782 réponses à ce sujet

[Para-Cord43]

only 18% of people played as her(most people didn't even finish the games to boot). If anything, I'd argue femshep got more content that she deserved.

I mean, how could someone not pick Sheploo? Just look at that...

[Hanako Ikezawa]

I mean, how could someone not pick Sheploo? Just look at that...

Quite easily, considering I never used the default face. 

[chessplayer209]

Crazy to think, but there are people who treat this third person shooter franchise as a datesim despite how brief said content is(and how horrid it is).

 

RE: that femshep "equality" poster,I see nothing wrong with it, as despite what femshep's vocal minority of agitator fans would have you think, only 18% of people played as her(most people didn't even finish the games to boot). If anything, I'd argue femshep got more content that she deserved.

 

And her getting all that extra content to appease the social justice warrior crazies ultimately detracts from content the majority of players would prefer because it consumes game developer resources that should have gone elsewhere.

 

The vocal minority has flooded the forums, and Bioware should stop listening to them. Bioware should give them just enough to keep them playing, but should by no means give equal development resources to femshep or to homoshep as they do to manshep and straightshep as the SJWs are demanding.

[KaiserShep]

RE: that femshep "equality" poster,I see nothing wrong with it, as despite what femshep's vocal minority of agitator fans would have you think, only 18% of people played as her(most people didn't even finish the games to boot). If anything, I'd argue femshep got more content that she deserved.

 

 

Eh, percentages are fun and all, but one might also argue that BioWare should just get rid of classes too. After all, Soldier dominates the list at 43% with Adept and Engineer coming in the bottom 2, so why bother with biotics at all, since Vanguard is seemingly the only one worth a damn among them? Anyway, that table of percentages is pretty old, like 3+ years by now. 

 

I mean, how could someone not pick Sheploo? Just look at that...

Nuts to that. Too bad we couldn't make him look older, and have a beard. Buzzcutloo just looks kind of weird to me. 

 

[S.W.]

The only thing that really disappointed me in the series was that Jack or Tali weren't bi options for femshep. I doubt it would have been out of character for either - Jack's open-minded when it comes to sex, and that may even extend to gender preferences, and Tali's suit-linking scene in ME2 always came across as almost romantic, I could see something blossoming in ME3 along the lines of "I didn't know I wanted this but yes".

 

Then again, I forget most people are actually straight a lot of the time (I know, it surprises me too) and forget that making all female love interests bisexual doesn't exactly make things fair.

 

Anyway, in terms of ME:A, whilst 2/2/2 is fair enough, it poses problems such as:

 

1. It's pretty rigid for the writing staff, and it doesn't allow for last-minute changes or additions (ex. Solas' romance in DA:I screwed with balance but was a nice addition, we saw a different side of his character, and the romance strayed from the typical formula). Those additions, whilst nice, will cause arguments this system was meant to prevent. At that point, you question why not let the writers do whatever with their characters, and make unique romances which suit them?

 

2. If you want romances which feel more organic, more responsive, and less like a dating sim, you'll run into a problem by limiting romances to two per sexual orientation. Let's say, our straight, gorgeous human male has pretty strong views on, say, Cerberus, and your wayward full renegade PC pisses him off by then help Ceberus restart when you had a choice to kill it dead, completely pissing on the principles that he clearly explained to you in your first interaction with him - and he kills the relationship then and there. Or, let's say that he has a fear of commitment, or even just takes the fear of breaking military regs quite seriously - and you have to make a series of choices in multiple dialogues to stop him breaking it off with you naturally. A lot of people will be unhappy with that.

 

A lot of people just want slushy fluff in their romance. Which is completely okay, I like slushy fluff as much as the next person, but that doesn't always make for thrilling stories or interesting or like there are any stakes. Of course, these aren't necessarily mutually exclusive things, but I think if you want more varied romances where the LI has some autonomy, they will make decisions that you might not necessarily like. For people who want a happy ending, that might not be great. You could say, well, that's why there's two options per sexual preference, which leads into the third point.

 

3. 2/2/2 gets complicated because of aliens.

 

Not everyone likes aliens. Which is perfectly fine. Not everyone wants to think about the specifics of bonking a fictional alien species. So if that straight, gorgeous male from above, for whatever reason, proves to be a tragic/bittersweet choice, and your only other male LI who sleeps with women is an alien, then straight female fans who aren't into them will feel hard done by.

 

If we split the love interests in half, so three are alien, and three aren't, then someone's always going to get hard done by unless the two bisexual LIs are both humans. Which they won't be, because there will undoubtedly be an asari LI, and it seems unlikely that a member of a species which doesn't really do gender to have gender preferences. If two of the three aliens, therefore, are an asari and a female quarian, a lesbian gamer who isn't into aliens may be annoyed. If you encounter the above problem on top of that - i.e. a unique, responsive romance that doesn't automatically hand you a happy ending - look, someone's likely going to be pissed off somehow.

 

 

Really, I just think Bioware should say 'screw it' and make everyone as gay as possible do what they want with romances.

[Youknow]

Eh, percentages are fun and all, but one might also argue that BioWare should just get rid of classes too. After all, Soldier dominates the list at 43% with Adept and Engineer coming in the bottom 2, so why bother with biotics at all, since Vanguard is seemingly the only one worth a damn among them? Anyway, that table of percentages is pretty old, like 3+ years by now. 

 

 

Yeah, I would hope not since my first playthrough chosen, despite being MaleShep : Soldier was never completed (data got corrupted), but my first completed was FemShep : Engineer. I'd hope my first choice was removed. 

 

And funny thing about FemShep. It was MaleShep that needed more attention in the games than FemShep before three. Sure, MaleShep got trailers, but FemShep could roleplay as a lesbian or a bisexual woman while MaleShep wasn't allowed until ME3. She also had some extra little tidbits of dialogue that just WEREN'T there for MaleShep. For instance? in Omega, when you are signing up for the merc's group to get archangel, you get a hilarious little bit of dialogue where the batarian mocks you and tells you to go the other way to the stripper's side-up. You get an extra renegade interrupt for it too. Now maleShep? He's just not pretty enough to be mistaken for a stripper. 

 

 

On topic: I'm still up for the "none" option. 

[Panda]

Ugh.

 

If Bioware started catering straight men more than they already do they would lose lot of players. Most of fans and not casual players like what they are doing in terms of having female protagonist and somewhat equal options for them. Female and LGBT+ demographic is after all quite big and less contested than straight male demographic that majority of games are going for. Bioware achieves less competion and gets more loyal fans from people who don't feel catered elsewhere for doing what they are doing.

 

Also especially on DA side it's what writers have been wanting to do, they aren't all straight male either.

 

It's nice to see how wanting women and gay people have options is being nut SJW to some. Anything that doesn't cater only straight white male demographic is considered being nut SJW nowdays, isn't that just great.

[Hiemoth]

It's 4. ME is leaned toward straight males, while DA is leaned toward straight females. I doubt neither sides complain when they're the ones who receive the benefit anyway. Fairness is a funny thing.

 

You know what is also pretty funny? The fact that most people I see complaining about it or throwing the argument around kind of ignore the reason for DAI, which is by the way the only DA game to lean towards straight female options just like ME3 is the only one with more straight male options, has that many straight male romance options. If you look at the party composition in DAI, it is 9 men and 3 women. Add in the advisors and your total tally is 10 male characters to five female characters.

 

This was actually something pointed out when the party composition was mentioned in that there were players complaining about the lack of female characters, which were derided by other posters as the writers should write the parties they wanted. Yet, when the logical consequence of this party composition followed, with more options for straight female characters, came out, suddenly the vocal complaints were about why were there more romance options for straight women than for straight men.

 

I would love to see a Venn diagram about the forum members who argued that the party composition was fine and the forum members who were shocked by straight female romance options becoming most numerous.

[Hiemoth]

And her getting all that extra content to appease the social justice warrior crazies ultimately detracts from content the majority of players would prefer because it consumes game developer resources that should have gone elsewhere.

 

The vocal minority has flooded the forums, and Bioware should stop listening to them. Bioware should give them just enough to keep them playing, but should by no means give equal development resources to femshep or to homoshep as they do to manshep and straightshep as the SJWs are demanding.

 

You know, normally I just ignore posts that make references to SJWs, as you know, why bother?

 

However, this post brings out one of my favorite arguments which is that Bioware should stop listening to people asking for inclusion as they are a minority because apparently it is a given that otherwise Bioware's vision would totally match with the non-minority view. I mean the interviews with the developers really, really support this view, don't they?

[KaiserShep]

And her getting all that extra content to appease the social justice warrior crazies ultimately detracts from content the majority of players would prefer because it consumes game developer resources that should have gone elsewhere.

 

This is baseless conjecture. Beyond something general that may only be backed up by some [dubious] statistics, like, say, female love interests, you can't really determine the specifics of what the majority of players would actually prefer, nor can you determine whether or not the addition of FemShep came at the cost of said content. What evidence is there that FemShep cost something that the majority may prefer? Or better question, without FemShep, what can you determine outright to have been improved if BioWare didn't add the option? How do you know that Mass Effect would not be exactly the same, minus FemShep, if BioWare spared itself the extra resources into recording Hale's VO? 

 

The vocal minority has flooded the forums, and Bioware should stop listening to them. Bioware should give them just enough to keep them playing, but should by no means give equal development resources to femshep or to homoshep as they do to manshep and straightshep as the SJWs are demanding.

 

 

I'm of the opinion that BioWare might actually do better to not bother listening to people who use catch-all buzzwords that are ultimately devoid of meaning. 

[Battlebloodmage]

You know what is also pretty funny? The fact that most people I see complaining about it or throwing the argument around kind of ignore the reason for DAI, which is by the way the only DA game to lean towards straight female options just like ME3 is the only one with more straight male options, has that many straight male romance options. If you look at the party composition in DAI, it is 9 men and 3 women. Add in the advisors and your total tally is 10 male characters to five female characters.

 

This was actually something pointed out when the party composition was mentioned in that there were players complaining about the lack of female characters, which were derided by other posters as the writers should write the parties they wanted. Yet, when the logical consequence of this party composition followed, with more options for straight female characters, came out, suddenly the vocal complaints were about why were there more romance options for straight women than for straight men.

 

I would love to see a Venn diagram about the forum members who argued that the party composition was fine and the forum members who were shocked by straight female romance options becoming most numerous.

And almost all the high NPCs in the games in high position are females. Bioware themselves said that they made it up with the number of females we encounter in the game as well. It's not just romance. 

 

I don't care about either ME3 or DAI distribution, but don't complain about one but accept the other because I find it to be very hypocritical. I don't sugarcoat and make it seem more or less than what it is. I find problems in both games' distribution and hope they fix it in the next game. 

[Kmaru]

 Hu?

Didn't you buy the game for the game? Romance is a side show. You can buy a Harlequin Romance novels, if that is your main interest.

 

ur post is funny, cause this Topic is about romance only.

 

 

After seeing this thread and the arguing in another thread about mature content, I'm convinced they should just make ME: Andromeda a first person shooter like Call of Duty.

 

Not sure if it's a good idea. Bioware offers more, why making steps back, just because those topics awake so much passion? To me it's a sign that, all the fans that are posting on those topics just adore the game. Real life is about sex and romances, if it was not we would not be billions, if it was not about sex, and romances for thousands of years, wether we are humans or not, there will be no life at all. ME is not just an action game, it is also an RPG, more than that Mass Effect offer a greater experience, more to explore by trying to reach every aspect of a human life.

 

 

Mass Effect needs more characters like Miranda, Legion, and EDI. As far as the romance or sexual content aspect of Mass Effect goes, I'm hoping for more characters like Miranda and EDI... especially Miranda. And with her black alternate outfit please  .  (I realize Miranda likely won't be present in ME:A, but I'd be satisfied with a character that is similar.)

 

Also, the game should have more opportunities to have sex in it. It shouldn't be a once-per-game thing. And there should occasionally be prostitutes here and there in the galaxy for the sake of realism if nothing else. Prostitutes have always existed throughout human history and always will. To not include them in open-world games diminishes the realism & immersion of the games, which is bad.

 

Also, don't listen to the people who say they want "equality for femshep."  That's ridiculous. Most of the people who play the game are males, so it makes sense to have more sexual content geared for males than for females.

 

 

I'm not sure about the prostitutes, but using the extranet to date someone else than squadmates would be great. Using internet to date is very popular nowadays, so what about the future ? It's like all the wires in Mass Effect, when we clearly tend to go wireless...

[karushna5]

If I was rewriting romances for the trilogy it would be:

 

*Snip*

Not bad but really limiting to gay men, if I could do it from the begginning (with modernviews and such when the game came out.

 

ME1

Ashley- BI

Kaiden-Bi 

Liara-Bi

To be fair all these characters were initially planned to be Bisexual, sadly, not enough LIs to make 2 guys

 

ME2

Thane- Straight 

Jacob- Gay (wouldn't go to make a kid)

Garrus- Bi (because everyone loves him)

 

Jack-gay(not actually gay but basically the opposite of what she was in ME2 and only in the mood to date girls now instead)

Miranda-Bi (because femshep must look at her butt)

Tali- Straight

 

Kelly-extra straight romance

 

I agree keep the ME3 romances the same.

[Gramorla]

In previous games, bioware has the tendence to make the male main li for female charakters very similar. There are mostly the "warrior typ". Nice but not so intellegenc guys, mostly very young and inexperienced with womans.

I would prefare someone like Dorian (or Sand from NWN2). Someon who is more sarcastic and intellegence. Solas and Anders where good steps in the right direction.

[S.W.]

[snip]

Jack-gay(not actually gay but basically the opposite of what she was in ME2 and only in the mood to date girls now instead)

[snippy]

 

um, what does that mean?

 

lesbian women aren't defined by a few preset personalities or appearances? it's not as if you're barred from the gayzone because you didn't act femme enough or something.

[karushna5]

um, what does that mean?

 

lesbian women aren't defined by a few preset personalities or appearances? it's not as if you're barred from the gayzone because you didn't act femme enough or something.

I mean she is bi but prefers women for now. I don't quite understand what you mean here, but I totally get the way I said that was confusing. I mean the opposite because she talks as if she is bi but not interested in girls right now from her dialogue. I meant she is bi but not interested in guys right now, so not actually a lesbian, but funcionally one gameplay wise

[Spacepunk01]

2. If you want romances which feel more organic, more responsive, and less like a dating sim, you'll run into a problem by limiting romances to two per sexual orientation. Let's say, our straight, gorgeous human male has pretty strong views on, say, Cerberus, and your wayward full renegade PC pisses him off by then help Ceberus restart when you had a choice to kill it dead, completely pissing on the principles that he clearly explained to you in your first interaction with him - and he kills the relationship then and there. Or, let's say that he has a fear of commitment, or even just takes the fear of breaking military regs quite seriously - and you have to make a series of choices in multiple dialogues to stop him breaking it off with you naturally. A lot of people will be unhappy with that.

 

A lot of people just want slushy fluff in their romance. Which is completely okay, I like slushy fluff as much as the next person, but that doesn't always make for thrilling stories or interesting or like there are any stakes. Of course, these aren't necessarily mutually exclusive things, but I think if you want more varied romances where the LI has some autonomy, they will make decisions that you might not necessarily like. For people who want a happy ending, that might not be great. You could say, well, that's why there's two options per sexual preference, which leads into the third point.

 

I think it's really important to make a push for more realism in this area. People think they know what they want, but maybe they'll learn to appreciate the fact that even if a relationship didn't work out, it still felt real - and that this carries its own reward.

 

I agree that companions should have more autonomy. They should have integrity, and if your paragon falls in love with a renegade companion, then the choices you'd have to make should be difficult. You have to take some risk. Nothing about love is safe. I think people who want slushy fluff romance will be positively surprised how rewarding it can be when a character you really love doesn't want you back. Furthermore, I think the pleasure will be even greater when a romance actually works out, when the odds were not in your favour.

[Sartoz]

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Here is an idea. Create a Mata Hari.

 

A spy that can insinuate herself in the major Command Decision chain and who then can influence mission outcomes.... perhaps the ending as well.  Now the romance must be intense with more nudity to influence/keep the lover's interest....  and no Toggle!

 

Welcome to the Exotic Goodtime Bar.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Kmaru]

I think it's really important to make a push for more realism in this area. People think they know what they want, but maybe they'll learn to appreciate the fact that even if a relationship didn't work out, it still felt real - and that this carries its own reward.

 

I agree that companions should have more autonomy. They should have integrity, and if your paragon falls in love with a renegade companion, then the choices you'd have to make should be difficult. You have to take some risk. Nothing about love is safe. I think people who want slushy fluff romance will be positively surprised how rewarding it can be when a character you really love doesn't want you back. Furthermore, I think the pleasure will be even greater when a romance actually works out, when the odds were not in your favour.

 

It will be a real improvement, i think. So far i love all the companions personality, but it should be more challenging and rewarding if it was not that easy to get access to their heart. Not all of them at least. But that also mean more investment, more time, more money. So i support the 2/2/2 (humans) + 1 (alliens). or 4 humans. 2 straight (male/female) 1 bi (female) 1 gay (male) and 3 alliens that are what they are.

 

If we push further 2/2/2 is not fair either but at least it will give options.

[karushna5]

I think it's really important to make a push for more realism in this area. People think they know what they want, but maybe they'll learn to appreciate the fact that even if a relationship didn't work out, it still felt real - and that this carries its own reward.

 

I agree that companions should have more autonomy. They should have integrity, and if your paragon falls in love with a renegade companion, then the choices you'd have to make should be difficult. You have to take some risk. Nothing about love is safe. I think people who want slushy fluff romance will be positively surprised how rewarding it can be when a character you really love doesn't want you back. Furthermore, I think the pleasure will be even greater when a romance actually works out, when the odds were not in your favour.

 

If this were more about romance, I would agree, but Sci-fi/fantasy doesn't work as well with this method especially something like mass effect which is part star wars and part star Trek. I have met no one who thinks Han Solo should never had a chance with Leia, and that because most of their ideas were different they should have never even been together.

 

I have never met anyone who thinks Indiana Jones or 007 should have been romantic hit or misses, with often losing due to various reasons. The romance needs to suit the game, and ME is just not a series that lends itself to realsim. Zombie outbreak? yes. Dystopia? yes. soft sci-fi with the focus on action and adventure and not romance? Cheesy is good. A gimmick, a romance flavor, and viola story romance.

 

A game more about drama this sounds perfect, or a serious romance games but action adventure doesn't always benefit from more realism.

[Spacepunk01]

If this were more about romance, I would agree, but Sci-fi/fantasy doesn't work as well with this method especially something like mass effect which is part star wars and part star Trek. I have met no one who thinks Han Solo should never had a chance with Leia, and that because most of their ideas were different they should have never even been together.

 

I have never met anyone who thinks Indiana Jones or 007 should have been romantic hit or misses, with often losing due to various reasons. The romance needs to suit the game, and ME is just not a series that lends itself to realsim. Zombie outbreak? yes. Dystopia? yes. soft sci-fi with the focus on action and adventure and not romance? Cheesy is good. A gimmick, a romance flavor, and viola story romance.

 

A game more about drama this sounds perfect, or a serious romance games but action adventure doesn't always benefit from more realism.

 

I might be in the minority here, but who knows.

 

I am not necessarily saying that someone like Han and Leia shouldn't have had a chance. I only ask that it feels more realistic. There has to be some risk, a chance that you might be disappointed. When there is no risk, where is the reward?

[Panda]

I think 2/2/2 would be most reasonable and fair system there could be. That way too much time wouldn't be used on romances, but everyone would have options in terms of gender and sexuality. All or couple characters could have optional sex scenes so these romances would work to asexual/demisexual characters.

 

What becomes aliens, well there is different kind of reasons why players don't count LI's as options for them although they are. S/he is not squadmate s/he doesn't count! Aliens don't count! S/he is not my type/ugly/bald/has bad personality/is racist/pro-cerberus/etc. Point is that it's impossible to Bioware consider all things some people don't like in LI's and design LI's so that everyone would have LI that they are into. If people are going to have high standard and have many things they can't look pass with LI's then they should prepare themselves to be disappointed. If they have two options and one is alien and they don't like other they shouldn't blame Bioware on that or feel like they don't have any options.

[Sartoz]

I think 2/2/2 would be most reasonable and fair system there could be.

 

Big Snip

 

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 I fear, though, you may be right. Chris Wynn tweeted something about making sure they create balance characters as job #1.   That statement can be interpreted in many ways...

 

Regardless, if I buy the game it won't be because it contains LIs.

[9TailsFox]

Quite easily, considering I never used the default face. 

[Killdren88]

The 2/2/2 system won't work because your forgetting the non binary genders! *This post is brought to you in part by Sarcasm*