was perfectly content with my Romance Options 'cause she was amongst them.

Don't mistake Dave there.  He likes Josie as a character, but was just less than impressed with her romance.  

[Feybrad]

Don't mistake Dave there.  He likes Josie as a character, but was just less than impressed with her romance.  

 

I know. I'm just being my young Self with the rather stupid "Jokes".

[Quarian Master Race]

On duty: Good question. Seems to me that transit time is considered off duty at least sometimes. Your squaddies move around in the ship, making eggs and chatting with each other. They really shouldn´t do it in the gun battery but well as you said we never see Shep use the bathroom, we never see another pilot relieving Joker from duty so he can get some rest. We never see where Garrus is sleeping or Tali´s room. I hope she doesn´t have to sleep in that suit 24/7.

Presumably the crew who don't have their own specific rooms (Miranda/Liara, Kasumi, Zaeed/Allers etc.) sleep in the crew quarters on those bunks. If they have one, Shepard's LI seems to sleep in the cabin with her/him (judging by some dialouge as well as the now defunct phone app's mail system). Tali sleeps in her suit, in fact if you read Ascension that's how quarians on the Flotilla sleep. Some ships have private or crew quarters, but lots of them are cargo haulers with partitions in place in the holds to make cubicle rooms where whole families live together. Without being in the suits 24/7, any potential diseases would spread very quickly in such an environment.

[themikefest]

Don't mistake Dave there.  He likes Josie as a character, but was just less than impressed with her romance.  

Her romance is my favorite

[daveliam]

Don't mistake Dave there.  He likes Josie as a character, but was just less than impressed with her romance.  

 

Yeah, no harm meant on the Josie comment.  I support anyone who really likes her (character and romance).  Just expressing my sympathies to those who don't like her romance.  But to be honest, I actually find her really boring as a character, too.  She's the only major character whose dialogue I routinely skip in every playthrough.  She's like a walking wikipedia entry for Antiva and, while she's certainly a thorough info dump, she's not super compelling for me.  I also tend not to be terribly interested in the 'cutesy' characters, which is how I view her.  Similarly, I didn't find Leliana (DA: O) or Tali (ME1-2) terribly interesting either.  But both got significantly more interesting when they became a bit more jaded.  Not likeable, necessarily, but interesting.  But I digress......

[Dantriges]

Tali sleeps in her suit, in fact if you read Ascension that's how quarians on the Flotilla sleep. Some ships have private or crew quarters, but lots of them are cargo haulers with partitions in place in the holds to make cubicle rooms where whole families live together. Without being in the suits 24/7, any potential diseases would spread very quickly in such an environment.

 

Didn´t read Ascension.

This doesn´t even ... how is this supposed to...

So you are saying that genociding the quarians is an act of mercy as they got a terminal case of EU nonsense syndrome?

[Quarian Master Race]

Didn´t read Ascension.

This doesn´t even ... how is this supposed to...

So you are saying that genociding the quarians is an act of mercy as they got a terminal case of EU nonsense syndrome?

Why is it nonsense? It's not exactly EU anyway, as Tali's line "we are in our suits even among family" would strongly imply this is the case even without the tour of the Idenna given in the book. It's not just for preventing the transmission of diseases either, it's a preventative measure to save lives in case of hull breaches.

Only time quarians are out of the suits is in specialized clean room facilities for hygenical or medical purposes.

[karushna5]

As a straight male who played DA:I, I completely disagree. I feel like we got shafted pretty hard.

 

I think in the future keeping it to 6 LIs or if you do add 2 extra, it being across a spread. Honestly, I feel like DA:I was almost making it up to them from ME3. The first game in a long time where it was possible for a straight character to have no options, gays and lesbians got 2 and straight men had 5. Admittedly, the romance content for anyone but Tali/Garrusmancers was pretty sparse compared to DA:I but I definitely feel the two games leveled each other out.

[BabyPuncher]

I wish it worked that way! Here in Canada (we all DO remember where BW is and from?) if some product is more popular then others of the same kind, they remove that particular product from the shelves in order to "give equal opportunity" to others (to be able to sell them all, actually, and do not stop production of those other brends).

 

Are you bloody serious?

[Mazder]

Why is it nonsense? It's not exactly EU anyway, as Tali's line "we are in our suits even among family" would strongly imply this is the case even without the tour of the Idenna given in the book. It's not just for preventing the transmission of diseases either, it's a preventative measure to save lives in case of hull breaches.

Only time quarians are out of the suits is in specialized clean room facilities for hygenical or medical purposes.

Don't forget that the books go into far more detail about everything in the universe and sometimes has things which can not be represented in the games. If we're going to take something too close from the books it means we have to acknowledge that abomination that was Dietz's contribution to the books.

The one which includes "an Asari Air kiss".

 

Yeah...

 

But I am a quarian romancer and I would definitely like to see more intimate Quarian relations.

Stuff like "how do you translate a kiss to people who live in suits with helmets all their lives/most of their lives?"

 

Maybe a hand to their own mouth-light part of their helmet to the others? "Forehead" tap?

 

 

In fact i'd like to see more intimate moments in general.

Hand holding, some tactile playing. Jokes played on each other. Conversations between each other other than mission based or info grabbing to forward the romance points.

 

Maybe a romance that doesn't begin at the end of the game.

Getting into a relationship and then banging at the end should not be the main goal.

Weave it through the story and make it interesting to follow other than "+1 point into this characters romance box".

Make it more real.

[Panda]

I feel like everyone got shafted by every aspect of DAI.

 

I'm feeling extremely shafted with DAI, but at least I was happy with the romance options it had.

[Spectr61]

See the title.  This is a thread for suggestions and discussions.  No being rude, no bashing others for their opinions, please.
 
I know some people would rather romance be taken out altogether, but I think it can really help with immersion at times.  I'm fine with playing a single character sometimes, but I enjoy playing the romances.  I am a sappy person and I know it.  I love to gush about the romances.  Still, I think they could be done better in ME:A than they were in the previous Mass Effect games.
 
My personal suggestions:
 

• Equal numbers of romances, beginning to end, for male and female player character.  At least one option each for gay and lesbian player characters as well.
• Limit the number of romance options.  If the series follows one protagonist, allow romances to begin mid-series with the "base" romances from the first game.  If not, then you can have brand new romances every game and no one's going to mind that too much.  This is not an "I hate variety" thing, but a matter of practicality.  The ME games didn't usually have a huge variety of squadmates, so not all of them should be romanceable.  Also, they tended to carry forward as cameos etc. to the next game.  Limiting the number means we can have them as party members in every game, or at least that there won't be an overwhelming amount of possible LIs to deal with without mistreating certain groups of players in the final game.
• If this is a series, rather than a single game, romances should build on the relationship through time, through ups and downs.  This happened in ME1-3 with Kaidan, Liara, and Ashley.  Also with Garrus and Tali.  I was one of those weird ladies who romanced Garrus and couldn't get enough because I LOVED how that story played out, and it was because it took time to build it.  Characters like Jack, Miranda, Thane, and Jacob didn't get the same kind of development, because they showed up later.  It's better if we can let everyone romance a character who's been around from the beginning.
• Only add as many romances as you're willing to deal with in the final game of the series.
• It is very much not okay to take options away from straight women or LGBT people, while still leaving straight males with all of their options.
• If Andromeda is going to be a trilogy, don't add romances in the third game.  Stick with the previous games' romances, and build from there.
• Allow players to start a romance with characters they chose not to romance in a previous game.  This can happen even in the final game.  To be frank that is probably realistic, because when things get rough, well... you're going to be looking for comfort.
• The final scene shouldn't always be sex.  If there's sex, when it happens should depend on the character you're romancing.  Some might sleep with you right away, others midway through, still others not until the final moments.  And a few might not want to have sex at all.
• Let players discuss marriage and family with their LIs.  Even if the response, from either the player or the LI, or both, is "I don't ever want that," it's an important discussion.  We're not talking about having kids running around the ship in-game.  Just let characters think about the future a bit, and where their relationships are going.  You know, kind of like real people who are dating might do after a while.
• Breakups and deaths of LIs are fine if that needs to be part of their story, however, unavoidable breakups and deaths of LIs and/or betrayals should not ONLY happen to the female player character.  If it has to happen as part of the story, let the men experience it too. If it's believed that the players of male characters will suffer too much heartbreak from this, or that it is horrible in some way because a female LI might suffer or die, then please consider that it is not much fun for most of the players of the female characters either and that it's equally horrible when male LIs suffer and die.  If the player's suffering/heartbreak is a concern preventing this from happening to male PCs, just don't do it at all.  Players of female PCs get seriously unhappy about these things, too (and when it's almost always us it happens to, it gets pretty old and loses its impact as a plot device).

 
Off the top of my head that's all I can think of.  Obviously others are free to disagree, make other suggestions, discuss, etc.  That's what this thread is for.  Someone may have way better ideas than I did.

Good post.

Not being a douche, but what is the difference between gay and lesbian?

[Amirit]

Are you bloody serious?

 

Absolutely. In food department it's very clear and when I first came across that nonsense that was an explanation I got. Since then I saw it not a single time. 

[Feybrad]

Good post.

Not being a douche, but what is the difference between gay and lesbian?

 

Gays are Men that are into other Men. Lesbians are Women that are into other Women.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Not being a douche, but what is the difference between gay and lesbian?

There really isn't any. Lesbian is just "gay woman". 

[karushna5]

 

Limit the number of romance options.  If the series follows one protagonist, allow romances to begin mid-series with the "base" romances from the first game.  If not, then you can have brand new romances every game and no one's going to mind that too much.  This is not an "I hate variety" thing, but a matter of practicality.  The ME games didn't usually have a huge variety of squadmates, so not all of them should be romanceable.  Also, they tended to carry forward as cameos etc. to the next game.  Limiting the number means we can have them as party members in every game, or at least that there won't be an overwhelming amount of possible LIs to deal with without mistreating certain groups of players in the final game.

 

This makes a lot of sense and I agree whole heartedly, but will add that doesn't mean their can't be substitutions or new characters. I feel if you kept all of them, then either you would never get anyone new (like your Garrus) or there would be a huge group like in the last game where they didn't have the budget to cut. 

 

So keep one romance for each group in one way or another and substitute 1. If one character is just really unpopular (like Jacob) substitute 2 and explain that characters disappearance in some way. Also no mass deaths or it is just impossible to keep up with it all.

 

So imagine ME2 was the first game and everyone lived. Bench 2 of the characters slightly to have new romances, and replace the least popular romance. So Miranda would be an NPC in this one only mentioned here and there, But now there is Liara. Thane is Benched due to sickness but you can talk to him. But Kaiden is a new romance. Jacob was a bit of a flop, so he is gone and that is explained romantically. But look here is Vega.

 

Personally I would love if each game grew the romances a bit. So in 1, 4 bisexual romances, in 2, a couple romances will be replaced by 4 new romances gay and straight of each (they are still around just not crew members) and then in the 3rd, all of them are back with 8 romances. A slow growth. 

[NWN-Ming-Ming]

Just had an interesting thought along the above lines...

 

Maybe have one of the romances come to a sudden self-realization mid-series, and 'switch teams' realizing they are gay.  Could be an interesting way to either bench an unpopular romance or breath new life into them as they start being true to their orientation?

 

Hell, it's not like it's something unheard of in real-life, and could be a way to humble or humanize the Protagonist with a bit of humor, i.e. "I am such a horrible romantic partner, I turned Kaiden gay!" and the resulting banter back and forth.  "It wasn't you!  It was your awful dancing!" 

[Kappa Neko]

I remember a number of Kaidan fangirls being quite pissed off when he was made bisexual out of nowhere in ME3. Some even said it ruined the romance for them. Broke the illusion or something.

While I personally didn't care and even thought it was nice that the gay community got what they wanted - more Kaidan for everyone, yay! - I don't think many people would like their fantasy ruined like that. In my playthrough Kaidan was simply straight, since there was no hint at anything else prior to ME3. So nothing destroyed my fantasy. But I understand how a love interest suddenly realizing they liked different body parts might be considered even worse than Jacob dumping femShep for some random chick.

[BraveVesperia]

I remember a number of Kaidan fangirls being quite pissed off when he was made bisexual out of nowhere in ME3. Some even said it ruined the romance for them. Broke the illusion or something.

While I personally didn't care and even thought it was nice that the gay community got what they wanted - more Kaidan for everyone, yay! - I don't think many people would like their fantasy ruined like that. In my playthrough Kaidan was simply straight, since there was no hint at anything else prior to ME3. So nothing destroyed my fantasy. But I understand how a love interest suddenly realizing they liked different body parts might be considered even worse than Jacob dumping femShep for some random chick.

I have to wonder exactly what fantasy it was ruining for those fangirls. Maybe they were really into the idea that Kaidan was a hardcore breast fanatic or something? 

[karushna5]

I remember a number of Kaidan fangirls being quite pissed off when he was made bisexual out of nowhere in ME3. Some even said it ruined the romance for them. Broke the illusion or something.

While I personally didn't care and even thought it was nice that the gay community got what they wanted - more Kaidan for everyone, yay! - I don't think many people would like their fantasy ruined like that. In my playthrough Kaidan was simply straight, since there was no hint at anything else prior to ME3. So nothing destroyed my fantasy. But I understand how a love interest suddenly realizing they liked different body parts might be considered even worse than Jacob dumping femShep for some random chick.

 

I mean, people somehow react terribly around bisexuals. And heaven help the bisexual who has a preference. Its just biphobia. People are Bi and often don't mention it because others have these reactions. Nevermind that if you have a strong preference one way or another, it is very possible to not know you are bi til later in life. I always felt like biphobia was rooted in possessiveness and jealousy.

 

I am engaged to a bisexual woman who greatly prefers men. She will be attracted to women occaisonally but the ones she gushes about are always men. She likes dudes and that is okay, it has absolutely no effect on our relationship. It just means I can rib her when she buys things because of pretty boys, and she ribs me when I buy things because muscular ladies. 

 

People don't get the attraction or feel threatened by it and always lash out against their "loved" ones because they imagine it as a danger or something. I guess what I am saying is people need to not feel betrayed when a character, or real person, is bisexual they aren't losing them, just learning more about them.

[Felya87]

I must admit I'm not really a fan of characters that "came out of the closet". Mostly because many times it feel just a way to give another (for now it happened for gay romances) romance "recycling" an already existing character previously only interested in only one gender. I prefer a character being interested from the start to both/one gender, than having the moment "out of the blue" later.

 

But it may be just me.

[Kappa Neko]

I have to wonder exactly what fantasy it was ruining for those fangirls. Maybe they were really into the idea that Kaidan was a hardcore breast fanatic or something? 

I don't remember... I just read a couple of such posts in 2012. Not sure they even stated what exactly pissed them off about it. It's not like Kaidan came out as gay and dumped femShep. Now THAT would have pissed *me* off, being invested in the romance, being told how much they are in love and them, oops, he's actually gay. That would have made no sense to me. And I don't think Bioware is ever going to do something like that - ever. Not the kind of realism anybody wants, I think.

 

But finding out that your love interest is actually bisexual midway through the game? Why not? Doesn't change the significance of the relationship your character has with them. Dumping your character for the opposite sex, however, would be a shitty feature. Who wants to be dumped in a videogame (for whatever reason)? Jacob proved how very much that sucked...

 

One thing that I would find interesting as mentioned above is a love interest who is introduced with a certain sexual orientation but then slowly falls in love with your character and realizes that they are actually bisexual or even gay. So said squadmate would initially not be a love interest and have neutral conversations.

I kind of roleplayed that as an alternative ME3 scenario for my canon femShep. She was with Kaidan but then Liara turned out to be so much more supportive. And she kind of stole my heart in ME3... so I was VERY tempted to turn that wonderful friendship into a slow-burn romance. I think it's a beautiful setup. Having been friends for two games and then realizing that you are actually the perfect match (doesn't have to be about being gay/bisexual). My femShep was straight, but I almost made her bisexual for Liara (or asari-sexual, still not sure if being with them counts as lesbian/bisexual).

I doubt ME:A will be another trilogy, so slow romances that take longer to build up won't happen. But I'd love that. Having to earn somebody's trust and friendship through certain story-related events. Imagine you'd have had to first save Ash/Kaidan on Virmire, build a friendship for the rest of the game, then trust issues in ME2, and THEN in ME3 they are so relieved you're still one of the good guys and you celebrate the reunion with an (unexpected) kiss. That could play out as a oh-I'm-bisexual romance too. Which I guess this is what they tried to do with Kaidan? I haven't played a dudeShep romance with him yet. So I have no idea how it played out...

 

However, romantic drama, especially when it's about self-discovery or coming out, gets cringe-worthy easily. So if we were to get a surprise bisexual romance, I'd rather it not be too big a deal. Make it a sweet but short scene.

[Felya87]

I like the "slow building" relationships. If the game is again a trilogy, I would like having romances start from the second game too, like Tali and Garrus. As long as the "new" romances added later in the game are already known characters, even better if companions of the first game. As much as I liked Jack, I have to admit she lack the build up of characters like Liara, Garrus and Tali.

 

And there is one thing I can a little understand (understand, not share) about the girls who didn't like kaidan revealing he is BI. Is a little of jelousy, I think. MaleShep is so special that make even characters became gay for him, other than having already basically all the ladies minus one, and not having to be humiliated by one drunken night stand (one not even consensual from the player) cheating (with remind of the almost sure barren state of FemShep) and inavoidable death of the LI. Sometime I have the feeling ME3 was written by insensible fratboys, if Garrus wasn't in the game.

 

I see mostly a "recycled romance" with Kaidan, the "let's make him BI as we thought in the first game but scrapped, so we don't have to make another gay character". But for many the effect may seem "MaleShep is better than FemShep".

[Panda]

Well there is many reasons why people are against characters who weren't known to be bisexuals before being revealed as bisexuals later on. However I don't think there has been that many characters like that around, just Kaidan from those who were romanceable before just with one gender and later two. Anders could be counted as well I guess. Well I guess there is Cullen who almost was romanceable by both genders, but in the end weren't. Overall I think it's quite unlikely that we will encounter characters like this though, since there probably is no returning characters around.