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Maybe don't promote your worst writers to be "above writers"?


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#76
Dread-Reaper

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The story is that DAI had won GotY, while also generally praised by critics and players, no matter how a group of people consistently try to sentence this game to trash.

The awards have spoken for the devs, not those who think their opinions rule the world.

Critics liked the game, but players felt pretty lukewarm about it.



#77
FKA_Servo

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Critics liked the game, but players felt pretty lukewarm about it.

 

Incredibly, that is not actually a universally held position.


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#78
Dread-Reaper

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Incredibly, that is not actually a universally held position.

I'm too tired to think and I honestly can't tell if you're agreeing or disagreeing with me



#79
Paul E Dangerously

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The story is that DAI had won GotY, while also generally praised by critics and players, no matter how a group of people consistently try to sentence this game to trash.

The awards have spoken for the devs, not those who think their opinions rule the world.

 

The cynic in me always wonders "How many of the outlets that gave it GotY paid for the game and didn't get comped a review copy?"



#80
FKA_Servo

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The cynic in me always wonders "How many of the outlets that gave it GotY paid for the game and didn't get comped a review copy?"

 

Honestly, probably few or none. If this was actually a thing that happened a lot, then it would have inevitably leaked. All these GOTYs (and DAI) hit right around peak gamergate idiocy.

 

I think the simplest answer is that lots of people actually liked it.

 

I'm too tired to think and I honestly can't tell if you're agreeing or disagreeing with me

 

Spoiler

 

But seriously, I disagree. Lots of gamers actually like it, too.



#81
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Honestly, probably few or none. If this was actually a thing that happened a lot, then it would have inevitably leaked. All these GOTYs (and DAI) hit right around peak gamergate idiocy.

 

I think the simplest answer is that lots of people actually liked it.

 

 

Spoiler

 

But seriously, I disagree. Lots of gamers actually like it, too.

I don't completely agree with Paul, but after that ME3 IGN review they probably could've just been extra careful with it.

 

Also, there is no doubt that many people liked the game, but from the sites I visit to the people I talked too, they felt the game was a resounding, meh.



#82
Apollexander

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Critics liked the game, but players felt pretty lukewarm about it.

May I ask how do you get the conlusion?



#83
Dread-Reaper

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May I ask how do you get the conlusion?

Metacritic, friends, people on various sites/forums, including this one.



#84
Apollexander

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Metacritic, friends, people on various sites/forums, including this one.

 
Let's say if we assume that the user score could be trusted. Then a larger sample of users is definitely more persuasive. Take the Xbox One as an example, DAI is rated 6.9/10 by 575 users on metacritic, but if you look at the Xbox One store then it is rated 4.5/5 by 11514 users.
 
If you get the conclusion by your perception then I would say perception may not be the fact. I am a moderator on a smaller Dragon Age forum where thousands of users visit everyday. I have been watching that forum since last year. There are similar behaviours as here.
There are people who try to convince everyone they meet that DAI is trash. There are people who try to argue every time they meet the former ones.
You know what? Both of these groups are minority.
A far, far large group of people are just posting like "How to kill a dragon""How to craft""Help me to find that NPC". There are also a large group of people posting like "Hey I love Cassandra""Blackwall is handsome""The followers are awesome". Also one cannot ignore a group of people who have no interest in this 'GotY vs. trash' fight, but keep contributing awesome posts, such as writing playthrough guides, sharing original arts, and so on.
To my knowledge louder ones may not be the mainstream. The majority just keep following and progressing.

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#85
Saphiron123

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All I know is there was barely a story here. The maps were empty. The lack of cinematic dialogue made everything feel impersonal and unimportant. The villains barely got any writing at all. The major battles took place off screen and you only heard about them from the advisors... for me, it was a disappointment. It felt empty and lifeless.

And I'd consider origins one of my favorite games of all time.

I keep hoping the new dlc will have some actual story, some tough decisions, some real emotion but... nope. Big health bars, changes to lore, no attempts to address unanswered questions. It's an okay game, boring at times, but dragon age deserves so much more.


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#86
Dread-Reaper

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When were those reviews for the X1 posted, because one thing I noticed among my friends and other is that when the game was first released they were singing praises about it. As time went on though and the hype died down I didn't hear a peep about the game from them again, most of them forgot about it entirely and some even hated it.

 

My perception may not be the fact is incorrect, my perception is not the fact, that is a fact. I realize my statement may have been generalizing a bit, I should have said 'some' players find it to be lukewarm. 

Every game will have it's naysayers and it's protectors, that's to be expected, but asking for help does not mean they like/enjoy the game, usually it does, but not all the time. My friend wanted to know how to get a certain item in Dark Souls, didn't mean he liked or enjoyed the game, in fact he loathes the game. About the companions, fan art and guide, fans talking about things they like, it's too be expected in a DA forum, Also BSN is only one forum, I've seen posts on giant bomb, kotaku, ign, gamefaqs, escapists and other forums, that express their disappointment with DAI.



#87
Zatche

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The cynic in me always wonders "How many of the outlets that gave it GotY paid for the game and didn't get comped a review copy?"

 

Honestly, probably few or none. If this was actually a thing that happened a lot, then it would have inevitably leaked. All these GOTYs (and DAI) hit right around peak gamergate idiocy.

 

I think the simplest answer is that lots of people actually liked it.

 

Early review copies for major gaming news outlets are quite common, no? I think there's plenty of reason to be cynical of the mutual relationship between major game publishers and major reviewers.

 

But, I would presume that any reviewer getting an early review copy of DAI also got earlier review copies of many, if not most, other games. Sure, the press gets a lot of perks, and they get buddy-buddy with the developers at big events, and this definitely influences coverage, previews, and reviews to some degree. But all things being equal between publishers, this wouldn't really give DAI much of an upper hand in winning so many Game of the Year awards.

 

Despite how much I really like Inquisition, I'm actually pretty willing to buy into the narrative that the competition just wasn't as strong in 2014. But, even then, with the sheer number of GOTYs the game received, reviewers, as a whole, still must have thought the game was, at very least, really good.

 

Whether one thinks these reviewers' opinions are worth anything is their own prerogative, but the narrative that DAI's GOTY awards were all, or even mostly, bought or lobbied just doesn't hold much ground. Even less ground considering past big GOTY winners were The Walking Dead and Journey.


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#88
9TailsFox

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Friends.

comics-Dorkly-games-sims-697954.jpeg


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#89
CuriousArtemis

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All I know is there was barely a story here. The maps were empty. The lack of cinematic dialogue made everything feel impersonal and unimportant. The villains barely got any writing at all. The major battles took place off screen and you only heard about them from the advisors... for me, it was a disappointment. It felt empty and lifeless.

And I'd consider origins one of my favorite games of all time.

I keep hoping the new dlc will have some actual story, some tough decisions, some real emotion but... nope. Big health bars, changes to lore, no attempts to address unanswered questions. It's an okay game, boring at times, but dragon age deserves so much more.

 

Agree 100% to all of this, minus the DAO bit ;) I liked DAO all right but not enough to play it more than a couple times. Good story and GREAT characters but the combat was too slow and old school for me (and I understand why some would prefer that... but we're talking about the writing here. And the DAI writing is terrible).


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#90
pdusen

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Metacritic, friends, people on various sites/forums, including this one.


Even if you had personally interviewed over 500 individual players for their opinion on DAI, that would *still* be anecdotal and statistically insignificant.
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#91
Morroian

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To the point of calls for Mike Laidlaw to be fired and death threats to Jen Hepler for 'ruining' the game. BSN was a toxic soup back in the day.


They didn't forget. But DA2 is tainted in so many minds that any word they were attempting anything related would have set off a storm.

 

When the devs started talking about ideas for the game they talked about it as a combination of DA2 and DAO.

 

To the OP I agree I think both should not be in the positions they currently hold.



#92
wolfhowwl

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Either write an opinion piece on Laidlaw or don't. Don't try to be unnecessarily coy about it and don't muck it up by trying to throw shade at someone over at Montreal.

 

Yeah seriously.

 

Everyone either knows who these employees are or is a google search away from knowing.

 

 



#93
cJohnOne

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Sooo On DAI I don't like repeating areas and I don't like the anchor mechanic.  Not sure what you could do about that though.



#94
Nibten

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No, they didn't. I mean, they looked like they were killed by a sword in the eyes of someone who has no idea how swords work.


I'm a Hema(historical european martial arts)-instructor. So I think I know a litten bit about whats possible with the sword.
And beside the finishing moves against fantasy creatures like the ogre or dragon, there is nothing that is completely ridiculous in DA:O. At least you couldn't let your enemies explode with a sword. Push a button and something awesome happens. Riiiiight...

The fact that it crosssed your personal threshold for ridiculousness in one case and not the other doesn't make it some objective point. It just is a comment on your own preference.


I never claimed otherwise, did I?
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#95
FKA_Servo

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Wasn't that usually somebody getting killed while cursed with Walking Bomb or something, though? I don't know. There were definitely some funny fatalities in DA2. Overall, though, the combat was super enjoyable, but I did wish they had kept the style of slow-motion fatalities that DA:O had presented.

 

Depends on when you played DA2, as I think they subsequently patched it to tone it down. At release it was ridiculous. You'd whack a dude and he'd fall apart like a broken mannequin.

 

In TW3, I'm still getting kill moves that reduce drowners to three separate pieces with one slice, so I'm not so sure about "realism." Maybe it's just the lack of blue sparks or whatever else people seem to decry in DA these days.


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#96
Gwydden

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I don't know about how liked or disliked DAI is, but I can say I personally enjoyed DAO and DA2 more. For those two? I started a second play through right after I finished the first. For DAI I had to practically force myself to finish the first time around.

 

Story and roleplaying are the selling points of the series for me. 90% of DAI's content is mindless MMO style grinding. The story is very, very short and not all that great. DAO had a crappy main story, but great subplots, while DA2 had a great concept even if the execution was a bit lackluster. DAI doesn't have any of that, and it's quite ironic when the stuff you read about in the war table sounds way more interesting than what you're doing.

 

I don't hate DAI. There are stuff I thought it did well, such as the companions. But overall I found it somewhat disappointing.


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#97
Ariella

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DA2's were way, way more over the top. Kind of like everything in DA2, really.

In DAO, you'd lop off a guy's head. In DA2, you'd blast him into a thousand gibbering chunks with one swing. Not entirely the same thing, really.

Da 2 was a response to DAO complaint of moving to slow, they sped thing up. Stll isn't a huge deal, and unlike the slo mo idiocy it didn't screw up combat flow.

This is Dragon Age, not the Witcher.

#98
Fearsome1

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DA2 is a tragic case of unrealised potential. It's still okay, but it could have been so much more. Legacy gave us a tiny glimpse of what could have been if they had been given more time.

 

Had the rinse & repeat caves & other overused locations not been pencil-whipped in their rush to market, much of that decent games outspoken fan blowback heat would never have scuttled some of the ideas originally intended to have been incorporated into DA2 (such as The Exalted March). 


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#99
Ariella

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When the devs started talking about ideas for the game they talked about it as a combination of DA2 and DAO.
 
To the OP I agree I think both should not be in the positions they currently hold.


No, they talked about what worked, what didn't and took fan feedback.

And I'm glad neither you nor the op are in charge of human resources at Bioware.
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#100
Saphiron123

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Agree 100% to all of this, minus the DAO bit ;) I liked DAO all right but not enough to play it more than a couple times. Good story and GREAT characters but the combat was too slow and old school for me (and I understand why some would prefer that... but we're talking about the writing here. And the DAI writing is terrible).

Well it's an older game too, but in it's time it was pretty revolutionary.


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