52 réponses à ce sujet

[mfr001]

Science Correction. Its not kinetic energy but conservation of momentum that'll determine just how far they're flung when things collide. Formula and very barebones explanation below: KE is pretty useless in and of itself for collisions, because it is the step of 'how much work' (in joules, usually) is required to get to that velocity.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Momentum

Yes, I know about conservation of momentum, which allows calculation of velocities after collision compared from those before. Assuming mass is constant (so no relativistic effects) and known (and who doesn't watch their weight in these health-conscious days) velocity is all you then need to work out momentum from KE. To determine how far a particle travels after a collision you need to know what resistance is slowing it, and hence work out how far it travels before all KE is lost, and hence velocity is zero, so KE is relevant.

 

In fact simple models of point particle collisions won't do here. Even Silent Sisters are not point particles, and some parts are squishy and others are not, so the result will depend on the parts which collide and at what angle. Especially if the pointy bits of headdress on the card are involved. To quote, "They don't like it up them.".

[Angelus_de_Mortiel]

well she's small and hit's them in the ding-dong

 

Volus Engineer + Batarian Gauntlet versus Cerberus. Agent Codename: The Nutcracker.

 

I'm surprised you haven't wondered why she can use War Cry.

 

You do know her vocal cords are still intact right? Doesn't take a tongue to scream... 

 

Yup, that's going on my list of "Gamer Quotes Out Of Context". 

[Drasca]

Yes, I know about conservation of momentum, which allows calculation of velocities after collision compared from those before. Assuming mass is constant (so no relativistic effects)

 

Yes conversation of energy is important, but

 

Not just relativisitic effects that would affect it. Much simpler, she doesn't drop any of her knives or loses body parts in the process haha. Her apparant density does matter too, and the elasticity

 

You wouldn't need KE if you already know the velocity, and you can just calculate momentum directly, and that is easy especially since charge is a fixed velocity every time (game wise). KE is only required if you don't already know the mass & velocity or figure out the fuel requirements for propelling the object (SS here).

 

What we don't know is the SS's mass (or anyone else's for that matter)... and given she's not telling us, we'll probably never know.

 

We don't know the exact elasticity of the collision either (or as you point out in laymen's terms, squishy) but I'm betting it is a partially elastic collision (as opposed to perfectly elastic or inelastic) given the SS doesn't stick to the enemy, and there's noise made.

 

https://en.wikipedia...astic_collision

https://en.wikipedia...astic_collision

 

Of course game physics ignores and is seperate from real world physics too, since the SS doesn't slow down (at all) when colliding with enemies she can knock down.

[uzivatel]

You do know her vocal cords are still intact right? Doesn't take a tongue to scream...

More like inarticulate sisters?

[toddgambit]

Everyone's trying to talk all sciency.  The whole concept of "charging bull" was that a character was so big he could run at you and knock you down.  That's the whole point of warriors being big.  Having a tiny female dwarf with this ability is just weird.

[Drasca]

Everyone's trying to talk all sciency.  The whole concept of "charging bull" was that a character was so big he could run at you and knock you down.  That's the whole point of warriors being big.  Having a tiny female dwarf with this ability is just weird.

 

If these goats can do it, the dwarf can too:

 

Note the nut shot.

[mfr001]

@Drasca

KE is the key to the point which I was trying to make. It is the square of SS's velocity which affects the distance travelled by the enemy. So a lighter body, SS's, can have the same effect as a heavier one if it moves at a greater velocity. The advantage is that doubling the velocity has the same effect on SS as increasing her mass four times.

It is fairly straightforward to show this in the simplest case of direct impact with a static enemy. First show that the velocity of the enemy is a multiple of the velocity of SS. Then use the Work-Energy Principle to show that the distance travelled is a multiple of the square of the enemy's velocity and hence of SS's velocity. Then - profit.

However, I think this should go to PM if we continue. Otherwise the class may get restless.

And for the rest of you reading this - there will be a test on Friday!

 

Oh and to get back to OP's point, this is an example of the old saying "Size doesn't matter."

[Drasca]

@Drasca

KE is the key to the point which I was trying to make. It is the square of SS's velocity which affects the distance travelled by the enemy. So a lighter body, SS's, can have the same effect as a heavier one if it moves at a greater velocity. The advantage is that doubling the velocity has the same effect on SS as increasing her mass four times.

 

However, you (and others) presume she has a lighter mass. That may not be true. All we know is the relative sizes are different, we have no clue what the actual mass & density of the dwarf and the others are. They have the same velocity though. The SS may have higher density, and the same mass.

 

Hahah, its not size but mass here. Density is deceiving.

 

The KE isn't relevant because velocity is known, as all charging bull characters charge at the same velocity. Its more likely that.

 

A) The game devs say so

Higher density

C) Magic i.e. different Game laws of physics than our world

 

My main point though is ignorant people ( gun nuts ) obsess over the idea of KE, but have no clue over momentum (or actual physics of motion at all). Its conservation of momentum that matters, even though conservation of KE is still in play.

 

You're still missing the elastic and inelastic (and more importantly partially elastic) collision mechanics though.

[Texasmotiv]

As someone with a Pala sized wife, this doesn't seem unrealistic at all to me. They can pack a wallop.

[Courtnehh]

Please take out all mage abilities because they are unrealistic.

[uzivatel]

Please take out all mage abilities because they are unrealistic.

Even fantasy has to avoid breaking some fundaments of physics (too much) to maintain immersion.

[Courtnehh]

Even fantasy has to avoid breaking some fundaments of physics (too much) to maintain immersion.

My exact point about the topic of this thread

[Beerfish]

Yeah her katari charge is bogus, give her biotic charge instead.

[zzaffrzz]

How does 'War Cry' make sense on a Mute dwarf?

[Angelus_de_Mortiel]

How does 'War Cry' make sense on a Mute dwarf?

You do know her vocal cords are still intact right? Doesn't take a tongue to scream...

[Saboteur-6]

Fantsy Dwarves in general are pretty ridiculous in their depiction of being capable of this unparalleled fighting prowess. Think about it any harder and you realize that fantasy Dwarves are based on a real life medical condition and that the whole thing is super offensive.

[JAMiAM]

Fantsy Dwarves in general are pretty ridiculous in their depiction of being capable of this unparalleled fighting prowess. Think about it any harder and you realize that fantasy Dwarves are based on a real life medical condition and that the whole thing is super offensive.

Exactly how is the concept of short, superb warrior folk "super offensive" to those afflicted with Dwarfism?  Methinks you've drank too much PCool-Aid.

[thevaleyard]

 

How does 'War Cry' make sense on a Mute dwarf?

You do know her vocal cords are still intact right? Doesn't take a tongue to scream...

 

 

But she's under oath as a SS to never speak or shout or vocalize in any way. War Cry still doesn't make sense.

[BansheeOwnage]

Lower center of mass, higher muscle density. She's actually probably not 60 lbs but closer to 160 or more. Either way, she's able to to do it because the devs say so, and made it work in-game.

Drasca's right. I don't know why you're assuming she's 60 pounds. Not even the elves are that light, not by a lot. Dwarves are bulkier and stockier. It would help, though, if they used the female dwarf model from DA:O/DA2, since it looked quite a bit larger. I hate that they changed it.

[Saboteur-6]

Exactly how is the concept of short, superb warrior folk "super offensive" to those afflicted with Dwarfism?  Methinks you've drank too much PCool-Aid.

 

Methinks you should research the issue a bit further.

[valium]

Yeah her katari charge is bogus, give her biotic charge instead.

give me a character with the krogan headbutt

[Ispan]

IIRC the Silent Sister Utha from the Calling also fought with a lot of knockdown tactics... Strategically placed punches, flying kicks and such. So... Not totally new for a dwarf lady to do that in the DA universe

[Zorinho20_CRO]

Yeah her katari charge is bogus, give her biotic charge instead.

Add vanguard glitch, too

[kalenath]

Lower center of mass, higher muscle density. She's actually probably not 60 lbs but closer to 160 or more. Either way, she's able to to do it because the devs say so, and made it work in-game.

 

'Size matters not.' Truer words were never spoken. it is the small and quiet ones who are the most dangerous.

 

Best martial artist I ever met was 1/2 my size. And yes, she was scary too.

[Zantazar]

In Glasgow we had a move called "The Glasgow Kiss" (think about it). Now,it did not matter what your mass/weight was, just plant the forehead on that nose in the correct angle ... and biff ... lots of claret and a good stun. Let us introduce that at the end of the charging bull run.

 

Zan the Man has a Plan