27 réponses à ce sujet

[andy6915]

I think I want to do some threads asking what everyone's favorite game was for a combat style. This one is mage, which game gave you the best mage experience?

 

DAI is my favorite. Mages in DAO were too slow and had a lot of useless fluff in the ability list, they just felt like a chore to play. Between DA2 and DAI was a real difficult pick though, both are quite mobile and fun, and every single ability feels useful on some level. But I really like a lot of the DAI spells, like fade step and static cage and fire mine. It just felt more reactive than DA2's mage feel, and I really like how enemies incinerate down to a skeleton or freeze and shatter or "pop" apart to lightning. Although, in DA2's favor I really liked how mages could melee with their staffs and how fast DA2 mages could run... Actually, I kinda dislike how ranged fighters have no melee at all anymore, like archers lost their cool emergency dagger combos they had in DA2. Oh well .

[Lebanese Dude]

Dragon Age: Origins

 

Advantages:

 

• Huge selection of spells
• Viability of pure support casters
• Independent Spell Combos
• A lot of utility, arguably too much
• AOE spells feel oh so good to use
• Mages are powerful on their own due to their CC and support effectiveness. Can be a disadvantage in terms of challenge if you use even one.

Disadvantages:

 

• Abilities are generally low impact and weak with the occasional ability being godlike
• Abilities have to be spammed and not in a fun way
• Animations are very basic. My mage looked like an angry neighbor poking a ceiling with a broom half the time when casting spells, and a pool player when attacking with a staff. Arcane Warriors had no melee combat upgrades, making them tankbots.
• Spell power tied to Magic stat, forcing the mage to stack Magic to be efficient. Willpower is a very weak stat.
• Friendly Fire due to AOE hard to predict
• Good gear is hard to find.
• Progression is linear. Players are forced to pick up up to 3 unwanted or weak spells to get to what they want. 
• Specializations are mediocre. Shapeshifting is outright horrible. Arcane Warrior makes a character powerful but renders a large portion of their toolkit inconvenient or unusable due to sheathing issues.

 

I ended up downloading Combat Tweaks to make the spells more balanced and fun. Funny enough, what ended up happening was that enemy mages on Nightmare destroy me in seconds if I don't disable them asap. I seriously recommend this mod if you're looking for a challenge on DAO.

I also downloaded a mod or two that distributed good upgrades for my characters throughout the game. I think it was Dragon Age Redesigned. It gave me a bigger selection of equipment to choose from, even incorporating some DA2 models like the Apostate garment. In vanilla, all I'd use is the DLC robe which looked ugly.

 

Dragon Age 2

 

Advantages

 

• A lot of spells to choose from. There are less non-specialization spells overall, but those that remain feel more high impact.
• Upgrades! Upgraded spells are very high impact. This leads to less spamming with only 10-12 abilities being needed til the late game.
• Better animations than DAO. Mages now have a snazzy attack.
• Specializations are much more significant with a larger array of spells to choose from. 
• Mages can now crit! 
• Spell combos with other classes are fun

 

Disadvantages

 

• Spend more time attacking than casting spells. 
• Long cool downs on many basic support abilities. This renders support builds relatively weak til later in the game.
• Sustains were more powerful, but if you tried to use more than three, you'd severely limit your mana. Blood Magic solves this, at the cost of your own health.
• Magic effectiveness still tied to the magic stat, and each individual stat has less benefits than Dragon Age Origins.
• In DAO mages had too much utility. In DA2, it felt like they had too little unless you specialized into Force Mage.
• Limited equipment choices. Mage Pack DLCs offer good items but they cost money to obtain. 
• Most AOE spells are weak. Firestorm is the only effective one but it's a nightmare for Friendly Fire since it has a random element.
• Mages are weak on their own

I ended up using the save game editor to create or upgrade good and pretty equipment for my mages. I'd try to be as balanced as I could, but obviously this felt like cheating.

 

Dragon Age Inquisition:

 

• Spells have A LOT of impact. Each individual spell hits like a truck and has up to two to three additional effects. 
• Interesting passives. Most of them have environmental or personal requirements to trigger. 
• Beautiful unique animations for each spell. 
• Spell effectiveness no longer tied to a stat. Weapon Damage is much easier to control via crafting.
• Much more stats to choose from allowing a greater degree of specialization for your mage. Crit mages actually viable from the get go and my god they feel good.
• AOE is back. Spells can be combo'd in insanely fun ways.
• Specializations are a very important choice that massively changes the way you play the game. 
• Crafting lets you make awesome-looking and specialized gear.
• Spells from different schools interact with each other
• Mobility increase
• Focus spells GG

Disadvantages:

 

• Support mages still viable but weaker and more limited.
• Entropy and Creation trees are mostly gone. Spells mixed in with specializations.  Basic spells are all elemental. 
• Eight-ability limit is a non-factor til late game if you are efficient with your character building, but becomes more obvious as you reach the higher levels.
• Melee staff attack from DA2 removed

 

-----

 

My favorite mage has to be in Dragon Age Inquisition. While I miss being able to play various support builds like in DAO, the remaining builds have been vastly expanded.The deep crafting system allows you to further specialize your character in ways that were difficult or impossible to do naturally without using save game editing. 

 

My favorite mage in Dragon Age so far has been the AOE Crit Rift Mage spec. Destroying everything with pretty colors is a gamers' wet dream.

Tank-support Knight-Enchanter lags just behind, making the Arcane Warrior in DAO look like a boring snail in comparison.

 

Also, the animations and mobility have made mage gameplay feel much more fluid, making mages less dependent on having a tank.

 

Kudos to whoever designed Arcane Barrage. That has got to be the most satisfying spell ever made. 

[andy6915]

 

Dragon Age: Origins

 

Advantages:

 

• Huge selection of spells
• Viability of pure support casters
• Independent Spell Combos
• A lot of utility, arguably too much
• AOE spells feel oh so good to use
• Mages are powerful on their own due to their CC and support effectiveness. Can be a disadvantage in terms of challenge if you use even one.

Disadvantages:

 

• Abilities are generally low impact and weak with the occasional ability being godlike
• Abilities have to be spammed and not in a fun way
• Animations are very basic. My mage looked like an angry neighbor poking a ceiling with a broom half the time when casting spells, and a pool player when attacking with a staff. Arcane Warriors had no melee combat upgrades, making them tankbots.
• Spell power tied to Magic stat, forcing the mage to stack Magic to be efficient. Willpower is a very weak stat.
• Friendly Fire due to AOE hard to predict
• Good gear is hard to find.
• Progression is linear. Players are forced to pick up up to 3 unwanted or weak spells to get to what they want. 
• Specializations are mediocre. Shapeshifting is outright horrible. Arcane Warrior makes a character powerful but renders a large portion of their toolkit inconvenient or unusable due to sheathing issues.

 

I ended up downloading Combat Tweaks to make the spells more balanced and fun. Funny enough, what ended up happening was that enemy mages on Nightmare destroy me in seconds if I don't disable them asap. I seriously recommend this mod if you're looking for a challenge on DAO.

I also downloaded a mod or two that distributed good upgrades for my characters throughout the game. I think it was Dragon Age Redesigned. It gave me a bigger selection of equipment to choose from, even incorporating some DA2 models like the Apostate garment. In vanilla, all I'd use is the DLC robe which looked ugly.

 

Dragon Age 2

 

Advantages

 

• A lot of spells to choose from. There are less non-specialization spells overall, but those that remain feel more high impact.
• Upgrades! Upgraded spells are very high impact. This leads to less spamming with only 10-12 abilities being needed til the late game.
• Better animations than DAO. Mages now have a snazzy attack.
• Specializations are much more significant with a larger array of spells to choose from. 
• Mages can now crit! 
• Spell combos with other classes are fun

 

Disadvantages

 

• Spend more time attacking than casting spells. 
• Long cool downs on many basic support abilities. This renders support builds relatively til later in the game.
• Sustains were more powerful, but if you tried to use more than three, you'd severely limit your mana. Blood Magic solves this, at the cost of your own health.
• Magic effectiveness still tied to the magic stat, and each individual stat has less benefits than Dragon Age Origins.
• In DAO mages had too much utility. In DA2, it felt like they had too little unless you specialized into Force Mage.
• Limited equipment choices. Mage Pack DLCs offer good items but they cost money to obtain. 
• Most AOE spells are weak. Firestorm is the only effective one but it's a nightmare for Friendly Fire since it has a random element.
• Mages are weak on their own

I ended up using the save game editor to create or upgrade good and pretty equipment for my mages. I'd try to be as balanced as I could, but obviously this felt like cheating.

 

Dragon Age Inquisition:

 

• Spells have A LOT of impact. Each individual spell hits like a truck and has up to two to three additional effects. 
• Interesting passives. Most of them have environmental or personal requirements to trigger. 
• Beautiful unique animations for each spell. 
• Spell effectiveness no longer tied to a stat. Weapon Damage is much easier to control via crafting.
• Much more stats to choose from allowing a greater degree of specialization for your mage. Crit mages actually viable from the get go and my god they feel good.
• AOE is back. Spells can be combo'd in insanely fun ways.
• Specializations are a very important choice that massively changes the way you play the game. 
• Crafting lets you make awesome-looking and specialized gear.

Disadvantages:

 

• Support mages still viable but weaker and more limited.
• Entropy and Creation trees are mostly gone. Spells mixed in with specializations.  Basic spells are all elemental. 
• Eight-ability limit is a non-factor til late game if you are efficient with your character building, but becomes more obvious as you reach the higher levels.

 

 

So um, really good post (not sarcasm), but... You didn't actually say which your favorite is. You outlined a lot of things, but didn't actually conclude anything.

[Darkly Tranquil]

Origins. Although overall combat is better in DA2, I found Origins mages' huge toolbox of spells and combinations to be the most enjoyable (although DA2 also had some fun specs). Not all the spells were powerful or always useful, but they were varied and interesting for the most part. DAI's magic, like every other aspect of DAI's gameplay, was rubbish, it was mostly just red damage, blue damage, or green damage, and minimal support or utility abilities; all flash, no substance.

[Lebanese Dude]

So um, really good post (not sarcasm), but... You didn't actually say which your favorite is. You outlined a lot of things, but didn't actually conclude anything.

 

lol edited

[Nixou]

Arcane Warriors had no melee combat upgrades, making them tankbots.

 

 

I kinda liked the fact that Arcane Warriors have no melee upgrades: your never-trained in melee combat mage-Warden turns out to be a terrible fighter who make up for lack of skill by hitting really, really hard and never getting tired from it.

 

Arcane Warrior makes a character powerful but renders a large portion of their toolkit inconvenient or unusable due to sheathing issues.

 

 

That's where using a secondary weapon comes in handy: go with the staff when you're about to use large AoE spells or snipe enemies from afar, then when they get close by, switch the Sword and Shield and start tanking.

 

Better animations than DAO. Mages now have a snazzy attack.

 

 

 

***

 

which game gave you the best mage experience?

 

 

I didn't roll a mage in Inquisition (two mage-protagonists in the previous games were enough)

Also disabled AoE attacks from the mage teammates in order to avoid unwanted friendy fire, meaning my mages were mostly basic long range fighters outside of boss battles where I micromanaged the team.

 

My favorite style was DAO: gameplay wise, magic was an unbalanced mess, but in terms of narrative, having an overpowered mage as the protagonist shows why people are terrified of mages (a ruthless mage-Warden is a catastrophe waiting to happen) and why the Circles and Templars are dysfunctional (for all their bullying of ordinary mages, they are, quite obviously, incapable of keeping in check the most powerful ones, who actually should be closely monitored)

[Ashaantha]

I personally enjoyed Inquisition mage much more then Origins or Hawke, though I do miss some of Hawke's spells and melee staff attack. Ok I mainly missing bashing people with the staff.

[zara]

I liked Origins best because of the spell combos and variety of spells. I liked Inquisition least because of the eight-ability limit and lack of healing spells.

[First Enchanter]

TL;DR: Mages in DA3 are fun, but generic and waaaay too similar to each other; we need more spells.

 

I only play mages cuz I love them.

 

I think Inquisition did a lot right, but I'm EXTREMELY upset they got rid of Entropy and Creation (and most of Spirit too). I think Inquisition mages are fun to play but repetitive and, especially at the end of the game, all of my mages feel very similar to each other except for a few minor variations. So what they do have is cool for the most part, but my fondest hope for DA4 is that they bring back a wider variety of magic. Because right now, DA3 mages feel extremely generic to me (they're nearly elementalists by default).

 

I'm hoping for 4 trees per class like now, but with much bigger trees to give us more options for character builds (I imagine them radiating outward in multiple directions from a central point). And I desperately want mages to have their trees return to: Entropy, Primal, Creation, and Spirit.

 

Of course, I don't expect the same number of spells as Origins (there was definitely a lot of fluff), but I'd still like more than we have now - passives were good but aren't very exciting to attain as the player. Plus, for goodness' sake bring back the option to select abilities from the radial menu.

[Nixou]

Plus, for goodness' sake bring back the option to select abilities from the radial menu

 

 

Or introduce a functional menu-based tactical mode

[Zehealingman]

I miss fireball.

And DA IIs cone of cold.

[Wulfram]

Probably DA2.  I dislike the small AoEs and the sameyness of each tree in DAI, while DA:O mages were more overpowered than interesting.

[Maferath]

DA2 forcemage. Enemies ragdolling everywhere. Just amazing.

[Statare]

I agree with pretty much everything Lebanese Dude mentioned in his thorough post.

 

Yet, I prefer games that allow me to make the type of mage I want, even if the spell mechanics/combat mechanics have issues. In DA:O I always made a Spirit/Nature mage (Arcane Bolt, Curse of Mortality, Walking Bomb, Crushing Prison, Locust Swarm, and Arcane Warrior (for survival) and Shapeshifter (for Stinging Swarm, which was actually really useful combined with Arcane Warrior). It fit the type of character I was role-playing and I enjoyed it. The Spell Combos (sleep and horror, death cloud and death hex) were awesome.

 

Similarly, in DA2 I wanted my Hawke to feel like a Hedge Mage, someone trained outside the Circle, and I achieved that by using Spirit Damage, Entropy, and some Arcane and speccing Force Mage (for the added oomph). Honestly, that was the most fun I had with a mage character in DA. While my mage was not a one-hit wonder able to destroy entire groups of enemies in seconds, it was fun casting Entropic Cloud, Hexes, Improved Horror, Walking Bomb, and a well timed Spirit Bolt to trigger a walking bomb explosion. It was fun, reactive, and did not make you feel like a god except in brief moments of synergy.

 

Unfortunately, I really don't like DA:I as a mage. I feel like I spam powerful spells over and over again. I feel like if there are spell synergies, they tend to be two spells layering over eachother nicely and not triggering powerful moments (Fire Mine and Static Cage is just not as satisfying as the group damage enhancement of Entropic Cloud, Status Effect Combo, Hexes and Walking Bomb, or the amazing spell combo system of DA:O. I really love the animations of DA:I and I like the physics they kind of developed in the fighting, but I feel they left out a lot by cutting off spell schools and not giving magic some more subtlety again, instead of everything being pew pew boom but a few spirit and ice spells.

[Lebanese Dude]

 

I feel like if there are spell synergies, they tend to be two spells layering over eachother nicely and not triggering powerful moments (Fire Mine and Static Cage is just not as satisfying as the group damage enhancement of Entropic Cloud, Status Effect Combo, Hexes and Walking Bomb, or the amazing spell combo system of DA:O. 

 

It seems like you would enjoy playing the Necromancer specialization.

 

It's important to note that hexes have been incorporated into abilities. 

 

Vulnerability/Affliction Hex is part of upgraded Arcane Barrage, for example.

 

Entropic Cloud is now incorporated with Horror. Several passive upgrades offer increased damage on CC'd targets or reduced damage from weakened targets for example. Misdirection and Death Hex are noticeably absent from the mage's arsenal, but rogues have actually adopted them as part of their own abilities. This is a mere continuation of balancing the classes and their roles.

 

AOE can also be enhanced by using the Rift Mage spec. Pull of the Abyss retains all the glory of its DA2 predecessor, making the combo with Fire Mine and Static Cage all the more glorious.

 

I also think there are still many ways to play a mage despite the lower number of abilities. Why not try new ways to play the class? 

 

The Winter tree allows for some sick plays for example. I actually tried a three mage party where I had all three cast the Ice Wall in a triangle formation to keep everyone in then nuke them to hell with AOE. Fade Step alone greatly increases your potential for fun plays.

 

I played a Knight-enchanter as a pure dps, a support, a tank, and a hybrid. Each required a different party setup on Nightmare or I'd get wrecked.

 

etc..

 

I suppose it all comes down to how much you like to click on abilities.

 

Those that like to keep on casting spells, irrespective of their magnitude, will obviously enjoy DAO more. 

Those who prefer efficiency and cleaner combos like me will like DAI.

Those in the middle prefer DA2

 

If I'm going to be honest, I enjoyed playing a mage in all three games. Each one presented different gameplay experiences, and encouraged me to find new and fun ways to play the class. If DAI was merely a visual upgrade from DAO or DA2, I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have had as much fun.

That's just me though.

[N7_5P3CTR3]

^ This.

 

My only real complaint is having the focus/rift powers eating up my slots, these should have under the potion/command wheel.

[Aren]

 

Dragon Age 2

 

 

 

•  
• Most AOE spells are weak. Firestorm is the only effective one but it's a nightmare for Friendly Fire since it has a random element.
• Mages are weak on their own

 

I don't agree with this,Thunderstorm casted in 3x with Hawke,Merrill and Anders were by far more effective than Firestorm,especially because it wasn't a problem for Friendly fire on nightmare.

3 mage in DAII were a nightmare with 3 thunderstorm

[First Enchanter]

I also think there are still many ways to play a mage despite the lower number of abilities. Why not try new ways to play the class? 

 

I suppose it all comes down to how much you like to click on abilities.

 

Those that like to keep on casting spells, irrespective of their magnitude, will obviously enjoy DAO more. 

Those who prefer efficiency and cleaner combos like me will like DAI.

Those in the middle prefer DA2

 

I'm one of the people that is dissatisfied with Inquisition's mage abilities, but it wasn't so much the abilities themselves as it was the scope. Sure, Energy Barrage or Ice Mine can serve the same essential function as a Hex from Origins or DA2, but I really like the thematic element of having an actual dedicated hex or glyph of paralysis. Making everything elemental made everything more...one-note, imo, even though what was there worked really well. 

 

I never thought that Inquisition's spells were bad, just that they are all thematically way too similar. It's even worse when you consider the layout of the party and that pretty much every mage will end up specializing in Elemental magic because of lack of options. You can do a Spirit mage + Specialization, but that's pretty much it. Mechanically, there are a good number of options, but in the world, it was just super jarring for me that suddenly the vast majority of magical tools we know mages to have (through 2 games, comics, and several novels) effectively vanished.

[Lebanese Dude]

 

I don't agree with this,Thunderstorm casted in 3x with Hawke,Merrill and Anders were by far more effective than Firestorm,especially because it wasn't a problem for Friendly fire on nightmare.

3 mage in DAII were a nightmare with 3 thunderstorm

 

 

Firestorm does way more damage than Tempest (the spell I assume you're referring to). It also has a lot more force. There is also an extra 25% damage passive (Pyromancer) that fire spells get. Upgraded Firestorm hits enemies reliably and effectively permanently CC's them.  Of course the downside is that it also hits your companions. When I play an elemental-focused mage, I enchant my characters with fire resistance to effectively cancel out the problem. I do something similar with Spirit Resistance when I play Spirit mages for Walking Bomb.

 

Tempest is obviously the safer and reliable choice for Nightmare, but it's not nearly as effective. 

[Lebanese Dude]

I'm one of the people that is dissatisfied with Inquisition's mage abilities, but it wasn't so much the abilities themselves as it was the scope. Sure, Energy Barrage or Ice Mine can serve the same essential function as a Hex from Origins or DA2, but I really like the thematic element of having an actual dedicated hex or glyph of paralysis. Making everything elemental made everything more...one-note, imo, even though what was there worked really well. 

 

 

The Glyph of Paralysis still exists. It's just in the form of an ice mine. It comes with perks too

 

Of course like I said before, if you simply like to cast spells every other second, then clearly you'll enjoy the DAO style more.

 

 

 

I never thought that Inquisition's spells were bad, just that they are all thematically way too similar.

 

I don't think I can agree with this. Each tree has spells that function differently with different forms of CC and disables attached to them.

 

No two spells are alike. 

 

Compare a single target ability in Winter to one in Inferno. 

 

Winter's Grasp: 4-sec duration low-damage single target CC that upgrades to a small AOE

Flashfire: 8-sec duration medium-damage single target CC that upgrades to a longer duration

 

The former freezes a target(s) for a short duration and an be combo'd with a crit for a giant nuke

The latter interacts with abilities that are enhanced by the Fear Debuff. It also acts as hard CC.

 

What about the AOE damage spells?
 

Winter has one, Blizzard, which is toggleable and affects enemies with a slow debuff.

Inferno has three. Immolate acts a small AOE nuke with a DOT, another as a wall of damage, and the third as a HUGE trigger mine.

 

The passives are entirely different, with Winter spells focused on mana regeneration and defense while Fire passives focusing on dealing huge damage passively or with barrier.

 

How do they feel the same? I can do this again with Storm 

 

 

pretty much every mage will end up specializing in Elemental magic because of lack of options. You can do a Spirit mage + Specialization, but that's pretty much it. 

 

This is an odd argument.

 

First of all, you're chunking all the trees into the Elemental Tree. How is this different than specializing in Primal, Elemental, or Spirit, the three damage-oriented trees in DA2?

 

How is it even functionally different than Dragon Age Origins?  You have four trees, each with 16 abilities that are often redundant, mutually exclusive, or upgrades of one another.

 

Every game had four main trees to choose from. There are less spells in Inquisition, but that's largely because redundancy was removed and sustains incorporated into abilities or passives.

 

The support tree in Origins consisted of the three tiers in Creation as well as two tiers in Spirit. In Dragon Age Inquisition, this is mostly relegated to the Spirit tree, but the specializations themselves have been vastly improved to potentially incorporate support spells.

 

While I miss Creation and the ability to heal, I can't say that Spirit Healer ever felt powerful in Dragon Age.

Group Heal was the only useful ability in the DAO specialzation, as the remaining spells were functionally weak or pointless in the vanila base game. Combat Tweaks made them better, but that's modded.

 

In Dragon Age 2, using Spirit Healer blocked you from casting any offensive spells and drained your mana. The base abilities were weaker than in DAO, only surpassing it when upgraded.

 

At least the Spirit tree encourages gameplay with other trees. Inferno mages gain damage from it. Knight-Enchanter mages charge it... etc...

 

 

All three specializations in DAI can function as support trees if you play them as such much like in DA2. Your Knight-Enchanter can be a tank WHILE being useful with their spells unlike the Arcane Warrior. The Necromancer can CC like a boss. 

 

....

 

I also don't see the argument on how mages feel "all the same".

 

At early levels, you can specialize in one tree or mix and match across four trees. When you access your specialization, you can only pick one for the entire game and it completely changes how you play. Knight-Enchanter makes you melee, Necromancer encourages brinksmanship and CC, and Rift Mage encourages AOE gameplay. 

 

Now if you make each companion play with different spells and use them all, then naturally you'll exhaust most options but it's always been this way.

 

Morrigan goes Primal and Entropy. Wynne goes Creation and Spirit. Er... my character goes Primal and Creation... oh I've seen this before...

 

Your character though can have dozens of potential builds to play for the major part of the game. 

When you get to higher levels, then the natural power creep of RPGs kicks in and you start investing points in skills you don't need for passives that you want or whatever. I think it's safe to say this happens in all games. In DAO, I would start taking spells I don't even remember to get to ones I care about.... like Crushing Prison making me take Telekinetic weapons and something else I forgot. In both DAO and DA2 I'd start having too many abilities to actually care to use around level 16+. It's even worse in DAO when I get to awakening. At that point leveling up is like a chore.

 

it was just super jarring for me that suddenly the vast majority of magical tools we know mages to have (through 2 games, comics, and several novels) effectively vanished.

 

The only arguably missing tool is direct healing and even that is not completely true. It's still technically available as part as Knight-Enchanter's focus ability, which is ironically stronger than any healing spell in previous games if fully upgraded.

 

Disables still exist.
Damage still exists.

Debuffs and Buffs still exist.

 

You can't generalize.

[First Enchanter]

It just didn't work for me.

 

I don't think I made myself very clear earlier. What it really comes down to for me is not mechanics. You keep talking mechanics. I get that those things exist. I don't like that they're all dressed up as elemental. I preferred the variety we had in earlier games in terms of...flavor, I guess?

[Lebanese Dude]

I don't like that they're all dressed up as elemental. I preferred the variety we had in earlier games in terms of...flavor, I guess?

 

Well... in my opinion the specialization changes more than make up for this shift in spell composition.

 

The only missing damage type in the base trees is Spirit, but it's expanded upon in all three specializations. In previous games the specializations were mostly there for resource regeneration and crowd control with very little damage. Made them relatively boring compared to the Warrior and Rogue trees if you ask me.

 

The gameplay change from reactive (healing) to proactive (shielding) also made the Creation tree rather obsolete to use.

While I miss it, it doesn't fit. Maybe it would have been nice to have long healing cooldowns like in DA2. That could have been a middle ground.

 

Personally, I see that the DAI style has a different sort of flavor... one that promotes style and substance over fluff and quantity. 

 

As I said earlier, if you're the type that likes to cast an independent -10 attack "Weakness" ability rather than have it baked in with an ability, then you'll like DAO more. I can certainly see the appeal.

Modifié par Lebanese Dude, 10 août 2015 - 10:14 .

[Thibax]

I want all magic schools back.

I miss nature and healing.

I love all DA mages, but I love nature and healing too.

 

Fire! Cold! Electrical! Nature! Spirit! 

 

Let's make the dance elemental magic!

 

Bioware, shall we dance?

[First Enchanter]

The gameplay change from reactive (healing) to proactive (shielding) also made the Creation tree rather obsolete to use.

While I miss it, it doesn't fit. Maybe it would have been nice to have long healing cooldowns like in DA2. That could have been a middle ground.

 

Personally, I see that the DAI style has a different sort of flavor... one that promotes style and substance over fluff and quantity. 

 

As I said earlier, if you're the type that likes to cast an independent -10 attack "Weakness" ability rather than have it baked in with an ability, then you'll like DAO more. I can certainly see the appeal.

 

1.) It's funny that you say Creation is obsolete. I don't mind the more active style, but I'd like maybe...one...healing spell back in some fashion. But Creation, to me, is waaay more than just healing. If I was designing the abilities and did Creation, I'd want, for instance: Revive, Heroic Aura (but activated, not toggled, as that makes it more significant and more exciting to use), Glyph of Paralysis, Heal (AoE like Barrier but max healing capped at 50% health...could be worked into Revive as an upgrade or vice-versa, tbh), Glyph of Warding (combined increased defenses with upgrade that knocks enemies back like Glyph of Repulsion), Grease (like a Pitch grenade but cooler) and then throw in Resurgence as a Focus ability for the entire Creation tree.

 

2.) I also prefer style and substance over fluff and quantity. I don't want 80 spells again...playing Origins now is tough because of all the crap you have to get through to get to the good stuff. And it's funny you mentioned Weakness because I HATED that spell lol. I always mentally sneered at it when I took it because I wanted Paralyze. But yeah, I don't want fluff, I want substance. I just don't see why that substance has to be balanced towards elemental stuff and away from some pretty cool schools of magic we had before. It doesn't ruin the game for me, but I miss them hugely.

 

@Thibax: LMAO

[nightscrawl]

<SNIP>

I agree with pretty much everything you said!

For me a good balance would be a combination of DAO's variety with options for upgrades, but fewer skill points overall. I liked DAO's variety because you could really specialize between support, utility (entropy drains and so forth), and damage. Unfortunately as you got higher in level you could pretty much just GET ALL THE THINGS and having individual mages be unique mattered less and less as you just threw points in anywhere, even spells you weren't going to use.

I like the idea of having -- limited! -- upgrades for spells you use all the time or you want to have a specific additional function, but I don't think every skill needs an upgrade. Also, some upgrades are so awesome or essential that it's almost pointless to use a skill often until you get the upgrade.